Motion for "gatekeeping"

[livednlearned]

I was in court this morning. N/BPDx had filed a bunch of motions that were ruled "moot" and he was found in contempt of court for not paying my legal fees. Which means he has to pay my legal fees for not paying my legal fees. Yes, this is how it really works.

So now he owes me legal fees for three motions for contempt. Today, he was in contempt of court for one of them. Then we go back to court for the second one. The fees from today will make a third one.

You think it could go on forever, right? Apparently not. I just learned today that the judge can file his OWN motion. It's called motion for gatekeeping. Has anyone ever heard of it? It will stop certain motions from being entered.

N/BPDx had to get up on the stand and answer questions about his salary. Apparently he got a nice raise and is adjunct professor of law on the side, pulling in a nice bump in his income. I could technically file to have alimony adjusted, but people, I am here to tell you that I. Don't. Care.

I do care about the legal fees. I do care about moving on. Which I can do (literally) because I finally have the title to my car, no longer co-own the house with N/BPDx.

I'm celebrating the small victories   

[DreamGirl]

So the Judge is filing a motion to have him stop filing motions?

That is just beyond any scope of something I could imagine happening.   

[maxen]

i've heard of a 'vexatious litigant', which names a certain repeat litigant as vexatious to the court. that's directed at a person, though, not at the motions the person enters. in some cases the litigant must have his/her suit vetted by the court before being allowed to proceed.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vexatious_litigation

[livednlearned]

So the Judge is filing a motion to have him stop filing motions?

That is just beyond any scope of something I could imagine happening.   

Yes. The judge. Filing it under top three most surreal moments of my court appearances. My lawyer had to pick my jaw up off the floor.

[livednlearned]

i've heard of a 'vexatious litigant', which names a certain repeat litigant as vexatious to the court. that's directed at a person, though, not at the motions the person enters. in some cases the litigant must have his/her suit vetted by the court before being allowed to proceed.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vexatious_litigation

Maybe it's one of those state-specific things? I dunno. This is what I found online:

Courts have the inherent authority to enter pre-filing injunctions ― also referred to as gatekeeper orders ― restricting individuals from filing new lawsuits or other papers without court approval, when necessary to prevent abuse of the judicial process and protect other parties.

The gatekeeper order should be the judge’s last resort after other attempts to control the litigant, such as Rule 11 sanctions, have failed. As with any disciplinary matter, the subject should be given notice of the proposed order and a chance to respond before it is entered. The order should be limited to the circumstances showing abuse ― that is, if all the abusive litigation is directed at one

particular party, the order should only limit filings related to that party, or if the frivolous filings all are in one court, the order should be limited to that court.

[Waddams]

I would think it fall under the category of "Bench Motions" that a judge can issue from the Bench.  Like a Bench Warrant for Arrest for Failure to Appear.

There's probably lots of types of Bench Motions judges can issue.  

I'm glad to hear the judge is getting sick of your XH's antics.  I like the idea of holding him in contempt, throwing him jail, and letting him execute a power of attorney with someone to get you paid off before he is allowed out of jail.  It's horrible how progress has to be so slow.  They'd rather cut their own noses off than be decent.

[livednlearned]

I would think it fall under the category of "Bench Motions" that a judge can issue from the Bench.  Like a Bench Warrant for Arrest for Failure to Appear.

There's probably lots of types of Bench Motions judges can issue.  

I'm glad to hear the judge is getting sick of your XH's antics.  I like the idea of holding him in contempt, throwing him jail, and letting him execute a power of attorney with someone to get you paid off before he is allowed out of jail.  It's horrible how progress has to be so slow.  They'd rather cut their own noses off than be decent.

Actually, the judge asked my lawyer, who asked me, if I wanted to consider jail time for N/BPDx. I said no.

True, it's awful it takes so long. But the gatekeeping order actually neutralized some of my exasperation. I thought I was going to be on this hamster wheel for years.

N/BPDx has 2 weeks to pay.

[atcrossroads]

Awesome news, LnL!    

Two weeks or else what, though?

What influences your decision to say no to considering jail time?  The judge has clearly had it.  I couldn't send my husband to jail either, so I think I get it.  What I don't get is why doesn't someone (anyone) amongst do the few friends and family he has left encourage him to get help?  Your husband is clearly sick (not just the pd but the alcoholism), yet he's managing to work and wreak havoc on you.  By "he," I mean your husband and mine -- they are so similar.  The whole thing is surreal!

I'm happy that you are going to be able to get off wheel!

[ForeverDad]

In two weeks you better say, ":)o what you will, just get it done, I think he wants all this conflict/contact to continue!"

