Am an idiot...

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I reached out to my ex again asking her to be honest about when she started her relationship.  She has ignored all my previous requests.

I don't know why I feel the need to do that.   In my head I need to know that it started a lot earlier than when we broke up so that I know just how disordered she is.

The fact that she hasn't been able to do it for a year should have been enough for me.

I am terrified by the backlash now.   

I can't get in to see a therapist until the end of next month so am really struggling in the mean time. 

I am such a fool.    I have just reopened my wounds and hurt myself.   She will be laughing at me for doing this and using it as ammunition in her games of bad mouthing me to others.

I have done nothing to interfere with her new relationship nor exposed her many lies to her family and friends.    I am not vindictive.

I am simply hurt and felt that I needed that closure to stop blaming myself for it all, as she likes to do.

Having my head say "it's because she has BPD" is easy... .  Getting my heart to accept it and not turn the angst on myself is difficult.  That is what I need to speak to a therapist about.

[really]

I reached out to my ex again asking her to be honest about when she started her relationship.  She has ignored all my previous requests.

I don't know why I feel the need to do that.   In my head I need to know that it started a lot earlier than when we broke up so that I know just how disordered she is.

The fact that she hasn't been able to do it for a year should have been enough for me.

I am terrified by the backlash now.   

I can't get in to see a therapist until the end of next month so am really struggling in the mean time. 

I am such a fool.    I have just reopened my wounds and hurt myself.   She will be laughing at me for doing this and using it as ammunition in her games of bad mouthing me to others.

I have done nothing to interfere with her new relationship nor exposed her many lies to her family and friends.    I am not vindictive.

I am simply hurt and felt that I needed that closure to stop blaming myself for it all, as she likes to do.

Having my head say "it's because she has BPD" is easy... .  Getting my heart to accept it and not turn the angst on myself is difficult.  That is what I need to speak to a therapist about.

[seeking balance]

an addiction is hard to kick, my advice is to start going to CODA meetings - they are free and available most places.

Replacing "ex, she, her" with heroin - you know it will hurt you and you do it anyways... .  are you an idiot - no, I would say you are an addict.

Using a DBT skills approach in your scenerio would be:

- what emotion are you feeling when the need to contact her occurs

- what can you do instead? 

This won't be easy and beating yourself up for something you did in the past isn't going to help.  Figuring out a strategy for next time is what I would focus on if I were in your shoes.

Peace,

SB

[Jay08]

Its like that saying, you dont know the stoves hot until you touch it yourself, no matter who warns you not to. Lesson is learned brother, she is who she is and you cant change that. NC really does work, not overnight but give it at least a few weeks and youll start feelin better

[really]

Thanks for the responses.


Well the gates of hell are about to probably open.  Her boss has been on my Linkedin page so am sure that she will be in contact via my firm... .  have not contacted her by work emails but her work email is the only one I know.

Had to go cap in hand to my boss to explain the situation... .  felt like a bit of a goose.

Have been an idiot.   Expecting that she will have a good side, be capable of understanding the hurt she caused... .  Nope.    Nope.  Nope.

Thanks for the recommendation for the CODA groups.   Have tracked one down in my city.

[Take2]

You are most definitely not an idiot.  It sounds like you feel compelled to continue trying to make sense out of a situation that won't ever make sense.  I know all too well.  I keep doing the same thing.  Not seeking closure (I don't even need closure and can't get it anyway as we work together) - I just keep asking questions that I feel like might help me understand how someone could lack empathy to the extent that my ex does... .  and nope, it's never once helped me... .   

Keep trying to maintain the focus on you and why you continue to seek closure.  Forget closure (a ridiculous statement, I know) - just concentrate on what makes YOU feel better... .    you will remember that you are NOT an idiot... .  you are a normal human being... .     who deserves to move forward... .  

[really]

Well when someone will involve her work colleagues, and damage my reputation (and at one stage my liberty) rather than taking 5 mins out of their life to be honest about things... .  it does really show how disordered they are. 

Sitting here shaking at the moment.   

She may have be beautiful and nice (in rare moments) but she has a nasty side far worse than anything I have experienced.

Shame I have given up drinking for a few months as could certainly do with a beer right now.

