Questions after latest rage episode

[Ray2017]

Things were better for about a week, and then with no warning (literally - not a hint of dysregulation, just into full blown rage) the last two days have been awful.  The trigger was our son not behaving during church (I was at home, sick), and H's mother not offering to help.  They came home early, son (4 years old) sobbing while my H called him a jerk and told him he ruins everything.  I told him - no matter what happened - that was unacceptable to say to our child, but later, after comforting our son, did try to listen and validate about our son being crazy and his mom not helping (both of which are common).  Within minutes, it snowballed into no one caring for him, people letting him down/abandoning him, he has nothing to look forward to, no one does what he wants - the usual.  I'd say I'd give myself a C+ on not JADEing and being validating, which is, frankly, an improvement for me.  Still have soo much work to do on that!  By that night he was out of control, saying he wanted to drive an hour away and slit the throat of one of his former friends for being so awful to him.  He's made statements like this before and I freaked out; this time I was calm and said I was leaving the room.  He followed me to the other room.  With that background, I am looking for advice:

1.  What do I do when he states he wants (not sure that's the right word) to hurt someone.  He says that he was told he needs to tell me what's he's thinking and feeling and I shouldn't react badly to it.  I do believe that he would not harm someone; but then again, I don't want to be complicit in NOT saying something.  He has specifically mentioned wanting to murder specific people in the past and I've let his therapist know, and let the social worker at the hospital know when she asked for history.  They gave no advice on what I should do or say.  I want to think that if he said something like that and then got in the car I should call the police; but if he just states it and then stays home - what do I do? 

2.  What can I do to protect my kids?  I've read articles; I have them leave the room when he's upset to limit their interaction and what they hear him say as so much is inflammatory.  When our son was sobbing and kept saying "I'm a jerk; it's my fault daddy's mad" I kept reassuring him he was not a jerk, nor was it his fault.  He's still saying it two days later (there have been incidents in the past when I've been at work; if I'm being honest our son is my H's scapegoat.  It's NOT okay.  Our son remembers these incidents and talks about them from time to time).  Our daughter is 10 and we have very open, frank discussions that we are in no way responsible or at fault when he is like this.  She seems to get it, but how can I get the same message across to a four year old? 

Rage continued into yesterday (he's just sullen today, so far).  I did less well with not JADEing yesterday.  He was really pushing my buttons (I'm not a partner; he can't rely on me to listen - because I will leave the room if he uses bad language or is really insulting to me; I was the only one that was supporting him and now I'm not, etc.) and I didn't posses the self-control not to defend myself and bring up the facts, which I know are not facts to him because emotion is fact.  That's so frustrating to me).  I so desperately wanted to tell him THIS is why he loses friends - but I didn't.  He takes and takes from us emotionally, then accuses us of not doing enough.  I know the ongoing advice is to remove yourself from the room with personal attacks or whatever your boundary may be, which leads to my next question:

3.  What if you can't leave the house, the room, etc.?  I'm not leaving the kids (or dogs) behind; he won't let me leave the house with them.  If I leave the room his intensity goes up about 10 notches, which I then have to deal with when I inevitably have to go back into the room (especially should the kids need something) - or he follows me (only doors with locks are the bathroom, and it would be tough to lock myself in there when the kids need something).  I honestly feel trapped, which I know sounds victim-y.  Any suggestions?   

I'm still posting on the trying to better a relationship board because I truly want to be a family.  I read something on another workshop post that I know is true ("it's unlikely to ever be a normal relationship, we need to accept this to move forwards rather than reliving a constant disappointment that things aren't how we hoped they would be") but I haven't been able to truly accept.  I also believe I cannot continue with things like this indefinitely, and I am so worried about the damage to the kids.  I finally have a therapist appointment on Friday and I hope she is able to help me, over time, become stronger for both myself and the kids and get to a point I can trust that I am able to make correct, informed decisions for our future. 

As before, I really value the advice I've been given.  Thank you to everyone!

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[LoneRanger307]

First off, that sucks to have all that rage poured on you. It sounds like you are trying to use your skills in a very difficult situation.

For the kids, have you thought about therapy for your kids at all? I was listening to Brene Brown recently talking about teach her kids the difference between behavior vs. self values. "The dog behaved badly, but he is not a bad dog." I think it's very important to protect your kids from taking on negative self values. Maybe think about how you can help your son process these experiences after the fact, or things you can give him to read or watch. But the behavior you are describing is emotionally abusive (imo) and would be hard for any kid to process.

Regarding leaving the house, I was reading something yesterday that said leaving should always be an option. And if you can't leave, then you are being held "hostage" (word used in the book) and you might consider calling the police.

Are you able to have calm conversations with your husband after the fact? I wonder if he would be open to a calm ground-rules for arguing/boundaries conversation when he is in a more neutral mood.

[isilme]

Ray2017,

Sorry, been in a few of these situations.

