Bringing matters to the surface

[VIDEO: "What is parental alienation?"]

I'm was trying to stay remote from recent no contact and not making progress, in fact the recent escalation burst seems to have resulted in a mindset that we are over, no more to be discussed, end of.  The only response I seem to get that brings any comment is when I seem to get passionate about the fact that I point out she told me she knew something wasn't right.  Her response now is that I'm throwing it back in her face and its me that is mentally torturing her! she wants me gone, no more discussion.  I have informed her I am not comfortable leaving the kids without me here and we should discuss the implications etc...   There's no rational thought from her on the practicalities of child care or anything. I had today pulled W up on a task she had asked S15 to undertake despite our family agreement that she would undertake the task, I pointed out it wasn't fair on him to be expecting one thing, then on a whim tasked with doing the opposite... .  It seems that whilst I didn't rise to the ongoing bait from the last 7 days, she had switched the target to S, unfairly in my view, thereby provoking a reaction in me.

From this  confrontation, D10, overhearing raised voices and me being ordered to get out of the house, she got upset and so I took all kids to in laws to tell them I was concerned on how the kids are being impacted by this behaviour to discover they had been updated this week by W that things have been much better! I despair, as this seems like its the end of the marriage (which fills me with dread) but even if so, I will need to make arrangements to sell house, we all need to find new places etc. yet W is refusing to engage, I have told her we will talk about it when she is calm but she doesn't want to engage with me and hasn't for the last week... .  When I enter one room she moves to another... .  

Is there any rational that sometimes a heated argument can help bring things to the fore?

[Whichwayisup]

I'm was trying to stay remote from recent no contact and not making progress, in fact the recent escalation burst seems to have resulted in a mindset that we are over, no more to be discussed, end of.  The only response I seem to get that brings any comment is when I seem to get passionate about the fact that I point out she told me she knew something wasn't right.  Her response now is that I'm throwing it back in her face and its me that is mentally torturing her! she wants me gone, no more discussion.  I have informed her I am not comfortable leaving the kids without me here and we should discuss the implications etc...   There's no rational thought from her on the practicalities of child care or anything. I had today pulled W up on a task she had asked S15 to undertake despite our family agreement that she would undertake the task, I pointed out it wasn't fair on him to be expecting one thing, then on a whim tasked with doing the opposite... .  It seems that whilst I didn't rise to the ongoing bait from the last 7 days, she had switched the target to S, unfairly in my view, thereby provoking a reaction in me.

From this  confrontation, D10, overhearing raised voices and me being ordered to get out of the house, she got upset and so I took all kids to in laws to tell them I was concerned on how the kids are being impacted by this behaviour to discover they had been updated this week by W that things have been much better! I despair, as this seems like its the end of the marriage (which fills me with dread) but even if so, I will need to make arrangements to sell house, we all need to find new places etc. yet W is refusing to engage, I have told her we will talk about it when she is calm but she doesn't want to engage with me and hasn't for the last week... .  When I enter one room she moves to another... .  

Is there any rational that sometimes a heated argument can help bring things to the fore?

[an0ught]

Hi Whichwayisup ,

NC is not an effective approach if kids are involved and you have things to communicate. She is upset and angry and avoids you. And you too avoid her and then when you break that pattern you still have a lot of (understandable) anger in you and it affects how you communicate and what you communicate. That can be improved and while you don't control her side you control yours.

So the question is more when, how and what to communicate.

When - Clear communication times and non communication times. In face of escalation clear timeouts for a defined time.

How - See workshops on SET, validation

What - a) Information via SET as straight as possible.

           b) Change requests in small doses only when needed as they tend to be upsetting. Also if possible via SET otherwise DEARMAN

           c) It is worth thinking about boundaries, values and respect when deciding what needs to be communicate.

Pointing out that she violated the agreement fulfilled what purpose?

  - preventing future violations? Do you really believe that?

She made a mistake. What are the consequences other than you telling her she did bad? Did your S15 know about the agreement? If yes you could e.g. explain to her that

S: She may not have thought of it

E: and may sure not like it

T: That breaking the family agreement violates the trust S15 has in her.

Check out the workhop section or the LESSONS at the top of the board for pointers to workshops.

How did S15 take the situation?

It is a tough situation for sure,

a0

[Whichwayisup]

Thanks an0ught for your thoughtful reply,

I seem to have been reading everything and not necessarily relating it to my situation, NC is certainly not something that helps the domestic situation with kids.  It's been refreshing to see you state that clearly.

I am in some state of shock, feeling this is all a surreal nightmare cos this can't happen to me, our love for 14 yrs cannot possibly succumb to this... .  I have been reading too on the aspects that I must possess as an enabler and feel so unaware of what brought me to this place. 

We spoke last night for a little while and she seems intent on working out the living arrangements for the future.  Truth be told in my heart I just want her to say she's sorry and we can both work at the marriage.  She did say that this wasn't about me but I didn't pursue deeper into that comment.  She again slept on the couch and I was up from 5am with D3 being ill so we have all been much more mellow today.

I do not know what the future will hold and I do not feel adequately able to protect the kids. 

She explained she just wanted S15 to help her for that moment and it was just a little thing I have got the wrong end of the stick on- whilst this is plausible, I recognise I'm  over analysing everything now, I had thought I was acting on the principle of sticking up for him and also demonstrating that the kids shouldn't be fair game to become embroiled in her issues with me.  I have a real reluctance to leaving the kids with her.  I need to go back to focussing on me and not assuming every signal has a deeper meaning. I have today apologised to her for going to the in laws as she made it clear she did not want them involved, I was wrong to do that.

As far as boundaries go, I think the only explicit one we shared was exclusive relationship and I'm confident she has not strayed(yet).  It does seem odd that at a time she is saying I should leave, for me to respond with my boundaries (if i can think them through) will not just inflame the situation at this stage rather than waiting for things to calm down.  We were meant to both go out tonight but given the recent goings and that I'm suffering from a lousy cold, she can enjoy going out tonight and we are both off work tomorrow whilst all kids are at school, I will make use of the time to determine how we/I move forward. (She has been to that leaving point once or twice before and switches back only to tell me it felt real that she had to go but was glad we didn't split- feel like I am now just biding my time for this cycle again)

This is all making me feel sick to the pit of my stomach trying to make sense of it all, I have always made time for myself, play sports a couple of times during the week, enjoy movies on home theatre when everyone's in bed etc... .  It's not that I don't do other things to keep me happy... .    I'm guessing there may be no coming back from this point and it feels like longing for the impossible at the moment. Does that mean I haven't fallen far enough? Are the success stories merely slow motion crashes? Does it inevitably end in disaster... .  

I'm daunted by it all.