Targeted?

[MrFox]

I have a question for the board that has been gnawing at me for most of the day.  Well, I have a million questions about what happened with my diagnosed exBPDgf, but this one is just at the forefront at the moment.  I haven't been on the boards long and if this topic has been discussed before I apologize for bringing it up again.

My question is this, does anyone else feel as though their pwBPD targeted them for more than just having someone to love them and care for them?  That they targeted them for something less tangible, such as social standing?  I hadn't thought about it until having lunch with a friend who knows everything that has happened.  At one point my friend looked at me and said, "She totally targeted you years ago."  It floored me but I think he may be right.

A bit of history.  I have been in the underground music scene in my hometown since middle school and still am.  I have a good reputation within that world as well as the tattoo world that seems to go hand in hand with the music scene.  These are two worlds she is very interested in.  Up until roughly 4 years ago she was married, and from the photos I have seen from that time, she could have been the poster child for suburban housewife.  Since leaving her ex she has transformed herself into something closer to punk rock pin up.  Not Suicide Girls, but getting close.  She began taking photos of bands to "build her portfolio", which is how we met.

She contacted me specifically asking to take photos of the band I play in.  She did not contact me through the band page, but through my personal FB page.  We met while she was photographing one of our shows.  She ended up shooting a couple of our shows, all the time refusing to really deal with the other members of the band when it came to picking up the photos, setting things up, etc.  Possibly because one is married and the other is a woman?  She always insisted on dealing with me and insisted on meeting me for drinks to handle things or meeting at her house (that she shared with her boyfriend or roommate, it really depended on the day).  We became friends but she always pushed for more, despite the fact that in the 2 years before we started a relationship she found the time to get engaged twice (now three times, this one to my replacement).

Could it be that one of the big draws she felt for me was to use me as an in to get into a world she was keen on becoming part of?  After the break up she attempted to break up the band I play in as well as spread poison within the music scene here.  Luckily I know good people and they didn't listen to her lies.  Since then she has pretty much cut off all ties with anyone in the music and tattoo scene here.

Is this something common that pwBPD do?  I know they don't have a problem using people to get what they need but this just seems a little creepy.

[love4meNOTu]

Well... .I can only relay my own experience.

My exhusband with PD told me in an email before we met for our first date that he was going to sweep me off my feet.

Now ask yourself, why would someone say such a thing before they've even met?

Perhaps because they've already decided that they want you, and since they haven't actually seen you in person (just pics) but know everything else about you, like your job, your friends, where you live, how much equity you have in your house...

Yes, I think we have been targeted.

[MrFox]

Sounds eerily familiar.  She knew quite a bit about me before we met.  At least what she could know from the internet, a few brief chats we had over the internet, and talking to some people we mutually knew.  After our first actual meeting, which was very brief after the first time she photographed for us, I got home that night to an email that said she didn't think anyone like me existed in the world and she might have not heard the last part of the conversation because she was lost in my eyes.  We spoke for like 5 minutes.  I think if I had been healthier, it would have creeped me out, but my need for affection drank it up.

Seems like, yes, they do actually target strangers for things other than just love and care.  Ew.

[Pearl55]

Of course, decades ago they used to call theses women gold diggers or home wreckers. Not all of them but the more intelligent they are the more pre calculated.

[MrFox]

Of course, decades ago they used to call theses women gold diggers or home wreckers. Not all of them but the more intelligent they are the more pre calculated.

I guess I didn't take that into account.  Or more so, I didn't take the internet into account.  I had the idea that women (or men) like that meet a person and then decide that's who they target.  With the internet, I suppose you can meet someone before you meet them.  Excellent point.

[goldylamont]

before we start throwing around words like gold-digger/home-wrecker i think it's important to make a distinction.

MrFox, yes, totally sounds like you were targeted--thing is, "targeting" in this way is kind of natural, kind of ok or probably even flattering--IF the person targeting you doesn't have a PD or has some empathy for your well being.

