Getting thoughts out of your head ...

[louise 716]

It's me again, Louise716. MIL of (after several years of marriage whom we - everyone but son - all have come to recognize) uBPDdil who is married to veteran son with PTSD.

Here's the bottom line to the following story: how do you get thoughts of your son possibly killing you out of your head? He has made NO threat. NEVER directed his anger to me personally - only in blasting e mails or text messages. My fear is that with all that is going for him, his uBPDwife, who has extreme hatred towards me, will someday push him over the edge. Another fear I have is that he will take his own life (how much needling and isolation can a person take) and worst case scenario is he will also take his wife's. (one of his buddies did this) Again, I repeat, NO threats have been made, but in these situations, we've all read about them ... .they just snap.

I am pretty sure if son does commit suicide his uBPDw will most likely not allow us to attend his service. So, I contacted a funeral home and found out legally we can write our own obituary for him. So I am working on that. I also am working on gathering photos. Worst comes to worse, we will have our own celebration of life service. I think, maybe once I finish with his obit and get the photos in order, I won't feel the urgency to put this piece in order and maybe then those thoughts won't be so on the surface.

Son wanted nc since last January with siblings and me, but not my dh. We obliged. End of April he comes over to say they are moving 2 hours away. Haven't heard from him since. DH has heard from him on average every other week.

Two weeks ago, son calls the house phone at 11:15 pm and we talk for 1 1 /2 hours. He obviously had had a little liquid courage, which is why he called. He tried reaching dh/his father 4 times but dh was working so couldn't answer his cell phone. One of things son said was something rambling about how we are a family - even though he said no contact - they are supposed to contact him. Next morning I write son a "thanks for calling" e mail (to his personal email account mind you) and reminded him we loved him, dh and/or I are willing to meet up and talking about "the situation" and if he wants we are willing to go to counseling together.

Next morning, home phone rings again and it's uBPDdil sounding very angry and accusatory saying son had "packed up all of his things and left." She said I had sent son an email talking about meeting up somewhere. Where was he. She was his wife and had a right to know. Needless to say none of us knew he had left nor where he was. I did tell her that the email was meant for son, not her.

Anyhow, we all texted him that we loved him. Let us know if he was okay. He did return home and when he did he sent me a messed up text message.

Fast forward to his birthday a week ago. We all acknowledged his bd with a simple text message. Mine said "Hi honey ... ." so he knew who that was from. Two siblings sent text messages and the reply they got was "Who is this?" ... .so, it is obvious he had deleted their contact information. DH and I sent a card (dh's handwriting since dil obviously has a real issue with me). No bd check. We donated to an organization in honor of his birthday. A text around supper time the day of his birthday he sent me and his siblings but not his father: ""One thing you all need to understand is that not only did you hurt me greatly, you hurt my wife. I'm staying with her, she is my family and you have to respect her or you all will not be part of my life.  While you guys may be over everything that happened, I am not and neither is x because no one bothered to try and talk about it.  You can't just pretend it didn't happen. I'm tired of everything always coming back on me or x. Brother, you f* everything up by stirring the pot and getting butthurt over a Facebook post.  I've tried to patch things up so many times but enough is enough. You can't apologize to only me, because there is x that was also hurt. You don't tell her happy birthday (son told us his wife was "done with us all" so honestly, he is right, we did not acknowledge her birthday) but you tell me. How does that make me feel? You have to think of both of us because one effects the other. You don't respect her, you're disrespecting me and I won't be part of it anymore. You want to get offended over trivial things, that's on you, but we are also capable of being hurt and offended.  It's a two way street. Mom, when x called to ask where I was, you were very rude with her (this is be/c I said the e mail was meant for son and not her.) Honestly, I should not have called but there is nothing I can do about it now. Happy birthday to me, family crap, and mass shootings. My wife has and always will come first and if you have a problem with her, you have a problem with me.  Still not in the mood to talk unless you all can somehow express your thoughts in a respectful manner to x. Thanks but no thanks for the birthday wishes. Nothing has changed."

My response to the above - no reply. To the best of my knowledge only one sibling replied and it was along the lines of "I'm sorry I can't be the sister you want me to be. I'm throwing in the towel."

He did just make Christmas very easy. Nothing. Wasn't going to give to wife anyway, but now, zip. nada. nothing.

It is extremely obvious PTSDson is being controlled by uBPDwife.

So, if you read all this, back to my original question, how do you get those nasty thoughts out of your head?  Who else is in this nasty boat? How are you dealing with it?

