SD8 and suicide

[How to communicate after a contentious divorce...]

We just got an e-mail from SD8's uBPDmom that SD8 is threatening suicide if SO and I get married. I'm not sure how to addres this. Either SD8 is saying it to echo mom and try to make her happy or mom is making it up to try to play it up in court for full custody.

SD8 doesn't have a therapist. Should we go to the school therapist tomorrow?

[Thunderstruck]

We just got an e-mail from SD8's uBPDmom that SD8 is threatening suicide if SO and I get married. I'm not sure how to addres this. Either SD8 is saying it to echo mom and try to make her happy or mom is making it up to try to play it up in court for full custody.

SD8 doesn't have a therapist. Should we go to the school therapist tomorrow?

[Matt]

SD8 doesn't have a therapist. Should we go to the school therapist tomorrow?

I would suggest talking to the school therapist as soon as possible, by yourself - just tell her exactly what you know.

She may meet with SD8, and that's probably a good thing.

She might also recommend a counselor in private practice - that's how I found my kids' counselor - and that way you can't be accused of shopping for a counselor who will "take your side".  Get SD8 into counseling as soon as possible, not as a quick fix, but for the long haul.

In the meantime, try to talk with SD8 alone, as soon as possible - maybe at her lunch time today - and see if she is doing OK.  You don't have to talk her out of anything, or even talk about your SO.  Just make sure she is doing OK.

[momtara]

This isn't going to look good for the mom, especially if it turns out not to be true.  I don't think it would make her a candidate for full custody.  Why would an 8 year old go to that extremes to be afraid of your new SO?  What is really going on?  I think an intelligent counselor won't buy into that.  But yes, you should see someone soon.

[Matt]

This isn't going to look good for the mom, especially if it turns out not to be true.  I don't think it would make her a candidate for full custody.  Why would an 8 year old go to that extremes to be afraid of your new SO?  What is really going on?  I think an intelligent counselor won't buy into that.  But yes, you should see someone soon.

I agree with that, and I think you'll have to be very cautious about how you handle the issue.  The counselor needs to be a resource for the child, not a tactic in the war between the parents.  Set aside the desire to win a battle - though at some point, as Momtara says, this may reflect very badly on Mom - and approach this with the intent to support the child, by establishing a relationship between the child and the professional.  (Which means you may not ever know all of what SD8 tells the counselor... . )

[NorthernGirl]

A counselor will be able to help determine if they think your SD has suicidal thoughts or if there is another agenda. Schools tend to take this stuff very seriously to ensure the child isn't at risk. So be prepared that they will want to involve both the parents (in the case of a friend of mine, the stepmom was not allowed to be part of the meetings) and there could be extensive follow-up.

[Thunderstruck]

My SO got a bunch of rages today from BPDbm about how SD8 hates me and wants to commit suicide if we get married and SD8 always says bad things about us and never wants to talk on the phone and on and on.

I went to have lunch with SD8. I said "So, what's going on at mom's house... . " and she said "My mom says i'm not allowed to like you but i do like you because you're nice." She denied the suicide comment.

I scheduled an appointment with the school counselor but then she called back and said she can't talk to me unless SO is there. So hopefully he can leave work and drive 45 minutes for this. Being a step blows sometimes. All the responsibility, none of the authority. Beh.

I've been campaigning for a T for a long time now. I think SD8 could really benefit from an impartial person to talk to. I don't know what to think of her. She seems happy when she's here then turns into a hate monster the next day when she's at BPDmom's? It sounds like she's telling mom what she thinks mom wants to hear (or maybe telling us what we want to hear?).

[Thunderstruck]

Ok just got the real deal from SD8. The suicide comment was a projection from BPDbm to SD8. Scary. SD8 said in one of BPDmom's "angry moments" (her words) last night she said she'd kill herself if we got married.

What do we even do about this?

[Matt]

Ok just got the real deal from SD8. The suicide comment was a projection from BPDbm to SD8. Scary. SD8 said in one of BPDmom's "angry moments" (her words) last night she said she'd kill herself if we got married.

What do we even do about this?

Very serious stuff.

I think in your situation I'd ask to see the child's therapist - you, SO, and SD together - and just talk it all out.  The T may be required to report Mom's threat - so be it.

I'd also suggest talking to a lawyer about an immediate change to custody.

In fact - not telling you it's right - but to be frank, I'd probably just make the decision to suspend SD's contact with Biomom til she gets the help she needs.  Let her take you to court.

If somebody said to me, "You should leave your 8-year-old child with an adult who has threatened suicide in front of her, and who has lied to you about the child threatening suicide." - why would I even consider leaving my child alone with someone like that?

Another option is a restraining order (or "order of protection" to keep that woman away from both of you and the child, until she is stable (which may mean never).

[DreamGirl]

Thunderstruck, it's hard not to get our emotions all wrapped up in this stuff.

Matt's advice is sound - and he tends to be no nonsense. It's worked really well for him. I also tend to be the same way when it comes to my own kiddos. I have sole custody of my oldest son because I firmly believed it was in his best interest. It cost me a lot of money in court costs (therapist testimony, attorney fees, etc.) and resulted in the very best outcome.

Part of that was being the grounded parent who wanted what was best for my son. I listened to his therapist and trusted her 100% to tell me what was in his best interest. It wasn't about me vs. his dad ~ even though that's what he wanted it to be.

Now.

My husband on the other hand is not full of conviction like I am. He is far more passive and his disordered ex-wife does a lot of things that he doesn't necessarily agree with, but he gives her the space to do. He always has. So when I tried to implement MY values and MY convictions into THEIR parenting relationship, it caused way more harm then good.

I don't know how your husband is or how he deals with these types of things, but Matt's suggestion will cause a lot of drama. Especially when you don't follow the court order and return the child. An emergency hearing also may not result in a change of custody or a restraining order and can make an already really contentious situation worse.

You are also basing all of this on the 8 year old. It's a lot of weight for her to bear and children have been known to tell the other parent what they think that parent wants to hear. Not saying that she's doing this, but it does happen.

So if it were me and my husband's situation... .

Dad would tell Mom that he is very worried about his daughter being suicidal. He'd even validate the fact that having a parent get remarried can be hard on kids.

He'd find a good therapist. He'd make an appointment on his time and then invite her.    

He'd also let the therapist guide the next stages of this - if she thinks the child needs to be removed from mom's care, I would definitely listen.