Dealing with the "push/pull"?

[In_n_Out]

I'll be brief.  I've been on the leaving board because I was painted black and thought that things were over.  I reached out and she responded somewhat.  That has led to a lot of talking and seeing one another over the past couple of days.  A big revelation was that she found a therapist to resume DBT/CBT work and she is acknowledging of some BPD traits. 

The one trait that has caused the greatest source of conflict over the years has been the pushing and pulling.  I know why she does it; when she feels engulfed or stressed, she runs or tries to flee.  She does it from jobs and she does it in r/s's.  We would be laying in bed happy as two bugs and she would out of the blue say "I think that we shouldn't live together any longer.  We should just date".  I should mention, she is a waif and never shows anger outwardly.

So over the past couple of days, we take giant steps forward (she's unblocked me from social media/phone/text for example) and then a leap backwards.  For example, we would be hugging and crying and laughing and happy and she will say "we can't do this, I need time away from you" and she will push me away.  From "your the love of my life" to "let's take a 6 month break apart (complete no contact)". 

So has anybody found the best way to work with this?  I'm a very patient man and I don't anger so I've gone from shutting down, to trying to rationalize with her - all those things in the past that did not work at all.  Just now she sent a text about how wonderful seeing me was last night, but that "people don't change overnight and she needs time apart".  My response was that this was the one trait that has been difficult for me to accept/deal with and that all that I can say is (lyrics to "sunshine... . don't take my sunshine away"- a song that she sings to me frequently when happy.

Other suggestions?

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RELATIONSHIP PROBLEM SOLVING This is a high level discussion board for solving ongoing, day-to-day relationship conflicts. Members are welcomed to express frustration but must seek constructive solutions to problems. This is not a place for relationship "stay" or "leave" discussions. Please read the specific guidelines for this group.

[OldnTired]

Hi In_n_Out

I'm fairly new here and I'm sorry but I don't have any suggestions. I do think though that your post has cleared up a question I raised in   Topic: Are we really split up ... . or not?

I think this push/pull thing is happening with me but he is managing it in a very subtle way. I have "we are split up now but nobody else needs to know about that". Then he got angry when I did tell somebody we had split up, as though I had made the decision to split us up, but it was really up to him to decide that.

He is civil, even friendly but I don't know how to re-engage with him now. It seems we are not in a relationship any more, we just live together. It is very peaceful now though after months of conflict so I think I will go with that for the time being.

I'll keep an eye on your post though to see if anybody does have suggestions.

OldnTired.

[bruceli]

In the same position myself and my only word of advice is ride the wave.  Yours, like mine is in therapy which I find to be helpful so who knows.  In this case, the way I see it is... . their is hope.

[In_n_Out]

Thanks for the replies all.

So after a wonderful past couple of days... . one where she presented one of the most thoughtful gifts ever*, I dropped off some hand picked flowers and a card/note thanking her for the gift this morning.  She was so happy about it.  In my note, I said that I would be honored if she would attend dinner and a movie with me some time this weekend.  She sent a text later in the day (I was at work) and it said something to the effect of "thank you so much for the flowers and the note... . (etc) BUT, I need time to get over what you've done" (paraphrasing).

So the thing that I've done in the past during our r/s that has been so damaging that she's at one time painted me black, got another bf, recycled with me but it stalls... . is the things that I've said when she has pushed me away.  The last one was very damning to her.  I texted "you're helpless... . good riddance".  Now, granted, saying "you're helpless" to someone that is dBPD was not very wise, I understand.  But LORDY!  We've talked about it and I've used SET and that has kept me in her graces somewhat but she is just stuck on that. 

Is it a "time heals all wounds" and she'll get over it and we can proceed (praying) or will BPD cause her to pull up that constantly for the rest of my natural born life? 

It's like I can see the gears spinning.  We will be laughing and holding one another and things will be so beautiful and then the roulette wheel will come up "black" and she'll mutter "BUT the things that you have said to me have hurt me SO MUCH!".  Grrrrr!  I've never even cursed at the woman! 

* The gift.  3 weeks ago, while I was painted black, she was missing me.  Home, alone and crying she got in her car and drove with no destination in mind.  She wound up at my moms grave (my mom passed in 1989 so no, they never met).  She said that she had a "chat" with my mom and tears flowed on to her grave marker.  She put a rose on the marker and just then, a beam of sunlight came upon it.  She knew that my mom was listening and "advising".  My ex took a picture of the scene and had it put in a nice frame and presented that to me over dinner the other night.  Clearly, a beam of light is coming down on my moms grave marker.  It is the most thoughtful, loving gift anybody has ever given me.  I just cried and couldn't thank her enough.  It's things like that which make me want to fight so hard to make this thing work. 

