I saw her last night/Learned something Maybe?

[arn131arn]

Another big event in my city last night.  Over 100k people in town.

I bartended from 9 in the morning until 9 last night.

I was on a break at 7pm last night.  Outside on a break, watching and talking to tourists walking by. There were thousands of people on the street walking by.  Then I saw her.  It was her. She had on a white wool hat she loves, her leather jacket, jeans and her riding boots on.

She was with my replacement on the way to the venue.  My replacement was with a group of his guy friends. She was walking 20 paces behind him.  It was her, she always had that "goofy" kind of walk.   I was saddened, not because I saw her with him; but she was literally far behind them, walking alone... . looking to catch up.  I would have been holding her  hand or had my arms around her keeping her warm; but she was by herself, following and although they have cops on every street corner, somehow make her feel that she was safe... . as a man my job.

It looked like she was following like a little puppy dog.  Waiting for a scrap from "Joe" millionaire.  I also know that he rarely picks her up from her sister's house, if at all.  I know his m.o. is to love them and leave them; so my son is of NO interest to him.  And I am glad for that.  Doubt he wants to meet her family because that would be some kind of emotional attachment that he doesn't want.

So, it saddens me that I realized that she would sell her body and morals for a chance at this lottery guy.  It saddens me that I know he is going to hurt her.  It saddens me that she is loving this because this guy is emotionally unattached, and it saddens me that this is what she can deal with.  I always tried to talk about our problems and make it right, but this would trigger her engulfment- something I had no idea I was doing.

It also made me angry that she has been pawing my son off to other family/firends while she chases this dream of luxury and "Real Houswife" living.  My son was her everything, she was very protective, and doting, something I thought was a good trait of hers or a good mother, but now know that my son MUST be feeeling some effect of this new guy... . I feel almost sorry for her today because I saw her last night.

[Pretty Woman]

Arn,

   

BPD's tend to be attracted to Narcissist types. It sounds like this Joe Millionaire is a Narc and that is why she is following him around like that... . him probably tossing her scraps every once in awhile.

It such a funny thing to me. BPD's thrive on the idealization phase and are a bottomless pit of need.

People like you and I fill those needs, get close and they run, due to their fear of abandonment. It just sounds funny... . we love them and they fear abandonment? We are showing them we WONT.

It just proves it's a f'kd up emotional disorder. It is sad for everyone involved really.

And don't think it's going to miraculously work out with this guy. After awhile she will find a reason to dump him as soon as someone else pays attention.

It's a vicious, no-win circle my friend.

The winner is the one that gets out alive.

The winner is YOU.

[heartandwhole]

arn,

I felt sad reading this, too.  I wish peace and love for your ex, and for you.  This disorder is serious, and from what I've learned, it entails a lot of inner turmoil and pain.  That is something that we can all have compassion for, yes?

Seeing an ex can be destabilizing, and it's so normal to feel sad.  You also sound strong, arn.  

What do you think is keeping you on track?

[arn131arn]

arn,

I felt sad reading this, too.  I wish peace and love for your ex, and for you.  This disorder is serious, and from what I've learned, it entails a lot of inner turmoil and pain.  That is something that we can all have compassion for, yes?

Seeing an ex can be destabilizing, and it's so normal to feel sad.  You also sound strong, arn.  

What do you think is keeping you on track?

Thanks HandW and PW,

I have a network of support!  EVERYONE! Family, friends, people in my AA support group, my boss... . this board.  I told my boss last night I saw her.  He said punch out and go home.  He knows, he has been there, as well. 

I cried all the way home.  Went to my sister's house.  What she told me is that, "you are not grieving something you had, you are grieving what that relationship never had.  What you wanted that relationship to be, that never was!"

Well, that made my mind explode bc I knew she was right.  I have allot of things good going for me.  I have hope and I have dreams of graduating in 2 years and working all over the world, meeting so many wonderful people, and women- some who may just love me for me.

Thanks,

Arn

[heartandwhole]

Thanks HandW and PW,

I have a network of support!  EVERYONE! Family, friends, people in my AA support group, my boss... . this board.  I told my boss last night I saw her.  He said punch out and go home.  He knows, he has been there, as well. 

Fantastic – this is so important.  I'm so glad that you are taking advantage of all the support that is out there for you.

I cried all the way home.  Went to my sister's house.  What she told me is that, "you are not grieving something you had, you are grieving what that relationship never had.  What you wanted that relationship to be, that never was!"

Wow!  Very wise words from Sis.

I have allot of things good going for me.  I have hope and I have dreams of graduating in 2 years and working all over the world, meeting so many wonderful people, and women- some who may just love me for me.

Yes, you do, arn.  Keep working through your recovery, and I have no doubt that you will find someone who loves you for you.   

[Ironmanrises]

You saw karma at work. You saw an image that will play itself out repeatedly, again and again. I know it hurt to have to see that. I have given up on any hope from my exUBPDgf. I am in the process of filing away all of this as a nightmare that turned real. Hang in there.

[Pretty Woman]

Arn,

  Your sister was right.

PW (used to be EA  )

[arn131arn]

Ironman, what do u mean by karma. Is this what she is destined for? Narc types who will use her up? That really hurts me to think about. I wish I could save her and take away all the pain, but I tried that for 14 years.

[Ironmanrises]

Her behavior is not going to change. It is scripted into her personality; a personality disorder. She will after the guy that replaced you either A) try and recycle you, B) find another person similar to you to eventually hurt, or C) both A and B concurrently so her impossible to meet needs are filled.

