Devastated re infidelity in my marriage after 12 months

[How to communicate after a contentious divorce...]

Hello there,

I’ve never actually posted on a board like this before, but feel I really need to, having read just how insightful the info and replies here are. I am in a state of pain and devastation at the moment.

I have been married for about 18 months, it is my second marriage. (My first marriage of fifteen plus years ended terribly - my then husband’s narcissism, alienation of my children’s affections for a period, his infidelity, physical abuse and emotional abuse. It was an extraordinarily difficult time. The separation for that resolved in 2014).

I met my current husband and Pw BPD (undiagnosed but I have very recently felt absolutely sure of it, it matches his background and behaviours) in 2016 and knew him socially for two years. We went out for three years from 2018 to 2020 and married in Dec 2020, he was very keen and proposed.

 I thought I had been extremely, even excessively, careful (given my past experiences) to observe and connect with him in a really considered way. I adored/adore this man and was excited and deeply happy at marrying him. I thought he was kind, playful, creative, earthy, sensual, loyal and unique. I felt truly loved. I would tell him that I loved him, that he was my “darling man” that he was a “beautiful” and “unique” man.  I thought that we would end our days together into old age.

Until this March I would have described our relationship as deeply close, very loving, with a blissful intellectual , romantic  and physical compatibility. Our relationship felt completely authentic, with two very authentic people in it.  I can’t think of any signs, that our relationship was anything but these things. I thought then , and still do think, that he genuinely felt the same way about what we had together.


About 7 weeks ago, it clicked that he has been engaging in an affair since about March of this year. I am convinced of this and trust my instincts 100 percent.

 The signs have been predictable, odd absences, intense irritability with me, a text at 2am in the morning, unanswered phone calls late at night, a long woman’s hair caught in his stubble when he came in one morning, google search terms for florists, cbd and northern suburban based eateries, cbd hotels, a search term that features a staff newsletter with her in it, search terms that I’ve figured out connect to her places of work where he obviously goes to pick her up, his google search queries like “meaning of tryst”, lies that contradict themselves about where he’s been or is going, booking sites for movie tickets, a booking for music concert tickets interstate (that were never mentioned to me). There are quite a few other things too.

What sickens and upsets me the most is the time he was clearly going to meet her, a couple of months ago, with me in the car - contradicting where he needed to be and at what time. He wouldn’t look me in the eyes that evening and couldn’t properly explain where he had been either. He said a play reading and then a cousin’s birthday party, to which inexplicably I hadn’t been invited, which has never happened previously.

On the way to dropping him off, I could feel his excitement, he was exhaling under his breathe, tapping his hands against the steering wheel, I could feel his anticipation. It was like someone about to get high. That just revolts me and makes me so sad.

Another time, he deliberately drove to near where she lives (I suspect this because the location matched numerous google maps locations)  with me, ostensibly for a family based errand. I could feel the excitement, the rush, emanating from him. That also revolts me, because part of the thrill must have been because I was there too.

Since all that, and my making clear recently that I will be separating from him (and providing him with copies of the screen shot trail) he has vehemently denied everything, told me I’m delusional and that he’s “concerned” about me. He declares that he refuses to separate from his “beautiful wife”, that he “adores” and “cherishes” me. He has ‘reported’ the computer search terms to a police friend, re computer hacking. I suspect he has stopped seeing his affair partner/ whatever I should be calling her - ie at the moment. It is very warped, I think he thinks he does  ‘adore’ and ‘cherish’ me - but if this is how he treats the people he loves the most in his life….no one who has been trusting and loving in a marriage should ever, ever be treated this way. It’s abusive and cruel.

I worked very hard, and thought that he had been too, for us to craft our future life together, we purchased a house together and moved in this past Feb, we planned a creative project and a residential study stay at Oxford university (which I followed through with, having returned a couple of days ago). We had bought a new greyhound (our previous pet had passed away about a year ago). I worked so hard at a professional job I find really gruelling at times, to ‘make’ these things happen for us.

I’m just in such pain and shock: that he would dream of destroying something so beautiful (and it really was); that his level of deception has been so mind blowing;  that it all happened on the turn of a dime; that he hasn’t had the decency to give me closure/acknowledgement for my intense pain (which I’ve been vulnerable enough to reveal to him over the past few weeks); that he would dream of doing this, knowing what I had gone through previously in my first marriage; that now he refuses to let go; that I was completely blind to this part of him for the first four years; that he would choose to do this at the very point when we had a beautiful life ahead of us. I think/know that he must be a disordered person to be doing this because it feels so insane.

