How to support the whole family

[lurchlookalike]

An adult child with this illness can be just as damaging to a family as a parent with the illness can be. Unless one has lived through this first-hand it is difficult to understand, and you can always tell those who really know by their comments.

It's heart wrenching, Moms & Dads often have to go into a self defense mode with their own child, not only for their own sanity but to protect other children in the family, and there is a very real danger particularly for the younger kids.

To accuse their parents of abuse, except in the most egregious circumstances, is almost as low as you can go in the realm of humanity. There are worse things, but from a psychological staNPDoint this is just about as bad as it can get for a parent.

A BPD (w/NPD traits) person in your midst can strain the strongest of marriages and families, and for the many families that already have other very challenging issues to deal with it can be devastating. We need as much validation and support as we can get.

Our objective is to better understand the struggles our child faces and to learn the skills to improve our relationship and provide a supportive environment and also improve on our own emotional responses, attitudes and effectiveness as a family leaders

[lbjnltx]

Our board has links to articles and workshops at the top of the page for ways to help self and the rest of the family.

If you look under Discussion: What can a parent do? #'s 2 and 4.

As with all the boards here on the site the Supporting Board's goal is give the support to members while they learn about the disorder, learn what they can change (self), and how those changes can help members stay in relationship with a pwBPD and/or become healthier versions of themselves.

The articles, books and workshops that we put forth are based on clinical evidence from outstanding professionals in the fields of psychology and psychiatry.  We also benefit from lay persons who have dedicated themselves to the education of non's... .  such as Randi Kreger.

BPD is an illness that can cause chaos in our homes and families.  Not personalizing is difficult when we are the targets of maladaptive behaviors.  Learning coping skills is an affective and proactive exercise in self preservation as well as the preservation of family relationships.

lbjnltx

 

[whiletheseasonspass]

An adult child with this illness can be just as damaging to a family as a parent with the illness can be. Unless one has lived through this first-hand it is difficult to understand, and you can always tell those who really know by their comments.

It's heart wrenching, Moms & Dads often have to go into a self defense mode with their own child, not only for their own sanity but to protect other children in the family, and there is a very real danger particularly for the younger kids.

To accuse their parents of abuse, except in the most egregious circumstances, is almost as low as you can go in the realm of humanity. There are worse things, but from a psychological staNPDoint this is just about as bad as it can get for a parent.

A BPD (w/NPD traits) person in your midst can strain the strongest of marriages and families, and for the many families that already have other very challenging issues to deal with it can be devastating. We need as much validation and support as we can get.

lurchlookalike - This is very validating with what dh and I deal with.  Our dd has both BPD and NPD and Histrionic behaviors and more.  She completely lacks logic where it is needed. She will relentlessly needle and needle and needle to get what she wants from us- which is harmful to her and keeps her stuck and it takes us- her parents down-this has been going on for YEARS.  Sometimes I wonder if she has a form of autism- like Rainman was relentlessly stuck- on Whapner at 2- Underwear at K-mart.  For a very long time dd was able to split her father and I.  dh and I worked hard on our marriage and dh needed to understand his enabling role which over time he has but the damage to me- as the bad guy still rears its head.  :)D will bypass me still to try to get what she wants from her dad who is so PTSD'd.  He has regrets for not taking the father role- instead of the "friend"/ enabler role.  I made my own mistakes so don't want to pin all on dh.  Anyway - lately dd has been more relentless than ever- some is just more habitual behavior- but amplified- some comes from fear and of course- from the BPD/ NPD/ Histrionic behaviors and whereby her physical illness affects her thinking as well- (which she will not treat - NO WAY- gets benefit out of being ill).  

I was reading some of your older posts and your highlighting of NPD really made me think.  What you wrote in some of your posts is so well put ( I see you were on the other boards ) but at any rate dh and I have worked hard on our marriage wc almost ended.  Now we are 85% on the same page and it is a much better marriage.  Wish it was like this when dd was really young and exhibiting these behaviors and he was there to help save dd instead of undermining my motherhood to dd for his benefit (sort of like parental alienation syndrome).  But that has subsided greatly and things are quite different now- and so have to deal with the here and now... .  much as I fight against if only's etc- but way less than I used to for it does no good.  I copied portions of your sentiments for my dh to read.  Some bullet points.  He needs help with guilt and other issues so as not to inadvertently keep dd stuck if it is possible to "unstuck" her.  dh needs big time help with his guilt that dd sniffs out and exploits... .  

lbj-thanks for putting the links there.  I copied the info from parts 2 and 4 for my dh to review.  He will read this stuff - hopefully sooner than later because he does need some of what is there - to be drilled into him... .  so he can take care of himself and be strong .  He said- he needs to be strong in FRONT of dd for he does know when she pushes him into a vulnerable place- she exploits this.  And when this happens when dd is at her most determined place to get what she wants (not what she needs) dh then has to take time to recover from what she can sometimes do to him.  dh has learned to become stronger but When dh goes down like a sinking ship- it affects me for I feel like not only do I have dd who is so far from being in the place where we as parents want our children- but then I have dh so weak and PTSD'd.  I fight against my own PTSD.  

