After the breakup, this is what he has posted on a mutual friend's FB page.

[Intent_to_learn]

The comments below have been made in the last week on the topic of forgiveness and reflect former friend's mindset after I initiated NC.  Feedback is appreciated on whether this man is BPD or Sociopath. Up until now, I had thought he was uBPD as he was positive for all of the criteria for BPD.  But after reading these comments, I'm beginning to think sociopath. Whatever the label, though, reading this has reaffirmed my resolve for NC.


"What's the point of forgiveness or forgiving?  Harboring ill feelings steels vigilance and feels better than the non-meaning that forgiving brings one.  Forgiving only pleases those who thought up old axioms.  It's a myth that forgiving makes one a 'better person.'  Forgiving also relaxes defenses which invites further harm.  I enjoy pulling out my list, smiling, sitting back and thinking... .'screw those sons of a hit_es!"

and then later on in the thread, he said:

"The trick, which you will learn in time, Grasshopper, is in being able to control the degree to which one allows accompanying emotion to affect one, or not. Once you have total control over your emotions, it's a breeze.  There are several (or more if I think hard) people who I would not want to forgive for their transgressions.  It's much more satisfying wishing ill upon them and enjoying the control than it would be to forgive and move on.  That's a rather dull choice I would think.  It's all simply a matter of what brings you the wildest degree of peace.  ;-]"


Part of me is saying, forget his mindset, move on.  The other part of me is still processing the fact that I willingly participated a friendship with a man like this, when I knew better and ignored the red flags early in the friendship.  At some point, you stop obsessing over what happened and why and pick up where you left off in recovery.  The more forgiving part of myself says, hey, you needed one more look at this dynamic, one more experience to underscore the need to stay away.

Whatever the case, does this resonate with anyone?

Thanks, CrookedSmile

PS: I think another reason why I continue to think about this is because some part of me feels the "flea" effect from it all.  Just sayin.

[schwing]

Hi crookedsmile,

Part of it resonates with me.  My understanding of socialpaths is that they don't have any conscience; not that I am a professional or anything, I could be wrong about that.

"What's the point of forgiveness or forgiving?  Harboring ill feelings steels vigilance and feels better than the non-meaning that forgiving brings one.  Forgiving only pleases those who thought up old axioms.  It's a myth that forgiving makes one a 'better person.'  Forgiving also relaxes defenses which invites further harm.  I enjoy pulling out my list, smiling, sitting back and thinking... .'screw those sons of a hit_es!"

But seems to me this sounds like a whole lot of rationalization, rationalization in order to avoid coming to terms with feelings about oneself.  On a philosophical note, "forgiveness" does allow one to "relax defenses" which "invites further harm," but it also allows one to make oneself vulnerable again in order to experience the surrender associated with love.  To not get past that "forgiveness" would be to deny oneself the chance at love again.  I can see why this might be a difficult issue for someone with BPD, because to seek forgiveness would be to admit having caused someone wrong.  And it would be preferable for someone with black & white thinking to be angry, prefer to be the one who is wronged; to admit to having wronged someone else could lead to self-devaluation.

"The trick, which you will learn in time, Grasshopper, is in being able to control the degree to which one allows accompanying emotion to affect one, or not. Once you have total control over your emotions, it's a breeze.  There are several (or more if I think hard) people who I would not want to forgive for their transgressions.  It's much more satisfying wishing ill upon them and enjoying the control than it would be to forgive and move on.  That's a rather dull choice I would think.  It's all simply a matter of what brings you the wildest degree of peace.  ;-]"

What better self delusion for someone who has zero control over his emotions, than to pretend they have "total control" over their emotions?  "... .it's a breeze."  Ha.  It is "more satisfying"?  No.  It is easier and more convenient to pretend the other person has problems, and pretend that he is in "total control" of his emotions, than to admit to himself that he has a problem.  It is preferable for him to pretend to be a socialpath than to admit to himself that he has a serious mental illness he has no control over... . "wildest degree of peace."  Wild peace?  So bad it's good?  So wrong he's right?

Part of me is saying, forget his mindset, move on.  The other part of me is still processing the fact that I willingly participated a friendship with a man like this, when I knew better and ignored the red flags early in the friendship.  At some point, you stop obsessing over what happened and why and pick up where you left off in recovery.  The more forgiving part of myself says, hey, you needed one more look at this dynamic, one more experience to underscore the need to stay away.

You don't just "get over" betrayal or abandonment.  You don't just "move on" as if it's just a matter of discipline.  Part of why we still gravitate towards those who have broken our hearts is a bit of denial and very much a battered puppy syndrome.  You take care of yourself and nurture yourself as you recover.  You definitely don't blame yourself: I'm certain that you didn't fall for him because of his pretend socialpathic nonsense; he presented himself quite differently to you in the beginning... .they all do.  They are as good at seeing what other people want (and giving it to them for a short time), as they are blind to their own dysfunction.