I feel such a mix of feelings and it’s so overwhelming - I know without question that I need to get out as soon as I can. If I don’t get out he will drag me to the bottom of the ocean with him. I know that. Part of me has been headed towards despising him (because of the ongoing deception), I feel waves of uncontrollable revulsion at who he is and what he’s done, and then searing pain for the loss of someone who I loved/love so much. Did he actually exist? I don’t even know? I feel I need the answer to that question.- I also feel that I must have been really, really stupid and needy when we first met not to have seen these things. I had been through a multitude of counselling by then for my first marriage and Emdr for childhood trauma. I was very, very ‘prepared’ to deal with my fears and face life again.

He is creative, handsome, playful, tender and kind (I think/would have said?) and  I have very similar qualities too.  I can’t believe what he’s tossed away into the rubbish. It’s mind blowing. Over three months I became something caught under his shoe.

In Dec 21 we were celebrating our first year wedding anniversary at a Japanese restaurant we’d been dying to try out and making up stories and in jokes for a creative inner world we have created, a few months later, some cheap, infatuated organised liaisons with a younger woman who obviously doesn’t care and doesn’t have boundaries either - who are these people? I feel repulsed and angry that they created a triangle (with me in it) without my consent or permission.

I’ve told him about the waves of revulsion I feel and that I don’t like him, as a fellow human being, for his ongoing deceptiveness. This is probably so ill advised but at times he just disgusts me, - because it’s so, so, obvious that it’s happened and all he can do is continue to lie and lie and lie.

 I tried to be understanding, to make clear I really do know, to give him ‘ways out’, to save face by saying I still recognised that parts of him are beautiful, that what we had had been beautiful. I don’t want to hurt him, I don’t want to become a person who hurts him by saying hurtful things.

I think the best possible answer is to keep him at polite arms length, particularly while we continue to reside under the same roof. He tries to engage in conversations where he inevitably, vehemently denies that anything has happened. They are ridiculous, circular conversations that need to stop. On our return from overseas I said that I want to sleep and live in separate parts of the house, after just a day and night of that, I already feel better.

There is an added issue - on our return o/s we discovered that his father had a serious stroke a day after we had left for o/s (his family only wanted to tell him on return to Aus so as not to upset his o/s stay). His father now can’t walk, talk clearly or care for himself independently. We both went to see him in hospital yesterday. It is a hideous situation. My Pw BPD has said he wants his wife with him through this - but I can’t do that in the way that he wants. It’s painful -  because of the state his father is in and because it brings home the very things that matter - love, marriage, mutual support, travelling on a life path together - that have all been tossed away. I’ll try and be supportive but it will have to be sort of arms length too. The horrible irony is that my Pw BPD is largely who he is, I think, because of his father growing up, and then his father before him. I feel like I’m watching a slow motion reel of the waste of human happiness, and with my Pw BPD, the erosion of an otherwise beautiful person walking around with a gaping hole in their make-up.

I still love and adore the ‘old’ him, I think I basically need to mourn that person, privately, in my own time. In the meantime I have to navigate the reality of who he actually is and get out - which is very, very  tough. It’s tough because I think I’ve loved/love him more than any other romantic partner during my lifetime.

Thank you for considering such a long post. Thank you for understanding how some of this is feeling.

[Elspethan]

Hello there,

I’ve never actually posted on a board like this before, but feel I really need to, having read just how insightful the info and replies here are. I am in a state of pain and devastation at the moment.

I have been married for about 18 months, it is my second marriage. (My first marriage of fifteen plus years ended terribly - my then husband’s narcissism, alienation of my children’s affections for a period, his infidelity, physical abuse and emotional abuse. It was an extraordinarily difficult time. The separation for that resolved in 2014).

I met my current husband and Pw BPD (undiagnosed but I have very recently felt absolutely sure of it, it matches his background and behaviours) in 2016 and knew him socially for two years. We went out for three years from 2018 to 2020 and married in Dec 2020, he was very keen and proposed.

