quit snooping

[Depression = 72% of members]

I know with a lot of you the wounds are fresh and the need to know why, how, who is sort of driving the ship.

If I can offer up something from my experience its that snooping only kept me trapped and if/when I did find "something" it only prolonged agony that I couldn't control.

When I stopped worrying about her I started fixing myself. I found me again.

That's it. Its hard, it sucks and it won't happen immediately but in the end its for the best.

Left

[left4good]

I know with a lot of you the wounds are fresh and the need to know why, how, who is sort of driving the ship.

If I can offer up something from my experience its that snooping only kept me trapped and if/when I did find "something" it only prolonged agony that I couldn't control.

When I stopped worrying about her I started fixing myself. I found me again.

That's it. Its hard, it sucks and it won't happen immediately but in the end its for the best.

Left

[Octoberfest]

I'll agree with this.  The only tricky part is that it is often incredibly painful and hard to stop living our lives for our BPDex's or for "us" and start living it for ourselves again.  It involves stripping away a part of ourselves, kind of like a part of us is dying.  It is hard.

But I agree, with stuff like facebook or other social media, you keep reaching out and looking until you figure out that EVERY time hurts.  It's like touching a hot stove.

[Undone123]

Soo true!

[Hollygoeslightly]

After thinking I was ok 5 months post break up and then having a set back looking at his Facebook today, I have to agree.

You know it's gonna hurt.

You know no good will come of it.

You snoop anyway.

[Perfidy]

I am vacillating in all my feelings. Right... Not sure who is steering the ship. No contact for quite a while. My pain and suffering are all that I have left of her. She has moved on and her struggle for happiness is shared with another now. She seems to have no  memory of me at all. She has not tried to contact me but that's good. She was playing some weird game with Facebook where she liked a lot of the pics that I posted. Mainly ones of myself. Even that was hurtful to me. She knows it. So I blocked her and her guy from my profile. I stay off hers. Facebook is a joke.

[TheDude]

But I agree, with stuff like facebook or other social media, you keep reaching out and looking until you figure out that EVERY time hurts.  It's like touching a hot stove.

When I was going through my first break ups, back when dinosaurs roamed the earth, healing/detaching/moving on seemed to be a much more expedited process. There were no pocket gadgets to secretly stalk an ex. The best you could do was as John Kusack did in "Say Anything" - camp out on her front lawn. Now? A virtual smorgasbord of digital temptation, like a recovering heroin addict getting a job at a syringe factory... .

[Octoberfest]

But I agree, with stuff like facebook or other social media, you keep reaching out and looking until you figure out that EVERY time hurts.  It's like touching a hot stove.

When I was going through my first break ups, back when dinosaurs roamed the earth, healing/detaching/moving on seemed to be a much more expedited process. There were no pocket gadgets to secretly stalk an ex. The best you could do was as John Kusack did in "Say Anything" - camp out on her front lawn. Now? A virtual smorgasbord of digital temptation, like a recovering heroin addict getting a job at a syringe factory... .

Apt analogy.

Yeah, I no longer have a facebook.  I went back and forth several times but I finally have decided that it is a detriment to have one.  All it does is tie up precious time that I could be spending living my own life.  I liken it to watching reality TV; who cares what other people do with their lives?

There is an additional wrinkle in that what we see of peoples lives on FB is not the complete story.  People post the happy things on facebook, the things that make it look like their lives are going great. No one hangs out their dirty laundry for every one to see.  We actually make ourselves feel worse because we look, see how wonderful everyone else seems to be doing, and do comparisons of their lives to ours.  It isn't a fair comparison though; we are comparing all of the happy things in their lives to both the happy and the sad things in ours.  We will always come up short.  So why make yourself feel bad when you have no reason to feel bad at all?

This is especially true of our BPDex's.  When we look at their facebooks we see all of the pictures of them smiling, the people commenting back and forth with them, their new lovers, whatever. It looks like they are on top of the world.

I actually haven't done a whole lot of real thinking on myself or my own situation here as of late... . I have found that posting here and trying to help others has allowed me to take my mind off of my own experiences. So last night as I was going to bed I decided to do some thinking.  I entertained the thought of looking at my BPDex's facebook and thought about the consequences of that.  I asked what positives could come from it?

I could see her with her new boyfriend/fiance

I could see her with a different boyfriend than I thought she had

Hell, she could even write a post on there saying "Octoberfest, I treated you so poorly and I am so very sorry for all of it.  I have been in therapy and am better now and I want to treat you the way you deserved to be treated.", and it would still be negative because it would try and drag me back into the relationship.

There is no way of swinging it where I could come out on top.

I then thought about the idea I mentioned earlier, of how her life would look all glamorous and awesome from facebook.  I made myself remember my personal experiences, the ones that didn't make it to facebook... .

-I had to stop her on multiple occasions from snorting hydros

-I had to stop her on multiple occasions from cutting

-She had panic attacks when I would catch her lying or cheating and go to leave.