What I mean is, any time a guy goes for a gal, or the somewhat rarer case where a gal goes for a guy (or guy to guy, gal to gal... .you get the picture), well this in itself is targeting, right? You're pursuing someone you are attracted to. Pursuing someone you like isn't inherently wrong, even if it's because this person is doing something (like playing music) that you really appreciate and want to be more involved in. What if all the sudden you started really getting into health and working out, then there was someone cute at a fitness class that you like so you kind of go to a particular class on a particular day and eventually want to talk to this person. As long as you're not a creep, don't come off as creepy and you have good intentions for the other party, well, this is just age-old courtship. nothing wrong with that.

Yes, sounds like you were targeted. The reason why it's creepy is because the person doing the targeting has so many secret motives, so many secret issues and most likely one (or multiple) other partners who she was abusing while pursuing you. Abusing by pursuing you when it wasn't appropriate maybe.

Pursuing with good intentions and a dose of puppy-love: cool. But anything done for completely self-serving reasons while recklessly spreading the sphere of abuse; not cool.

[MrFox]

You bring up some great points, goldylamont.  I guess we do all 'target' in a way.  It really is the motives behind it that dictate the creepiness or non-creepiness of it.  That, and the way that someone with BPD can be relentless in their pursuit of what they want.  Say anything, do anything to meet their needs.  I guess I should feel flattered that I was a trophy? 

Again, great post.  Thank you for the input. 

[GreenMango]

I agree with Goldy on the dating thing.  Part of dating is tendency to mirror eachother and idealize the other party for a time then real life kicks in and people adjust to coupledom.

Where BPD comes into play is one of the characteristics is a pervasive pattern of instability which includes a fluctuating sense of self.  This doesn't mean a run of the mill one off midlife crisis in most cases.  Most of the time you see the fluctuating identity and impulsive changes without much consideration to the impact and much it is linked to emotional regulation or an inability to handle emotional stressors.   Like changing your identity from a mom to pinup photographer, serial intense relationships, heavy conflict cycles, etc.

Good to hear you have solid friends.  It makes detaching from it easier.

[Tincup]

My ex new quite a bit about me when she asked me out.  she new of me through friends and new quite a bit about my qualities and characteristics.  I asked her shortly after we started dating why she asked me out, specifically what made her decide to ask me out, and her answer never sat right with me... .I was "safe".  I think I understand that now though.  Safe to her meant tolerant, patient, etc... .the whole thing repulses me now looking back on it.

[Turkish]

Hi MrFox,

I think mine targted me to be the father of her children. She says she wanted me due to my qualities, but I pointed out that she tried to get pregnant desperately with the Love of her Life two years before me, but it didn't take. I said I wasn't special. She reiterated that it was me, but the facts prove otherwise.

We call them chameleons. Not having a stable, cohesive identity, they change to attach to the person they desire. We also call this "mirroring." In my case, she stopped mirroring my responsiblity and common decency, and started mirroring the people she started hanging out with: the mostly college age party crowd. So where is the real X in my case? She mirrors the dutiful daughter and sister for her family. The career woman for outsiders (the one I think she does best and is most "Real". The teen lover for her current boy toy. She then alters to mostly responsible mom for me and our kids... .though I notice she is still a bit detached and she can't keep this one up.

She also targeted me because I was financially independent. Not so much a gold digger, she does have Entitlement Queen tendencies. Now, she will get child support from me and a financially stable life for HER children. The sad things is that I've seen all of these swirling identities played out in our r/s and home, especially in the past few months at the end.

It's fake... .and it's real at the same time. I daresay she would describe herself by her roles (mother, daughter, lover, etc... .) rather than by her core values and qualities, as I would. She changes the role to suit her "target" for validation to make herself feel like a whole person. I may be more shy, funnier, serious, professional given the situation, but I am the same person all of the time. She is not.

[MrFox]

We call them chameleons.

Seems like a very apt description, and one I have actually heard in relation to my exBPDgf.  She also described herself with roles, "mother", "artist" (never photographer, that's too common), "lover", never about who she was inside.  It never hit me until now that she did that.  The more I learn the more I see.

