Wondering about my Mom

[Depression = 72% of members]

I had a difficult time growing up with my Mom. She had many of the symptoms of BPD. She would rage for hours at a time, and really not for any reason that justified it. It was so bad that she emotionally (and occasionally physically) abused her husband and children. There was constantly a mismatch between crime and punishment, confusing me about when I was good or bad. She never made me feel good when I felt bad (she wouldn't express her own emotions reasonably, and would not validate mine). No "hugs" or "I love you" or any other caring words. She also invaded my personal space by listening to my phone conversations and searching my room.

She easily turned on friends and family. When she did, she would go on about it endlessly. Telling me over and over about how someone had been mean to her. She very easily cut people out of her life. It reached the point of paranoia. People were either good or evil, it seemed. I think she pushed away some decent, if flawed, people over the years.

Being in public with Mom is very awkward. She was always nervous about how everyone saw her and her family. If someone did the slightest thing "embarrassing", she would make a nasty remark. But, to the rest of the world, outside the family, she managed to keep a "mask" of civility. Things didn't get crazy until it was just the family again (often in the car on the way home).

My Dad is still with her. Despite decades of abuse, he has always provided for her and she is dependent on him. Mom never really did much work outside the home, though she has some talents with filing and bookkeeping. Dad took a lot of abuse, and I kind of resent him for not standing up for himself. As a male, I needed a father with a backbone.

One thing my Mom didn't seem to do, which is common with BPD, is self-abuse. I've never known her to abuse substances or food or money. Nor any sign of a desire to commit suicide. Maybe I just don't know that side of her.

I resent her endless rage and the dark cloud of negativity she created in the family. But I still try to love her despite her unaffectionate ways.

Can someone be BPD without obvious signs of self-abuse?

[isshebpd]

I had a difficult time growing up with my Mom. She had many of the symptoms of BPD. She would rage for hours at a time, and really not for any reason that justified it. It was so bad that she emotionally (and occasionally physically) abused her husband and children. There was constantly a mismatch between crime and punishment, confusing me about when I was good or bad. She never made me feel good when I felt bad (she wouldn't express her own emotions reasonably, and would not validate mine). No "hugs" or "I love you" or any other caring words. She also invaded my personal space by listening to my phone conversations and searching my room.

She easily turned on friends and family. When she did, she would go on about it endlessly. Telling me over and over about how someone had been mean to her. She very easily cut people out of her life. It reached the point of paranoia. People were either good or evil, it seemed. I think she pushed away some decent, if flawed, people over the years.

Being in public with Mom is very awkward. She was always nervous about how everyone saw her and her family. If someone did the slightest thing "embarrassing", she would make a nasty remark. But, to the rest of the world, outside the family, she managed to keep a "mask" of civility. Things didn't get crazy until it was just the family again (often in the car on the way home).

My Dad is still with her. Despite decades of abuse, he has always provided for her and she is dependent on him. Mom never really did much work outside the home, though she has some talents with filing and bookkeeping. Dad took a lot of abuse, and I kind of resent him for not standing up for himself. As a male, I needed a father with a backbone.

One thing my Mom didn't seem to do, which is common with BPD, is self-abuse. I've never known her to abuse substances or food or money. Nor any sign of a desire to commit suicide. Maybe I just don't know that side of her.

I resent her endless rage and the dark cloud of negativity she created in the family. But I still try to love her despite her unaffectionate ways.

Can someone be BPD without obvious signs of self-abuse?

[whiletheseasonspass]

Dear IssheBPD,

I'm sorry for your problems with your Mom     

I also see that this is your first post.  That said there is another board on this Website that would be of more help to you.  I can't move your post but you would be in the right place if you placed this same exact post on the board dealing with BPD parents... .

https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?board=7.0

Best to you

wtsp

[Tumbleweed]

Dear IsshBPD,

I'm sorry to hear about your experiences with your mom. They very much mirror my own. Especially that mask of civility. In my family we call it the "Picture Window" effect. When I was a teenager my family bought a house with a large picture window. We had a 6' Christmas tree that my mom insisted that we replace with a 9' tree so that it would "look right" in the window. Everything you saw in the window was picture perfect and looked like a Norman Rockwell painting. Everything behind that, however, more often resembled the destruction of Dante's Inferno. It was pretty bad. So when we went out in public and mom insisted that everyone had to be perfection when in reality our family was a crumbling mess ruled by an iron fist we just shrugged it off as the "picture window". I have come to have a real disdain for people that I perceive to be false or "fronting" for that reason.