-She has a pretty broken family life with lots of stress in it and fighting between members

-She is on a cocktail of medication that she often did not take

-She was in therapy but skipped group more than once

-She has a drinking problem, or at the very least is developing one

-She got poor grades in school and did not do her work

-Her friends use her for her money (which she really does not have to give away), use of her car, and other things

-She lives lies every day in order to keep her world together... . a tragic way to live in my opinion

-She lives everyday with the shame and pain of the things that have happened in her past.

These were just off the top of my head... . I am sure I could come up with more. 

I have to remind myself to take a step back... . I sort of see this healing process as having different levels... . at least 2. There are probably more but I haven't gotten there yet.  The first level, the most basic one, contains all of the anger and resentment and the Me vs. Her attitude. The second level, which is deeper, takes a step back and focuses more on yourself and looks at things objectively.  It is more grounded. It is easy to slip back and revert to the Me vs. Her mindset... . to see things like what she has on facebook as some sort of competition, who is moving on quicker, who hurts less, etc.

I have to remind myself that things are not golden rays and sunshine for my BPDex, that the struggles she had when she was with me are just as real as the ones that she is still having now to this day. Remembering that is helpful in more than one way, because it also helps me to reaffirm that "It WAS NOT me.  It WAS NOT that I wasn't good enough."

The flaming ferris wheel spins... .

[left4good]

I know how entangled it all becomes and ive been the most severely lost person out there.  I guess my point is... . when I found what I was looking for not one time did it benefit me. It was never healthy. Not even the times when her world crumbled and I had a semblance of validation.   I just had to find the courage to stop it all and put that energy back into finding me.

This time around... . I know who I am and who she is. I. Moving on and so is she and That's that.

Left

[Notthesame64]

She has not tried to contact me but that's good.

I agree perfidy... mine hasn't reached out either... don't really care if he's with another.  I know his behavior and if it was like him before me, with me... it will be another repeat with another.  Just with different personalities involved.  If he did contact me, it would be very hard for me to not engage.

I don't look for him... but I do get hung up on the details of what went wrong... for I loved him and kept trying... the end was inevitable right from go.

[left4good]

The truest thing anyone ever told me about her and the demise of our relationship was it wasn't ever my fault. "It really had nothing to do with you, left!"

Left

[Octoberfest]

The truest thing anyone ever told me about her and the demise of our relationship was it wasn't ever my fault. "It really had nothing to do with you, left!"

Left

I'll go a step further and assert that the relationship was never about you either.

[Notthesame64]

Yea October and that's the hardest to come to terms with... . What does that even mean?  I mean he sold his house to move with me in another state, he high tailed it back home after only 5months of marriage because it was to stressful, and then 5months later proclaimed his love for me again and moved back down... . if it wasn't about me... why would he of done all that... only to threaten suicide and get the drama back... his supply?  Makes no sense to me... . none of it!

[Octoberfest]

I think I made a post in another thread that might help you see a little of what I mean. I will see if I can find it

Edit: Found it-

Why am I not good enough but he is? Why? I did my best to love her, I never insulted her. WHYYYY?

Cska, you are doing yourself a disservice by asking questions like this that only serve to hurt yourself. On top of that, they are not even fair questions to ask.

You have seen enough on these boards to have read about people who's BPDexes try and recycle weeks, months, years afterwards.  A breakup can be incredibly ugly, with the non painted the darkest shade of black, and sometime later the BPD comes back like nothing has happened and attempts to start right back up again.

Honestly I think an apt comparison to being a relationship partner of a BPD is like walking into the DMV and taking a number.  To those sitting at the counter, you are simply another anonymous face, just another number.  The same can be said of much of the relationship with a pwBPD.  That hurts, A LOT to think, but let me explain and I promise you will feel better.

I firmly believe that my BPDex loved me.  But I also firmly believe that we DID NOT start dating because of some magical connection we had, or because we had a lot in common, or for any other "normal" reason two people become attracted to each other.  We both had needs that we needed/wanted to fill.  My BPDex NEEDED someone to love her/care for her/give her validation.  I had never dated before or been emotionally close to a girl, I WANTED to be loved.  For awhile, we were in love with what the other could DO for us... . it was only later that we fell in love with each other for who we were as people.  This is the first time that I have related this concept in which I have said "we"... . and that has evolved because I have a greater awareness of WHY I was drawn to my BPDex and WHY I was in that relationship.  That all comes with time.

My real point here is that, in the eyes of pwBPD, who we are as people, the things that we have to offer the world, all of our good traits, come SECOND to the validation and feelings of being wanted that we can provide them JUST by being human.  The thing that matters most to pwBPD IS NOT who we are as people.  It is how we can make them feel. Their love for what we can do for them takes priority of their love for who we are as people.

I told my BPDex at one point after the breakup, "You always told me how much you loved me... . how I could never understand or grasp just how much I meant to you.  The truth is you loved the way I could make you feel."

I think a post I made in another thread would be useful here as well, so I will copy at paste it.  To give some context, the discussion was our BPDex's in their new relationships and why they are there.

He is head over heels in love with her and she(the BPDex) is trying to learn to love him.

