RTC Interviews

[raytamtay3]

Tomorrow is our first interview at the place I mentioned I'm most interested in based off of what they have on their website anyway. But I'm back to having anxiety over the thought of driving there with DD and her finding out not only is it not a 6 months stay, but it's a 9 to 12 month stay. I'm just tired of the badgering and making me feel like crap over "making my daughter go away for so long". I don't want to send her away. I want her home with me where she belongs. But I also don't want constant verbal abuse, constant worry and constantly feeling like I'm walking on eggshells. I just want peace and harmony. And right now with her at the shelter, I've had a taste of it and it tastes wonderful. I'm enjoying spending time with my DS6. I'm enjoying not having constant stress and constant anxiety (I'll take this tiny bouts as opposed to every single day). I'm enjoying seeing my DH relaxed and not so tense. But it's nevertheless hard. And I just feel so bad for my DD that she has to go through this and live this life.  :'(

On a different note, I don't know what's going on with me lately. I don't know if it's caused by stress or possibly early menopause (I'm 42), but I've been having bouts of irritability like crazy. And I find myself getting clingy with my DH! Nothing major but he likes to hang in his garage sometimes and lately it's bothering me because I want him near me. Like he's my security blanket or something. Neither of which I've ever done! And it frightens me. I guess what frightens me most is that I've read how people with BPD are and sometimes I get worried I'm either developing or had it all along and that I'M the one who passed it on to my DD or something. Plus the other night, I had a meltdown over my DH calling me a name. He never calls me names and it really wasn't a big deal but it was a trigger for me from being in a verbally abusive marriage where I was constantly called bad names. I went in the bedroom and cried and he caught me. I felt really stupid and like a child. I've never done that before. Very scary!

Our objective is to better understand the struggles our child faces and to learn the skills to improve our relationship and provide a supportive environment and also improve on our own emotional responses, attitudes and effectiveness as a family leaders

[jellibeans]

Oh Ray... . you are just going through a hard time and you need to take the time to take care of yourself right now. It is understandable to have all those feelings. When under stress we are not ourselves. I felt all the things you are saying and my H and I have gone through a lot... . this kind of illness will put a lot of stress on a relationship. Our kids are very good at trying to split us too. Have you thought of seeing a therapist? I have seen a few over the years and some have helped. Those that know about BPD. I really suggest you make some time for yourself? Maybe even a weekend get away?

[raytamtay3]

Probably not until the summer as I plan on taking D6 to the shore for a few days and am saving up for it so we can have a lot of fun. I'm so looking forward to spending quality time with him. I just feel like he has been so jyped (sp?). He's such a pleasure to be around.  

I'm not sure what the process is going to be tomorrow. Like what should I expect? Should I try and sell the fact of how much she has to be there and what her history is or will they already know? I just want to be prepared because if I'm not, because I'm so burnt out right now, I could possibly do more harm than good forgetting about some of the critical things that has happened leading up to this.

Also, DD told me I mind as well not waste my time taking off to take her to these places because she won't agree to go to any that is for more than 3 months. I've read somewhere that someplaces won't accept them if they don't feel they are invested in treatment.

[jellibeans]

Ray

Stop listening your dd right now... . she is not in control... . I am not sure if you can be prepared for court... . maybe writing out a kind of timeline will help you remember. I have a small journal to help me remember the dates and times she was at the ER... that is something that could really help. All I had to do was list the many hospitalizations she had had and no further explanation was necessary. I also had a list of how many times we called police to help when she ran away. I think that might help you if you are asked questions... . don't worry... . start planning your vacation with your son... . put your energy there and that might help relieve your stress.

[raytamtay3]

I know. How twisted is it that I allow a 14 year old to make me feel so unsettled? I just cannot believe my luck that it took me over 20 years to gain the courage to leave my ex for that which I'm still dealing with with my DD! I know that's horrible to say. But I'm sorry. It's true. I really try not to compare. I know she is not him. But good lord is she her father's child!

[Being Mindful]

Hi Ray, I'm wondering if you did the visit without your d? That way you can ask the questions you need to ask without being intimidated by your d. My dh and I visited the RTC's that we had researched and were still on our list as potential. We didn't get our d. involved until we had made our decision. She was too young and too ill to weigh in. Plus, it saved a lot of stress and badgering our d would have given us. There's no way our BPD kids can logically discern what is best for them. Think about it... . a healthy teen can't make life decisions for themselves why would we give that responsibility to our ill ones. Once we had picked the RTC, we told our daughter and took her for a visit. It was a done deal. Then, the RTC took over to help prepare my d. for her arrival a couple of days later.