My mom never showed signs of self abuse until after my step-father died. Then there have been two suicide attempts in two years. I would have said that my mom didn't show any of those signs (and she didn't really for 25+ years) but I think it may have just been that I didn't notice them. I know that doesn't much help your question.

I applaud your attempts to work things through with your mom. It is a tough thing to do (I've given up on it myself because it was so difficult) and takes a lot of strength (and good boundaries).

Tumbleweed

[mooseareloose]

Dear IsshBPD,

I'm very new to this and in fact joined last week. Your post touched me because I, too, have a U BPD M (trying to the abbreviations too).  I couldn't believe how similar my mother sounds to yours.  She also is still married to my father after all these years of abuse, but he is an enabler and makes excuses for all her abuse.  ie "She says she hates you because she's lonely or she just had a hysterectomy." He travels often for work and either brings her with him or ships her to one of my siblings houses since she cannot be alone. 

She also does not have drug abuse or self abuse as far as I know, but has been depressed and medicated a lot for that.  I often wonder the same thing you do, that she does have suicidal thoughts but hides it well and I don't see that side. Or maybe my father prevents that behavior by enabling.  I often wondered like you do if someone is BPD without exhibiting these behaviors.  According to what I've read (the more experienced board members please help), to be diagnosed with borderline personality disorder, a person must show an enduring pattern of behavior that includes at least five of nine symptoms.  So while my mom doesn't have all nine including the self abuse, she definitely has 5-7 of the other symptoms (ie extreme reactions, stormy relationships). 

Hope that helps.  The other thought I had was that my mom was also very good at keeping her "mask" of civility too.  I remember her having a tantrum on the floor crying and screaming how much she hates me, then the phone would ring and she would get up and answer in a completely normal voice.  I was bewildered by this, but maybe this ability to mask her disorder to the outside world, may also mask some of her symptoms to her family.  Is that possible?

I resent my mom's negativity too, but I must still love her somehow for her to affect me so. 

For the first time ever, I went from limited contact to no contact this summer after she attacked me.  Now, I'm struggling with the holidays.  Do you maintain limited contact with your mother?

Mooseareloose

[GeekyGirl]

Hi IssheBPD,  Hi!

Welcome, and I'm sorry that you're going through this with your mother. To answer your question, it's possible to have BPD without showing signs of suicidial thoughts. It's not uncommon for a high-functioning person with BPD to not have self-harming or suicidial behavior.

According to what I've read (the more experienced board members please help), to be diagnosed with borderline personality disorder, a person must show an enduring pattern of behavior that includes at least five of nine symptoms. 

Yes, according to the DSM-IV, which is what clinicians use to diagnose mental health issues, this is correct. A good friend of mine who works in the mental health field said, though, "Even if you only fit four out of nine symptoms, that doesn't mean that you don't have BPD traits."

My mother is also an undiagnosed person with BPD, and I'm finding that I need to look at her behaviors and develop healthy responses to them than it is to focus on whether she actually has BPD--she's not likely to seek a diagnosis.

How are you working through your conflicting emotions of love and resentment?

How is your relationship with your father now?

As you've seen, you're not alone here. Many of us struggle with the same emotions that you described and understand where you're coming from.

[rmsquared]

Welcome!

Your story resonates with mine.  I also have a BPD mom, with the phony outward appearances, the awkwardness, everything.  My relationship is, however, too toxic.  She became a serious problem for my anxiety and PTSD, to the point where I had to sever all ties for my mental nd physical health to improve.  That was 5 months ago, and I am loving it.  That being said, I only recommend that if you really can't have any sort of a positive relationship with your mom, because it is a hard step to take, and not always the right one.

Good luck dealing with things, it isn't easy.