 I thought I had been extremely, even excessively, careful (given my past experiences) to observe and connect with him in a really considered way. I adored/adore this man and was excited and deeply happy at marrying him. I thought he was kind, playful, creative, earthy, sensual, loyal and unique. I felt truly loved. I would tell him that I loved him, that he was my “darling man” that he was a “beautiful” and “unique” man.  I thought that we would end our days together into old age.

Until this March I would have described our relationship as deeply close, very loving, with a blissful intellectual , romantic  and physical compatibility. Our relationship felt completely authentic, with two very authentic people in it.  I can’t think of any signs, that our relationship was anything but these things. I thought then , and still do think, that he genuinely felt the same way about what we had together.


About 7 weeks ago, it clicked that he has been engaging in an affair since about March of this year. I am convinced of this and trust my instincts 100 percent.

 The signs have been predictable, odd absences, intense irritability with me, a text at 2am in the morning, unanswered phone calls late at night, a long woman’s hair caught in his stubble when he came in one morning, google search terms for florists, cbd and northern suburban based eateries, cbd hotels, a search term that features a staff newsletter with her in it, search terms that I’ve figured out connect to her places of work where he obviously goes to pick her up, his google search queries like “meaning of tryst”, lies that contradict themselves about where he’s been or is going, booking sites for movie tickets, a booking for music concert tickets interstate (that were never mentioned to me). There are quite a few other things too.

What sickens and upsets me the most is the time he was clearly going to meet her, a couple of months ago, with me in the car - contradicting where he needed to be and at what time. He wouldn’t look me in the eyes that evening and couldn’t properly explain where he had been either. He said a play reading and then a cousin’s birthday party, to which inexplicably I hadn’t been invited, which has never happened previously.

On the way to dropping him off, I could feel his excitement, he was exhaling under his breathe, tapping his hands against the steering wheel, I could feel his anticipation. It was like someone about to get high. That just revolts me and makes me so sad.

Another time, he deliberately drove to near where she lives (I suspect this because the location matched numerous google maps locations)  with me, ostensibly for a family based errand. I could feel the excitement, the rush, emanating from him. That also revolts me, because part of the thrill must have been because I was there too.

Since all that, and my making clear recently that I will be separating from him (and providing him with copies of the screen shot trail) he has vehemently denied everything, told me I’m delusional and that he’s “concerned” about me. He declares that he refuses to separate from his “beautiful wife”, that he “adores” and “cherishes” me. He has ‘reported’ the computer search terms to a police friend, re computer hacking. I suspect he has stopped seeing his affair partner/ whatever I should be calling her - ie at the moment. It is very warped, I think he thinks he does  ‘adore’ and ‘cherish’ me - but if this is how he treats the people he loves the most in his life….no one who has been trusting and loving in a marriage should ever, ever be treated this way. It’s abusive and cruel.

I worked very hard, and thought that he had been too, for us to craft our future life together, we purchased a house together and moved in this past Feb, we planned a creative project and a residential study stay at Oxford university (which I followed through with, having returned a couple of days ago). We had bought a new greyhound (our previous pet had passed away about a year ago). I worked so hard at a professional job I find really gruelling at times, to ‘make’ these things happen for us.

I’m just in such pain and shock: that he would dream of destroying something so beautiful (and it really was); that his level of deception has been so mind blowing;  that it all happened on the turn of a dime; that he hasn’t had the decency to give me closure/acknowledgement for my intense pain (which I’ve been vulnerable enough to reveal to him over the past few weeks); that he would dream of doing this, knowing what I had gone through previously in my first marriage; that now he refuses to let go; that I was completely blind to this part of him for the first four years; that he would choose to do this at the very point when we had a beautiful life ahead of us. I think/know that he must be a disordered person to be doing this because it feels so insane.

I feel such a mix of feelings and it’s so overwhelming - I know without question that I need to get out as soon as I can. If I don’t get out he will drag me to the bottom of the ocean with him. I know that. Part of me has been headed towards despising him (because of the ongoing deception), I feel waves of uncontrollable revulsion at who he is and what he’s done, and then searing pain for the loss of someone who I loved/love so much. Did he actually exist? I don’t even know? I feel I need the answer to that question.- I also feel that I must have been really, really stupid and needy when we first met not to have seen these things. I had been through a multitude of counselling by then for my first marriage and Emdr for childhood trauma. I was very, very ‘prepared’ to deal with my fears and face life again.

