Self Esteem

[VIDEO: "What is parental alienation?"]

So many people on here are hurting so bad as someone with BPD dumped them.  What would serve them well is a healthy dose of self esteem.   A good relationship is based on mutuality.  If it's not, it is not a relationship at all.  Unfortunately, often pwBPD look for a way out when faced with real, natural emotional intimacy.  So they take the easy way out, and leave a broken heart.  Your boyfriend/girlfriend ceased to be your boyfriend/girlfriend the moment they asked for that phone number or e-mail address, the moment they betrayed you.  You think you can do better than me?  Goodbye.  Face it.  It is up to the person who is left to realize they deserve more.  It's as if some people are just waiting to swallow the theory that it is their fault, somehow they "weren't enough."  That is why they are hurting so.  They need to know that with a pwBPD no one person will ever be enough to fill the void within them.  You say it hurts?  Yes, I've been there, til I realized I could not take his illness personally.  It is not about me, that I wasn't smart enough, pretty enough, nice enough, good enough, it is not that I wasn't enough, period.  It was because he has an illness.  And unless he wants to fix himself (very doubtful) he will go on messing up other people's lives.  I will no longer wallow in sorrow, I've done enough of that, thank you very much.

[eniale]

So many people on here are hurting so bad as someone with BPD dumped them.  What would serve them well is a healthy dose of self esteem.   A good relationship is based on mutuality.  If it's not, it is not a relationship at all.  Unfortunately, often pwBPD look for a way out when faced with real, natural emotional intimacy.  So they take the easy way out, and leave a broken heart.  Your boyfriend/girlfriend ceased to be your boyfriend/girlfriend the moment they asked for that phone number or e-mail address, the moment they betrayed you.  You think you can do better than me?  Goodbye.  Face it.  It is up to the person who is left to realize they deserve more.  It's as if some people are just waiting to swallow the theory that it is their fault, somehow they "weren't enough."  That is why they are hurting so.  They need to know that with a pwBPD no one person will ever be enough to fill the void within them.  You say it hurts?  Yes, I've been there, til I realized I could not take his illness personally.  It is not about me, that I wasn't smart enough, pretty enough, nice enough, good enough, it is not that I wasn't enough, period.  It was because he has an illness.  And unless he wants to fix himself (very doubtful) he will go on messing up other people's lives.  I will no longer wallow in sorrow, I've done enough of that, thank you very much.

[Octoberfest]

I am glad you have come to this conclusion.

The only tricky part, I have found, is staying firm in your belief of it.  It is very easy to inadvertently spend a lot of time thinking back through the relationship, all the suspicious things that you glossed over at the time, all of the instances of hurt, and get lost in it all until "I was the problem" is the only answer you can believe.  Because the idea that cause-effect does not apply, that a relationship could be broken before it even begins, is a foreign and uncomfortable thought.

So yes, you are right.

The painful part comes during the time period where you slowly stop blaming yourself.

I know that I, for sure, put my needs farther and farther down on the list as the relationship progressed.  I let myself get walked all over... . And getting those needs and wants back to the top of the list can prove to be a hard thing.  It is weird to think about "me" instead of "us".

[cal644]

Great post! I know I gave 150% to the relationship and when I suffered while my brother died from cancer she ran instead of her being a supportive wife. I know that she will never find another who could give her the long term (19 yrs) of attention and affection.  While I may have been replaced by a guy she knew only through texts - I know that will never be a deep and sustaining love she received from me - especially once he has to put up with her crap of always having to get her way - or him showing her who is in real life.  She can live in the fantasy of texts - but when it comes to the real world she will be hard pressed to ever find another like me!

[eniale]

Octoberfest -- Think of it as a bottomless pit, and there you are, with your buckets full of love, pouring it all in, but you cannot fill up a bottomless pit.  Or think of the little Dutch boy with his finger in the dyke, trying to hold back the torrent of water.  Nothing would/could ever be enough.  It is not that you were not enough did not do enough, remember:  it is the disorder:  nothing can ever be enough to fill the void.  Good luck.


Cal644 -- You are right, the reality of day-to-day living soon will crumble any facade.   She will be the same with any significant other.  I was blindsided and flattered at first, then confused by bizarre behavior.  Did not know what I was up against.  As the song "Amazing Grace" says:  "I once was lost, but now am found, was blind, but now I see."  The hurt is far less when I realize that wherever he goes, whoever he is with, he bring himself to the relationship and that self will never change.  Good luck.

