Contradiction

[Hollygoeslightly]

Just trying to sleep and for some stupid reason all I can think about is the BPD ex and his new gf. I kept looking on her fb page and comparing and feeling so jealous. I have blocked her now to stop further temptation.

It's just tearing me up tonight and I'm trying to get to the bottom of it so sorry if rambling slightly.

I think, deep down, I feel like he's fobbed me off and any love I had (have?) For him. He told me when it ended that he coukdnt take my giving my all to him, that he protects his heart, hurt in past and I was too risky too bank on for the future (he had major anxiety about his leaving the country a few months down the line - I said I'd fallen for him and if we kept at it and took it one step at a time maybe I could go with him).

Too risky he said.

A few weeks later he goes to Prague on a uni trip. Has a fling with random girl. Decided in a whim that he is now going there, not Kenya or States to live. Fast forward a few months and they have stayed in contact and now facebook official.

I don't understand why she was a less risky option than me and why he suddenly felt able to risk his heart. Why wasn't I worth it?

He also said he woujdnt let me give up my life for him like that. Why her?

This is what is upsetting me tonight, when I thought I was over him, I've gone backwards.

I feel like he's taken an idea I had for us, brushed it aside then used it for his next gf.

There is a cynic in me that knows he wanted to move country anyway so at least he has a place to stay... .

[dancinginthelight]

Just trying to sleep and for some stupid reason all I can think about is the BPD ex and his new gf. I kept looking on her fb page and comparing and feeling so jealous. I have blocked her now to stop further temptation.

It's just tearing me up tonight and I'm trying to get to the bottom of it so sorry if rambling slightly.


Hi Hollygoeslightly

I truly feel the same way towards my ex.  And I cannot stop looking at his n hers fb pages.

Every word you have written, I am right there in the same place  :'(

[Hollygoeslightly]

Thanks dancinginthedark. I read your post before and I agree with and feel all you say. Why does it turn US into scary people we hardly recognise. It's so hard to apply logic to the illogical. Awful. And on they go like nothing is ever wrong.

If you ever need to vent let me know. Got to try and sleep now and push away bad thoughts

[dancinginthelight]

Ok thanks Holly

try and get some sleep, goodnight 

[Scout99]

I am sorry you are going through such a difficult time at the moment and that you cannot sleep, (even though I hope you have fallen asleep by now... )  

Pondering on why a BPD loved one chooses to do one thing and not another, is a futile quest... . since there are no way of scanning what might go on in their minds. What might help better is to try and focus your thoughts on all the times when things have been rough and stay away from fonder memories for the time being... .

My own take on this, and mind you this is just my personal theory and may not be valid, is that the more intimate or intense a relationship gets, when it comes to how they feel about a person they love, the higher the risks and the stakes get for them... .

They seek relationships partly for the same reasons we do, to find that partner that makes it all worth while. But they also seek validation and not the least also relief from anxiey and instability in their minds... .

But behind all that there is also the core of their disorder, which is about fear of abandonment. That is they cannot ever feel totally at peace or secure within the realms of a r/s. And the more they love, or the more a partner offers intimacy or brings a lot of intensity to the relationship or they themselves feel a lot of loving feelings, that too amps up the fear of abandonment.

And I believe more and more that can be an underlying reason why they so often choose to leave a partner that pretty much promises them everything they say they wish for, and above all perhaps stability... . It becomes to them in a way too much too loose, and that fear will never leave them... .

Therefore having a multitude of partners or choosing to settle down, (or at least form some kind of more steady r/s), I think it might be easier for them to do so with a partner they may not have as strong feelings for as they would have for a partner who has been able to evoke stronger passion and a stronger connection with them initially... .

I am not saying that is the case with your ex bf, because obviously I can't know that. But I think it could be a possible explanation behind some situations like this... .

For you in your current situation reading a bit about how relationships with pwBPD often plays out, might be helpul in you gaining some new perspective on your situation... . Maybe you are better off, the way things are, than the woman he currently is choosing to be with... .  

How a Borderline Personality Disorder Love Relationship Evolves


Best Wishes

Scout99

[papawapa]

For five of the twelve years my ex and I were together I was going to college and taking care of children when they were young. I took 60k in student loans that went into our joint account. The only positive thing that she did contribute to our relationship was that she always held a job. The entire time she p****d and moaned about having to support me, that I didn't contribute enough financially. The entire time she also constantly accused me of cheating.

