theoretiically: a BPD-afflicted person could easily pass a lie detector test

[ogopogodude]

(sorry but I didn't know where to post this). We all know that a person with BPD typically stretches the truth and outright lies and all the time that person believes what is coming from their own lips as truth and factual. So, theoretically, a person with BPD could oh, so easily pass a lie detector test .

[ForeverDad]

My lawyer always used to call my ex F_ N_ or crazy.  As we left court one day, this was years ago, my lawyer called her a sociopath and stated she could probably pass a lie detector test.

We had two entire days in court a couple months ago (with court decision still pending) and her answer to many of my lawyer's question after he had played clips from our phone conversations was, "I don't remember that but it's my voice."  When my ex kept disagreeing with our child's GAL concerning events at GAL's visit to her home, GAL asked, "Ms FD, do you have memory problems?"  Seriously, I'm not making it up.

This is the closest I've come to having my ex's issues and obstructions exposed before the court.  The only other time was back in 2010 during my Change of Circumstances case where ex said she obstructed my vacation plans between Christmas and New Year's Day only so she could observe Kwanzaa despite not being of Jewish descent and the judge decided it was "not credible".  I've been in and out of domestic court for eight years.

[Matt]

I don't know if someone with BPD could pass a lie detector test, but I wouldn't be surprised.

But... .

My ex and I both took the MMPI-2 - Minnesota Multiphasic Personality Index - a very detailed instrument for psych evaluations.  One part of this - it's not separate, it's mixed in with the other stuff - are three "truth scales" - combinations of items that can be analyzed to figure out if you're taking the evaluation honestly or trying to look good.

My "truth scales" are showed I was telling the truth.  My wife's all showed she was "presenting falsely".

So... .if you can get the court to appoint a psychologist who will administer the MMPI-2, you can establish who is honest.

If there are false accusations, you can also file a motion to depose the other party, so they will have to answer questions from your attorney under oath.  That worked for me - my wife told dozens of lies, some of which we could easily prove.

[Bugg4]

WOW!

I saw the subject heading and my mouth dropped!  My husband has said for years that our daughter could pass a lie detector test because she truly believes everything she says.

Even when caught in a lie its always someone else's fault.

[livednlearned]

I don't think lie detectors have much validity in general, do they?

Agree that BPD sufferers engage in emotional reasoning, and lies seem to roll out rather easily (although, I know people who aren't BPD sufferers are pretty good at lying too).

Since this is posted on Family Law, is this about lie detectors being used in court? Does that even happen?

[Nope]

I don't think lie detectors have much validity in general, do they?

Agree that BPD sufferers engage in emotional reasoning, and lies seem to roll out rather easily (although, I know people who aren't BPD sufferers are pretty good at lying too).

Since this is posted on Family Law, is this about lie detectors being used in court? Does that even happen?

General validity: no. I know someone who was denied employment after a lie detector test showed deception and the poor guy absolutely told the truth. I also know someone who was granted employment and he did lie about several things. Before he took the polygraph I asked him how he intended to explain X, Y and Z away. He told me something to the effect of; "None of that stuff matters. I don't need to tell them about that because they don't care. That isn't the kind of thing they are really looking for." So apparently emotional reasoning, minimizing, blame shifting and rewriting history can work.

As for use in court, polygraph results don't strike me as admissible.

But I think the underlying issue of how well BPD sufferers lie and how convincing they are in court is very real. When given enough time to really think about it and get all of her lies firmly lined up, my fiancé's BPD ex gets us confused about if we've just misunderstood everything somehow. And we have recordings and documented evidence.

[ogopogodude]

I started this topic really only for the reason of personal experience. Whenever my ex wife opens up her pie-hole she truly and honestly thinks that what she utters is pure biblical knowledge and gospel,  and she is very capable of convincing someone (that is listening to her woes) that she is soo very right in her point of view. 

But I have to say, ... I really love that phrase "one can fool SOME of the people SOME of the time, but you cannot fool ALL the people All of the time"

[ogopogodude]

But also, ... if my wife was all wired up to a lie detector machine, I really think that she would pass it even though there would be a whack of Q's posed to her (as if backed into a corner) and evidence put in front of her that would actually SHOW that she was lying, … but she would in fact pas the test anyways, ... (Because she is BPD and her brain works unlike us non's)