We work hard - the two of us- but it has been so many years and we are simply burnt out... .  anyway- we will likely review from part 2 and 4- the sections that are applicable.  

 

wtsp

[qcarolr]

I am living through this with my BPDDD26, gd7, dh trying to keep this household in some sense of balance. There is a perception, at least for me and I feel you may be validating my opinion with this thread, that being in a parent/child (of any developmental age) relationship needs different skills than someone recovering in a partner/friend/FOO relationship. The healing boards here, and many of the workshops and articles, often come out of these other boards. There is a much greater quantity of members posting from the non-parent point of view. Sometimes I have struggled to find the support I need for my recovery as a loving parent, needing to untangle from my BPD adult child.

As parents we have a hardwired drive to connection with our children - and this applies to anyone who has been the primary caregiver of a child (bio, adopt, foster, etc.). Many of us have also experienced the FOO issues that did not give us the best training as future parents. I have certainly had to deal with my resistance to shifting my focus to my own recovery of 'self' and letting go of my DD's maintaining of her 'self'. I still hold onto feeling that parental responsibility for her - she has never grown up to become an independent adult. And she sure lets me know this - in that classical "I HATE you, Don't you dare leave me" way.

On the other hand, I have gained much benefit from all the information gleaned from this website - and the first link here "What can a parent do?" was a great addition to this board. I have again been stuggling with my boundaries and focus on taking care my needs - and it feels so unfair unfair unfair that my depression destabilizes everyone else in the household (or do I need to own that as part of my current dysfunction?)  [wish: saying it three times makes the magic parent fairy appear and make everything all better without my doing any work on myself  Where is that little girl stomping her feet tantrum emoticon?]

I do think there will be more workshops, books, articles, etc. coming in the future that are focused on family support. Not sure which board they are best connected to. We do need support for this special connection we are hardwired for with all our kids of all levels of ability and function. We need support in taking care of our own needs too so that we have the energy to be facilitators for the others in our family. For me that is my dh. He is highly resistant to new information and changing his ways of coping. Makes it hard when both he and BPDD26 refuse to participate in therapy -- since she was about 3. Whew. No wonder I am tired.

I wonder if there could be a top level thread for discussion of this area at the top of this board? Or on a sidebar - healing the family with a BPD child. Kind of like on the FOO board sidebar? Not sure how much work this would take behind the scenes to create. Sometimes I need a "Survivors Guide from Being the Abused Parent" like they have on [L5] - Healing from relationships with Parent, Relative, In-Laws.  

Don't know if this really makes a lot of sense - will ponder a little more and read what others have to offer.

qcr  

[peaceplease]

Reviewing the thread:Discussion-What can a parent do?  After glancing at the workshop, I will be involved in studying it.  Currently, it is really about my NPD ds.  I really have a communication problem going on with him.  I have allowed myself to feel guilt.  I feel like I am in the presence of my ex-husband.  I have to remind myself that this is my child, and he came out of my uterus.  He is almost a clone like my ex.  He has so many of his mannerisms.

I know that he is using drugs IV.  I found a syringe cap under my bed, last week.  It was right after he was laying on my bed.  He appeared to be very high, and I knew that he was on something.  Finding the syringe cap was devastating to me.  It was devastating to discover that he shot up in my house.  I have not mentioned a word to him about it, yet.  I  am not sure what I want to say.  Not sure of what boundaries to make, yet.   

I did not acknowledge his comment that he only had  $25 for the week.  I wanted to yell to quit buying drugs.  I know that he will end up turning it around and manage to make me feel guilt.  And, make me feel guilt for his depression which led to his drug use.  He will take it back to his childhood, and tell me that I should have kept him away from his dad's side of family.  I need to prepare and not feel guilt.  I need to take care of myself.

I realize that my uBPDd will be off house arrest soon.  I have had a great degree of peace this past month.  Soon, she will be able to go outside of her house and not have to worry about violating her house arrest.   If she is dealing with some stressors that are hard to cope with, she may try to self medicate without worrying about being drug tested.  She has admitted that she hopes that she continues to do as well when she is off house arrest.  I am impressed with her verbalizing it to me.  Our r/s has been great this past month.

I know that I need to prepare myself.  Reviewing the workshop will be of great help.

I really appreciate this thread and linking to What  can a parent do.

 

peaceplease

[qcarolr]

peaceplease - be strong. take care. keeping you in my thoughts and prayers. qcr  

[BioAdoptMom3]

Wow, I can so relate to that!  Our two older sons were 12 and 9 when when our infant foster daughter came to live with us.  Things were great for several years. No family is perfect, but we were all content, got along with each other, obviously loved (and still do of course) each other, but when DD turned 11 things began to change for the worst.  Just six months ago I said to a co-worker in whom I was confiding that I honestly felt like that we become a dysfunctional family! She is only 13 but sometimes it really does seem like she is tearing our family apart!

[whiletheseasonspass]

qcarol sure came up with a brilliant name i.e. Survivors Guide... .  