PS: I think another reason why I continue to think about this is because some part of me feels the "flea" effect from it all.  Just sayin.

What sort of "fleas" do you think you are expressing?

Best wishes, Schwing

[MonkeyGurly]

Yes, almost all resonates and hurts... .   My now ex bf BPD would post similar crap pointed toward me on his dating profiles.   And they rant and rave depending on their moods... They do it in part in an attempt to hurt us,.  But mostly because they are not right   Are they just BPD or socipaths?  I think that they are both really. 

The control fact of this matter is he is the one who has no control or he would not be posting that stuff.  He has no control or he would move on, and he and they don't because they continue to contact us even thou we don't want nor welcome it. They have no self control and they love to project on us non BPD.

Yesterday got another text from him after a week with non.  Wasn't happy about it but NO I DID NOT RESPOND,    I am never going back to him ever

[drmom]

Does this resonate? ARE YOU KIDDING? YESSSSS!  I think anyone who is doing the NC thing with their BPD has experienced a "" of this sort. No, they are not "right"... .and at this point for me, the label doesn't matter. It is very hurtful to read such a post on facebook. I am experiencing the same thing. What is worse, is then reading the responses from those that don't know the entire story. Then, I give myself a little kick in the pants and remind myself that this person can't handle the nc and this is how they "engage" in a relationship without actually having one. Just a little BPD... .just a little sociopathic in nature.

This experience has taught me so much. I always remember that there are two sides to EVERY story. I also have learned that my personal wellness is to be treasured, nurtured and valued. I made a bad choice and got sucked into something I shouldn't have. On the other hand, I made a good choice and left the relationship. Sounds like you did the same thing. Pat yourself on the back, say a prayer of thanks and praise, and find some new, healthy friends! (and don't check facebook anymore) Good luck! Blessings to you!

[2010]

This guy is just seething with hostility. And if you get involved with someone who's seething in hostility- you're only in for one big train wreck down the line. Beware of people who see no point in resolving conflict and instead *accumulate* several "or more if he thinks hard!" objects of aggression. The World is against him. His statement of "It's much more satisfying wishing ill upon them and enjoying the control than it would be to forgive and move on." really is about fear that people will hurt him. His mind thinks, why not hurt them instead? A frightened, anxious fear of being dependent on people whom he figures are sadistic and cruel. He thinks it's better to strike out against others before they annihilate him. He uses the comment "wildest" degree of peace. He's showing you how he grew up and what happened to him as a child. Don't feel sorry for him. It's his choice to not seek resolution. Yours is another path to walk, free from his illness and away from his game.

The good news is that his reaction formation has nothing to do with you. You didn't cause it. You cannot control it and you certainly cannot cure it. While this guy may be attractive in other ways, he's not that hard to figure out mentally. His open book statements are a huge red flag that he's unstable- unsure and unwilling to meet people on a level playing field that shows respect. This guy wants a constantly moving goalpost to prove his point. Dont take the bait. He's a loser and a game player. Good riddance.  

[Intent_to_learn]

Schwing, thank you for your thoughtful response.  Yes, I believe much of what was said was defense mechanism to avoid the pain he feels.  Instead he pushes it outward and onto others.  Now that I am not in the picture, others are getting his wrath. 

What jumped out at me is your comment that I can't just get over this and move on.  You, of course, are so right. There is a process that one must go through, a grief process, all the stages of it, whether the relationship is healthy or not.  It is still a loss.  Pretending otherwise would be denial, I agree. Thank you for reminding me of that.  The support this forum makes available helps a lot.   I suspect time will take care of the rest.  This is an opportunity for me to learn and is an opportunity for spiritual growth as time moves along.  Until then, I am making an effort to take care of myself and give myself plenty of space.  Thank you for your well wishes Schwing.

Re fleas, I'm not sure, it's probably me doing a number on myself, a self-blame thing.

[Intent_to_learn]

Thank you monkeygurley and drmom.  Reading your responses gives me additional perspective and I feel way less alone in dealing with this.  And, heck, yes, I DID break away.  You're right! And I mean to stay away.  I want my wellness back.  That is where I will focus my energy. 

[Intent_to_learn]

Whew, 2010.  You said, "His reaction formation has nothing to do with you. You didn't cause it. You cannot control it and you certainly cannot cure it."

Wow. Just wow.  I just now realized from what you have said that I hung in there for a year because some magical thinking part of me thought I could make him better.  How grandiose of me and how unfair!  Of course I can't fix him.  In fact, I realize now that I only enabled his ill behavior! What's more, me giving so much time and energy toward making him "better" took away a ton of energy that I NEED for my own health and my own personal goals and pursuits.  Dang.  This is exactly what I needed to hear.  I was truly in a fog and totally unconscious.  Well, the good news is... .I'm awake now.  I'm alert and listening... .  thank you. 

And as far as Facebook goes, he is blocked.  I can't see him any more nor any of his posts.  No more "pain shopping" for me!