[PrettyPlease]

It's me again, Louise716. MIL of (after several years of marriage whom we - everyone but son - all have come to recognize) uBPDdil who is married to veteran son with PTSD.

Here's the bottom line to the following story: how do you get thoughts of your son possibly killing you out of your head?... .[snip]

So, if you read all this, back to my original question, how do you get those nasty thoughts out of your head?  Who else is in this nasty boat? How are you dealing with it?

Hi Louise716

Your story is very difficult, and I'm sure it's causing you a lot of pain. My own experiences don't match what you've asked for -- I don't have a voice in my head warning me about a loved one killing me -- but I'm not sure you will find someone like that, so if I may I'll give my reaction.

Your story sounds like a knife-edge situation. Certainly it could be dangerous. You describe at least three people with strong anger and/or fear (son, DIL, yourself), and several others involved. Your son was in the military, has PTSD, and knows of people who have murder-suicided.

This is not a situation to take lightly. On the positive side, the thoughts of the threat, and the obsessing on the obituary and death (I'm being blunt using the word obsessing here, but from my point of view that might be fair), are in your mind. And I'm not surprised that they are -- it's a hellish situation -- but what I mean by 'positive' is that you have control of them. They are yours. Do you have a T to tell these thoughts to? If not, my suggestion is take them immediately to a professional counsellor and begin laying out the story. That way you may be able to relax some of your anxiety, change some of your internal reactions, which is all you can really control.

Another thought I had is how tragic it all is -- but this is always the case with axis two disorders, I think. The anger of the DIL, her BPD, is really caused by things happening long ago, probably when she was a toddler. And your son's anger and PTSD probably from things that happened in the military. And perhaps you have some triggers or hooks for engagement that came from your own early history. Most of us do.

What I'm getting at is that this complex 'engagement' that you all have is about something else; it's a replaying of emotions caused by other people who aren't here any more. So I think that disengagement is your main task. And I think having your own T to talk to about how to best do that would be a good place to start. It would also mean that you'd have an objective observer ready to alert you if things take a turn for the worse and you're still too engaged to recognize the danger.

Caveat: I'm not a professional counsellor, and I know this post may sound too prescriptive and meddling on my part (and it may be), but I think I prefer that risk to the one of discovering later that the situation escalated out of control and I didn't say anything when I could have. My reaction is that you need to change something fundamental here, and you are what you have the most control over.

PP

[louise 716]

Thanks, Prettyplease for giving me some sort of perspective to consider.

For me, once I put some pieces together (obituary and photos for son) I think I can put that piece aside as best as I can. I know I can't control if he does do that, but at least I can feel like I will have some control over how we remember him, while I am thinking straight. I've already walked the path of his legally who gets his body, etc, and that won't be an issue for me. So if I have some control while I'm thinking straight, that helps that piece.  I am not planning out his service, just getting facts/names on a sheet of paper and printing photos.  I know I have no control over if he commits suicide and if it ends the murder-suicide route, so I'm not trying to control that. I know it won't be my fault either.

I don't go around looking over my shoulder thinking he is right there.  Just knowing the hatred she has for me and how easy it for her to manipulate me. Also, the memory that the last time she and I were together I was talking about how challenging my new manager at work was going to be. DIL's response was "just kill her." Who says that?

I do think I need to go back to the T we went to back in the early spring/late winter to talk this part out.  Actually, my T has said I have a "healthy disengagement."

"My reaction is that you need to change something fundamental here, and you are what you have the most control over." ... .I get that, but what am I supposed to change? I can change my thoughts ... .for the obvious thing I have control over, which I am working on but since we don't have contact with him unless he contacts us ... .there's nothing to change there either.

Keeping myself busy will help to occupy my brain.

[GeekyGirl]

Hi louise,

 I'm so sorry that you're going through this. I can see why you'd be worried. This has to be hard for you.

So, if you read all this, back to my original question, how do you get those nasty thoughts out of your head?  Who else is in this nasty boat? How are you dealing with it?

PrettyPlease brought some excellent points. You cannot control your DS or your DIL. You can't change them. I agree that you and your actions/thoughts should really be your focus, and getting a T (if you don't have one already) would be an very prudent thing to do. Whether your fears are unfounded or not, they're causing you a lot of fear and discomfort, so it's worth it to explore what's driving them.