[isshebpd]

Follow-up after to talking to uBPDm:

First, I never heard of BPD until my Mom mentioned it very recently.

For some reason we were talking about her older sister, who died many years ago. Her older sister was an eccentric old hippy and a substance abuser. Even though she lived in our house for a time (in a basement apartment), when I was a child, I never saw the BPD in my aunt. I remember her sunbathing in the nude (ewww) but also reading the Narnia Chronicles to my sister and I while we ate turkish delight. And I remember one day, my Aunt packing up and leaving with my Mom saying nasty things about her as she drove away. My Aunt never settled down to have a family, and may have been infertile as she did have a few husbands over her life. She then lived in dive apartments in dumpy parts of town, until she died in her 60s after her hard life.

My Mom feels she was the victim of her older sister. Numerous times in my life, she has reminded myself and others about the time, my Mom and her younger sister hid in closet while older sister supposedly raged so much she ripped a phone out of the wall. Keep in mind, older sister was many years older than the younger two sisters (thanks to WW2). When my Mom was 12, her father died leaving his wife a widow with the two younger daughters, and a fall from middle class to just scraping by.

A couple of days ago, when my Mom was in a stable mood (she is often better these days because I think she is talking medication), I asked her what she meant about her older sister having BPD. Rather than hating on her deceased older sister, she seemed to have a little more sympathy for her. But she also said that, with her BPD, she is glad her older sister never had children... .

... .uh, wait a minute, I thought to myself. Either she is admiting she herself has BPD and shouldn't have had children... .or she isn't aware she (probably) has BPD. She knows something is wrong with her because I suspect she is medicated now, and is reading a book about "mood disorders" I saw on her kitchen counter.

Wanting to keep my Mom in a good mood, I didn't press further. But I did remember, in my own mind, something peculiar my Mom has sometimes done while raging at me over the years. She compared me to older sister. I'm a guy, so I always found it odd.   Though I'm also the eldest of three kids, I'm nothing like her older sister. But if she is one of her messed up moods, I might get compared to her older sister. what the heck?  ? I'm not the only one, though, as I recall she's made the comparison between her older sister and other family members. Maybe I just notice it most when she talked about me.

Do I want to ask my Mom why she did that? Why she compared me to her hated older sister? Do I go there now, when she seems to be trying to heal? Did she give me extra abuse because she somehow made me older sister in her mind? "You're just like (sister's name)" she would say. Totally messed up.

While its not the "walking on eggshells" of my childhood, I have to watch for when I trip a mine in her mental minefield. If Dad is around, I can see the pain on his face if I somehow "cause" my Mom to escalate (a word from my past work in customer service). She is better than she used to be, but still has her bad days. On her good days, I feel like I'm talking to a different woman from the crazy woman who raised me.

Reading between the lines, I think she knows she might have BPD. I asked her how she came to the conclusion her sister had it. She was vague, saying a couple of people have told that might have been the case. Who are these people? Therapists maybe? Has the therapist told her SHE has BPD. Did it sink in?

Does she now feel guiltly for the decades of rage and emotional abuse, especially to my Dad and me, and to some extent to my two younger siblings? I think she does, but I can't be certain. I'd like her to one day come out and clearly say "I'm sorry. I raised three children while BPD. I messed up, I should have sought help but I didn't."

As for Dad. GeekyGirl asked about Dad. I get along with him. We have never been that close as our interests are quite different. He is jumpy and what I call hyper-responsible. Despite being under constant emotional bombardment from Mom, he has done well with his business (he is a professional engineer) and I respect him for that. I don't like the way he didn't stop Mom from going crazy all the time when we were growing up. I hope he understands he should have done more for the sake of his kids, and his own sanity. You can't fix the past, I guess.

As for me, I'm trying to work this all out in my head now. Finally admitting to myself that what went on in our childhood wasn't right. That it messed me up. I have anxiety (with IBS flare-ups when its really bad) and abuse substances (marijuana and alcohol). But I have a wife of 20 years and a good relationship. My wife also believes my Mom is BPD. We've discussed it at length. She has always been afraid of her MIL. My sisters husband also watches himself around my Mom, and clearly understands she is troubled.