[Jay08]

I would stop contacting her because shes probably gonna use that as leverage and say your stalking her or something.

Besides, i got closure about a week ago, and let me tell you although satisfying, it was only for the wrong reasons. First of all, it wasnt the type of closure i expected, (i.e. her apologizing for what she did and realizing her mistakes while crying to me, making me think maybe there was a sense of humanity in her), it was more along the lines of her pm me to tell me i looked good, she got butterflys and i should come back over. The only closure i got out of it was retaining the power i lost, its not as great as you think, and right now if she did respond to you, she would attempt a recycle and in your state of mind there is a possibility you could go back to her and the process would start all over.

Let yourself heal first, after a month or two you wont care anymore, and i GUARANTEE she will wonder why your not talking to her anymore, she will probably contact you and youll get what you want. Only thing is, your not gonna care anymore or want it anymore, and your sadness will by then be anger and youll probably be furious that she even contacted you. The grief stage is really a comical thing, go through the motions brother, you will see what im talking about.

[really]

Am on the other side of the world from her now.   She is engaged.    There won't be a recycle.  I don't want it anyway... .  i simply wanted her to be honest... .  

Even Lance Armstrong (narcissist and cheat sadly) can summon the decency to be honest.

[FoolishOne]

Jay is on it.  Keep your eye what's ahead of you... .  because nothing good can come from what's behind you.

[Jay08]

Am on the other side of the world from her now.   She is engaged.    There won't be a recycle.  I don't want it anyway... .  i simply wanted her to be honest... .  

Even Lance Armstrong (narcissist and cheat sadly) can summon the decency to be honest.

Ahhh... Engagement means nothing. If you were engaged to her she would have done the same thing, would an engagment have stopped her?

His fate will be like yours, and so will the next guys, and so forth. There will be a recycle attempt if he leaves her first, i seen it with my ex. When i broke it off with her she immediately called her exes before me. It was only when she broke it off with me did she pull this crap, and thank god she did, i would never have left her.

Can i ask you why you want her to answer your question? I know the whole closure part, but what do you expect to get out of it or for her to say to you? Think deeply, and ask yourself if her response will actually make you feel better?

How would you react if she said:

"I was cheating on you the last few months of our relationship"

Maybe she is being decent and does not want to tell you because she knows the answer is not one you want to hear.

[really]

I have no doubt she was cheating on me for the last few months of the relationship.   That's what she does...   That's what she did with her previous partner.   And she was wearing my engagement ring for a good while but hadn't announced it... .  

Was a complete mess.   

He won't leave her.   She knows how to suck people in.  Her previous partner said he had lost all faith in relationships after she broke up with him.

As for the question... .  knowing that she cheated on me for months would really help me accept it was 100% her.   

I even said... .  I don't care when it started... .  I just want to know the truth.

That's never going to happen... .  Truth doesn't exist in her world.

[seeking balance]

As for the question... .  knowing that she cheated on me for months would really help me accept it was 100% her.   

Do you mean that you want the relationship ending to be 100% her fault?

[Jay08]

As for the question... .  knowing that she cheated on me for months would really help me accept it was 100% her.   

Do you mean that you want the relationship ending to be 100% her fault?

I think seekingbalance is right. You want her to realize she was the one who messed up. But as you probably know, BPD mentality has defenses towards that.

You can not outsmart a psychopath on these terms. Deep down she knows shes at fault however.

You said it yourself:

1. You have no doubt she was cheating the past few months, so you do not need her to tell you that, you know it.

2. You know she has a history with her ex partners. She has a pattern of this, just as all of them have their own patters. She will do this continuosly.

We all know it was 100% her fault. You want her to admit it, she will not. The fact she wont admit it, is admission. She has nothing to say to you because she does not want to feel her shame. Her lack of response is an admission of guilt. You win.

Check your pms in a second.

[seeking balance]

As for the question... .  knowing that she cheated on me for months would really help me accept it was 100% her.   

Do you mean that you want the relationship ending to be 100% her fault?

I think seekingbalance is right. You want her to realize she was the one who messed up. But as you probably know, BPD mentality has defenses towards that.

You can not outsmart a psychopath on these terms. Deep down she knows shes at fault however.