 I was out with my oldest and dearest friend this past week.  She is an angel.   She knows the story of our dd and what her mental illness has done to our family not to mention how her mental illness over which we have no control- has done to her.  My friends knows that there is nothing we can do.  Because she gets it.  For she too has her own problems and she feels torn apart- the family is so affected.  I was able to listen to her and make her feel less alone.  Because as has been mentioned on this  thread- I get it because I walk in the shoes.

I have never seen her like this- things have gotten so bad in her life.  We were in a public place having tea and she could not prevent the tears - she could not hold them back and she is never like this.  I get her and she gets me.  We  get one another... .  we have forever in all kinds of ways but for this kind of pain and trauma- we both agreed with a concept that you mention in the above quote from you: It would be very difficult for anyone who hasn't lived through this as a parent to really understand and identify... .    

We kept saying how grateful we were to have one another.  

I can't tell you how many mothers I have gotten to know over the years in the flesh-  a few fathers also- somehow we just found each other in our small county.    At least 4 have lost their child to death from self-medicating- overdosing but there were YEARS of roller coaster living- worrying and the family being torn apart in most of those situations.  One was out and out suicide- jumping from a bridge.  That dear family is still torn apart years later... .  and the mother says- even before the suicide and like all of us say to one another- UNLESS YOU WALK IN THESE SHOES... .  you cannot identify.  It is not just the BPD that causes this. I agree with you- that it is the NPD part which not all pwBPD have.  That NPD almost always = abuse.  

The friend, my dearest long time friend who could not hold back her tears this past week as I listened to her-  she said that she has a friend who used to have troubles with her own dd and she was really affected but her situation was not as severe as our stuff- but still she was very taken down- it is all relative... .  but fortunately that situation all got straightened out- and things are nearly wonderful.  And even though the trouble USED to occur and my friend and her could talk THE SHOES.... .  now that it is all hunky dory - this friend or my friend- well she doesn't relate to my dear friend anymore.  She has moved on. AND finally she said to my friend- YOU SHOULD MOVE ON WITH YOUR LIFE- YOU JUST NEED TO ACCEPT but this friend - if her situation was not straightened out I doubt she'd be saying YOU SHOULD MOVE ON etc.  How can my friend move on?  That other friend she used to have- cannot relate to her anymore and my friend was stunned when the other "friend" just said YOU SHOULD MOVE ON WITH YOUR OWN LIFE.  

Our dd is ripping us up- dh and I.  Someone once posted on this board- that this kind of situation is gut-wrenching and soul destroying.  It is.

The friend who I keep speaking about- We said we have always been able to be close- total kindred spirits and have been there for one another since grade school for happy times too.  But THIS -we kept saying- how nobody could get it UNLESS you are in these shoes.  That could be the first sentience of qcarol's book "Survivors Guide to being and Abused Parent".  

Unless we can get better tools- how can we even fathom ways to help our children when what we try to do- ends up in being abused.  But also- we deserve to NOT live in anguish.  We deserve to BE ABLE to get a decent night's sleep.  We deserve to learn how to UNDO the PTSD and to find a way to live as it is not POST trauma- it is ongoing trauma.  

lurchlookalike, I told my dh- when I printed down some of your bullet points for him to read- I told him that this was the first time I ever saw anyone talk the language (which you got going     that he and I can relate to regarding our dd-  on this board.  

So I thank you for starting this conversation.  IT is a really important one.  And btw- you "speak" so eloquently.  

 

wtsp

[mggt]

As I read all the statements , How sad because it is very true.  I have been saying for years I fell like "abused parent" I am in turmoil most of the time right now I am so jumpy inside constantly shaking , I wake up shaking and go to bed shaking.  That sick feeling in stomach that just wont go away you know that feeling like when you get scared and your stomach reacts almost like sinking feeling.  I should go see a t but so  tired of all appts throughout the years my husband says I am having nervous breakdown he does not get how I feel about our d he tells me she wont change and you have stop being upset.  How do you do that I ask! She is my daughter and I love her but also I feel myself so resentful towards her because of all of these years of problems and constant heartache.  We have had problems with her since she was a little girl, me and my h would argue over this I would tell him something is just not right and his response was " shes only 7 shes only 8 shes only 11 shes only 12 and so on" My biggest fear for her is what she is doing now.  Years ago I told my husband I  was afraid this was going to be her life and he said no you worry too much you exagerate .  I wish I was wrong but what I said years ago has come true.  The life she leads is bad and no one can do anything about  it .  So how do I stop worrying is there a magic pill? I love her very much but honestly right now I do not like her and can feel heavy resentment towards her I know I know not her fault about disease . 

[JKN77]

Mggt, I am so sorry for what you are going through. I understand too. Before we sent our son to the RTC things were horrible. I was at the point where I just wanted to get in the car and drive away, didn’t matter where I went as long as it was far away from here. I wasn’t even sure I would take my youngest with me. But I stayed, of course. If it wasn’t for being able to send him to the RTC, I really don’t know how much more I could have endured.