Since your DS is limiting contact with you (which I know has to hurt)  , you could continue to look at his e-mails/calls, ask your DH to listen for anything that could indicate that he could endanger himself or others, and be prepared to get the authorities involved if something doesn't seem right.

[GeekyGirl]

Keeping myself busy will help to occupy my brain.

It will, and I think it's a good idea to keep your brain engaged and busy anyway, for your own well-being. Is there something that you like to do that can keep you busy and feeling good?

For me, once I put some pieces together (obituary and photos for son) I think I can put that piece aside as best as I can. I know I can't control if he does do that, but at least I can feel like I will have some control over how we remember him, while I am thinking straight. I've already walked the path of his legally who gets his body, etc, and that won't be an issue for me. So if I have some control while I'm thinking straight, that helps that piece.  I am not planning out his service, just getting facts/names on a sheet of paper and printing photos.  I know I have no control over if he commits suicide and if it ends the murder-suicide route, so I'm not trying to control that. I know it won't be my fault either.

If he did do something to hurt himself, it wouldn't be your fault. What's going on now with him isn't your fault. As parents, we tend to feel a sense of responsibility for our children's actions. Do you feel like you could have or should have stopped him from getting into this situation? Sometimes that can lead to some much stronger feelings.

[louise 716]

Geeky Girl,

":)o you feel like you could have or should have stopped him from getting into this situation?" ... .short answer is no.  We have always tried to play by their ever changing rules. Don't do this. Do this. Don't do that, etc. You know that drill. We didn't realize until last December that his wife was uBPDN. Game changer. We then realized we were not just dealing with young people (mid 20's) who needed guidance. We were dealing with a serious mental health issue. Way back when they were first dating he broke it off with her - that's not uncommon. He told me "her mom is crazy." When he was deployed one of those times, his other then gf broke it off with him and somewhere in there I suggested he give this girl (his now wife) another look. I didn't know her be/c she lived in another country, but from what she had been emailing me I knew she had feelings for him. Obviously, he did give her another look cuz they got married.  Shortly after they were married he was talking to me saying how emotionally draining it was to always have to validate her. At that point I know I said "For heaven's sake, divorce her." My feeling was, marriage is already hard enough given the best of circumstances, but given what he was saying and I had already received scathing e mails from her, I knew it was not going to be an easy road. uBPDw is bilingual. I've never been able to have a conversation with her parents be/c literally, we don't speak the same language.

Son doesn't e mail or text us, with the exception of that last blasting text message. If we don't write/respond he doesn't write. And since he is the one who said NC, we are obliging. That and it's just too painful when he does write those hurtful things.

That is exactly correct - I have no control over DS and DIL.

Here's a question for you ... .short of not answering those hurtful texts or e mails, they are the ones who went NC with us.  Say the next time we get a "nasty gram" do we reply something like we don't want those types of angry, hurtful messages any more? His siblings could block their numbers/e mail addresses (that seems pretty permanent) but right now I'm thinking as parents I would still want to be able to have contact if he chooses. It's not like we get messages from them even monthly.

I do know the city DS lives in and have put the police and sheriff non-emergency numbers in my phone. I did that years ago when one of my brothers was going through a low point in his life.  I will have absolutely no hesitation to call authorities if something seems really wrong. A true emergency would be a 911 call and I know their address so that part is covered.

[GeekyGirl]

Here's a question for you ... .short of not answering those hurtful texts or e mails, they are the ones who went NC with us.  Say the next time we get a "nasty gram" do we reply something like we don't want those types of angry, hurtful messages any more? His siblings could block their numbers/e mail addresses (that seems pretty permanent) but right now I'm thinking as parents I would still want to be able to have contact if he chooses. It's not like we get messages from them even monthly.

You could reply with something like, "When you say things like [insert nasty comment], it makes me feel [insert emotion]." The other thing you could try is setting a boundary and asking your DS or DIL to respect your feelings as you'll respect theirs. SET (Communication tools (SET, PUVAS, DEARMAN)) is good for communicating boundaries.

Do you want to try a response using SET with us?

[louise 716]

Sure but I have to think up an example first ... .and I'm about to go on a walk with a friend.

[louise 716]

Okay, so I am trying to think of an example. In our phone conversation he said no one contacts him ... .Like I said before this is bec he said he wanted to go nc with us. I could've used some sort of communication tool in that response.

His nasty emails/text messages don't warrant any response if I don't want to encourage that type of behavior.

I hear nothing from her except when she was upset ds was AWOL.