[peaceplease]

raytamtay,

I just read this thread.  I hope all went well with the interview.  Does your dd have to be present?  I know if it was my dd at that age, he would have found all kind of ways to sabotage acceptance into program.  Please remind yourself that you are in control.   Most teens would try to sabotage anyway they could.  I don't think any teen will be motivated for treatment.  It will take time once they are in treatment.

Hoping you will find a place that meets your needs.

peace

[raytamtay3]

It started off bad but ended very well.  My DD was visibly quite angry to anyone who encountered her beginning with me, then her CM and then the first person we encountered at the facility (the director).  On the drive there, she kept putting her knee in the back of my chair . I know for a fact it was on purpose. And I'm very glad the CM drove us as it was over an hour away.

I really liked the director who has a very sunny and pleasant personality.  My DD gave angry one word answers when the director asked her questions.  :)D said she didn't like horses when being asked at first (even though she's been asking for me to get her one for years). Then later kept asking about how often she'd get to be around hers. The director later told DD she didn't take it personal when DD was aggigated and knew that as the day progressed, her demeanor would improve as many who come for orientation are the same.  We first were given details about the program and pretty much everything on the listing that Crumblingdad provided me as far as questions go were answered and everything was a yes. The only thing was a little disconcerning was when I mentioned to the therapist we later visited with that DD was diagnosed as having "traits of BPD", she did say how she doesn't believe in given diagnoses of that at such an early age because all teens exhibit "traits" of BPD. DD seemed pleased and snotty to me about that.  But the therapist mentioned how some things are typical teenager behaviors and then gave a listing of those that constitue having a problem and low and behold, they were things that DD exhibits. So that look went away real fast. .

They do do CBT therapy, individual, group, equine, anger management (actually they gave a different name for it saying adults typically do anger management but that for adolescents, it's a bit different) and family involvement is crucial.

We met with a therapist and the nurse on staff.

We got a tour of the facility. It's a native american themed facility and we learned that not too long ago, they actually had teepees (sp?) that the kids stayed in. Then they updated to this barn looking thing (that even the director said we pretty disgusting) and now they have more modern cabins. It accomodates 10 girls and 2 staff. They have two full bathrooms, bunkbeds, a common area with a flat screen tv and offices for the staff. It's nothing fancy but it's liveable.

 Considering DD is in 8th grade, she will be bussed to a special school in the county and since she will be there going into the next school year and will be starting high school she will have schooling on site.  It's a 9 to 12 months program. Our CM told DD on the way there and DD obviously was not too happy about that, but she eventualy accepted it.

The grounds are beautiful as it's in the pine barrens. It does kind of resemble a wilderness type of facility, but  do like their approach.

DD decided she will go there saying she just wants to start the process and get it over with rather than continue interviewing at other places.  I am satisfied with this as I do think this place will do her good.  Some people I've spoken to about said they didn't think there was any way my DD would like the place as it's more of a boot camp type of approach, but I didn't get that impression at all.  And not for nothing, that would probably do her good!

So if all goes well, DD will probably be going Monday.  She told me what sold her on the place is that the kids can earn from $5 - $20 a week doing chores. She didn't like the fact that they have to wear uniforms though. But I told her how she can always dress it up with a nice scarf, etc. She's all about appearance.

We stopped at a WaWa on the way back and DD was asking me to buy her a pack a cigerettes which I declined doing. Told her now is the time to quit smpling aas well.

I like the fact that after 30 days, and provided she behaves, she will get weekend passes. She can come home on Friday nights and go back Sunday. And the provide transportation.

The boys camp is accross the way through the woods. Minimal interaction wth them thankfully. Oh AND one of the other good things is it is directly next store to where my DH works!  When DD learned of this she was like good, now D can drop me off stuff if I need it. Progress! She actually wants him to drop her off stuff.

So fingers crossed.