This idea is one that has always fascinated me and struck me as one of the more obvious "backwards" ways of thinking that many pwBPD have. When I would catch my BPDex dating another guy at the same time as she was dating me and break things off with her, she would go and cling desperately to the new guy.  I would even get into contact with him and share with him what she had been doing, send him proof in the way of text messages, etc, and she would come up with the most elaborate lies to convince him I was crazy and lying about all of it.  Later on we would talk and when she would say how much she missed me and how she hadn't wanted things to end up the way they did, that she would rather it was me she was with, and I would ask her why she was with the new guy if that was how she felt... . she would reply, "he wants to be with me.".  I would ask do you even like him? do you love him? and she would come back with "I could learn to"... .

It honestly seems to me like she didn't believe she had control over she would end up with, like she was not the one making the CHOICES that led to whatever result. The idea of being with someone only because THEY liked you, being able to admit that you would have to WORK to get to like them back, just strikes me as so backwards and so wrong... . it makes me want to ask "what the hell are you doing?"... .

The flaming ferris wheel spins... .

They fly back to an ex or to a new person after the breakup because they NEED someone to cling to.  They need someone to give them the validation and feelings of self worth that they are incapable of giving themselves.  IT DOES NOT MATTER WHO IT IS THAT IS GIVING IT TO THEM.

The truth is, IT DOESN'T matter how wonderful or great or awesome you are; that is NOT what pwBPD are looking at and making decisions on.  

That DOES NOT make you any less great or worth any less! It just means that your BPDex is incapable of appreciating it. I know that if I walked into the louvre and saw two abstract paintings side by side, one by a famous, multimillion dollar painting making artist, and one by a completely untalented nameless artist and had to guess which was which, I would be flipping a coin.  I don't have the ability, the appreciation, to tell good art from bad art.

When BPDex's come back and make recycle attempts with us, it is because they have found themselves yet again in need of the validation and feelings of love/being wanted that we are able to provide.  Their current source has dried up, so they go looking.

I think it would be helpful for you to think a little about the concept of communication/cause and effect.  Not purely in the sense of communication like verbal or written, but in all walks of life.  Communication like say... . something that sends a signal and another something that receives that signal.  

Perhaps an analogy will help (i'm going to be famous for these soon)... .

Imagine you drop your cell phone and it is damaged.  Now when you talk to people on the phone, you are able to speak into your phone and they hear what you say, but when they speak into their phones, you are unable to hear what they are saying because the speaker in your phone is broken.  Lets say you have 5 friends, and you experience the same troubles with every single one of them.  But, when any of those 5 friends call each other, they are all able to communicate normally with each other.  All of their phones work, it is yours that is damaged.

So, what would you conclude here?

Would it be that

A. Because you cannot hear what anyone else is saying, it is EVERYONE ELSES phones are damaged, there is nothing wrong with yours

or

B. Because you cannot hear what anyone else is saying, it is your phone that is damaged.

The parallel to BPD that I am trying to make here is that IT IS NOT YOU who is not good enough/damaged/ineffective/whatever. You are putting out PERFECTLY good signals, she just can't pick them up and see them for what they are, even though everyone else can. It isn't an issue on your end; it is on hers.


Whew... . that was a brain bender to write.  Hopefully it makes sense  

[Notthesame64]

Aww that would be great thank you!

[Octoberfest]

It is edited into my previous post.  I think the specific question that is addressed is "why am I not good enough, what is it about the new guy/girl that they are with them instead of me", but I believe it touches well enough on how we as partners, and the relationship itself, fulfill a need for the pwBPD.

[Notthesame64]

Their love for what we can do for them takes priority of their love for who we are as people.

I'll comment on this.  Perfectly clear.  He could never tell me what it was that he loved about me... spent a two hour ride home in silence when I asked him this question... . but he could list a thousand things what I made him feel like or what I didn't do for him.  I don't think he ever saw me as a person that loved him for him, but instead as a object that he couldn't get to fit into his ideas and reality.   Emotional depth, attachment, bonding never took place.  It was always a constant push and pull with him, trying to fill what he wanted, needed but yet kept me at arms length... truly never letting me in.

When he left and came back to recycle, he use to say... I want to be the man you deserve.  When I look at that comment it is sweet, but when I think on it I see something between it.  When he left back to the state he came from, he lied about me all the way home... now he wanted to come back.  His job ended he hated where he lived and he had nobody.  I was an option not a true loss.  Not once did I hear... why he missed me or what he missed about me... ever!  It was about how he wanted to prove he was the man I deserved.  He always felt as if he let me down.  Was that about me or him?

Your article was great and I can relate so much to what was said... it's a hard pill to swallow.  I truly think I was an extension of him... he would tell me that he always felt ashamed for what he put other people through in regards to your relationship (mother, father, sister) that he was a joke to his family.  But what he failed to realize is that he created that feeling by blabbing his mouth to everyone and using everything and anything someone has ever said or done to him against them.  He's created his own chaos for all to see... So now he feels like a failure a joke... not because he lost me or what we had like I feel I am... but because his self image and ego has been compromised.