[Rose Tiger]

Yes, lack of self esteem kept the r/s going.  I do think the inability to grieve in a healthy way is lacking, too.  a r/s with a pwBPD is an addiction, a way to avoid pain.  Because it is hard to process painful feelings, better to stuff them up and distract ourselves with an unhealthy r/s.  What a distraction!  I think if I had learned how to process painful feelings, to grieve, I never would of hooked up with the ex.

[eniale]

Yes Rose Tiger, I was just thinking of this today.  How life sometimes can get lonely and boring and how the r/s I had was, at its best, busy and fun.  But what a price to pay.  I now realize most of the time I was uneasy, walking on eggshells.  Thinking 2 or 3 times before I spoke and this is just not me.  I had been widowed for 7 years but had a job that was very interesting and very fulfilling.  Then, due to changes in administration I resigned.  So I was bored when I met my pwBPD & of course never recognized the bizarre behavior for what it was.  And he was accomplished and we did things that were fun.  The breakup was just awful for me, but thanks to an excellent therapist and lots of research and reading, I now know a healthy relationship with him was impossible.  But you are right, we have to take responsibility for not handling our own issues.  And I must say I saw red flags but thought I could "fix" things.  Biggest mistake ever.  I learned a great deal but paid a heavy price.  Now 4 mos. NC and I feel compassion for all who still think it was somehow all their fault.  Not so!  This is an illness one may not recognize until it is too late and severe damage has been done.  But recovery IS possible!

[Rose Tiger]

Oh, a widow, I'm so sorry.  I can't imagine anything much more difficult than that.  Was your marriage a happy one?  Sometimes folks can get sideswiped by these BPD relationships, you do want to help them, such as a partner getting sick and you research for the cure.  Out of love.

[cal644]

That had to be my biggest shock. Every one thought we were the perfect couple including myself and daughters, then out of the blue when she found her new texting friend. Life became hell, the woman I thought she was just changed. I honestly don't know who she is anymore. After 19 years I knew she had issues but I guess I was to busy trying to always make her happy. But now I see the real her, an angry, bitter, spoiled little child.

[eniale]

Rose Tiger --

Yes, my marriage was a happy one of 27 years.  But my husband had 8 years between 2 very serious illnesses; I was his caregiver, then 7 years of widowhood.  I was doing well as I had a job I loved, then felt I had to resign due to a change in management & being unwilling to compromise quality of my work. After I resigned my job, I felt bored & that was when I met my very talented, accomplished pwBPD.  Between my husband's illnesses and the years of being a widow, it had been 15 years since I really had fun, and he was a musician, great dancer, etc.  But I do take responsibility as there were red flags.  Guess I thought I could "fix" him, the old, sad, story. But 4 mos. NC and thinking of him less and less.

[eniale]

Cal644--

You said you "knew she had issues" but seems like there was a sudden change for the worse.  Was she diagnosed?  As far as I know, my ex was not diagnosed, and although my therapist said she does not like to diagnose w/o meeting the person, my description of his words/actions were such a give-away that she asked me to research BPD.  And bingo!  He hit all the marks.  She also thinks he has ND and he was verbally abusive.  You were married a long time before she "met someone" so I wonder did the behavior suddenly escalate, or did you just put up with an awful lot for 19 years and this was the final blow?  My relationship was for just 1 year; I put up with too much but he finally did something so outrageous that I ended it, though he wanted us to "remain best friends."  As I told him "best friends do not betray each other."

[flatspin]

Octoberfest -- Think of it as a bottomless pit, and there you are, with your buckets full of love, pouring it all in, but you cannot fill up a bottomless pit.  Or think of the little Dutch boy with his finger in the dyke, trying to hold back the torrent of water.  Nothing would/could ever be enough.  It is not that you were not enough did not do enough, remember:  it is the disorder:  nothing can ever be enough to fill the void.  Good luck.


Cal644 -- You are right, the reality of day-to-day living soon will crumble any facade.   She will be the same with any significant other.  I was blindsided and flattered at first, then confused by bizarre behavior.  Did not know what I was up against.  As the song "Amazing Grace" says:  "I once was lost, but now am found, was blind, but now I see."  The hurt is far less when I realize that wherever he goes, whoever he is with, he bring himself to the relationship and that self will never change.  Good luck.

Absolutely !

What you said is exactly what I told my ex-wife in the last e-mails that we sent each other. She said good-bye and wished me to be happy. After having told her that she had BPD (which is not advised but which I did anyway because I had nothing to lose anymore), I replied that I wished I could tell her the same thing but that she would unfortunately repeat the same patterns again and again with other guys unless she decides to tackle the real reasons of her sorrow and misfortune in life. She was always reproaching me of having destroyed her life and of being the cause of all her problems. I saw lately in a comment she wrote on a website that she was beginning to confess overtly that she has a problem, a mental one. Now, in the light of this awareness, I just hope that she'll take the proper decisions, if not for me, at least for her kids... .