[BioAdoptMom3]

Oh it is so obvious that you and your DH are under such incredible stress and that is understandable!  You are so not alone.  I will not make your post mine, but I having a DD14 for whom we are also looking at residential treatment and having many of those same emotions of relief, worry and stress I can so understand  !  I am thinking of getting DH and I our own therapist where we can go to learn, vent and just be heard.  I highly suggest that.  I am also on Effexor prescribed by my primary care doctor and it does help to take the edge off.  I also calm down faster when I get worried, angry or stressed.  It sounds like, which is a typical difference between a male and female, you are both dealing with stress in your own ways.  He is retreating to the garage and you are getting clingy, both normal in my humble opinion.  For him to call you a name when he has not done that before indicates intense stress.  Please do not be embarrassed about him finding you in tears.  I would think that is a typical reaction.  I wish I knew what else to say, but I don't.  Just please know that we here understand and we are here for you!  My prayers also support you and your family!

[jellibeans]

Dear Ray

I think that went really well and you and your dd handled it well! These first few weeks will be very telling and you will be tested many times by your dd... . be prepared for that... . sounds like that place is really nice. Did they say anything about DBT therapy? When you will be given a treatment plan?

I laughed at the horse comment... . reminded me of my dd when we tried a horse therapy program two summers ago... . she hated horses all of a sudden... . I don't remember her saying that when she went to horse camp when she was little... .

Keep us posted... . so glad you found a place you are happy with... .

[Verbena]

raymaytay,

Congratulations!  You have fought hard to get your daughter help, and it's finally happening. 

I wish your daughter could know and understand that God made her, He loves her, and she doesn't have to live this way.  I am so thankful that there's something wonderful waiting for us after the problems of this world that we have to navigate. 

I pray your daughter's RTC really helps her. 

Our objective is to better understand the struggles our child faces and to learn the skills to improve our relationship and provide a supportive environment and also improve on our own emotional responses, attitudes and effectiveness as a family leaders

[raytamtay3]

Did they say anything about DBT therapy? When you will be given a treatment plan?

I/quote]

The do CBT (Cognitive Behavioral Therapy) which I learned to similiar from the folks on here.

Thanks everyone for your continued support and well wishes! I really appreciate it!

[Rapt Reader]

Wow! That's an incredible breakthrough for your daughter (and for you, too!), raytamtay3! From being so incorrigible and unwilling to cooperate in any way, to being (however grudgingly) willing to go to the RTC . Yaaaaay! 

You've done your homework, you've persevered, you've researched and followed where the information led you, and now your daughter will get the help she needs. And you and your family will get a 9-12 month respite from the tornado you were swirling in for so long. I'm truly so happy for you all   

[crumblingdad]

Oh I'm so thrilled to read this and that you've finally reached this point.  Don't get too excited though as it's a tough road ahead and I can't stress enough it's important to stay grounded in reality.  As they say keep the lows from being too low and the highs from being too high.  Just let the process take it's course and know there will be a lot of highs and a lot of lows along the way but with the right treatment all will be fine. 

I too heard those same comments on BPD diagnosis.Bottom line is the validation of the diagnosis is good to hear but as long as their treatment program addresses the symptoms through an effective and evidence based program then it doesn't much matter who accepts or refutes the label or diagnosis of BPD.  It wasn't like throughout my journey hearing those things were going to make me think anything different from what I knew to be true. 

Keep us updated I'm thrilled to hear this!

[raytamtay3]

Well now she is saying that she doesn't want to go there. That she wants me to find a 6 month program so that she can go to highschool. That she doesn't want to be in a wilderness type of environment. Essentially dragging this process out now and causing us to more than likely have to go back to court tomorrow (they gave us until the 11th to find something) and my having to take more time off. I'm so fearful all of this is going to cause me to lose my job. Between having to take off for this stuff and all the snow days recently, I would not be surprised if my boss doesn't start saying something about all this time off. They have been so good to me over the years but even I know that the perspection could be that I'm taking advantage of their patience.

[jellibeans]

Ray

I just don't understand why your dd is calling the shots? does she really have that much say?

[raytamtay3]

jellibeans, I didn't say she was calling the shots. God no. I'm just saying what her latest protest is. I just wish she was just more willing and would just stop making this process harder. I was so happy when she was in the acceptance stage and was ready to "get it over with".  This is her though. She flip flops and tries to change my mind. It's just hard - that's all. I just want it done. It's hard to explain.