Fast forward to today... . my replacement is a convicted felon that has limited prospects for employment. He will be lucky to make $10 an hour. She lives with him in his mother's basement and he has another girlfriend living there with him. She is buying them fast food, cigarettes, weed, and alcohol. He is completely leeching off her and contributing nothing to supporting her. He is also sleeping with the other woman while my ex is off at work. Her new situation is the exact thing she always exaggerated and complained about when her and I were together. It is mind boggling that she tolerates such a situation.

My opinion is that this type of behavior is the result of her not having any true sense of who she is and what she wants out of life.

[danley]

Similar examples here... .

He said he doesn't feel like being in a relationship and ends things with me. He starts dating someone else two months later. Two months later he tells me he's not sure he should be dating or dating this new person. Two weeks later he's reminiscing about us being together and being flirtatious... .

He says I'm his best friend. I tell him I think we should take a break. He paints me black. The next week he's telling me what a great friend I am and how lucky he's to have me as his best friend.

After breakup he tells me we will remain friends. A few days later he's a jerk and not friend like material. I try to keep cordial and friendly and he pushes me away and says we can't be friends. I avoid him. He starts trying to engage me and tells me I'm his best friend. I tell him that I agree that this friends thing isn't working out. He rages and tells ME seconds later that HE thinks being friends isn't working out. The next week he's telling me I'm his best friend... .

I'm black one day and white the next. I'm generous one day and the next day he's calling me selfish. He's ashamed to be around me and when I leave he chases me down. He says he needs space and I disappear but then a few days later he's trying to contact me... .

He says he can't stand people who lie and are full of themselves but he has shown these qualities the last few months. He says he can't stand when people talk about people behind their backs but yet he does it all the time. He says money isn't important to him but yet he cannot stop talking about money. He says he's so concerned about my well being but yet he acts like he doesn't. He says it's vital to be mentally healthy and to learn from your mistakes but yet he isn't and doesn't. He says he doesn't like it when people treat him like a doormat but yet it's okay for him to treat others that way... .

Contradictions... .

[obtunded]

He says money isn't important to him but yet he cannot stop talking about money.

Mine always said money wasn't important... . right before she went and spent it all... .

He says he doesn't like it when people treat him like a doormat but yet it's okay for him to treat others that way... .

Wow! Mine used the exact same line; must be something about how their brains are wired!

[clover528]

Danley,

I could have written that post. My ex to a tee! he is a walking contradiction. Swears undying love one minute then hates me the next. Says he doesnt have a relationship with the new women he is living with then would send me photos of them "together"... . Uhm yeah I do mean what that says. They are sick individuals and trying to understand or apply logic to their actions, nonsensical. Do not try. contradictions abound because they cant form a cohesive thought longer than a few moments in my opinion.

[Hollygoeslightly]

Thank you Scout99 for your take on my story. To be honest, I had thought the same, but wasn't sure if I was just telling myself that to make myself feel better and go "aha - you did mean something to him. See?" Early on, before I knew about BPD, I figured that he fell for me hard, that all these feelings were more intense than he had dealt with before, and he couldn't actually handle it. I think that is what makes this harder - that I feel we had "something" good and he couldn't cope. It's a new one for me. I think because we never said I love you to one another, but it was gearing up for it, hurts the most.

I just feel with this new girl, as they are so similar and he appears to be doing it long distance right now until they move to her country/travel together (whatever they are doing), that it may well work out and she could be the one for him. I feel like I meant nothing to him and he is doing all this stuff with her and taking risks that he wouldn't with me. Arrrgh - it's like you say, you can't see inside their brains.

He did say at one point to our friend "I can't cope with her giving her all to me right now." Flashes of honesty.

I think though if he was stressed out from a part time uni course and part time uni work, whilst working part time, how is he gonna cope travelling country to country and looking for work with a girl he barely knows in reality.

I think I should try and go with your reasoning - they yes they may be happy, and he could stand to be with her a longer time, but that's only because the same intensity of feeling isn't there as what he felt for me, and therefore he can handle it better and actually enjoy it more because of the lack of pain (panic / anxiety attacks, lack of emotional overwhelm) etc. I'm not saying I want them to fail, but I'm expecting them to. Shouldn't bother me!

I think you are right in that I am better off, and my head definitely knows this, it's just the old heart going "but... . but... . but... . you love him!". Did I really love him though? Or was it just the "him" that he presented to me?

Papawapa - love the name btw - the lack of a true sense of self thing is really interesting. In old photos on facebook (which I know you can't judge much by, but humour me... . ) my ex was a non-descript nerd with glasses, lack of style etc. Fast forward 2 years with a girl who is into her vintage fashion and he's suddenly a non glasses wearing flat cap donning hipster wannabe. I thought when I met him that was going to be his personality but in the end that was just date 1 and he ended up a hoodies and jeans kinda guy. I didn't mind at all one way or another, but I do wonder how much personality of the other person he took on.

