What is rock bottom for a pwBPD?

[Deleted]

I often read on how BPD will MAYBE seek therapy after they hit rock bottom, well, what the hell is rock bottom for them? Most of them push these stories of sexual abuse, drugs, failed relationships with partners and family, how deep is rock bottom for them? Any insight is greatly appreciated!

[WalrusGumboot]

Maybe those stories are half-truths or lies?

I have always wondered the same thing because their perceptions of reality is different. They might see losing everything and everybody as the fault of others and not them.

[tailspin]

It takes courage to enter therapy and a willingness to endure extreme emotional pain; most simply cannot consider this to be a choice.  The potential for emotional annihilation is too strong.  Also, many never hit rock bottom because of their finely honed defense mechanisms such as denial and projection; you will be painted black and blamed before rock bottom is reached.  This is their escape route away from the pain and shame... . they cut and run.

Therapy peels back layers better left covered for most because it's so much easier to blame someone else for your misfortune than it is to take responsibility for your life.  As such, most choose to remain perpetual victims.

tailspin

[mango_flower]

For my ex, this is how the story goes.

I asked if we could postpone the wedding for a year due to financial reasons and the fact we hadn't organised yet, and other stuff.

She was upset but a week later told me she was fine.

She started staying away "with work" though, and got more and more depressed.

She didn't sleep at night when she was back, and moved into the spare room.  She had to have her TV on all night to stop her thinking.

She felt suicidal she told me, and spent time plotting ways to do it so as not to hurt anyone else.

She started phoning her mother (they are estranged) and demanding she not hang up on her, or she'd go down to where she lived and see her face to face.

She told me if she had a gun she'd happily shoot her Mum in the face.

She was binge eating (I found the wrappers when she'd moved out)

She threw up whenever she ate (she says it was stress, I say it was deliberate)

This was her rock bottom.

When she moved away (just so "happened" to be where her new girl lived, although she CLAIMS they were just friends at this point, yeah right), she wasn't working.  And she went to the doctor and got referred for counselling.  I don't think it was BPD related, I don't think she even knows she has it... .

I don't think she was lying about going to see a counsellor, as she was quite detailed with the things the counsellor supposedly asked/said, and she's not that smart in terms of psychology 

But then she got a full time job.  I have no idea if she's still going to see her counsellor, as I can't imagine she'd be able to fit it in, and most don't work on weekends.  I also don't think she'd have the staying power when they started exploring deeper issues. 

I get the feeling she started the counselling when she'd hit rock bottom, and then when things started "taking off" again (she got her job, became "official" with her gf) my gut instinct is that she stopped going to counselling, as she's using her new relationship as a bandaid... .

But seeing as she can't possibly be fixed in a couple of months, I'd be very surprised if her life is hunky dory from now on... .

[mcc503764]

It takes courage to enter therapy and a willingness to endure extreme emotional pain; most simply cannot consider this to be a choice.  The potential for emotional annihilation is too strong.  Also, many never hit rock bottom because of their finely honed defense mechanisms such as denial and projection; you will be painted black and blamed before rock bottom is reached.  This is their escape route away from the pain and shame... . they cut and run.

Therapy peels back layers better left covered for most because it's so much easier to blame someone else for your misfortune than it is to take responsibility for your life.  As such, most choose to remain perpetual victims.

tailspin

This is such a good perspective!  Unfortunately, "rock bottom" will vary with the individual.  Is she there?  That's a personal decision for everyone.  "One man's trash is another's treasure" right?  Everyone has their own personal definition I guess... .

I am a father of 2, which live with me, from my first marriage.  I watch my kids growing up and the challenges that they face as they grow (13 + 15 years old.)  It pains me sometimes to watch my children struggle with learning, accepting, and conforming into young adults... . Guess what I am trying to say is that I feel sorry for them sometimes while watching them learn certain lessons in life.

And my x (2nd wife) is no different.  So I guess I have to take the same approach to her as I have with my kids.  I know at the end of the day I gave them my everything.  Are there certain things I should have done differet?  Of course there are!  Point is, I know that I can look at myself in the mirror and that I armed them with the knowledge and skills that they need for this world.  What they choose to do with it?  It's their choice.  But I know that I was honestly there when it mattered.

Since my x BPD acted like my 3rd child, I find adopting that same metality towards her seems to make things easier to handle... .

MCC

[bpdspell]

I often read on how BPD will MAYBE seek therapy after they hit rock bottom, well, what the hell is rock bottom for them? Most of them push these stories of sexual abuse, drugs, failed relationships with partners and family, how deep is rock bottom for them? Any insight is greatly appreciated!

i agree with the others.