He is creative, handsome, playful, tender and kind (I think/would have said?) and  I have very similar qualities too.  I can’t believe what he’s tossed away into the rubbish. It’s mind blowing. Over three months I became something caught under his shoe.

In Dec 21 we were celebrating our first year wedding anniversary at a Japanese restaurant we’d been dying to try out and making up stories and in jokes for a creative inner world we have created, a few months later, some cheap, infatuated organised liaisons with a younger woman who obviously doesn’t care and doesn’t have boundaries either - who are these people? I feel repulsed and angry that they created a triangle (with me in it) without my consent or permission.

I’ve told him about the waves of revulsion I feel and that I don’t like him, as a fellow human being, for his ongoing deceptiveness. This is probably so ill advised but at times he just disgusts me, - because it’s so, so, obvious that it’s happened and all he can do is continue to lie and lie and lie.

 I tried to be understanding, to make clear I really do know, to give him ‘ways out’, to save face by saying I still recognised that parts of him are beautiful, that what we had had been beautiful. I don’t want to hurt him, I don’t want to become a person who hurts him by saying hurtful things.

I think the best possible answer is to keep him at polite arms length, particularly while we continue to reside under the same roof. He tries to engage in conversations where he inevitably, vehemently denies that anything has happened. They are ridiculous, circular conversations that need to stop. On our return from overseas I said that I want to sleep and live in separate parts of the house, after just a day and night of that, I already feel better.

There is an added issue - on our return o/s we discovered that his father had a serious stroke a day after we had left for o/s (his family only wanted to tell him on return to Aus so as not to upset his o/s stay). His father now can’t walk, talk clearly or care for himself independently. We both went to see him in hospital yesterday. It is a hideous situation. My Pw BPD has said he wants his wife with him through this - but I can’t do that in the way that he wants. It’s painful -  because of the state his father is in and because it brings home the very things that matter - love, marriage, mutual support, travelling on a life path together - that have all been tossed away. I’ll try and be supportive but it will have to be sort of arms length too. The horrible irony is that my Pw BPD is largely who he is, I think, because of his father growing up, and then his father before him. I feel like I’m watching a slow motion reel of the waste of human happiness, and with my Pw BPD, the erosion of an otherwise beautiful person walking around with a gaping hole in their make-up.

I still love and adore the ‘old’ him, I think I basically need to mourn that person, privately, in my own time. In the meantime I have to navigate the reality of who he actually is and get out - which is very, very  tough. It’s tough because I think I’ve loved/love him more than any other romantic partner during my lifetime.

Thank you for considering such a long post. Thank you for understanding how some of this is feeling.

[Rev]

Good morning El,

I just wanted to say welcome.  You have come to a really great place. Lot's of wisdom here, and ZERO judgement. On the surface your situation sounds an awful lot like mine.

So I am going to read it carefully before adding anything, because I don't want to see my story in your story - if you catch what I mean.

In the meantime, again, WELCOME.

Reach out any time.

And above all, hang in there.

Rev

[Rev]

Hi again.

Just checking in to see how you're doing.

I've taken some time to read this again. And I keep coming back to how eerily familiar this is. I too felt revulsion when I discovered what my now ex was up to.

And that's how I found these boards.

So maybe I might say - beyond having to opportunity to vent - if your connection to these boards is be helpful in some way, what might be some of the signs that reassured you that are the right path?

Hang in there. Reach out any time.

Rev

[Elspethan]

Thanks Rev for such kindness in your replies. I can feel your goodwill and really appreciate it so much.

I realise now how long my post is, and looking at a lot of other ‘first timer’ posts I can see the same thing. I think that first wave of shock means there’s a heck of a lot to just ‘get out’. Maybe the writing out of it all helps to process (and acknowledge it).

But very short replies and thoughts/tips from others is more than welcome by me.

[Elspethan]

….my message cut short there for some reason
What I’m finding is that I am trusting myself and my gut 100 percent - so that gives me strength
But the part I’m going to miss the most is the day to day gentle feeling of living and being loved - that’s something that’s so important to me and it aches to let that go
How did people manage that last part? I’d love to know
Thanks

[Elspethan]

…I’m not very tech savvy with posting - so not sure if I’m posting in the right spots, this is meant to be further to my last post…

Auto spell correct intervened, but what I had meant to write is that what I miss/will intensely miss is the gentle practice of loving and being loved each day - ie letting go of the gentle tides of daily companionship between us - did other’s feel this loss acutely too? I have adored having that as part of my life.