When you can't leave... well, you can't leave.  Ships at sea try to avoid storms... and still have to weather storms.  I am often trapped by late-night rages, or rages when I am feeling so poorly I can't drive, can't leave to walk, and honeslty unless I have money for a hotel (rare) I have nowhere to go.  If I leave the room, and he follows, and I can't leave, I work on deescalation.  It's pretty obvious when things have hit that point, and so I freeze and work to address the disassociating person in front of me who honestly in many ways is no longer running the show.  No JADE.  I protect myself as I can, try to keep distance, furniture between us.  I hate these moments, but also know that my H has left the building - he's no longer there, pure emotions are what I am facing.  I have ittle advice other than to simply seek a deescalation without compromising yourself.  Let him yell - don't respond.  Don't try to convince him of anything at this point - real conversation is over until this storm has passed. 

Threats - BPD is an emotional disorder.  Unless that person is right there in front of them at the time they are losing control (often near impossible, they hold it together until it's "safe" to let go in their "safe" environment) I'd call this a very disturbing but hollow threat.  I don't respond to things like this an worse that being said, and yes, they get said.  And yes, things like this damage my feelings for him, they are horrifyingly ugly, and it is the rage and emotion and the lack of ability to process these emotions in any sort of normal manner, so the creatures of the ID spew out on all their glory. 

I work really hard to separate (split? ha) the BPD rages/pure emotion from the personality that gets suppressed by those emotions.  I'm not sure if this is healthy, but it helps me.  The less I see the rage as coming from a person I love, the less it hurts me in the end?

As for the children - I am at a loss.  I was the only child of 2 BPD parents - I lived a very confusing, painful, isolated childhood.  Age-appropriate discussion of "daddy isn't always able to say things the best way... etc." all the way up to disclosing BPD by teen years if needed is the best I can suggest.  At least your kids have you... I know when my parents finally divorced when I was 15, it hurt but I realized in a year it also cut in half my exposure to abuse.  Having one regulated parent can make a difference. 

[Ray2017]

Thanks for the responses and suggestions.  Our daughter (10) was seeing a therapist for anxiety (mostly sleep issues) and I was hoping it would continue, but the therapist moved out of network.  We live in a very small community and it's really hard to find a therapist - especially one for children - that are accepting patients within a reasonable distance (less than 45 minutes).  It is definitely on my radar though.

Loneranger37 - I guess at times I do feel held hostage, but calling the PD would really escalate things in a way I don't feel comfortable with - yet.  If things get to a point where I decide to end the relationship and he wouldn't let me leave, I can see doing that.  I am sensitive to the fact that he works closely with the PD in town and things like this can have ramifications with his employment.  And he needs his job.  Probably sounds like a ton of excuses, but if I (or the kids, furry and not) felt physically threatened, I most definitely would leave - no matter what he did - or call the PD. 

Isilme - I laughed at your reference to "splitting" your husband.  During the thick of it, when I was so frustrated and just wanted OUT, I kept thinking "I'm totally splitting him black right now".  It actually helped a little.  And I appreciate your insights about the threats.  Having done so much reading on not making things worse, I do shut down more out of an automatic response when he's so over the top - there is literally nothing that can be said.  If I can't leave the room or he follows me, I just sit wherever I am, silently, and listen enough that he doesn't think I'm ignoring him. 

The good news is the past two days were okay.  He had a really stressful day yesterday and got through it well.  He's frustrated today (I'm at work, he's home all day with the kids, and they can be a handful at times) which can easily lead to dysregulation, but I'm trying to give him the benefit of the doubt and hopefully he can hold it together.

Thanks again for everyone's suggestions.  Quite a road we're all on!

[Ray2017]

I have another question, which probably cannot be answered definitively, but I'm curious.  I had my first appointment with my therapist this past week (it went well!), and I was talking about how I don't know/feel like I can't walk away without having a worse reaction from my H, and how I either feel completely checked out emotionally (cold) when he's raging OR I feel like I break (for lack of a better term) and start crying uncontrollably.  She asked what he does when I break, and I realized he always immediately calms down.  My question is - does he do that because he has a moment of realizing he's contributed to making me a sniffling lump on the floor and feels bad, or is it perhaps I've fully gotten on his roller coaster and he feels more in control of his emotions because I'm not in control of mine (this is what the therapist was leaning to; using it as proof that I need to stay in my own lane and that's what we'll be working on).  I know he has disordered thinking, whatever the diagnosis is, but I guess I've never thought of his sudden calming down when I'm a mess as a control thing.  Does anyone have any insight on this? 

[isilme]

I can't say for sure, but you might be shocking him by a reaction not in "the script".  Often when they choose to fight, they need that venting, that yelling, that release.  They are like teapots of poorly controlled emotions that boil over, but they need us to be the cup to catch it for them. 

But if we are able to not participate along with the script they feel they need (they rage, want us to rage back, to make their rage somehow acceptable) it MIGHT, just might shake them out of the rage, at least for a bit.

I don't think this is a reaction out of sudden self-awareness, realization, not the way you mean it.  It IS some sort of epiphany for them, but try not to project YOUR feelings and understanding onto them - their emotional processing is just alien enough that we are all at cross purposes far too often.  Accept that the rage stopped, for whatever reason, and work to continue to resvolce as possible, and de-escalate.