[arn131arn]

Jesus... . I am starting to look at her differently. I believe my anger is subsiding. Something, I can't pinpoint it, maybe a weight being lifted off my shoulders. Not god or great. Contentment, maybe. Maybe the shock is leaving. Maybe that's it. Acceptance, maybe? But is it okay for me to still love her? Always love her? Just understand the truth? That we can never be again? But still love her? Is that ok? When I look at her as a sick 5 year old little girl with her boy haircut, I have compassion a bottomless heart of love. When I think of her as a scorpion woman who  has hurt me... . then I, well, hate.

[EdR]

Another big event in my city last night.  Over 100k people in town.

I bartended from 9 in the morning until 9 last night.

I was on a break at 7pm last night.  Outside on a break, watching and talking to tourists walking by. There were thousands of people on the street walking by.  Then I saw her.  It was her. She had on a white wool hat she loves, her leather jacket, jeans and her riding boots on.

She was with my replacement on the way to the venue.  My replacement was with a group of his guy friends. She was walking 20 paces behind him.  It was her, she always had that "goofy" kind of walk.   I was saddened, not because I saw her with him; but she was literally far behind them, walking alone... . looking to catch up.  I would have been holding her  hand or had my arms around her keeping her warm; but she was by herself, following and although they have cops on every street corner, somehow make her feel that she was safe... . as a man my job.

It looked like she was following like a little puppy dog.  Waiting for a scrap from "Joe" millionaire.  I also know that he rarely picks her up from her sister's house, if at all.  I know his m.o. is to love them and leave them; so my son is of NO interest to him.  And I am glad for that.  Doubt he wants to meet her family because that would be some kind of emotional attachment that he doesn't want.

So, it saddens me that I realized that she would sell her body and morals for a chance at this lottery guy.  It saddens me that I know he is going to hurt her.  It saddens me that she is loving this because this guy is emotionally unattached, and it saddens me that this is what she can deal with.  I always tried to talk about our problems and make it right, but this would trigger her engulfment- something I had no idea I was doing.

It also made me angry that she has been pawing my son off to other family/firends while she chases this dream of luxury and "Real Houswife" living.  My son was her everything, she was very protective, and doting, something I thought was a good trait of hers or a good mother, but now know that my son MUST be feeeling some effect of this new guy... . I feel almost sorry for her today because I saw her last night.

I noticed the same thing as you so powerfully wrote down (in bold).

It saddens me as well. She never was like that, but this looks like an evolution of her disease.

She probably still is around someone like me, a caring guy who she's able to control etc. But her choice for possible boyfriends has definitely shifted to the type you mentioned.

[Clearmind]

Arn, it is sad considering you have a child together. You can provide a good balance for him and your role as Dad has never been more important.

I'm not sure there is a type! Borderlines are impulsive and there is no set pattern to who they attach themselves to. They attach to those that are perceived to attach back. If the other person does not attach - which is what they rely on the relationship does not last long.

It takes two to attach and types radically shift.

[arn131arn]

Clearmind,

I start my therapy with my P next Friday.  I want him to work with me on getting stronger, setting boundries with her, and loving myself and validating myself insead of the need for her to do those things.

If when I am stronger, can I love her without being in a relationship with her?

Is that okay?

I know she is toxic to me; but I think I will always love her in some weird stokholm syndrome way

Arn

[Clearmind]

Arn for me as time went on my feelings towards my ex shifted from thinking I was in love with him, to anger to resentment and shame to finally arrive at empathy for him.

Love comes in many different forms and now I can honestly say I don't love my ex because I redefined what love actually is. Love is not what we had - it was need for both of us.

When we start to work on us (awesome you are seeing a therapist) we tend to (for me anyway) shift our feelings from them to us. We begin to love ourselves more and build self worth - when this happens - we become that little more allergic to dysfunction and toxic relating.

Is it okay to love her? Of course Arn. When you have a child with someone there will always be a certain amount of love for your childs mother - completely natural. The big question is - how do you define it and are you able to shift from enabling to boundary setting for the sake of your son. She may get hurt in the process of this boundary setting so we need to be mindful of the limits of that love/relationship/friendship or however you wish to define it.

Loving someone who is abusive is more about co-dependency than anything. Your therapist will begin to work on that and you can do your own work at home if you wish. There are some great books out there on co-dependency and I can highly recommend Co-dependent No More - Workbook - by M.Beattie.

You made a very good point Arn. We do and did rely on them to provide us with validation. We need to begin to that for ourselves. We also need to work through the reasons why that was the case. Much of the reasons lie way back. I had an alcoholic parent and my fixing and placating of my ex was certainly reminiscent of what I endured as a child. I was repeating a pattern of relating in my own relationships. Was I co-dependent? Likely I was... .

[Pearl55]

Arn

A borderline is always better at this game. Nobody can use a borderline, even a NPD. A borderline always better at using people.

[mango_flower]

Arn... . this broke my heart for some reason.  Both for you and for her.  I get it, I really do. Even though I HATE how she treated m, just discarded me like I was nothing, it would break my heart if she were to be treated like that... . part of me still wants to protect the little 3 year  old I see in her... . (apparently though, her new fiancee treats her like a princess).

This post really helped me to understand that my caretaking ways have not been fixed... . so thank you for that!

When you said part of you will always love her in a weird toxic way - well, I get that too... .

One thing I wanted to pass on to you is this:

My ex has liked me long before I ever had any romantic feelings for her.  I once asked her (once we'd gotten together) what she'd have done if I hadn't reciprocated... . her answer was that she'd love me from a distance. 

That was the smartest thing she ever said.

So now we have to do the same - love them from a distance. And not feel bad about it.  Just go with it, but don't let it consume you.  And don't bear yourself up over it.  Every day, it should encroach on your every day life less... . but I agree, part of you will always love her. And that is honestly ok! Sometimes it's just better to accept these things and know it's normal, rather than trying to fight it.

And it's natural to be triggered by seeing her.  Hopefully you won't see her again.