It hurts so, so much to think of letting that go because it’s felt so precious throughout the relationship. It’s something I treasured.

I’m struggling to understand how on the one hand, I can be a person who values family and emotional intimacy and day to day closeness as a way to live so strongly  (above say professional accomplishments), and on the other hand, I’m the very person who wont be living that way anymore.

I feel as though there’s a paradox. The very way of living that’s the most precious to me is something that I have say goodbye to and is the very thing that has eluded me, both in my first  marriage and now in the second. It was the second that had felt so real and rare.

 I’m kind and caring and I have so much authentic  love to give- I’m finding it really hard to understand how I ‘ended up here’.
I think there must be some deficits in my own expectations or ways of relating. Did/do other’s feel this?
 
What did other’s do in this situation? Where deep human closeness is one of the most precious things for you? I’m an accomplished person in the ‘outside world;, I could distract myself and immerse myself in ‘being busy’, ‘investing in myself’, but that’s not the most important way to live to me.

How did other’s survive this time? How did you get by without feeling like you were going ‘through the motions’?

[Rev]

These are all outstanding questions.

I'm in the midst of moving so if you don't mind, I'll write you back in a few days.

In the meantime, I say they are outstanding because they reflect the steps towards healing and they are pretty much in the same vicinity that pretty much everyone asks themselves when the reality of who they were really with hits.  It is can be a real mind blower. 

For now, I would encourage you to in fact go through the motions just a little bit. It may take some time for your body and your mind to sync up again.  Not sure if that makes sense?

I'll write back.

In the meantime, hang in there.  As someone said to me really early in my journey, "Rev. It does get better even if it does feel like it right now."  Same thing applies for you.

Rev

[Rev]

Hi again ...

So after taking time for all of this to "download" so to speak - this is what stands out for me to share with you without, hopefully, projecting my story on to yours.

I’m kind and caring and I have so much authentic  love to give- I’m finding it really hard to understand how I ‘ended up here’. I think there must be some deficits in my own expectations or ways of relating. Did/do other’s feel this?

I did - bigtime. I am an abuse victim in the clinical sense of the word.   I was a mess when it finally ended. I needed to couch surf for six weeks at a trusted friend's place to get some sense of who I was any more. Three months after the separation and a month after the divorce papers were signed, I needed to have my lawyer write a cease and desist.  So yes - you are not alone in this.  My therapist at the time said to me, "Rev - It's much easier to get into a relationship than to get out of it."  My ex also cheated on me, right under my nose. My system went into shock at one point while I was couch surfing and I experienced the first and only two panic attacks I have ever experienced. And, I too am highly accomplished. Very humbling experience. A little scary too.
 
What did other’s do in this situation? Where deep human closeness is one of the most precious things for you? I’m an accomplished person in the ‘outside world;, I could distract myself and immerse myself in ‘being busy’, ‘investing in myself’, but that’s not the most important way to live to me.

Here's what I did.

1- I gave myself 72 hours to have a pity party and then chose to say "that's it - now one step at time."

2- I enlisted three friends who were there for me to really help me process this out. They also kept me accountable to my promises to myself. My ex tried more than once to either bully me or lure me back during the separation period.

3 - I got specialized counseling (CBT) from a therapist who had experience with male victims of domestic abuse.

4 - I wrote a list of all the things she did to me to stave off the shame spirals.

5 - I cut out any alcohol from my diet and replaced them with walks. I did this to stay focused and clear headed.

6 - I took drives in the middle of the night if I needed to.

7 - I devoured pod-casts and books on NPD/BPD.

8 - I rode it out until the physical symptoms started to subside.  We can often romanticize "living in the moment" but I'll tell you, living in the moment took on a whole new importance for me.

9 - I chose to understand her and not "forgive her" in the traditional sense of the word. I chose instead to do whatever I needed to do to get in touch with my pent up anger so as to release it.  My expression was that "I don't want to get angry because I don't want to BE anger."



How did other’s survive this time? How did you get by without feeling like you were going ‘through the motions’?

My advice - trust to process because there is an element of "fake it until you make it" in this. Here's an image for you.  Do you remember the original "Karate Kid" - where Mr. Miagi puts Daniel through "paint the fence, wax on wax off, and sand the floor"?  It's like he felt he was going through all these useless motions ... until ... it all came together.