I guess I should get therapy now that I sort of understand why my childhood was so messed up. I'm still putting the pieces together, still trying to get perspective on what happened. It wasn't good, and I need to finally heal.

Oh BTW, my Mom also severed ties with her younger sister a few years ago after squabbling over a relatives estate. I think she is finally realizing it was a mistake but she can't bring herself to build a new bridge. She can't quite admit her hate is wrong though. She can never admit she was wrong about anything... .or apologize.

[isshebpd]

One more thing I forgot to mention about the last visit with Mom:

We had a more pleasant conversation then I'm used to. Mom seemed in a really good mood. When we were leaving, I thought I'd try to something I don't recall ever doing:

As I was leaving, I softly hugged her and said "I love you".

She responded with a blank expression and stared to the ground. She said nothing.

What does that mean? Does my Mom love me? Do I really love her?

I spent years away from her, and I remember coming home six years ago at the airport. When I arrived I had forgotten how unaffectionate she is to me. Even after not seeing her for years, I didn't see much emotion in her face.

I used to ignore this lack of genuine emotion. But now that she is getting older, at some point I'm going to have to help her in some way. Will I do it out of obligation or out of love? Why should I do it, if its not for love?

My wife tells me when she arrives home after being away, the first thing her Mom does is hug her like crazy.   

[GeekyGirl]

As I was leaving, I softly hugged her and said "I love you".

She responded with a blank expression and stared to the ground. She said nothing.

What does that mean? Does my Mom love me? Do I really love her?

It may just be that she's not comfortable with showing emotion. It's really hard to say what's going on in someone's head when they don't react at all. That doesn't give you much to work with. Some people (including people without BPD) just aren't comfortable with showing affection, which might be the case with your mother.

Do you really love her? It's possible to love someone and not like the things they do. Do you think that's the case?

[isshebpd]

I don't know if I love my Mom. All my life, any attempt to express my emotions around her was met with a fit of rage or a detached yet digging comment. So I rarely did it. I never let her know my feelings, and she seemed happy that way.

I don't think its normal for a mother to act like this. My sister, who has two young children, has no problem showing them affection... .even though she didn't get any obvious affection from our Mom either. I have a feeling my sister set out to purposely be a different Mom from her Mom. Good for her, I suppose.

I don't know how I feel about my Mom. I just don't know.

[Cordelia]

Our mothers sound very similar.  My mom would always compare me to her mother (who she hated) or my dad (who she also hated).  I think it's that people like this are very self-absorbed in their own issues and don't really see those around them as individuals.  The only thing that matters to them is how they feel so if someone else in their life once made them annoyed, and now you are annoying them, it's exactly the same experience to them.  They can't perceive the difference in the situations, how one situation is between two spouses (in my case) and one was between mother and child.  All they know is they are annoyed and they hate feeling that way and blame the person "causing" it. 

It's very hard to love a parent who doesn't show you affection and directs mostly rage and blame and crazy talk at you.      Although I've grown to respect the challenges my mom faced and how she tried to overcome them, and I believe she loved me to the best of her ability, my feelings for her are not like those of most children towards their mothers.  No trust, warmth, feeling of closeness or being understood and accepted, etc.  I've come to accept the situation with her - I've been lucky to experience love, real love, in other parts of my life - but it's definitely a real loss and a deep pain that I was never able to really be close to her, and actually had to give up on efforts to create that closeness in order to protect myself from further abuse.  Don't blame yourself for feeling the way you do - accept that any feelings you have are natural and normal responses to a very difficult situation - and eventually you will come to know how you feel more clearly. 

[isshebpd]

I've been experiencing the "Breakthrough Crisis". I've never had formal therapy so I've just been reading like crazy. I'm starting to realize a lot of things about Mom and others in my family. I now believe my brother has NPD, and that's why I've been avoiding him. My parents still feed his ego, which disgusts me to no end. Good thing others see it. My wife, my sister and my sisters husband all seem upset with the dynamic of "uBPDmom", "uNPDbro" and "victimdad".