I too remember when he was younger, and throughout the years, telling my h and several t’s, “something just isn’t right, he doesn’t process things right, it is like there is an electrical short in his brain, he is so angry all the time”.

Then there is the worrying about the other children. Our home dynamics have been so “over the top” (which is a term I think only you on this forum can totally get), that my oldest daughter,21, is afraid to have children for fear they will be like her brother! I just want to cry.

We are also a religious family, well not my BPD son or the one below him, but they go to church with me. Any way, it is horrible sitting in church and knowing that your family is the most dysfunctional one in the congregation. They all talk about these little problems they have and I start to wonder why I even bother going to church, my home is so far from being what it is supposed to be.

Things are still hard, but we are moms and just can’t seem to give up hope. The University closest to us has a Phyc. Department and they do clinical’s for the students working on their doctorate. They charge on a sliding scale and are going to use my son’s wages so it will be more affordable. They use the DBT, which I have just learned about, so here goes another rollercoaster in my emotions hoping again that this will work. At least he knows he has a problem and agreed to try the therapy. This is good, but it also raises my hopes up more too.

Wish there was a magic pill, unfortunately I don’t think there is. But at least you know you are not alone now.

[mggt]

Dear jnk77, Thank you for kind words mjy d was also in  a rtc for 1 year all run by dbt, when she got out at age 17 she kept going to see t that uses dbt the only problem is she has never used the skills . She is now 20 and said she has been going back to t which has been over three years .  BPD is so hard to understand I think her t is way over her head and wont admit it.  Whatever my d tells her she believes I call to express what has been going on and t will not talk to me because of her age.  Actually even when she was younger t will hardly tell me anything which still upsets me because no one loves our children more than we do and we are trying everything in the world to help but noo privacy rules . 

Like I said she said she is seeing her t again but cant be sure due to her constant lying .  Which is a big part of BPD at least with her anyways not sure about everyones else .  Take care and I will keep you in our prayers  

Our objective is to better understand the struggles our child faces and to learn the skills to improve our relationship and provide a supportive environment and also improve on our own emotional responses, attitudes and effectiveness as a family leaders

[JKN77]

mggt, I will pray for you too. I remember when things were at its worst, before and at the first of, the RTC I felt like there was such a dark cloud over me that I shut myself off from everyone. I quit my job, wouldn't talk to friends except for the minimum, wouldn't really talk to anyone at church. Functioned best I could with my kids and h. I just didn't want to expose anyone to it. But it seems when things get beyond what we think we can endure, somehow there comes a little calm after the storm.

Your calm will come, hang in there.

[qcarolr]

As I read all the statements , How sad because it is very true.  I have been saying for years I fell like "abused parent" I am in turmoil most of the time right now I am so jumpy inside constantly shaking , I wake up shaking and go to bed shaking.  That sick feeling in stomach that just wont go away you know that feeling like when you get scared and your stomach reacts almost like sinking feeling.  I should go see a t but so  tired of all appts throughout the years my husband says I am having nervous breakdown he does not get how I feel about our d he tells me she wont change and you have stop being upset.  How do you do that I ask! She is my daughter and I love her but also I feel myself so resentful towards her because of all of these years of problems and constant heartache.  We have had problems with her since she was a little girl, me and my h would argue over this I would tell him something is just not right and his response was " shes only 7 shes only 8 shes only 11 shes only 12 and so on" My biggest fear for her is what she is doing now.  Years ago I told my husband I  was afraid this was going to be her life and he said no you worry too much you exagerate .  I wish I was wrong but what I said years ago has come true.  The life she leads is bad and no one can do anything about  it .  So how do I stop worrying is there a magic pill? I love her very much but honestly right now I do not like her and can feel heavy resentment towards her I know I know not her fault about disease . 

I too am in this sick gut place right now - it has been better the past year but things are spiraling down since bf breakup in Jan and now exbf"G" back in her life.

I have been reading about how our neurosystem responds - the big nerve with a direct link to our lower level/instinct brain is connected to our gut. And out of our conscious control. And this is our 'freeze' response link. Like we are about ready to be eaten by a saber tooth tiger and our physical body is shutting down to avoid feeling the pain. This metaphor works for me right now. I am so shut down and ineffective in all areas of my life.

I am searching our a new counselor closer to home to see more often, The one my ins. pays for is only available once a month - this is not enough. Doing the Al Anon 12-step stuff is not enough.

It is so good to have you all here that get this. I am not sure how to go about getting a survivor guide for us - one that is shorter, direct, quicker to assimilate than the 'what a parent can do' workshop.

Family calling me, so have to go.

qcr  

[mggt]

qcr.; Thank you I have read alot of your post and I dont know how you are still standing My goodness what you have endured .  I feel selfish complaing about my d , '"You seem to be one of the strongest women i have ever met .  I cant imagine how tough it has been for you seems like you have been dealing with this situation for ever raising your gd being her mom when her mom is living there I can only imagine the conflict .  We never ever stop worrying i dont care how old they are.  But with BPD it is a crazy crazy life.  WE have of gd for now and my d comes on sundays and mondays to see her (lets hope anyways) .  I try to concentrate of my gd but my other half of brain is always on D.  Keeping you in my prayers  

[tiredmommy2]

At the height of my daughter's instability, my family was nearly destroyed. There was so much focus placed on validating her, supporting her, running her to the hospital, making sure she took her meds, taking her to appointments, monitoring her for cutting or feeling suicidal, and then the physical threats of violence, that I hardly noticed that my marriage was crumbling right before my eyes. BPDd did whatever she could do to create friction between us, and now that she's in a RTF, she still tries to control and triangulate from a distance. I am honestly horrified at the thought of her coming home - I'm not ready to deal with this again.