Rock bottom is personal and depends on the individual. My breakup with my ex was rock bottom for me; it was painful beyond my own imagination. But for some on here a BPD breakup isn't their personal rock bottom. Some blame their ex's 100%, move forward and even continue to date without looking into their own damaged mirrors.

One of the reasons why people with BPD often don't seek treatment is because they have major blind spots and lack insight into their condition. It's a real term called Anosognosia. Introspection and looking in the mirror is HARD WORK whether BPD or not.

Rock bottom is no one rescuing them, enabling them, and handling them with kid gloves. Rock bottom could be prison, murder, suicidal ideation... . or the death of a loved one... . Rock bottom is whatever is rock bottom for them... .

All that matters is that we understand that it isn't our job to figure out what their rock bottom should look like.  We need to tread lightly because most times our motivation for them to get help is so the relationship can continue and in a ways rescue us from our hurt, sad feelings, and abandonment pain. At one point I was so obsessed with fixing my ex that I actually believed that he should get help for me! In my own twisted thinking I was desperate for him to fix himself so that we could survive. I allowed my self-worth to get tied up in his decision to get help for himself. When he didn't get help... . I felt defeated and an intense worthlessness that was based on the narrative that I wasn't worth getting help for. And boy was I wrong.

But them getting help is not designed for that. It's their life and it's their choice to live it how they want it. Our only job is to protect our boundaries and the take ownership of how we allow others to treat us.

Spell

[VeryFree]

Rock bottom and seeking therapy are two different things.

Mine was/is in therapy for many years, but never for BPD. Her T has diagnosed her with PD, but I don't know if it was handled in T. I don't know if a BPD can hit rock bottom. Everytime I thought my stbx was as low as she could go, but after us separating, I don't know where it ends.

[Deleted]

Hey all,

I just say to myself sometimes, they tell stories of them literally going through hell and they're able to function. Their defense and coping mechanisms are almost robotic. I know my exBPD knows she has issues because she admitted it herself. She will not seek therapy. She's gone a few times but after a session or two, just stopped going and found something wrong with the therapists. However with a disorder like that its the equivalent of having a gunshot wound and simply treating it with neosporin and a bandaid.

I agree with all of you on here when they either self medicate through dating others cuttig us off an quickly repressing what they have done and/or putting the blame on us.

[elessar]

Lol! thanks for the laugh at the last one Deleted. A week or two back I told my ex how she is trying to heal a fracture by putting bandaids all over her body and then complaining that she is still in pain. Instead of dealing with a core wound, she is trying to find superficial cures through her behavior. Funny you wrote pretty much the same thing.

[Tordesillas]

I think getting them into some kind of therapy is just half the battle.  Once they're in there they can be un cooperative, deceptive or duplicitous.  And I know mental health professionals are obviously the best able to help but quite honestly, it can take FOREVER to diagnose someone you see for 1 hour once a week who may or may not also be trying to deceive you!   

[ScotisGone74]

'Rock Bottom' is mentioned often on here and I too have wondered what this term may actually mean for BPDs.  I believe that for the majority of them this means actually acknowledging that they have a problem that is no one else's fault and is something they must seek professional treatment for, of course this concept flies in the face of the ohh so perfect persona that many of them try to portrait-(Haha- ie  the facebook profile pics)    For many of them just getting to that point of actually acknowledging a problem and not blaming someone for it is a huge milestone, that is why the percentage of those that actually undergo years of professional therapy and counseling to change their coping skills and behavior is so drastically lower. 

[Cumulus]

I think this is a really good question. Speaking from only what I know and have lived I think almost every day was rock bottom for my xBPDh. He spent most of his time in the detached protector mode, occasionally emerging with a fiery but short burst of anger. The only other times he emerged from this almost hypnotic state was when he had something going on, an affair, a business dealing, a manipulative plan or intrusion into another's life. Rarely, I would see the side of him that seemed to realize how much he was lacking as a person and how loath full  he found himself. But of course I never really knew him so I could be wrong. Maybe there is no rock bottom. Maybe there is nothing inside of him to ever let him know that he had lost it all. Maybe he knows but just doesn't care. Maybe that detached protector mode kicks in again not allowing him to feel the pain. I think for myself the greatest growth I have had as a person has been during the most painful times of my life. If someone or something cuts off the pain, does it also cut off personal growth?

[rollercoaster24]

Hi all

For me, way before I even realised that my (now 3 week ex) was BP, I was implementing strategies against enabling him as much as possible, I was supportive and helpful and caring, but I kept limits to how much help I gave. I also kept certain boundaries up, and he only acted out worse because of them.

I now realise that even if I had done everything right, (not even intermittently reinforcing his behaviour/abuse/violence/aggression it wouldn't have made any difference, because his parents, (mostly his Mother) have been enabling him for 13 years now, (he is now 46 and still living in a shed at their house).