[livednlearned]

Thanks for the support! Only thing that feels good about it is knowing the judge sees the pattern.

N/BPDx said he had two more motions he was planning to file, which I think is what got the judge to consider gatekeeping. One motion to change custody, and one motion to have the minor child examined. N/BPDx kept saying that S12 has "deteriorated."

At another point in the hearing, when my L had N/BPDx up on the stand and was asking him to state his income, savings, etc. to show that he had the means to pay me, she referred to the judge's orders that he pay me $5500 for the hearing and asked him if he was aware of the order. N/BPDx said "Yes, but I didn't agree to it."

What the what? My L said, "Mr N/BPDx, you don't get to agree to it. That's why it's called an order."

With that kind of response, I'm inclined to think that N/BPDx will not be paying me in two weeks. I think if he fails to abide by two orders, then he does go to jail.

[atcrossroads]

Wow.  Sounds likely may well be spending a couple days in jail! The judge definitely gets it. 


Again, it boggles me that "friends"/family don't intervene and try to stop pd's from destroying themselves.  My stbex has a few negative advocate type friends at work (and at least two of them KNOW he is CRAZY) and he has a very reasonable family, aside from his BPD/npd mother.  Yet they don't do anything to discourage him to stop the madness.  I feel astonished that my stbex's family aren't encouraging him to get help (which they had been doing for 2 years before I left -- saying he needed inpatient help) -- once I left, all the attention turned to me as the b*tch. It's almost like they are fueling his fire.  Is this the case with your ex?  Does he have anyone reasonable in his life who could step in to try to convince him to stop but isn't?  That's been hard for me to understand lately.

Keep us posted. You are an inspiration!

[Nope]

At another point in the hearing, when my L had N/BPDx up on the stand and was asking him to state his income, savings, etc. to show that he had the means to pay me, she referred to the judge's orders that he pay me $5500 for the hearing and asked him if he was aware of the order. N/BPDx said "Yes, but I didn't agree to it."

I'm glad a judge finally got angry about this stuff. It's amazing what some people think they can get away with. It's a good thing for seasoned lawyers. If I had been in your lawyers shoes I probably would have just stared at him like he'd suddenly grown a third arm out of his forehead.

[Waddams]

Some would rather go to jail than pay per the order.  He was telling the whole world he didn't care about the authority of anyone or anything, court included, when he said he "didn't agree to it".  It was a big F*** You! to the judge, L's, and LnL.

[livednlearned]

Some would rather go to jail than pay per the order.  He was telling the whole world he didn't care about the authority of anyone or anything, court included, when he said he "didn't agree to it".  It was a big F*** You! to the judge, L's, and LnL.

Yes, he is one very consistent guy in that way. The weird thing is that he was so deferential the entire time. So the order of things: the judge heard N/BPDx's motions and found them moot. Then the judge talked about gatekeeping. As judge was about to take a quick break before we discussed my motion for contempt (to pay the legal fees), N/BPDx called out to him that he was all for the gatekeeping order.

I asked my L why he would say that, and she said, "Maybe an attempt to not be found in contempt of court?"

Who knows.

Mental illness doesn't go away with him, it follows him everywhere.

[Waddams]

Could he also be splitting the judge black at this point and just trying to pi$$ off the judge?

[livednlearned]

Could he also be splitting the judge black at this point and just trying to pi$$ off the judge?

I guess it's possible. The bizarre thing is that the judge has been shoveling narcissistic supply to N/BPDx at every hearing. "Mr. N/BPDx, I am sure you are a very good lawyer [in your specialty]." And then he went on for a good 5-10 minutes commiserating with N/BPDx about how hard it is to refinance these days, and he really felt for him, blah blah blah. But then he found him in contempt of court, so it's been confusing.

My L said that judges want to make sure that everyone feels heard because angry litigants can become angrier. Meaning, if the judge humiliated N/BPDx, that might end up as my problem.

But still. It's weird to be "winning" in court while listening to the judge talk one way, ruling another. And N/BPDx being deferential while saying screw you all.

[Waddams]

But still. It's weird to be "winning" in court while listening to the judge talk one way, ruling another. And N/BPDx being deferential while saying screw you all.

Maybe N/BPDx liked the idea of the gatekeeper order so that he could go complain to friends and family how unfair everything is and use it for sympathy.

Hopefully, soon you won't have to sit in court over any of this anymore.  I'd be trolling for help from a hitman by now.

[livednlearned]

But still. It's weird to be "winning" in court while listening to the judge talk one way, ruling another. And N/BPDx being deferential while saying screw you all.

Maybe N/BPDx liked the idea of the gatekeeper order so that he could go complain to friends and family how unfair everything is and use it for sympathy.