I believe I was also targeted for child creation.  She was not on birth control and insisted that she couldn't get pregnant and we didn't need protection, yet the last time I looked at her FB page (over a month ago, I finally stopped doing that) she was going on and on about how her new birth control was messing with her body.  But, I thought you couldn't get pregnant?  This despite the fact that she walked away from her ex-husband, giving him full custody of their daughter.  Which is definitely for the best.  One major area of contention between us became my unwillingness to not use protection.

Sorry to hear about the situation, Turkish.  As much as I hate the situation I'm in, I'm so thankful that the only person I have to worry about is me.  I can't imagine what you and anyone else who has children with a pwBPD is going through.  My heart goes out to you.

[Pearl55]

You've been so lucky, Mrfox. Having children with these people is a recipie for disaster!

[MrFox]

You've been so lucky, Mrfox. Having children with these people is a recipie for disaster!

I only saw how it was from her end when she dealt with her ex about seeing their child, and I was deep in the spell of how "wonderful" she was.  I bought into how horrible he was but even in the thick of my blindness to her true nature I thought there were times when she crossed the line.  I feel for anyone who has to deal with what her ex-husband has to deal with.  And, I'm so thankful that I didn't marry her or have children with her.

[Turkish]

We call them chameleons.

Seems like a very apt description, and one I have actually heard in relation to my exBPDgf.  She also described herself with roles, "mother", "artist" (never photographer, that's too common), "lover", never about who she was inside.  It never hit me until now that she did that.  The more I learn the more I see.

I believe I was also targeted for child creation.  She was not on birth control and insisted that she couldn't get pregnant and we didn't need protection, yet the last time I looked at her FB page (over a month ago, I finally stopped doing that) she was going on and on about how her new birth control was messing with her body.  But, I thought you couldn't get pregnant?  This despite the fact that she walked away from her ex-husband, giving him full custody of their daughter.  Which is definitely for the best.  One major area of contention between us became my unwillingness to not use protection.

Sorry to hear about the situation, Turkish.  As much as I hate the situation I'm in, I'm so thankful that the only person I have to worry about is me.  I can't imagine what you and anyone else who has children with a pwBPD is going through.  My heart goes out to you.

Thank you. Never, ever trust a woman (I guess this applies for men in some cases) who says, "I can't get pregnant." I never believed her from the beginning, and stretched it out a year. She would have been "happy" had I gotten her pregnant the very first time. She based it on 8 mos of no b/c with her X which never took. With us, it was about once, she was pregnant right away. Ditto for the second child after she went off the b/c. I guess that young stud didn't have what it took! I love my kids to death, but sometimes I wish it had, and I wouldn't be here writing this... .

No, our children are precious gifts. Everything happens for a reason.

[MrFox]

We call them chameleons.

Seems like a very apt description, and one I have actually heard in relation to my exBPDgf.  She also described herself with roles, "mother", "artist" (never photographer, that's too common), "lover", never about who she was inside.  It never hit me until now that she did that.  The more I learn the more I see.

I believe I was also targeted for child creation.  She was not on birth control and insisted that she couldn't get pregnant and we didn't need protection, yet the last time I looked at her FB page (over a month ago, I finally stopped doing that) she was going on and on about how her new birth control was messing with her body.  But, I thought you couldn't get pregnant?  This despite the fact that she walked away from her ex-husband, giving him full custody of their daughter.  Which is definitely for the best.  One major area of contention between us became my unwillingness to not use protection.

Sorry to hear about the situation, Turkish.  As much as I hate the situation I'm in, I'm so thankful that the only person I have to worry about is me.  I can't imagine what you and anyone else who has children with a pwBPD is going through.  My heart goes out to you.

