Church believes "victim" story of BPDw

[Barnabus]

Has anyone experienced a BPD going to their church with their "victim" narrative and the church leaders believe it and start judging the true victim who has been made the villain? How does a Christian deal with the abandonment of BPDw and church?

[Harri]

Hi Barnabus.  I haven't experienced this but I it sounds painful.  I assume you are the real victim that you are referring to here? 

What are you experiencing that says the church leaders have bought her story?

[empath]

I have experienced the challenges of a spouse who was believed by the church leadership. It is painful.

Can you tell us more about your experiences?

[Barnabus]

The church has an incredibly narrow view of agreeing with divorce on grounds of abuse, agree with it for adultery or abandonment (desertion). The only abuse they will acknowledge is physical abuse. After I understood that, I told the pastor that I was just going to leave the church because I didn't want to stir up a mess/argument with my Christian brothers. I had a conversation with one elder after that, and they apparently spoke with the BPDw. A couple of months later I got a letter that basically said I was sinning by pursuing a divorce for un-biblical reasons, although I can assure you I was deserted or abandoned mentally, emotionally, spiritually, and a couple of times physically. Although I considered myself a non-member at that point, I hoped to help the church leadership better understand this, so I spent 3 weeks writing a response, citing all kinds of Christian and secular sources about emotional abuse. I thought it had at least gone away, until about 5 months later and got another letter. I didn't respond quite so nicely then.

[empath]

There are certainly churches that narrowly define abuse as physical only, and it's hard to get them to move from that position. Even those that allow for divorce in cases of physical abuse can be difficult to convince that the abuse is happening.

Does the church consider you a non-member?

[Barnabus]

I think they probably do consider me a non-member now, but not sure.

[empath]

How are you feeling about the church and your w?

[Barnabus]

I'm just staying away from the church - still have many friends there. As far as the w, I'm so over that. Now I'm just trying to get the divorce finished and hopefully some healing with my kids will happen.

[zeus123]

What’s new? For the past 2000 years, the church was always on the wrong side of history.

[Enabler]

Hey Barnabus,

https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=334261.msg13037317#msg13037317

Different side of the coin in that I don't want the D and my W does and has accused me of verbal and emotional abuse. I however know that she has sinned with another man and continues to do so.

Remember these are fallible people playing God... .many of which will abandon their preached values quicker than you can say cake raffle. 'People' believe what they see, which is typically emotions, not stories. 

[Barnabus]

Another confrontation from the church. It’s like the Hotel California- I guess I can check out but I can’t ever leave. Anybody ever dealt with anything like this? It’s like double or triple abuse. Sad when one can’t even go to his/her church for support. Imagine a church telling a battered woman that she needs to repent from wanting to divorce the abuser. Most professionals that I’ve read say that emotional abuse ican actually worse than physical abuse. Thoughts?

[Enabler]

Would you be prepared to sit down and have the conversation with them. Maybe set some ground rules with regards to the structure of the meeting such as we each get 20 minutes to detail our case. Would you not like the opportunity to clarify things? Ironically I would like the clarify things but this would likely be seen as abusive and unwelcome, I somehow feel you are in a different position where clarification would be welcomed and is actually being asked for. A time to put forward your evidence.

I have read one of your recent posts which points to 3 major events which occurred over the last 30 years, one dating back to late 80's. I appreciate that these events weren't so much flash points and actually stretched over many months to maybe represent 'periods' of trauma. I wonder whether or not you can detail the day to day chaos involved in your life, maybe pretend that I am the clergy you are 'making your case to'.

The church does have a very narrow view of divorce, more often than not because even the worst marriages can be salved where both parties are willing and able. Ultimately a vow is a vow is a vow. This is a recent sermon I listened to, one my wife took interest in... https://www.emmausrd.com/series/the-way-of-the-king/ (top one) ... this is a more militantly rational perspective https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rc_NNjV0s1o 

The question might not be so much are you willing and able to stay married, but are both of you willing and able to do the work to rebuild your marriage from the ashes again. If your wife is unable to accept at least 50% of the responsibility for the marriage breakdown and do something about it, likewise are you, then there is no hope on religious or secular grounds... it just wont happen.

You want the divorce so you have very little to lose from raising your marriage to a higher authority to be discussed.

Enabler

[Barnabus]

I have discussed it with many of the church officers. They simply will not recognize emotional and mental abuse as a grounds for divorce. It's like talking to a tree. I told several of them there's no use discussing my particular situation with them because even if they did listen (they won't), they wouldn't change their minds or their policy. I told them there is no sense in us beating our heads against a brick wall, so I will just leave and not cause any more strife. In their minds, I can't leave until they say I can leave, so here I am. I told them I'm not under their authority any more, and to leave me alone. They just won't do it. I guess they are going to beat me over the head with their bad (IMHO) doctrine until I either die, or sue them.

And, by the way, the stbxBPDw has stated in front of my son that 100% of the responsibility for our marital problems lies with me.

The best analogy I can make is a woman who is regularly beaten physically who finally, after years of prayer, and after her husband throws her out in a rage, goes to the church and they simply tell her she can't divorce him, and she needs to repent and go back and reconcile. What would she do?