My wife just told me I could have PTSD, and may have had it for a long time. I'm working part-time. On my days off I'm abusing marijuana and alcohol (can't do it while I'm working, which I guess is a good thing). My Dad, brother and I have used marijuana since always, to deal with uBPDmom. My use of alcohol has been sporadic throughout my life, with periods of heavy drinking between years of no drinking much.

Time for therapy at the age of 43. My wife feels bad, she dealt with her own problems (abusive alcoholic father) 20 years ago. Why didn't I wake up when I was still young?

[Pilpel]

issheBPD

About the self-harming, I was just wondering if you know much about her life before she started having kids?  I don't think my uBPD sil self-harms now that she's married and has kids.  But she had an eating disorder when she was younger.  She had severe depression and suicidal thoughts after her first child (that put her in the hospital) --she describes it as post pardum depression.  But she was a major witch/queen terror leading up to this "ppd" episode.  Now that she's a mom and feeling more secure in her marriage, she's quite a bit more calm and reasonable.  Still difficult in her way, but not as amped up like she was.

[isshebpd]

My parents were quite young when I was born, just 21. They have never hidden the fact that I was totally unexpected and I suspect that it was a difficult time for them.

I don't know much about their life at the time, but I think my Mom's original trauma may have been the loss of her Dad when she was just 12 (by the way, my Dad was only 14 when his father died). Mom had other trauma's too, from what I understand. One time she was talking about her experiences as a teen. She didn't say much but it was clear those were painful times.

From what I've read, my Mom is a Hermit/Witch. She is mostly high-functioning but her social anxiety can be obvious. Its the reason why I've never liked to be in public with her. You can see how miserable she is at social functions. One time, she freaked out at the wedding of a friend's daughter, and forced us all to storm out with her (I didn't feel like I had an option  :'(  ). That stunt ended a friendship she had for decades (with the mother of the bride) and left me totally confused. Its not like she has many friends.

[InaMinorRole]

IssheBPD, first, I'm sorry for all this stuff you go through.

You asked if your mom would qualify for a diagnosis of BPD. I'd like to put this in perspective. They argue among themselves when putting together the DSM-IV as to what to call what and where to draw lines. When it comes to personality disorders there are very blurry lines between what are called Cluster B personality disorders: borderline, histrionic, narcissistic, and anti-social. The reason is that most cluster B's have symptoms from more than one category. And it can look like a matter of semantics when trying to say the difference between someone who cares only about themselves, for example - that can be narcissism, that can be anti-social, that can be borderline. The same when someone will lie or do literally anything to get what they want, with no moral compass. There is more than one category you can plug that into.

So the bottom line is, if it looks like a duck and quacks like a duck, it's a duck. If you are resonating with what a lot of what people are saying here, good enough. Nobody's family member is going to be exactly identical to anybody else's, even if they have the exact same diagnosis.

When I took my very first college psych class they drilled into us that the purpose of the field of psychology was to "describe, predict, and control." If what you read in these forums does a pretty good job of describing what you deal with, so that it helps you predict what she's going to come up with next, and most of all, so that you can control your relationship with her so that it's not toxic to you, then that's all anybody can ask.

[mindfulness]

My mom never really showed overt signs of self-abuse. However, she did do a lot of reckless/impulsive things, which is another sign of BPD. In a way, that is a form of self-abuse, because you are engaging in potentially risky behavior, usually as a way to get attention or be rescued, the same thing that motivates a lot of self-abuse in BPD. Maybe your mother was more along that continuum?

All of that being said, I think it's totally possible to be BPD without the self-abuse. That is just one more severe feature of it, it doesn't make or break the diagnosis.

[Pilpel]

issheBPD, you talk about your mom's original trauma and traumas during her teens.  Do you mean trauma that you think caused the BPD?  Just questioning that b/c my uBPD sil claims she was abused when she was a kid.  Yet her parents are completely different --in fact I think they're the only people who have really strong boundaries around her.  Any time she my sil talks about being hurt or mistreated by others, I take her story with a grain of salt, because she always sees herself as a victim --even when people are responding to her bullying .

[isshebpd]

":)o you mean trauma that you think caused the BPD?"