I'm not here often these days, but used to be a very active member. There was (and probably still is) a good amount of material floating around which should be helpful to parents of BPD children, it's just that most of it was written for people in chosen relationships, so you'd have to twist it around a bit so that it would apply to you as a parent.  Most of what I learned about communicating with BPDd and setting boundaries to protect myself, I learned from the Staying Board, so it does work.

There should be a Board focusing on how to protect yourself and your family, not so much focusing on the affected person but on everyone else that lives in the home. That I believe would help more people here and is a very realistic, achievable and serious concern which surpasses that of helping the BPD (w/NPD traits) affected family member.

Not to speak for administration here, but I find it unlikely that they would actually create a whole additional board for this purpose - compared to the other boards, this is a very slow board; split in half, it would move at a snail's pace.

That being said, I don't see why the tone of this board couldn't change, shifting some of the focus to ourselves, our marriages, our families, particularly protecting other children in the home. In the end, that is all we really have control over, isn't it?

I wonder if there could be a top level thread for discussion of this area at the top of this board? Or on a sidebar - healing the family with a BPD child. Kind of like on the FOO board sidebar? Not sure how much work this would take behind the scenes to create. Sometimes I need a "Survivors Guide from Being the Abused Parent" like they have on [L5] - Healing from relationships with Parent, Relative, In-Laws.  

These are all excellent ideas.  

[Reality]

The reality is that these young people need a community, with many people providing support and re-inforcement of how life works.  The nuclear family cannot support these complex, highly-sensitive souls.  Our friend lbj's daughter spent a length of time in what was essentially a therapeutic community, with seamless therapy and direction from everyone, including peers.  Her daughter is doing well. 

Unfortunately, we live far away from each other, as I think together we could manage a brilliant community. 

These pwBPD are like wild horses or thoroughbreds. 

Exhaustion is understandable.  The miracle is that everyone here is still standing.

As almostvegan says,

Peace to us all.

Reality

[qcarolr]

Reality - I so agree that this is what our BPD kids need. There are so many road-blocks though. These are the primary ones that DD seems to be crashing against - and therefore all in our home get bashed as well.

Funding

Trained counselors, case workers, etc

Willingness on part of adult kids to

--seek out help (housing counselor, job counselor, commnity groups, therapy)

--accept help offered (same as above all offered by Mental Health Center where she gets her meds.)

--persevere with program long enough for it to have some effect (more than 2-3 appts; 30-60 days)

----build trust

----stop numbing their pain with self-destructive means (SI, drugs/alcohol, toxic friends... .  )

Housing

I get that DD is under extreme stress, and my asking her to leave last week shifted things for a day. My reserves are gone - I have to protect gd most of all. There have to be some consequences for her abusiveness these past couple weeks. I can see gd adopting some of the rudeness, sarcasm, uncooperativeness. I have got myself calm enough to lower my tone and volume, and enforce GD's need to be a part of the family - ie. doing what we ask even when she doesn't want to. And then we do something fun together. I can do this yesterday and today with DD gone and dh here. He will be at work. Spring break is here - so no insulation of daytime with gd at school.

Sorry for hijacking. I will move over to one of my own threads. Just trying to point out the limits on what we as parents can be expected to 'do' for our grown up BPDkids.

qcr  

[jellibeans]

Can someone start writing that survival guide soon? I can really use it... .  I do feel the focus has been on my dd and I have put everything else on the back burner... .  I really could use the guide?

[whiletheseasonspass]

That being said, I don't see why the tone of this board couldn't change, shifting some of the focus to ourselves, our marriages, our families, particularly protecting other children in the home. In the end, that is all we really have control over, isn't it?

Hello Dear Tired Mommy,

It is good to see you appear on the board.  We've missed you!    .  You have always been very pragmatic and very wise and full of compassion.  I'm terribly sorry for all you have gone through with your dd.  I do understand and can relate in a huge way.  I wish you all well.  

The quote above is from you TM and I think it is a a very practical and important suggestion to imagine shifting at least some of the focus to ourselves- our marriages, our families especially in your case as in others where there are other children possibly placed in vulnerable positions to the worrisome actions of the pwBPD when they are prone to be harmful.    

Just trying to point out the limits on what we as parents can be expected to 'do' for our grown up BPDkids.

qcarol- you KNOW I get you on this!  I'm sure there are many of us who are with you all the way.  No need to apologize for saying what is true.  