You said it yourself:

1. You have no doubt she was cheating the past few months, so you do not need her to tell you that, you know it.

2. You know she has a history with her ex partners. She has a pattern of this, just as all of them have their own patters. She will do this continuosly.

We all know it was 100% her fault. You want her to admit it, she will not. The fact she wont admit it, is admission. She has nothing to say to you because she does not want to feel her shame. Her lack of response is an admission of guilt. You win.

Check your pms in a second.

Jay - BPD is not a psychopath; I know you are trying to be supportive... .  please be respectful of the differences.

[FoolishOne]

Hey "really"... .  I know what you mean about "100% her fault"... .  but something that I think we've all been learning in this process is that we all have a stake in it.  I am not saying you are to blame here... .  just saying that later (maybe not now), you will be able to see how you were a willing participant in this tragedy. I certainly know I was/ am.

Whether I am co-dependent, or needed to be the knight in shining armor... .  the fact remains that a normal person would have ran far away after her first "stunt".  I stayed for it all and wanted more.

Hopefully, you can get something out of this terrible experience... .  something that will make you a better person and a better partner in your next relationship.  At least, that's what I'm hoping for.

F1

[Jay08]

As for the question... .  knowing that she cheated on me for months would really help me accept it was 100% her.   

Do you mean that you want the relationship ending to be 100% her fault?

I think seekingbalance is right. You want her to realize she was the one who messed up. But as you probably know, BPD mentality has defenses towards that.

You can not outsmart a psychopath on these terms. Deep down she knows shes at fault however.

You said it yourself:

1. You have no doubt she was cheating the past few months, so you do not need her to tell you that, you know it.

2. You know she has a history with her ex partners. She has a pattern of this, just as all of them have their own patters. She will do this continuosly.

We all know it was 100% her fault. You want her to admit it, she will not. The fact she wont admit it, is admission. She has nothing to say to you because she does not want to feel her shame. Her lack of response is an admission of guilt. You win.

Check your pms in a second.

Jay - BPD is not a psychopath; I know you are trying to be supportive... .  please be respectful of the differences.

You are correct, but IMO anybody who can not experience empathy is a psycopath. I should have used cluster b. My apologies.

[seeking balance]

As for the question... .  knowing that she cheated on me for months would really help me accept it was 100% her.   

Do you mean that you want the relationship ending to be 100% her fault?

I think seekingbalance is right. You want her to realize she was the one who messed up. But as you probably know, BPD mentality has defenses towards that.

You can not outsmart a psychopath on these terms. Deep down she knows shes at fault however.

You said it yourself:

1. You have no doubt she was cheating the past few months, so you do not need her to tell you that, you know it.

2. You know she has a history with her ex partners. She has a pattern of this, just as all of them have their own patters. She will do this continuosly.

We all know it was 100% her fault. You want her to admit it, she will not. The fact she wont admit it, is admission. She has nothing to say to you because she does not want to feel her shame. Her lack of response is an admission of guilt. You win.

Check your pms in a second.

Jay - BPD is not a psychopath; I know you are trying to be supportive... .  please be respectful of the differences.

You are correct, but IMO anybody who can not experience empathy is a psycopath. I should have used cluster b. My apologies.

[really]

Hi guys, thanks for the responses... .  

I certainly contributed to the dysfunction of the relationship.  I stayed when she lied and listened to her words rather than focusing on her actions.

It wasn't her 100% ... .  just wanted to know whether when she said to me at the beginning of September prior to us parting that she had lied to me and wanted to make up for it (she had said so before) and whether I locked myself into a merged business in october after saying to her I would not do it unless she was truly committed, or whether around that time when we were intimate she said she wanted no other ever and she had her future husband in her... .  she was also seeing the other guy.

I won't ever know.   I need to come to terms with that.   

Thanks for the support on the psychopath front Jay... .  probably a bit tough.   Certainly has sociopathic tendencies... .  and certainly a complete lack of empathy.

It's really sad that someone who has so many amazing qualities has a fundamental flaw... .  but hey at best that's what she would say about me.   At worst I am "her worst nightmare."

[Jay08]

I sent you a message, check it out, hope it helps

~Jay