For better or worse, that's what I did.

3 years later I can honestly say I am not only not in the same place, I am a different version of my core self - if that makes any sense. Hope this helps.

Hang in there. Reach out anytime.

Rev

[Zoa]

I understand how you feel.  I treasured my family and was devastated when I learned his sexual appetite was more important than our family.  Best plan is to end the marriage sooner than later and work on yourself to recover.

[SinisterComplex]

Hello Elspethan. Welcome to the Fam. 

I have moved your thread here as you are currently still in the relationship and you will receive better responses here. In the meantime please be kind to you and take care of yourself.

Post as much as you need to. Feel free to ask as many questions as you want. We all get it here.

Cheers and best wishes!

-SC-

[ForeverDad]

9 - I chose to understand her and not "forgive her" in the traditional sense of the word. I chose instead to do whatever I needed to do to get in touch with my pent up anger so as to release it..."

I will comment on this one point.  Sometimes the hurt is so intense that forgiveness doesn't fit, especially when the other person does not sense, ignores or makes light of the harm done.  In other words, the remorse, if any, does not fit the severity of the offense.  Gifting forgiveness just wouldn't fit.

It is up to you to determine for yourself whether forgiveness is merited.  If not, then don't feel pressured to forgive.  The way I phrase it is that you can decide to "Let Go and Move On".  I don't mean you must give the other person a restart or do over, risking the enabling of a similar betrayal to occur yet again.  (Well, unless you wish to do that.)  What I mean is that you can leave the relationship without saying "it's okay and you're forgiven" and for yourself letting go of all that angst and moving on with your life.

I wrote this earlier this year, describing a death in the family that occurred some 25 years ago.

I will likely never forgive him.  This time forgiveness would be a dangerous thing.

Many people feel they have to forgive.  But Gemsforeyes makes an astute observation.  There are times forgiving is something a person cannot or should not do.  However, what a person almost always can do is Let Go.

I recall meeting ex's step-sister who had run away at age 16 and never returned.  Her father was dying and he expressed some deathbed sorrows.  She came to tell him he was forgiven for his abuse when she was a child.  I tried to tell her forgiving him for his abuse was not her obligation but I don't think she understood my perspective.

[Notwendy]

I think it's understandable that you feel devastated. Clearly you gave this relationship your very best.

Reading your description of your H's behavior when he's about to meet his affair partner- this doesn't have anything to do with you. He's not doing this because of anything you did or didn't do. He may even genuinely love you and value the marriage. But something about him craves this kind of thrill of an elicit affair as well kind of like someone addicted to drugs does.

There's a certain thrill to the sneaking around and also a new person. A new person is like a blank canvas. They can project whatever they want on that. A new person also doesn't know all about him. They can engage in this kind of fantasy together. Also, there's no commitment on his part - he's married. Eventually though, the thrill of this new thing wears off and he likely will seek out another one. It's the high of this situation, not the person, and not anything to do with you.

He made this choice, not you. You really can't control his choices no matter how much you love and care for him, and that feels devastating. What you can control is your decision. If fidelity is a core value for you, staying married to him is going to be a violation of this, and if it causes you continuous unhappiness, the choice of what to do about it becomes yours.

[Elspethan]

My goodness, thank you everybody for such incredible kindness and understanding in your posts - it means a great deal to me. Thank you.

I’ve been thinking on Rev’s wise words of advice over the past week and I’ve started to try some of those techniques and I’ll try to deliberately adopt more good habits as i keep going. I don’t exercise much or get outdoors, and I think that would be good for the soul.
I feel determined to give myself the best chance to stay ‘psychologically intact’.

I’ve put a list on my iPhone of the times that his behaviours have really hurt me, just to remind myself of the whole context of who he is, and not just the magical, loving version. I’ve confided in three very good friends, I’ve put the following sayings on my phone , (that I’ve read can be helpful for Pwbpd and are used for loved ones with alcohol addiction); “Get off their back, Get out of their way, Get on with your life” and “you didn’t Cause it, you can’t Control it, you can’t Cure it’.
 Every single time I don’t do the ‘three G’s’ particularly , and there have been a few times ,  I end up regretting it - circular conversations, manipulations, unavoidable conflict, not good..