[empath]

It doesn't sound like they think you have left their fellowship. Is this a church that you have signed a church covenant with? Some churches these days have that kind of thing that states they can exercise authority over their membership.

[Enabler]

I think it would be helpful to know what kind of Church you belong(ed) to. This doesn't sound like a church that understands human relationships... or any relationships for that matter. Asking clearly and concisely for someone to leave you alone should be enough for them to desist.

Maybe you need to learn how to cry more, maybe get hysterical to the point of shaking... people look for emotional cues and I dare say your W has a large toolbox of them to deploy.

Would be good if you could come back on "I wonder whether or not you can detail the day to day chaos involved in your life, maybe pretend that I am the clergy you are 'making your case to'. "

Enabler

[Barnabus]

Enabler, that's just it. It doesn't matter what the "facts" are.

Their "Biblical" grounds for divorce are adultery and desertion/abandonment. They "justify" physical abuse as a form of desertion. Any other types of difficulties or abuse don't matter. Divorce for any other reason is sinful. Period.

The facts would clearly show that she has abandoned/deserted me mentally, emotionally, spiritually, and even physically (walked out twice). It just does not matter. So my choices were simple - either leave the church or "repent" of my sin of divorcing her for an unbiblical reason and go back for another recycle of the behavior (had quite a few of those over the years). I've experienced gaslighting, blame shifting, projection, a multitude of silent treatments, zero sincere apologies in 39 years, refusal to do what counselors recommended, and one could only imagine what else.

Hence my confusion and frustration. I'm the villain and she's the poor innocent victim.

[Enabler]

What does the church suggest you do about that list of VERY GOOD reasons for you being utterly dissatisfied in your relationship? Do they even acknowledge them? Would you be prepared to do a church based counselling session?

I might add that I am not sure the latter suggestion is something you should do, since it may just be to 'prove' or show that your W is not capable of necessary change.

Assuming you don't think this is a productive route where she will mysteriously forced to enlighten herself, you problem appears to be the church leaving you alone such that you can continue about rebuilding your life. You have extracted yourself... good use of boundary... you have asked them to get out of your front garden... they have not. It's not reasonable for someone to follow you when you are trying to remove yourself from their influence, that's called harassment. To draw a very firm line in the sand which they 'should' respect you might want to have one final meeting where you state your case, state your action (moving away from church) AND state your consequence for them not respecting you right to not be harassed by them. If you believe you have already stated 1 and 2 clearly, I would state 2 & 3 in a clear concise letter making clear you no longer wish for the matter to be discussed with you.

Enabler

[empath]

Barnabus, I'm not sure why they think that they continue to hold spiritual authority over you, but I know that some churches require members to sign "church covenants" agreeing to having the church in authority. These can be viewed as legal documents, and there are ways to deal with that. Did the church require you to sign a "covenant" as a member?

[Barnabus]

To draw a very firm line in the sand which they 'should' respect you might want to have one final meeting where you state your case, state your action (moving away from church) AND state your consequence for them not respecting you right to not be harassed by them. If you believe you have already stated 1 and 2 clearly, I would state 2 & 3 in a clear concise letter making clear you no longer wish for the matter to be discussed with you.

Enabler, here is what I hand delivered almost 2 months ago, before the most recent encounter about a week ago. (Thanks for your reply.)

To the ... at XXX:
This letter is notice that I resigned my membership verbally to the Senior Pastor in May or early June of 2018. I formally resigned in writing in my letter to the Shepherding Committee on August 8, 2018. I am no longer a member (or attendee) at XXX.

As a non-member, I am no longer subject to any of your discipline. Any publication, notice, or speaking about me by any church staff or recognized church leader ceased to be authorized by me months ago.

Therefore any negative remark or statement about me, any encouragement that people shun me, or any action other than deleting me from your records will be evaluated for possible legal action for libel or other tort claim against the individuals involved and the organization.

If any one asks about me, refer them to me, any other action may result in a tort claim against you.

YOU HAVE BEEN WARNED. You must desist from any act that may harm my reputation or me or come between me and other persons of my acquaintance. Legal action may ensue.

Sincerely,

Empath, I didn't sign anything, but there are vows that say you will be subject to the discipline of the church. I was ordained as a deacon at which time I also vowed that if I found myself "out of accord" with the teachings and doctrine of the church that I would make it known to the elders. I did. See above. And thanks for your reply.

[empath]

Empath, I didn't sign anything, but there are vows that say you will be subject to the discipline of the church. I was ordained as a deacon at which time I also vowed that if I found myself "out of accord" with the teachings and doctrine of the church that I would make it known to the elders. I did. See above.

I have some friends who are ordained deacons (my h is an ordained deacon, too); that added another level of complexity to their relationship with the church. Who oversees your position as a deacon? And, how does your church view ordination? In my tradition, we consider ordination to bring with it a change in the person's being.

In the case of my friends, they resigned as deacons, but the process was not as simple as just sending a letter. I don't think they were fully released from their status as deacons because eventually, they were able to transfer their ordination to a different diocese.

[Enabler]

You have made a clear statement about the consequences of further communication. They breached your reasonable boundary, what have you done to deliver what you said you would?

Enabler