Hopefully, soon you won't have to sit in court over any of this anymore.  I'd be trolling for help from a hitman by now.

Usually, when someone sides with me (his lawyer withdrew, the PC established fair boundaries, etc.) N/BPDx becomes a victim of them. He kept saying that his lawyer "bailed" on him, and the PC was "in cahoots with the plaintiff." So you're probably right, that the gatekeeping stuff gives him one more person he can feel victimized by.

It's weird, but this stuff isn't really getting to me anymore. Dating a great guy, S12 is doing well, and throughout this entire saga, my career took off like a rocket. It feels more like a financial matter than an emotional one. I'm going to continue being vigilant, that won't ever change, but it doesn't feel as emotionally charged.

[KateCat]

This is all so astounding, LnL. In my county, inveterate contempt-of-court evaders sometimes learn to carry around a money order in the exact amount needed to stay out of jail. I wonder if your ex will ever need to resort to this procedure. 

[maxen]

sorry to interrupt for just one second ... .

Again, it boggles me that "friends"/family don't intervene and try to stop pd's from destroying themselves.  My stbex has a few negative advocate type friends at work (and at least two of them KNOW he is CRAZY) and he has a very reasonable family, aside from his BPD/npd mother.  Yet they don't do anything to discourage him to stop the madness.  I feel astonished that my stbex's family aren't encouraging him to get help (which they had been doing for 2 years before I left -- saying he needed inpatient help) -- once I left, all the attention turned to me as the b*tch. It's almost like they are fueling his fire.

spot-on description of my w's family/friends. her father in particular is an abdicator. some of her friends are facilitators. her T is useless. no-one seems willing to hold a mirror up to her life (i knew her history but it would be different this time because etc etc.) honestly i don't know how much family or friends can do though, in the absence of long therapy, with an adult BPD, much less an NPD.

[livednlearned]

Again, it boggles me that "friends"/family don't intervene and try to stop pd's from destroying themselves.

I've worked so hard in the past three years to change not only my behavior, but my thinking. And man is that hard. I have a tape running in my head, sometimes loud enough I hear it, sometimes not so loud, telling me I am weak, pathetic, blah blah blah, all the things I heard in childhood, all the things I heard from N/BPDx, and other exes in my life, all surprisingly similar to N/BPDx (although none quite as severe).

And then another tape, which is "don't trust this person" or "if this person gets close, you'll be vulnerable and exposed, and they'll see who you really are." Or, at the height of codependence, "I better fix this person, who is all wrong and falling apart."

And now a new one that I've been working on, which is, "You are ok. You're here, you're doing fine. That painful feeling is ok to feel. That joyful feeling is ok to feel too, and it's ok to let this person love you. It's ok to let this person help you. It's ok to let this person in, you'll be ok even if it sometimes hurts."

I think the reason people can't or don't or won't help people with PDs stop from destroying themselves is because they can't. We really can't. Not because we don't want to, but because it's just not how it works. The tape in their head prevents it. Only if they want to replace it with something else. And I don't know about your pwBPD, but mine has amazing defenses and I can't imagine him entertaining the level of vulnerability necessary to heal.

[DreamGirl]

And now a new one that I've been working on, which is, "You are ok. You're here, you're doing fine. That painful feeling is ok to feel. That joyful feeling is ok to feel too, and it's ok to let this person love you. It's ok to let this person help you. It's ok to let this person in, you'll be ok even if it sometimes hurts."


I absolutely love this. Can I get a copy of that tape? Do they sell it at Walmart?

[livednlearned]

And now a new one that I've been working on, which is, "You are ok. You're here, you're doing fine. That painful feeling is ok to feel. That joyful feeling is ok to feel too, and it's ok to let this person love you. It's ok to let this person help you. It's ok to let this person in, you'll be ok even if it sometimes hurts."


I absolutely love this. Can I get a copy of that tape? Do they sell it at Walmart?

Here, lemme give it to you for free      And everyone else, YOU GET A TAPE! AND YOU GET A TAPE! AND YOU GET A TAPE! E * V * E * R * Y * B * O * D * Y GETS A TAPE!

The truly crazy thing? That tape is the gift of N/BPDx. It would drive him (even more nuts) if he knew he helped me load a new tape in my head.

Thanks mean guy! Buh bye!

[Nope]

sorry to interrupt for just one second ... .