[Aussie mumma]

Goodness I so have to read these posts contsantly... .  what some of you say is so true... I've often felt exhausted after a visit from dd... I sometimes... want her not to call in... so I can have a peaceful day... this causes me to feel very guilty... this is my once beautiful daughter... who i love dearly...

a very interesting topic

[qcarolr]

For today, I have not guilt (i have done a bad thing) or feelings of shame (ie. i am a bad parent) in feeling relief that DD has been gone since Friday. i sent a very brief text this morning - she texted back asking for a ride home this afternoon - I replied could meet her at bus stop - no word yet.

Can see that gd does not want her mom to come home. She is worn out by 'yelling' - her all-encompassig expression of all the put-downs, blaming, loud voices, bullying actions... .   GD feels she has to 'protect' me from her mom. She has talked with me about this. I have to walk the walk, not just talk the talk, that I am here to keep her safe. I have to take whatever action is needed for gd to FEEL safe. And this will be good for me and dh too.

no short term solutions, other than dd is a survivor with her homeless friends and the few connections that have apts. or motel rooms. dh and I are starting the conversation about finding a way to get her a place to live - but must wait for an inheritance which is a sad occasion -- very very sad -- in the next 3-12 months with my MIL (alzhiemers final stages). So we may be able to 'invest' in a place for DD to live. If/when she gets her SSI, she can pay us rent. We can try to collect rent from roommates. It will have to be without too many expectations. The other option is to let go of DD and accept her homeless state -- she won't accept it though without a legal restraining order is my guess. So very hard all this is.

So -- focus on loving peaceful home for gd and dh and I. That has to be the priority. DD will have to find her way. I am so sad about this.

Let's keep posting here. I need this and need all of you.

qcr  

Our objective is to better understand the struggles our child faces and to learn the skills to improve our relationship and provide a supportive environment and also improve on our own emotional responses, attitudes and effectiveness as a family leaders

[qcarolr]

There has been a shift on this board in past 12-18 months toward primary focus on pwBPD - maybe from some newer books that have that focus. It is easy to forget that if we don't manage our WHOLE FAMILY with loving care, we won't be here for the pwBPD when they are able to choose to take care of themselves. And this applies to all ages of our troubled kids. This needs to be the focus of family therapy - empowering the parents to take care of ALL MEMBERS OF THE FAMILY. This may mean greater emphasis on finding out of home placement - this is a community issue and a cultural issue. For change at that level, it has to start in the family, with the family being clear about what they need to thrive. This is especially true for those of us with BPDkids that REFUSE TO ACCEPT THEIR ILLNESS AND GET THERAPY. Not ready to do any of the work to manage themselves. This is OUT OF MY CONTROL - and I need to let go of feeling it is somehow my resonsibility to 'make' her change. Not possible.  Cannot go back and have better boudnaries with DD as a 1 year old - can only have strong boundaries now. And can do better with gd7 - by living in my values with the boundaries with DD26.

This is a huge shift for me today. I was kind of here back in 2009 when I got an RO for BPDDD, 23 at the time, to keep her away from me and gd and our home. She still tosses 'my being homeless was all your fault, look what you have done to me, families do not do this, my friends all think you are weird, my counselor (who she has met with twice) thinks you are a terrible parent, you are a terrible parent to gd, you are not gd's parent (ie. dd is adopted therefore gd is not my blood relative either)... . It just goes on and on and on lately. I was a wreck - distraught, tearful, filled to the brim with FOG back in that time. Could not go NC totally - still left myself open to her abuse - and soaked it up like it belonged to me. We let her return home in Jun 2011, things have seemed better. Came to believe I had the ability to be her 'therapeutic parent' even as she refused all programs offered of realy therapy. She did try some things - 2 months is the longest she persisted at anything. And now she seems to be back in the low part of her cycle again. I have to be reminded of the cycling of this illness.

As  I am pulling out of my melancholy this time, I find I do have more skills. I have done most of the workshops offered in "What a parent can do", and may need to review some of them. I need to go back and review Ranki Kreger's book "Family Guide to BPD" -- it has a really good focus on family issues.

THe real test will come when DD returns to the house. Will dh and I be strong enough to offer her a ride away or offer a ride with the police? She just cannot be allowed to harrass and abuse any of us for any reason. Strong feelings are allowed, disagreement is allowed, anger is allowed - but name calling, blaming, profanity etc. is not allowed. My gut says things have not changed by some miracle with DD.

qcr  

[mggt]

Dear  qcr, I totally agree with you especially your last paragraph .  You are one strong woman,  i sincerly hope things turn out well for you and gd and h.  I will keep your d in my prayers and hope they will someday agree with all of us that they need help and we still love them will all of our hearts but, we cant take the abuse anymore.  Take care of yourself and keep your chin up   

[lbjnltx]

Some of us have been here quite a while and some of us are still fairly new.

Perhaps you read this information when you first arrived a few years ago or maybe you have never read it.  Either way, it is good to consider this information in regards to where you are now in taking care of yourself and your family.

For those of us who are further along in the journey it is up to us to help guide the newer members towards better skills which equals better lives.