His current girlfriend shares his career ambitions / life and travelling ambitions / likes etc. However, she could almost be my best friend because of how similar our interests are. Is he constantly looking for the same kind of woman?

Danley - it's so frustrating those contradictions. I've remembered a few more after reading what you said. Dating profile non smoker. Smokes a pipe daily. First date not much of a drinker. Seems to drink quite regularly. Going to be a successful animator. Falling behind/failing his masters. Going to move to Kenya but I can't go with as he couldn't let me give up too much for him. 2 weeks later meets a girl in Prague, keeps in contact, now in relationship and planning to travel the world together or something. Was going to marry his ex. Decided "something didn't feel right" the day before the wedding.

Lots of face palming with these BPD exes!

Clover 528 - I like your take on it. Simple and to the point. I think the only cohesive thought in my exes head was being able to pick a film.

[Scout99]

Hollygoeslightly wrote:

Thank you Scout99 for your take on my story. To be honest, I had thought the same, but wasn't sure if I was just telling myself that to make myself feel better and go "aha - you did mean something to him. See?" Early on, before I knew about BPD, I figured that he fell for me hard, that all these feelings were more intense than he had dealt with before, and he couldn't actually handle it. I think that is what makes this harder - that I feel we had "something" good and he couldn't cope. It's a new one for me. I think because we never said I love you to one another, but it was gearing up for it, hurts the most.

I just feel with this new girl, as they are so similar and he appears to be doing it long distance right now until they move to her country/travel together (whatever they are doing), that it may well work out and she could be the one for him. I feel like I meant nothing to him and he is doing all this stuff with her and taking risks that he wouldn't with me. Arrrgh - it's like you say, you can't see inside their brains.

He did say at one point to our friend "I can't cope with her giving her all to me right now." Flashes of honesty.

I think though if he was stressed out from a part time uni course and part time uni work, whilst working part time, how is he gonna cope travelling country to country and looking for work with a girl he barely knows in reality.

I think I should try and go with your reasoning - they yes they may be happy, and he could stand to be with her a longer time, but that's only because the same intensity of feeling isn't there as what he felt for me, and therefore he can handle it better and actually enjoy it more because of the lack of pain (panic / anxiety attacks, lack of emotional overwhelm) etc. I'm not saying I want them to fail, but I'm expecting them to. Shouldn't bother me!

I think you are right in that I am better off, and my head definitely knows this, it's just the old heart going "but... . but... . but... . you love him!". Did I really love him though? Or was it just the "him" that he presented to me?

Hi Hollygoeslightly!

Glad to be of help! I know how you feel since breaking up with anybody really who have been able to evoke strong and intense feelings of love and passion in us i hard!

And we don't want to really have to face the truth that it is over, even if we know in our heads, like you put it, it is the way it is... .

Since there are no answers to be found from a person not willing (or able) to give them to us, we are left with what we do know, and that is our own part in it... . I think you have to allow yourself to actually feel a bit of grief and loss for a while and let those feelings be acknowledged. It is painful to loose in love, no matter if the person in question has BPD or not and not get too stuck in the why's and the how's and the what if's of things... .

Having said that I think it would be fair to suggest that this new r/s of his has a whole different vibe to it for him than being the thing that makes him settle down... . From the way you describe it, it sounds to me as if it is like one hell of an adventure that can be coated with tons of magical thinking and also a convenient escape from thoughts and feelings of intimacy and stability that being what he is, a BPD, made him run for the hills... .

Adventure and passion is addictive to a person who has an unstable sense of self and who fears abandonment. Because it often offers a relief from introspection. It becomes very much living in the here and now. And that can be soothing for him at this time... .

Even though I understand hearing that can feel tormenting to you where you are now, still hurting a lot from your break... .

But if nothing else, try to find some kind of peace in the fact that a guy like this, who is this much affected by his disorder, usually means going through if not h*ll then at least purgatory for a mentally sound partner... . You would not have been long term happy in this relationship despite the intense feelings it evoked in you... .

And I can promise you this: Times will get better, and these intense feelings of loss will subside! And once they do, you will be able to look into this experience with new and clearer eyes. And take with you from it the things that were good, and learn from the things that were bad.

Best Wishes and keep posting! We are here for you!