[Rose Tiger]

I can understand wanting to have some fun after 15 years!  I was reading my Grandfather's ancestry book and I have a relative, a female, she ran off with a fiddler that came to town somewhere in the 1700's.  That's my lineage and I think I got a few extra of her genes.  A groupie, .     That's a bugger about the job, wish you still had that kind of challenge.

[Clearmind]

What would serve them well is a healthy dose of self esteem.   A good relationship is based on mutuality.  

eniale, more often than not partners (us) of Borderlines choose a Borderline because they themselves are emotionally unavailable and an unconscious fear of intimacy.

What a better way to avoid our own issues than to attach to a person who cannot commit and sabotage when things are good - this behavior is not just reserved for pwBPD.

Food for thought.

Falling in Love with an Unavailable Person

[eniale]

Clearminded:

Cannot agree with you on this one.  I had a good 27 year marriage to a man who wanted to commit (as I did) and who would never sabotage our relationship.  We had a strong marriage.  Sadly, he had a long illness and I lost him 8 years ago.  I know what intimacy is, long for it, and wanted it with my expwBPD.  I knew right from the beginning he was very difficult but did not recognize that he had BPD.  My therapist said she does not like to diagnose without seeing the person, but based on my description on what he said, and did, she suggested I research BPD.  Bingo!

In addition, I think it is important to have emotional intimacy with friends as well as partners.  I am blessed with many good friends; we are  very close and share emotional intimacy.  So I am very aware what it is, and very aware that I want it very much.

[Rose Tiger]

Just to add absolutely nothing to the convo, I want to say that my aunt growing up on a farm in upstate N.Y. probably saw this fiddler as a chance for a bit of excitement in a dull life.  Not that I or Eniale are groupies but sometimes, someone offering a different point of view, someone out of the ordinary, can be very attractive.  Ok, back to topic. 

[Clearmind]

Clearminded:

Cannot agree with you on this one.  I had a good 27 year marriage to a man who wanted to commit (as I did) and who would never sabotage our relationship.  We had a strong marriage.  Sadly, he had a long illness and I lost him 8 years ago.  I know what intimacy is, long for it, and wanted it with my expwBPD.  I knew right from the beginning he was very difficult but did not recognize that he had BPD.  My therapist said she does not like to diagnose without seeing the person, but based on my description on what he said, and did, she suggested I research BPD.  Bingo!

In addition, I think it is important to have emotional intimacy with friends as well as partners.  I am blessed with many good friends; we are  very close and share emotional intimacy.  So I am very aware what it is, and very aware that I want it very much.

Ok, fair enough - what were the reasons you chose a Borderline?

[eniale]

Clearmind --

At the expense of repeating myself, I did NOT choose a pwBPD.  I happened to meet a very charming, talented, nice man -- at least he was nice in the beginning -- I was puzzled and confused later on by the push/pull; had never encountered a person with this behavior before, and when his behavior got extreme I ended the relationship.  I did not reply to his many emails, etc., and have maintained NC for over 4 months and will continue to do so.

I do not blame myself, nor "take responsibility" for "choosing" a pwBPD.  I refuse to consider myself someone who looks for a person with problems.  You don't know me; I have wonderful friends and had a good marriage.  So, NO, I did not go looking for this person, he came by chance into my life.

[Clearmind]

You are right I don't know you. Being a public forum members will ask questions. As members we accept your written word. I'm not judging you.

All the best to you.

[flatspin]

I'd say that codependency doesn't explain everything. That's not a magic wand that explains everything.

I've received the same innuendos as an answer, in another thread that I started, about the reasons why I supposedly let chaos be brought into my life.

Why not just because I deeply loved my ex-wife, because I have one word and because marriage and commitment do mean something important to me ? I didn't know either what BPD was before making research about it after my ex-wife started to fly off the handle. When I discovered the ins and the outs of her disorder, I was already married which means that as I have one word, I took my responsibilities and tried to tackle the "problem" with love, compassion, patience and the best I could.

I didn't choose a BPD either but I chose to do my utmost to live up to my marriage vow and responsibilities.

[Clearmind]

There are reasons we stay despite the emotional, verbal and sometimes physical abuse - sacrificing yourself for the sake of another is worth exploring.

Everyone has there are own reasons, co-dependency is only one of them and I agree not the only reason and may not apply to everyone. I stayed because my r/s was a mirror of my home life as a child - chaotic, invalidating and boundary-less - it was the norm for me.