This is a good place to start:

From:

Perspectives:  The Do's and Don'ts for a BPD Relationship

This workshop is to discuss the Do's and Don'ts for adults staying in a relationship with a person with BPD.

Strength: It takes a great deal of strength and emotional stability to be in a BP relationship and not be emotionally injured by it.  A person in a weak emotional state, who feels wounded/abused, or depressed is likely to be consumed by the relationship, confused by the intense rages and idealization, and finding their self worth in decline.  If you chose this path, you've got to be very strong and very balanced.

Realistic Expectations: A person with BPD is emotionally underdeveloped and does not have "adult" emotional skills - especially in times of stress.  If you are in this type of relationship it is important to have realistic expectations for what the relationship can be in terms of consistent respect, trust and support, honesty and accountability, and in terms of negotiation and fairness, or expectations of non-threatening behavior.  It is important to accept the relationship behavior for what it is - not hope the person will permanently return to the idealization phase, not accept the external excuses for the bad behavior, and not hope that changing your behavior to heal someone else.

Accept the Role of "Emotional Caretaker": According to Kraft Goin MD (University of Southern California), "borderlines need a person who is a constant, continuing, empathic force in their lives; someone who can listen and handle being the target of intense rage and idealization while concurrently defining limits and boundaries with firmness and candor".  To be in this type of relationship, you must accept the role as emotional caretaker - consistently staying above it.  

~ Maintaining routine and structure

~ Setting and maintain boundaries

~ Being empathetic, building trust, even in difficult times

~ Don’t tolerate abusive treatment, threats and ultimatums

~ In crisis, stay calm, don’t get defensive, don't take it personally

~ Don’t protect them from natural consequences of their actions - let them fail

~ Self-Destructive acts/threats require action

And at the same time, its important to understand that you and your behavior cannot rehabilitate anyone - you can only end your contribution to the emotional instability of the relationship. Rehabilitation requires an individual's deep personal commitment, consistently, and over time.

Protection: Difficult things will likely happen in a BP relationship and it is important that you try to protect everyone (you, the BPD, the children) - financially, emotionally, etc.  Be prepared for digressions when they occur -  they will. This could range from controlling the bank accounts, to educating the children, to having a suicide threat plan.  You can mitigate some of the damage.

Preserve Your Emotional Health: The intensity of emotional reactions, and the rage take a toll on even the strongest.  Since you cannot escape the natural human impulses to "recoil when raged" upon or "be overly protective" when idealized, it really important to have other outlets / escapes to keep yourself grounded. It's important not to become isolated. It's important to have a significant emotional support system for yourself (e.g., close friends) that goes beyond the relationship.

Understand Why: There are a many reasons to be in BP relationship or to try.  It's a deeply personal decision.  Sometimes the reasons are unhealthy- such as BPD (w/NPD traits) relationships, BPD/Co-dependent relationship, etc.   It's important to understand your own emotional health and what motivates you to "stay in" and build a life that "evolves around" and has to "continually compensate for" the acts of a destructive person. Many professionals enter therapy when they are treating BPD to stay grounded.  It is a good idea for you too.

I thank everyone participating for helping develop this workshop.

Skippy

Change isn't easy. The way you feel about them ( RADICAL ACCEPTANCE ), the way you listen to them ( EMPATHETIC LISTENING ), the way you comm with them ( VALIDATION ), the way you respond to them ( BOUNDARIES ), all of these are tools that we use to stop making things worse so that we can begin to make them better.

It takes time and a lot of practice, but as you change - they are forced to change too.

If we stop following and instead take the lead we will see a difference    

United for Know

[qcarolr]

Thanks lbj.  I need to revisit all of this and share it with dh. So nice to have it here in one place.

qcr  

[qcarolr]

DH read the "do's and Don'ts list. His first response was something like "you've got this and i am way behind you". Yet I know that I am needing to work through it again. I am more aware than the last time - there has been lots of growth and recovery for me since 2009 when I first was exposed to BPD and bpdfamily.com. I am struggling to get my ground back under my feet.

lbj, this workshop excerpt on what it takes to remain connected with my BPDDD26 is helping me discover some of my thinking errors in the past few weeks.

From:

Perspectives:  The Do's and Don'ts for a BPD Relationship

This workshop is to discuss the Do's and Don'ts for adults staying in a relationship with a person with BPD.

Strength: It takes a great deal of strength and emotional stability to be in a BP relationship and not be emotionally injured by it.  A person in a weak emotional state, who feels wounded/abused, or depressed is likely to be consumed by the relationship, confused by the intense rages and idealization, and finding their self worth in decline.  If you chose this path, you've got to be very strong and very balanced.

I lost my balance and have experienced all of the above - triggering of old wounds, feeling abused, and depressed. Unable to think clearly or make good decisions. Found myself shutting down. Not able to be there for myself or anyone else in the family - so everyone was getting out of balance. Filled with resentment at the sense of unfairness. This was a thinking error: that their emotional state was so tied to mine. Gave me a 'big-head', or grandiose feeling of power in my family. Dh has done a good job of pointing this out to me with compassion and care - so I could hear what he was saying.