[Verbena]

I would not take off any more time from work looking for other facilities OR tell your daughter that you don't have the time to look for other places.  Tell her that you believe this RTC can help her, that this is where she will be, and that you hope she will learn to like it and see the benefit of being there. 

The court has ordered her to an RTC.  You, as the parent, feel that this one is the best choice so that's it.  She is is 14 and mentally ill.  This is your decision, not hers. 

You and your family are still in my prayers.   

[jellibeans]

Ray

You are the one in control of this situation... . allowing your dd to manipulate what is going on is sending her the wrong message... . it is telling her you might not be 100% sure of your choice... . it is telling her she is still driving the bus... . she is 14 and the time for negotiations are over... . be firm with her so she can get the help she needs... . there will never be a prefect place in her mind... . she could keep this process going forever... . the sooner you start the closer you are to seeing some results from treatment and the sooner your dd will be home again. Stay strong Ray... . your dd is counting on you... . show her you know what you are doing is right... . wavering on your choice sends the wrong message.

[crumblingdad]

Let her know you love her and understand she may not like this place but that based on your meetings and discussions with others who know what they are doing this is what you feel is best for her health and safety.  Tell her you know it could be the wrong choice but it's the best choice you have right now and whether she agrees or disagrees it's being done out of love and what you feel is best.

Stand strong as others have said.  Try your best to validate and not make it a power struggle - but set the boundary and the course you've decided is best and stick to it.

You're doing wonderful and it's a challenging battle to get where you're going.  I wouldn't take more time off from work either - if you know your choice is the best one stick to it and don't let her pull the heart strings because I know from my own experience it's a heart wrenching decision.

[theplotthickens]

You are the healthier, more mature person in this situation, so trust your instincts.

If your dd is kvetching, I'd consider not arguing with her or defending your decisions.  Just validate her by saying things like "I hear you on that!"  "It must be kind of scary to think of being away for 6 months"  "I am going to pass along all of your concerns and make sure they are heard" etc.

Defer, deflect.  Carry on!   

Our objective is to better understand the struggles our child faces and to learn the skills to improve our relationship and provide a supportive environment and also improve on our own emotional responses, attitudes and effectiveness as a family leaders

[Rapt Reader]

If your dd is kvetching, I'd consider not arguing with her or defending your decisions.  Just validate her by saying things like "I hear you on that!"  "It must be kind of scary to think of being away for 6 months"  "I am going to pass along all of your concerns and make sure they are heard" etc.

Defer, deflect.  Carry on!   

This is a good idea 

Also, S.E.T.:

Support: I can see that you are feeling apprehensive about this place, DD... .

Empathy: If I was in your place, I would be nervous and maybe even afraid, also... .

Truth: The Court has ordered that you attend an RTC, and this is what we've chosen and the wheels are turning... . Give it a chance before just dismissing it out of hand.

Like the other posters here have said, you are the Mom and you are in control, and she is allowed to feel the way she feels, but you don't need to accommodate those fears except by validating that they are normal and that she has a right to them. And then do the right thing and bring her to the RTC 

[raytamtay3]

Once again I want to say I love you guys!     I slept on it after reading your responses and I'm putting my foot down. Between us (because I will do S.E.T. with her),  I'm through allowing her to bully me into submission and through giving her control. I like this place. I think it will be good a fit and seems the best out of the approved places. And like my mother said, now is the time to nip this control issue in the bud now before she does come home and tries to run the house again.

[raytamtay3]