Yes, yes, I do think that is a major source of her disorder. Like a lot of mental health disorders, BPD seems to stem from both biological risks and environmental risks. Mom may have already been at biological risk but having her father die suddenly when she was at such vulnerable age must have been the kind of thing brings on BPD. Other things, like sexual abuse, are perhaps too difficult for me to even consider.

Keep in mind, your SIL could have been abused by someone other than her parents. Any adult in a position of trust can damage a child. I haven't come across anything yet about BPD-sufferers faking child abuse, so I can't say any more.

As to always seeing herself as a victim. Yeah, even as her child, I was guilted and shamed when I tried to respond to her rages. She started lots of circular and no-win arguments which hurt my ability to stand up for myself in all parts of my life. No matter what I said or how much I apologized, the mother kept the emotional attack going until I just stood there not saying anything... .  waiting for it to end. To this day, I don't know how to handle face-to-face confrontations, like when my brother has one of his temper tantrums.

[isshebpd]

Actually, I guess people with BPD could fake child abuse. I mean, why not? They seem to have general problems with what is truth and reality. What a horrible thing to do though. 

I know my Mom has repeatedly told a story about how her older sister abused her and had a violent temper. I really don't think her older sister was violent or abusive. Mind you, her older sister may have changed later in life. This is the same older sister my Mom used to project on to me. "You're being just like (older sister)".

[isshebpd]

mindfullness,

I think the main thing is whether the BPD sufferer goes inward or outward with their anger/self-hate. My Mom went outward, trying to pass it on to everyone else around her. To the extent she hurt herself, it was in isolating herself and ending relationships. Now that she is apparently getting better (fingers crossed), I can tell she regrets not having certain people in her life anymore.

[isshebpd]

"So the bottom line is, if it looks like a duck and quacks like a duck, it's a duck."

More or less exactly what my wife said. It could be some combo of disorders, but BPD appears to be the main thing Mom has.

"If what you read in these forums does a pretty good job of describing what you deal with, so that it helps you predict what she's going to come up with next, and most of all, so that you can control your relationship with her so that it's not toxic to you, then that's all anybody can ask."

At this point its about creating a relationship with her that I could never have growing up and throughout my life. She must be in therapy. Lots of damage done, but I'm willing to forgive her. I just wish she could show affection to me and my siblings. I hug her but the she has difficultly hugging back. I say "I love you" and she stares to the floor.

The only aggressive behaviour I experienced this Christmas was from my brother (narcissistic rage, I believe), but that's whole other kettle of fish (easy to limit or end contact with him).

[InaMinorRole]

"At this point its about creating a relationship with her that I could never have growing up and throughout my life."

I just hope you aren't setting yourself up to be hurt.

[isshebpd]

Point taken, InaMinorRole.

Something else I need to get off my chest:

When I went to University, my uBPDmom decided to go to University too. She had left University when she was pregnant with me. I have nothing against the fact that she wanted to resume her education at that time in her life, especially considering she wasn't working and hadn't held a job for decades. She also had no choice but to go the one University in the city we lived in at the time (my Dad was working at the University so she probably got a spousal discount or something).

Here is what shocked and confused me: she went into the same program as me. She took the same Major. And started doing it at the same time.

I switched Majors, by the way. Why the hell would my uBPDmom do that to me? I really couldn't process it. My uBPDmom's explanation was it was something that always interested her. But it was too much of a coincidence for me to handle.

[isshebpd]

Feeling the pressure, inside and outside.

DW is 40 and still is uninterested in having children. I feel pretty much the same way. Although we have an average income and no debt, we both have deep issues and no real job security. She takes meds for OCD too, thanks to her abusive (emotionally and some physical) alcoholic father.

uBPDmom talks up the idea of grandchildren a lot lately. She has two already, from my sister, and they visit her and Dad. Note, semi-retired Dad is around unlike when we were kids. BIL knows uBPDmom has troubles, and his family won't socialize with my family (including innocent bystanders) because of it (something happened, I'll always wonder what went down).

One of these days I have to tell uBPDmom, "No, it isn't happening". I dread that day.

(its possible one of us is infertile, but we've never bothered to check into it since we figured the birth control was doing its job)

[GeekyGirl]

Here is what shocked and confused me: she went into the same program as me. She took the same Major. And started doing it at the same time.