Realistic Expectations: A person with BPD is emotionally underdeveloped and does not have "adult" emotional skills - especially in times of stress.  If you are in this type of relationship it is important to have realistic expectations for what the relationship can be in terms of consistent respect, trust and support, honesty and accountability, and in terms of negotiation and fairness, or expectations of non-threatening behavior.  It is important to accept the relationship behavior for what it is - not hope the person will permanently return to the idealization phase, not accept the external excuses for the bad behavior, and not hope that changing your behavior to heal someone else.

Thinking error: that I could change myself and heal DD. Changes in my actions do impact her in the moment - if she is not too far into her own emotional turmoil and projecting it onto me. She seems to be connected, and perhaps is in the moment. She has not accepted that she needs to change, so the next moment is totally unpredictable. I forgot this-in the moment.

Accept the Role of "Emotional Caretaker": According to Kraft Goin MD (University of Southern California), "borderlines need a person who is a constant, continuing, empathic force in their lives; someone who can listen and handle being the target of intense rage and idealization while concurrently defining limits and boundaries with firmness and candor".  To be in this type of relationship, you must accept the role as emotional caretaker - consistently staying above it.  

~ Maintaining routine and structure

~ Setting and maintain boundaries

~ Being empathetic, building trust, even in difficult times

~ Don’t tolerate abusive treatment, threats and ultimatums

~ In crisis, stay calm, don’t get defensive, don't take it personally

~ Don’t protect them from natural consequences of their actions - let them fail

~ Self-Destructive acts/threats require action

And at the same time, its important to understand that you and your behavior cannot rehabilitate anyone - you can only end your contribution to the emotional instability of the relationship. Rehabilitation requires an individual's deep personal commitment, consistently, and over time.

Thinking error: that I have the power to create the outcome of DD's recovery - reahbilitate her. She has not taken any actions to show an ounce of commitment or even acceptance that she needs to recover. Clearly, she stated over and over to me the past few weeks that I 'need to fix yourself' 'you do not know how to communicate or listen'. I forgot the lesson that I am limited to creating oppourtunities. The outcomes are 100% out of my control.

Protection: Difficult things will likely happen in a BP relationship and it is important that you try to protect everyone (you, the BPD, the children) - financially, emotionally, etc.  Be prepared for digressions when they occur -  they will. This could range from controlling the bank accounts, to educating the children, to having a suicide threat plan.  You can mitigate some of the damage.

Thinking error: I am able to protect gd7 when DD is raging. I needed to get gd out of the house, or dh needed to get gd out of the house. Dh and I need to work on our safety plans. Gd actually said 'you will let me hit, or I will kill you" today. Words out of her mom's mouth during past rages. Damage control is needed here - have meeting with gd's T next week to stratgize on this. I am reaching out for help.

Preserve Your Emotional Health: The intensity of emotional reactions, and the rage take a toll on even the strongest.  Since you cannot escape the natural human impulses to "recoil when raged" upon or "be overly protective" when idealized, it really important to have other outlets / escapes to keep yourself grounded. It's important not to become isolated. It's important to have a significant emotional support system for yourself (e.g., close friends) that goes beyond the relationship.

I am working on this - it is slow to build the trust to reach out to my new friends in womens bible study group. Have to be cautious about "floodlighting" them - ie. saying more than they can process before trusting r/s built and they withdraw or shut down. Am surprised at the powerful responses and prayers for me and my family. I am not used to this level of support. Also reaching out for a new counselor in my community since the one in my HMO has limited appt. times.

Understand Why: There are a many reasons to be in BP relationship or to try.  It's a deeply personal decision.  Sometimes the reasons are unhealthy- such as BPD (w/NPD traits) relationships, BPD/Co-dependent relationship, etc.   It's important to understand your own emotional health and what motivates you to "stay in" and build a life that "evolves around" and has to "continually compensate for" the acts of a destructive person. Many professionals enter therapy when they are treating BPD to stay grounded.  It is a good idea for you too.

I am in this because my DD is my daughter. I made a promise to love her always and forever. So need to find ways to be there for her and protect my 'self' and my family. Sometimes this means a temporary seperation, physical and/or emotional. Then there may be chances to rebuild. I really never give up hope -- I never stop searching for those opportunities. Need to work on the skills listed below to gain a deeper level toward intergration. This will give me clarity again.

I thank everyone participating for helping develop this workshop.

Skippy[/i]

Change isn't easy. The way you feel about them ( RADICAL ACCEPTANCE ), the way you listen to them ( EMPATHETIC LISTENING ), the way you comm with them ( VALIDATION ), the way you respond to them ( BOUNDARIES ), all of these are tools that we use to stop making things worse so that we can begin to make them better.

It takes time and a lot of practice, but as you change - they are forced to change too.

If we stop following and instead take the lead we will see a difference    

United for Know

These four practices - they work when I am able to work them. I have renewed hope that dh and I can build a unity as part of our support system in loving our daughter, and loving, keeping her safe, and caring for our granddaughter.

Please let me know where you find yourself in all this. Such a valuable dialogue here.

qcr