Vent - OT

I think I've mentioned how my ex (DD's father) has issues. I don't know if he's bipolar, BPD a narcisst or what. He does have OCD though. Anyway, I've taken so many days off between snow days and things related to DD in January and February. At least 8 days. And yes, I have asked him (ex) if he could keep our DS6 a couple of times recently for things related to DD, because she is his daughter too! You know, the one he pretends to actually care about but doesn't let her come over to his house anymore and the one he gave me full custody of because he couldn't handle her anymore and the one who plays good cop with DD to make her think he's on her side on everything? Well it's his custodial week with DS this week. He's been blowing up my phone freaking out beause DS has been vomiting. He probably has a stomach bug. No big deal to me. It will pass. But my ex gets overly worried like he's dying. Literally. So play by play he texts me what DS is doing with respect to vomiting. I only answered once to tell him to maybe take him to the pediatrician. Which he didn't respond to. Now he is TELLING me that I need to take off tomorrow if DS is sick because he doesn't have any more time left at work and he will get in trouble. I told him that I really really wish I could, but I've taken off so many days already this year and have to again on Friday to take DD to the RTC that I simply can't. I need my job too. He went on a rant (via text) with about 7 messages about how he's helped me out 15 times this year with DS (assageration). I said yes, for things pertaining to DD. That he needs his job MORE THAN I NEED MINE!    And that he is just going to drop DS off at school tomorrow then even if he's vomiting. He is such an arse! Grrr! He tried to brow beat me too. I'm just so sick of this between STILL, even after divorcing him, having to deal with him. And the cherry on top, is having a child JUST LIKE HIM. My only other text to him during this rant was for him to please stop blowing up my phone as I am at work. His response and final text to me was "well if you don't care, neither do I".  Thanks for letting me vent. Not that you had any choice. .  

[jellibeans]

Dear Ray

Have you read any of the resources on co parenting? I find that mothers seem to take the bulk of the responsibility when it comes to the kids. Seem most H's think it really doesn't concern them and they shouldn't be inconvienced ... .


Shared Parenting 

Things to cover in a parenting plan

hope these articles help... . I think it is best to have everything in writing then you can avoid these kind of conflicts with your ex... . hang in there

[raytamtay3]

Great articles and tools unfortunetly my ex would have to read them and he won't be willing to do so. We have a parenting plan in place. But we do help one another out and can do so effectively most times. I've asked him if he'd be willing to take a parenting class with me. But it never panned out. Plus what you see is not what you get with him. He talks a very good game and tells you what you want to hear while doing things in the sly.

To this day when my DD is asked by therapists if she had any traumatic experiences, she always comes back to it being when her father told her all of the negative things about my past (alienation). I never reciprocated because for one, that's not me, and two, I try and sheild my kids from it as much as I can when they are away from him and with me. I've even gone so far as to take people aside who talk negative about their father in their presence to not ever do that.

I have to constantly remind myself that you can't make a parent be a good parent. I can only control what I do and how I parent.

[crumblingdad]

well my belief is he won't drop DS off at school like that and is just an idol threat - call his bluff and let him deal with it.  It's his week you've got enough on your plate.

(not an advocate of violence but my previous offer of a cuff upside his head still stands for the ex    )

Stay strong!

[raytamtay3]

I really like our lawyer. He is very personable. DH thinks he has a crush on me.    Anyway, he goes the extra mile for us and doesn't do like most lawyers do and charge you for every single interaction. I told him how DD was protesting going to the RTC we picked out now. He called her at the shelter yesterday to try and talk her in to going. He then called me and told me that before they hung up, DD said "fine, I'll go". But he said he doesn't know if she just said that to get him off the phone or not.  

Today her case manager ("CM" is suppose to go to the shelter to visit with her to try and convince her as well.  I did tell her CM that if DD is still protesting going to the RTC, that for safety reasons, something is going to have to be figured out with respect to transporting her there. As mentioned before, she has grabbed the wheel of my car during a rage twice with my DS in the back seat. Once on a busy highway and once while going over a bridge... .

I'm going to call the RTC after I hear back from the CM to see if they could pick her up and take her there considering they said that after three months, and contingent upon DD's behaviour, she will get weekend passes home and that they could provide the transportation for that.

I just want this done. My stomach is doing flip flops.

[Verbena]

raymaytay,

No one needs to be trying to talk your daughter into this RTC.  You've done your research and this is where you have decided she is going.  That decision has been made. As long as your DD thinks you or her CM or her lawyer needs her approval, she will keep jerking you all back and forth. 

Because you fear she could grab the wheel of your car as she has done before, you definitely do need to figure out a safe way to get her there.  Is there any way your CM could be with you during transport?  Would your DD attempt to cause you to have a wreck with another adult in the car?  What about a police officer going with you?  I have no idea how all that works, but it's just a thought.  A friend of ours works for the sheriff's department here, and one of his duties is to transport people to mental health facilities. 

[raytamtay3]

No, don't get me wrong. She IS going one way or the other. It's not a question of her being convinced to go because it's where I choose for her to go. What I'm saying is it would be nice if she was agreeable to it so that I could drive her myself. No more, no less.