Again, it boggles me that "friends"/family don't intervene and try to stop pd's from destroying themselves.  My stbex has a few negative advocate type friends at work (and at least two of them KNOW he is CRAZY) and he has a very reasonable family, aside from his BPD/npd mother.  Yet they don't do anything to discourage him to stop the madness.  I feel astonished that my stbex's family aren't encouraging him to get help (which they had been doing for 2 years before I left -- saying he needed inpatient help) -- once I left, all the attention turned to me as the b*tch. It's almost like they are fueling his fire.

spot-on description of my w's family/friends. her father in particular is an abdicator. some of her friends are facilitators. her T is useless. no-one seems willing to hold a mirror up to her life (i knew her history but it would be different this time because etc etc.) honestly i don't know how much family or friends can do though, in the absence of long therapy, with an adult BPD, much less an NPD.

I've heard that is the problem with my fiancés ex wife's family. He went to them for help when the marriage was falling apart and their attitude was, 'Yeah. Something is wrong with her. What do you want me to do about it?"

[Waddams]

I've heard that is the problem with my fiancés ex wife's family. He went to them for help when the marriage was falling apart and their attitude was, 'Yeah. Something is wrong with her. What do you want me to do about it?"

My uBPDxgf's step mom actually called me once and complained that uBPDxgf was now her family's problem again instead of mine.  Was asking if there was any truth to uBPDxgf saying that she was talking to me and thinking about getting back together.  I hadn't spoken with her, or seen her for that matter, in 8 months at that point.  The step mom was quite dejected after hearing that.  I guess it shouldn't have been surprising that uBPDxgf was just using those statements as more subterfuge to keep BS'ing her own family.

[Free One]

As judge was about to take a quick break before we discussed my motion for contempt (to pay the legal fees), N/BPDx called out to him that he was all for the gatekeeping order.

I asked my L why he would say that, and she said, "Maybe an attempt to not be found in contempt of court?"

Who knows.

Mental illness doesn't go away with him, it follows him everywhere.

In my experience, ex KNEW his behaviors were wrong on some level, but it was almost like a compulsion where he just couldn't help himself. He was very angry at me for feeling like I controlled him, but at times would tell me he NEEDED to be controlled. It was almost like asking for help - I can't control myself, so I need someone else to do it. I wonder if your ex views the judge's order like this.

[Free One]

Apparently he got a nice raise and is adjunct professor of law on the side, pulling in a nice bump in his income.

Boy, that sure doesn't paint a good outlook for future lawyers, learning from him!

Congrats on the victories. Some peace for Christmas!

[livednlearned]

As judge was about to take a quick break before we discussed my motion for contempt (to pay the legal fees), N/BPDx called out to him that he was all for the gatekeeping order.

I asked my L why he would say that, and she said, "Maybe an attempt to not be found in contempt of court?"

Who knows.

Mental illness doesn't go away with him, it follows him everywhere.

In my experience, ex KNEW his behaviors were wrong on some level, but it was almost like a compulsion where he just couldn't help himself. He was very angry at me for feeling like I controlled him, but at times would tell me he NEEDED to be controlled. It was almost like asking for help - I can't control myself, so I need someone else to do it. I wonder if your ex views the judge's order like this.

That's interesting. I hadn't thought about it like that.

I think N/BPDx has two mandates: 1) get praise; and 2) be a victim. There isn't much in between for him. Since he isn't getting praise in court, that only leaves the role of victim. That might be where he is acting compulsively. He needs to tell someone his version of the story, except the version he tells isn't matching up with the facts. The judge has been a potential ally, because he sweet talks N/BPDx (I truly believe he's doing that to protect me, to keep N/BPDx from losing it). Now, the judge is saying, "I think someone needs to stop you from filing these motions. You're a good lawyer in your area, but you're not expert in family law, and I can't just let you keep filing these motions. It's not how we do things here." It's very paternalistic. N/BPDx actually did have respect for his dad, so I suspect there is some projecting going on.

Whatever it is, it's going to continue. I think N/BPDx needs the attention. Narcissistic supply must be slow in other parts of his life. 

[Fleur2013]

You truly are an inspiration, and this is the homestretch so Brava! I have to ask, how did you manage to get him to agree to the sale of the home? Ours has plummeted in value and is going to be impossible to sell and to get him to agree to short sell.

[livednlearned]

You truly are an inspiration, and this is the homestretch so Brava! I have to ask, how did you manage to get him to agree to the sale of the home? Ours has plummeted in value and is going to be impossible to sell and to get him to agree to short sell.

Oh that. Haha, funny story.



He didn't sell the house, he refinanced. I had to file a motion for contempt to get him to refinance. He showed up at the hearing to tell everyone the refinance (the second one) was already under way. So I paid over a thousand dollars to hear him tell the judge, "Oh the refinancing? I got that covered. And the title to her car? You guys can have that too!"   

Conflict is a spectator sport for N/BPDx.