Thank you. Never, ever trust a woman (I guess this applies for men in some cases) who says, "I can't get pregnant." I never believed her from the beginning, and stretched it out a year. She would have been "happy" had I gotten her pregnant the very first time. She based it on 8 mos of no b/c with her X which never took. With us, it was about once, she was pregnant right away. Ditto for the second child after she went off the b/c. I guess that young stud didn't have what it took! I love my kids to death, but sometimes I wish it had, and I wouldn't be here writing this... .

No, our children are precious gifts. Everything happens for a reason.

I never believed her either. One of the first lies she blatantly told me was that the only man she had ever slept with without protection was her ex-husband.  She had forgotten that when we were just friends that she thought she might be pregnant by are boyfriend at the time.  I asked if she they were using any kind of birth control methods.  She said she was on b/c but they didn't use condoms since they were monogamous (right... .).  She did often comment what a beautiful child we would make.  First time she said that was about a month after I had met her.

Children are precious gifts, but I will say that I'm glad I don't have one with her.

[GreenMango]

There can be a lot of unreasonable/fantasy expectations.  It can go both ways.

It's not necessarily a negative thing when you meet a partner and they want children.  It gets dicey with pwBPD if children are to address the abandonment fears and become the source of locking in a permanent relationship, unconditional love and acceptance the person felt they have not received.

It's hard on children to have a parent with this type of emotional immaturity and neediness.  There's quite a few stories of this from both male and female members here.  It usually starts out good the fantasy is realized then real life starts (children do what kids do and the same goes for marriage) and the disappointment sets in.

Those lies she told you were pretty blatant.  Did you ask her about it?

[MrFox]

I fully agree the unrealistic fantasies go both ways.  I had my own if I look back at the whole thing.  Still do.

I was never opposed to the idea of having a child or children with her, I just wanted us to both be secure in life (we both started our own businesses in the past two years) and married.  When she told me she couldn't get pregnant, I accepted it for face value and told her that I still wanted to be with her.  It wasn't until after I began to question the validity of her claims, since she is now claiming to be on b/c.  I do think she wanted a child for a variety of reasons, one of them being that she knows I would never not be a part of my child's life.

Having been raised by a mother with BPD, I can say that it's very hard on the child.  While she was a good mother to her daughter when she visits, there were a few red flags.  Her daughter and I got along very well and at times my ex seemed to be jealous of that.  She would play it off like a joke but she would say things like "Are you trying to steal my man?" or "Maybe I should just leave so you guys can hang out".

I never have called her on the not being able to get pregnant because we are no longer speaking.  I did ask her about the pregnancy scare thing and she claimed that she had never said they weren't using condoms.  I let it go.  I let it go for the sake of peace.  I let a lot of things go.

[GreenMango]

So many of us here are familiar with a parent having mental health issues.  It's a great primer for getting into a relationship like this.  Crazy was my normal.

Wow I can't believe she said that to her daughter - well I can.  Strange happenings.

I let it go. I let it go for the sake of peace. I let a lot of things go.

Me too. 

It can take some time wrapping your head around what exactly happened -  Step 1 on the leaving lessons on healing and moving forward.

How's your support system? Friends family etc? 

[MrFox]

It really is a wonderful primer for this kind of relationship.  Crazy was my normal as well.  I just thought that's how things worked.

I couldn't believe it either.  She would also say the same things when her female cat would curl up in my lap.

Seems to be what most the people on this site have done.  Ignored thing, let things go, blinded themselves.  I know I did.

I'm starting to wrap my head around things.  Not only this relationship, but my own patterns that have led to me being involved in unhealthy relationships.  In therapy for my co-dependence, reading a lot on, taking care of myself, etc.

I have a pretty good support system.  Some great friends and a sister who has done a lot to deal with her own issues and has been wonderful at helping guide me through mine.

[GreenMango]

Sounds like you are doing the healthy things.  That's a positive step forward.

Take good care of you.   

[MrFox]

Thank you, GreenMango, I very much appreciate your input and the kind words. 

[GreenMango]

No problem!  We've all been there.  It will get easier.  Happy Holidays and enjoy your music.  

[MrFox]

Happy Holidays to you as well