Mine may well have found extramarital affairs along the way, the signs were always there, so there likely was other women 'slaves' around helping him out in his victim-hood too.

I have always taken responsibility for any criticisms he frequently lashed out, in regards to being involved with me, and I owned up to anything on my side that made things harder, (acknowledging his pain/difficulty), however I often told him, that we had both made mistakes and the issue was to stop focusing on what had happened, make personal inventory not to repeat any of it, and move on to our future plans, individually and as a couple.

I said that if he wanted to genuinely feel better, he had to learn how to change his thinking, which would then improve how he was feeling, (I would get a blank stare).

BP just couldn't do this consistently, wavering back and forth, pushing and pulling me the whole time.

In his case, I don't see that he will hit rock bottom, unless his Mother dies, (splits her between being nasty and spiteful to being a Saint for putting up with his rotten Father, who apparently according to the Mother was exactly like her son).

Looking in on the dysfunctional dynamics in that family, (but still loving and missing them too) I have always been told that the Father is the source of all BP's problems, and hers, (the Mothers). I actually think, she may well have a whole lifetime of 'bugs' from her husbands abuse, and her refusal to seek any help for the abuse herself and her children suffered at his hands.

Both herself and her husband, are now in their late 70's, with their son living at home with them off and on for the past 13 years, (when he cannot find a willing female target to assist him).

For the past 14 months that he has lived back with them, they are the frequent subject of his denigrations, and he blamed me and everyone in my life, and me, for his having to return there. Then he splits and says he knew it was his own fault!

I have worried about his parents for the whole time, mainly because they are old, frail and have had ongoing issues with their health anyway, some serious. I await the day that one of them dies, through conflict with their son, as it gets further and further out of hand.

I also believe she may well have contributed to the downfall of our relationship, with her busybody interfering, and siding with her son. She has stood by and witnessed for three years the utter violence her son put me through, she has watched him hurt and fight physically with other members of his family, his violent threats, the foul mouthed denigration campaigns, (smear campaigns on her other children), she has watched him harming her husband, and done virtually nothing until the last year, when things got more out of hand.

The Father wanted to have something done about the son (BP) years ago, but somehow the Mother feels that he does not deserve it, because the Father has never admitted he has a problem either, so it is almost as if she gets some sort of sick satisfaction over seeing her son threaten her husband, or laughing when he denigrates him disgustingly.

I watched the dynamics between them all at the dinner table many times, and really was disgusted.

Occasionally, when the Father disappears for hours, (on his cycle or visiting) she is still so insecure he is cheating after all these years, that she is confiding in her son (BP) way too often. She would side with the son against the Father, and then when she witnessed the son abusing the Father, (and getting out of control and dangerous) she would go back to siding with her husband against her 'mentally ill' son.

Last year, BP had a 72 hour restraining order placed on him by his parents, (after he had threatened his Fathers life with a metal wrench). The parents gave him $40 via the police, and BP went off to his favourite beach city to hang out for several days, 'apparently sleeping in his car'. He often had done this when out of accommodation, (through his incessant need for conflict), as when I met him, his brother had 'kicked him out on the street'.

At the time, 3 years ago, his story sounded plausible, but I still had doubts, not really finding out the truth until it was too late.

In the last few months, BP and his Father got into conflict, which resulted in BP tripping his Father over, and he sustained damage to his shoulder, (the Mother took him down to the Emergency department where he was treated and the Hospital staff had a good talk with them about their son's condition too). The experts told BP's parents that at times he is incapable of empathy, so they had to protect themselves, and try and avoid conflict of any kind.

This is particularly difficult, because BP will see injury in everything his parents do, even when there is no harm intended, by everyday actions. At other times, he is off doing his disappearing act for the days he has money, hanging out at libraries on the computers, or at shopping malls, he often said he was 'avoiding conflict'.

But the conflict is all in his own head... .

He did the same thing here, perceiving every little pathetic item of everyday life as being 'against him'. So it made life really stressful.

Anyway, no doubt BP has found other women over his time with me, that he can do his little sob story on, about his horrible experience with me, and what a truly good guy he really is, they will give him money, sex, attention, and then they will find out the truth, and he will move on to the next 'fresh and new'. To avoid looking in any more than he already does, but creates this victim self because to confront the real reality would probably kill him.

Oh yes, besides all the violence to me, I heard frequent suicide threats too.

[danley]

DETACHED PROTECTOR MODE... .

I think my ex gets this way when he feels like he's about to hit the bottom. Not rock bottom per say. But he gets this way when he's overwhelmed and knows he's going down the crapper. And of course he likes to throw in the blame flames on me for an added bonus