[DaddyLonghair]

I don't want to throw cold water on a special moment, but didn't she just go to extremes to find the perfect emotional hook for you? It sound like she has a pattern of drawing you in, lifting you up and smacking you down. The picture and magical moment would seem suspect to me in light of previous behavior.

[In_n_Out]

I don't want to throw cold water on a special moment, but didn't she just go to extremes to find the perfect emotional hook for you? It sound like she has a pattern of drawing you in, lifting you up and smacking you down. The picture and magical moment would seem suspect to me in light of previous behavior.

I can of course see how it would/should/could be perceived that way.  Many here talk about that glazed look in the eyes when they disassociate.  Mine never has that look.  She looks me in the eyes with tears in her eyes and I know how much she loves me.

I'm reading "When Hope is Not Enough" and it has been very eye-opening for me.  The "eggshells" book gave me insight in to her world some but didn't offer real "solutions" IMHO.  This book has had some really good information.  I sent my ex a few texts last night and I won't go in to details but they were emotional, happy, validating.  She knows that I run in the park on Saturday mornings.  Well this morning I feel someone run up behind me and then grab me and it was her.  We hugged as she is just about to pass out from lack of breath.  She said that after reading the texts when she awoke she desperately grabbed clothes to put on to rush to the park.  I told her that I understand that it isn't what I said that matters but that what I said hurt her and that is hurt that is drawn from memories of being hurt all those years ago as a child.  She's nodding "yes" and crying.  We talked and walked and she told me how much she loves me and how "f'd up" this all is because she's "stuck" in a r/s with someone else and she's miserable (and I know that she is).  They're fighting and he doesn't know how to deal with her - but - he's taking her to places and they are seeing/doing things that she's always dreamt about (whatever those things may be) but it's f'd up because it's me that she always wanted it to be with but now she's invested time with this guy and other people would be disapointed in her if she left him, etc.

I know, I can see the eyes rolling from readers of this and I try to disassociate from my own body and look at it from the outside and I roll my eyes too but when she's looking me straight in the face telling me how I am "home" to her and that this is all that she's ever wanted but now she's stuck and desperate... . I melt.  I melt knowing that nobody else will ever go to my moms grave site on their own accord to weep and have a talk and then document the moment to share with me.  Not like how she did (and that is just one big example in a long list of similar examples).

So I have to decide if I play being "the other guy" for a while, if at all (I have been for months now actually).  I have to decide if I just store these memories and move on or do I keep waiting to see if she finds the strength to end it with him.  Whether or not I wait, I know that they are on their last dance.  I know her.  She posts cryptic messages on facebook when she is hurting like she is now.  She did it with me before I had become "knowing" of her BPD.  She was unhappy and posted the cryptic "escape" messages.  Her mom knows all too well the pattern and reinforces that she needs to get out if she is so unhappy (in her own cryptic responses).  She's doing that now with him and unless he somehow suddenly becomes "knowing" as I did AND he then decides that he still wants to fight for her, then she will do the dance with him (and me) and I won't be a part of that triangulation.  Yes, I'm triangulating now, but I'm still hopeful at this point that a corner of the triangle is close to breaking down.  I may be the big fool for thinking that way, but for me, it's still too early to just close it up and move on because I will always wonder "what if I had waited just a bit longer". 

I still believe she is very sincere with me about her feelings.  I know that she truly does love me and if she could wave her magic wand and make it "so", she would.  The borderline in her though will push/pull and deal with it the way that they do though.  I know that she has the "shame" that the book talks about and she may feel that she is not worthy of this man that is willing to set aside this tryst that she's having.  I don't know.  I really just don't know how it will all turn out.

[In_n_Out]

She kept saying over and over again "please don't hate me for doing this".  Maybe I am the fool.

[bruceli]

I don't want to throw cold water on a special moment, but didn't she just go to extremes to find the perfect emotional hook for you? It sound like she has a pattern of drawing you in, lifting you up and smacking you down. The picture and magical moment would seem suspect to me in light of previous behavior.

Perhaps, that's what the push/pull is all about.  Now if he is going to be able to go with it... .

[In_n_Out]

All that I can say right now is that the book "When Hope is Not Enough" has been a Godsend.  My story with her isn't fully written yet and I don't know how it's going to turn out, but it has been the most blissful 5 days since I discovered that book.  Her words "your validating my thoughts, my emotions.  Nobody has ever done that before.  You explain me better than I can explain myself.  I love you for doing this for me".