I switched Majors, by the way. Why the hell would my uBPDmom do that to me? I really couldn't process it. My uBPDmom's explanation was it was something that always interested her. But it was too much of a coincidence for me to handle.

Well, keep in mind that many people with BPD struggle with identity, and perhaps your mother gets a lot of her identity through you. Did your mother imitate you in other ways? It's also possible, although unlikely, that your mother saw your enthusiasm for your major and developed her own interest in it. Or maybe she realized that she could go back to school and thought it would be easier if you two could study together? Whatever her reason was, I'd feel the same way you felt. College is where many people go to really grow as individuals and branch out; to be in class with your mother would have robbed you of that experience.

One of these days I have to tell uBPDmom, "No, it isn't happening". I dread that day.

It's not uncommon for parents (even ones without BPD) to pile on the pressure when it comes to the subject of having grandchildren.   What are you most worried about when you think about telling your mother that you likely won't have kids?

[isshebpd]

I don't think she generally imitated me and can't think of any other examples at this time. She was a hermit usually, watching TV with an irritated look on her face.

Thankfully, we never ended up in the same class. Maybe the department made sure of that? I mean how would a university department react if a parent might be stalking their adult child? I avoided the department because my uBPDmom was around there often, and never made connections to classmates in my area of study. Within a semester or two I switched it to my minor so I didn't take any more courses there, and made my minor my major.

I was really busy in University so I was able to sort of ignore the presence of my uBPDmom. I was very involved in clubs/societies and had an on-campus job, so I made a lot of social contacts. But I only asked women out when someone else told me they liked me (usually a buddy). I was too nervous/anxious otherwise. I'm like the anti-narcissist finding complements hard to take, and I can be really hard on myself for my (perceived?) shortcomings. Its a good thing I was able to follow the crowd in University (high school too), so I could socialize.

Back to uBPDmom, I guess I can never figure out all her motivations. But I knew her actions, which were stalking and trying to interfere with my life. Huge boundaries issues, which I also maybe had at that time. I think I was dumped a couple of times because I didn't properly understand boundaries. I had a breakdown after my second year of University, when I almost dropped-out and engaged in heavy substance abuse. I think the source of my breakdown was uBPDmom. It was then that I switched my major and minor. I wish I had seen a therapist at the time, but my Mom's anti-therapist belief was in my head.

Even if she wasn't disturbed, no parent should do that to their child, ever. I had trouble in HS, was almost expelled and was thrown in the drunk-tank at 16. My grades were barely acceptable for entering University. I needed emotional support from uBPDmom not weirdness and raging.

[isshebpd]

Re: not having kids. I don't know how she'll react. She seems mentally better lately. Often acting much different than I've ever known before. DW notices it too, so I know its not just me who realizes it. Its the unknown that I dread.

[InaMinorRole]

If she really presses you on the grandchildren thing you can use passive voice and say it looks like that may not happen. If she asks what the matter is, say it's personal and you don't wish to get into it. And then there's your boundary right there. Nothing else she says from that point will induce you to say any more about it. Change the subject to her other grandchildren, or the weather, or anything. But it's personal, and you're not going to get into it. If you say you don't want children it will just be a big argument. You're smart to think in advance about what is going to cause a problem and come up with ways to head it off before it turns into a big deal.

[isshebpd]

re grandchildren: good advice.

Back to uBPDmom stalking me in University. Was she mirroring? If that's the case, than she thought she was me, right? If that's the case, she has gender confusion too, maybe?

I've only read a bit about mirroring, but that seems to fit.   

BTW I believe I've mirrored before, but nothing like that. I'm not sure if doing a bit of mirroring is    or something everyone does.

[GeekyGirl]

It's very possible that your mother was mirroring while you were in school. I think it has a lot to do with wanting an identity and seeing your interest in the subject. As for the gender identity goes, is there anything else that would make you think that she is unsure of her gender?

I've heard that in small doses, mirroring behavior can be a good thing. In conversation, when two people mirror each other's body language (facing each other, crossing legs the same way, etc), it means that they're both very involved and engaged in the discussion. It's sometimes completely involuntary.