Scout99

[Hollygoeslightly]

Scout 99 - thank you again for your kindness. I feel you speak a lot of sense, and sense is definitely what I need at this moment. I think I'm annoyed at myself that he was able to get me to react and feel in such a fashion and just go "meh - can't handle this, I'm off."

He did give me some answers when I asked him why it had to be over, but I guess this is where I became a bit unstuck as nothing he said seemed to make actual sense. The fact that I was sweetest, kindest, nicest, funniest girl he had ever been close to and generous beyond belief, but that wasn't worth "trying" for.

I thought I had grieved properly for the loss of the relationship, but perhaps there is more to get out of my system. Maybe I need to do one of those "letters you never send." I'm not sure how I should be grieving properly, truth be told.

Your comment about adventure and passion totally matches up to his past then - never settling in one house, country, family (when in foster care). No wonder this idea of travelling countries excites him. I was so willing to do that with him as I wanted to travel - though if like you said before he cared about me too much and it got too close, it owuldn't have ever worked and I'd have woken up in a foreign country alone.

I never really thought about it as a relief from his introspection before. That's a wise way of looking at it. If he is finally living in the here and now, then I guess I should be happy for him as perhaps he is realising and getting better. Realising that the past and future shouldn't impact on his current situation.

I wonder what the girl is like mental health wise and if she knows what she is in for?

God I do wish I'd never met him haha.

Thank you one again :-)

[HealingSlowly]

sKIP wrote earlier (sorry, not sure how to quote here!)... .

Therefore having a multitude of partners or choosing to settle down, (or at least form some kind of more steady r/s), I think it might be easier for them to do so with a partner they may not have as strong feelings for as they would have for a partner who has been able to evoke stronger passion and a stronger connection with them initially... .

I suspect my ex (it's been over - again - for over 7 months, and over two months of NC) is in fact with someone else. Interestingly, I have heard rumors from mutual friend/colleagues who are on his FB. He and I are not on FB. I cut that off months ago and thankfully can't see his page (past regular profile/cover pic and nothing "new"... .

One of my worst nightmares is that I was not the one - who stuck it out and tried everything and still loved and even loves this person - and he'd settle down and be okay with someone else... . And I have wondered if someone that is less "threatening" could "do the trick" - if someone he wasn't really in love with (but knows loves him) from the start, knowing that our relationship (close to three years) and despite all the problems, was also very close. There was a lot of love. Not in the way I understood it, I now see (in part - I think it was partly there for him) but it was love.

I guess I'm just wondering how a BPD could settle with someone with whom there are less intense feelings ... . when it seems to me the BPD NEEDS this and yet is terrified and in turn rejects this at the same time?

Any thoughts? Thanks!

[HealingSlowly]

P.S. The rumors I've heard. I've just heard that there seems to be a new "friend" and no one can tell if it's "romantic"and yet it seems pretty weird if it's friendship... . and, at the same time, that the friend seems to be a bit more "romantic" in comments but not clear ... . so i wonder if he has chosen someone who he is not "in love" with but she is with him and is keeping it cool... .

I can see my ex doing this but not for long. And because of the Bpd.

Just to clarify what where I was going on in my last post. Thanks again!

[HealingSlowly]

OMG, sorry for all the errors! It was SCOUT and NOT Skip whom I quoted:

Therefore having a multitude of partners or choosing to settle down, (or at least form some kind of more steady r/s), I think it might be easier for them to do so with a partner they may not have as strong feelings for as they would have for a partner who has been able to evoke stronger passion and a stronger connection with them initially... .

[Scout99]

scout wrote earlier (sorry, not sure how to quote here!)... .

Therefore having a multitude of partners or choosing to settle down, (or at least form some kind of more steady r/s), I think it might be easier for them to do so with a partner they may not have as strong feelings for as they would have for a partner who has been able to evoke stronger passion and a stronger connection with them initially... .

I suspect my ex (it's been over - again - for over 7 months, and over two months of NC) is in fact with someone else. Interestingly, I have heard rumors from mutual friend/colleagues who are on his FB. He and I are not on FB. I cut that off months ago and thankfully can't see his page (past regular profile/cover pic and nothing "new"... .

One of my worst nightmares is that I was not the one - who stuck it out and tried everything and still loved and even loves this person - and he'd settle down and be okay with someone else... . And I have wondered if someone that is less "threatening" could "do the trick" - if someone he wasn't really in love with (but knows loves him) from the start, knowing that our relationship (close to three years) and despite all the problems, was also very close. There was a lot of love. Not in the way I understood it, I now see (in part - I think it was partly there for him) but it was love.