I give myself permission to cry when I need to, but there are also times when I make myself focus on concrete tasks. I’m trying to filter all my day to day choices with asking if the action I’m about to take is good for me. I’ve booked an appointment with a psychologist this weekend who specialises in EMDR, because I want to process this trauma as it happens and not let it live with me.

I know that I can’t remain married to him. I’ve said to him that I consider myself separated from him, and I think that’s what’s starting to bring out some really odd behaviours. He’s told me he is starting to see that he is a victim of domestic violence because of my “emotional coercion” about him having an affair.  But he’ll also be sobbing at times and say he adores me and refuses to accept a separation etc…

The other night (back from Father’s Day) we drove on an unusual route past where I know his affair partner works. He didn’t necessarily know that I knew that.
His breathing changed, that same addictive quality of behaviour I’d observed a couple of times previously. I felt angry because it was degrading that my presence in the car was, again, contributing to the thrill. We had just come back from Father’s Day at my parents, so a rare occasion nowadays that we are together at all.  I felt my dignity being trodden all over.

I acted very unwisely, I got out of the car and told him to “F off”. When I arrived home I said that I was aware of what he had been doing, that any ‘frisson’  relied on a triangle, I had already taken myself out of the triangle, because we’re now separated, that he is a free agent and that my time is valuable.

Ten minutes later he faked (I really believe it was faked) a dizzy/nausea spell, asked me to call nurse on call and asked me to go to hospital casualty with him. Wanted to hold my hand and hug me as we entered the building. We waited for an hour and then he insisted on going home again, no longer wobbly on his feet at all, but angry at the wait time.

I think the whole episode had a few invaluable lessons in it for me;  the more ‘no contact’ the better, even not sharing car rides, because it reduces the chances of things spiralling, no calling out what he’s doing, no reactivity from me when he does something that really hurts and feels degrading. Normally I’m pretty good at sticking to these things - but not always. NotWendy I think you are spot on and wise about the nature of the affair behaviours. I really should have remembered that and not reacted the way I did.

It also showed me that his behaviour is going to get pretty intense as I go forward. That feels confronting, because I know that I’ll have to deal with that and also mourn what I feel I’ve lost, as two parallel processes..

[ForeverDad]

Besides my ex using our time at home "behind closed doors" away from public view, she also acted out when we were together driving on the road.  Not only was I her captive audience but also she was away from public view.

So I'm not surprised you've experienced such pressures when traveling in vehicles.

For example, one time we were heading to our congregation, about a 20-30 minute drive.  The entire time she was disparaging our friends there.  (This occurred before things had advanced to her disparaging me.)  Then when we arrived, she pasted a smile on her face as though nothing untoward had been said, expecting me to do similarly.  I was sickened by it all.

[Rev]

Besides my ex using our time at home "behind closed doors" away from public view, she also acted out when we were together driving on the road.  Not only was I her captive audience but also she was away from public view.

So I'm not surprised you've experienced such pressures when traveling in vehicles.

For example, one time we were heading to our congregation, about a 20-30 minute drive.  The entire time she was disparaging our friends there.  (This occurred before things had advanced to her disparaging me.)  Then when we arrived, she pasted a smile on her face as though nothing untoward had been said, expecting me to do similarly.  I was sickened by it all.

Dear FD,

I didn't realize that we had been with the same person!  LOLOLOL

Rev

[Notwendy]

It can be astonishing to see how different the "public persona" is from the private one. To be fair, we all do this to some extent. We might be watching TV at home in sweat pants but we would not do this at work. We are more formal in public than at home. The "persona" though is a wider gap- seems like a different person sometimes.

I think one hard part about the idea of an affair partner or even other social situations, is thinking they are getting the good side and you don't- that somehow these two will have it better than the two of you, or that you are less deserving.

The more likely truth is that all of us tend to match up with someone who "matches" us in a dysfunctional pattern. That is hard to see sometimes when it's the other person who is acting out in a more obvious disordered way, but somehow that person also meets some kind of emotional need of ours. Change can happen for us when we examine why this pattern is distressing to us- and decide to make our own changes. We can't change someone else.

The affair partner might seem exciting to him now, and he is showing the best of himself to her. But this can't last because he is who he is and he will interact with her with the same dynamics eventually. Once she sees this, she will either continue the dynamics or break it off, or he may get tired of it once the newness wears off. If they stayed together, it's likely they'd have this kind of drama too. She is not the solution to BPD and you didn't "fail" to be that solution because it's not possible to change someone else.