I guess I'm just wondering how a BPD could settle with someone with whom there are less intense feelings ... . when it seems to me the BPD NEEDS this and yet is terrified and in turn rejects this at the same time?

Any thoughts? Thanks!

There is no simple or just one answer to that, as there are many different people with BPD and they are all not acting or reacting the same... .

What they all have in common though is the fear of abandonment and the unstable sense of self. And with that usually comes fear of intimacy as well as often harbouring conflicting or quickly changing emotions together with an everlasting perception of emptiness on the inside.

Intimacy is however not the same thing as intense feelings or passion. Intimacy is deeper feelings promising of stability and security. And they often set off the fear of abandonment, in a pw BPD, since the fear of abandonment often consists of a deep set thought pattern telling them that nothing no matter how solid ever lasts. Those are the life rules that controls how they feel... . The promise of stability therefore to them may ring false in a way, since it stands in conflict with their negative expectation of stability always failing in the end... .

The consequence for them is that the emptiness of never allowing oneself of believing things can last, becomes that they crave/need validation from other people creating at least a temporary relief from the emptiness felt inside. And validation in the form of passion and intensity works soothing for them temporarily... .

As a partner of a BPD we are often mistaken these intense feelings and the passion for being true love and a promise of everlasting love, when it often instead is part of a mutual idealization. Idealization is not the same as true love or intimacy.

That does not mean they don't love! They just love in an intense and passionate and short lived way and usually can't sustain it. And when their fear of abandonment sets in they usually bail because conflicting emotions are usually unbearable for everybody. BPD or NON. With that fear, fear of pain also follows. And the discomfort of pain is something most of them, (at least when untreated), can't handle.

Now to your question, how could they choose to settle with someone they have less intense feelings for?

There is no universal answer to this either. Most BPD's never really truly settles, but often have a string of relationships, all drama-filled throughout their lives. But if the desire to settle is in them, for whatever reasons, (that could be expectations from family or wanting to have children or romantic ideas, need for financial stability or whatever), my guess is, ( and remember this is just a theory of mine!), it may be easier on them if such a relationship, for them, is not "infected" with too strong emotions from both the other party and/or too strong emotions on their side... .

However that is not a prescription for a healthy relationship! Just one that may easier stand the test of time... . But may instead be filled with many of the things you can see if you read on the Staying board about what challenges faces those relationships... . Raging episodes and cheating being perhaps the most common problems... . ?

They are usually though very perceptive of our emotions, so it would not be possible for a potential partner to sort of downplay our emotions, to better suit their eventual need... . They will detect the true feelings from the partner and react accordingly... .

One of the biggest problems in many of the cases here on the board with partners being pushed away and replaced is that we too have a problem of getting easily addicted to the intensity of the initial phase that often comes with getting involved with a pw BPD. That whole thing has to do with us, not them... . And usually stems from our expectations on relationships in general... . I know that is true for myself anyway... . I tend to get bored when things in a relationship is a bit too mellow... .  But the truth is lasting love is not about intense passion and roller coaster feelings. It is about stability, friendship and deep intimacy and trust... .

And in order to find that we have to get on board with that... .

In essence one could say, that we often make for bad combinations with pw BPD because of that... . We get easily addicted to passion and intensity and they are passionate and intense always in the beginning. But that is where the mutual ground ends... .

We wish for stability and intimacy and a future together, whereas they are primarily looking to fulfill their need for validation and pain relief in a dysfunctional way. And our wishes sets their fears off and that in turn creates fear of pain in them. And so the dysfunctional dance is on... . That can usually only end one way... .

On quoting - I too had a hard time with that in the beginning! there are two ways to quote.

You can either use the "Quote" link at the top of every post that will automatically put the whole post you want to quote from into the post you are writing. And once there you can cut away the parts, if needed, that you don't want to quote and then continue to write your part under the last quote mark that looks something like this:

([quote\])

You can also just cut what you want to quote and then use the button in the message writing box that looks like a little speech bubble then two quotation signs will come up, and you can then paste your quote in the middle of them leaving one quote designations on each side of the quote.

Hope that helps! I am terrible at describing technical stuff!

Best Wishes

Scout

[HealingSlowly]

Thank you, Scout, I think I've even figured out how to quote stuff... .

I appreciate your response, and all others' responses! I believe that you're right there is no universal answer. Still working

through all of this based on individual contexts ... that said, the patterns are unmistakable and pretty "universal" here.

Feeling better today - always do after visiting the site. More insight, more empathy - felt and given. Wow, never imagined anything like this but here it is and still is and it's a long process... .

Thanks again!