Doesn't know her own life

[Stella1425]

Aaaarrrgh! When will it get easier to understand she will never do what she says and she will never know what is going on in her life?  After asking our D who's easter it is (ex or her) she has to ask him because she doesn't keep a marriage dissolution where she can find it, finds out it's his. He is not seeing him right now but she asks if it's ok if we keep him all weekend and he says fine. Then tonight we get a call that his other grandparents expect him and the ex didn't communicate with them that he was here. She first said she worked till 3 on Sunday, the said doesn't work. Now says double on Monday and asked them to babysit. I think that's a lie and she just found out they expect GS at their house.  She had made a point of giving him to us because they screwed up our thanksgiving at the last minute and she acted like she's acknowledging that, but now she's giving in to them again. It hurts but also she never knows what is going on in her life. I should be glad that I am now very sure it's BPD, and not just beyond bizarre behavior but it still drives me crazy. I'm sitting here trying to calm down because she did it to us again. Why should I be surprised. I can't ever seem to understand that she will never do what she says and she will never have a handle on her life. Plus GS told us he stayed at daddy's overnight. I texted her and she said yes he did. So I guess that's happening again. Nice that she didn't tell us about that. Needed to vent but need to figure out how to never depend on a word she says. So we don't have him for Easter dinner although we were told we would. She has to make the 2 hour one way trip here and back and had to miss out on dinner now too. Aaarghhhh!  Thanks for listening.

Our objective is to better understand the struggles our child faces and to learn the skills to improve our relationship and provide a supportive environment and also improve on our own emotional responses, attitudes and effectiveness as a family leaders

[pessim-optimist]

I am really sorry this is another holiday without your grandson... .

I cannot remember - do you have an amicable relationship with the ex, or between you and the ex's parents? Perhaps it's not possible, I was wondering if there is a way for all of you to communicate and make it work despite your daughter's disorganized lifestyle... . It would have to be a delicate balance of communication, yet not enabling by taking the responsibility off her shoulders. Perhaps just being more informed - all around. Is that something that might work?

[qcarolr]

Stella1425

How old is your GS? This must be very confusing for him as well. Such a disappointment for you again.

Do you have options to be with your GS at other times, not holidays? Are you able to go get him for a visit instead of your D having to make the drive? It is hard to let go of wanting to have some say in how our grown up kids interact with us -- we just don't have the gift of that very often.

Perhaps if you can make this about being with gs it would indirectly improve connections with your D? Can you help me understand this a little better?

qcr

[Stella1425]

Pessim optimist, actually no we don't have a good relationship with ex or his parents. And it was just this that again got our  D to text on Easter Sunday "you'll never see your grandson agin" and "I"m on my way there (around noon) to get him. We had texted our ex SIL for the holiday schedule. We didn't have our copy anymore and D is so disorganized she just depends in others to tell her her life. He sent it. Thanked him. My H asked for his dads # in case Exsil couldn't show if he was back in pic. He said no then proceeded to tell our D we asked for it and on it went. He is a diagnosed Npd (diagnosed when he was forced into counseling after he hit our D while drunk a couple years before she left him).  He threw us under the bus a year ago so no conversation since till now. He thanked us for texting etc now, then threw us under the bus again. Soo that won't be happening for him again. Anyway our D was to show up Easter morn to "spend every minute I'm not at work with my son" and she never showed. Never called or texted till 6 pm well after she was to have him at the ex in laws who said they would not babysit for her Monday unless she got him to them for Sunday. Needless to say I finally got worried later in the day after texted her numerous times to see where she was. She find nally texted to meet her Monday night late, halfway, after her 2 shifts. So all that set this off was us asking for a phone number. She didn't mind us asking for schedule. I sent it to her right when we got it and she thanked me! Who can EVER know what is going to set them off.

Qcaroir, our GS is 6. We do get lots of time with him as we drive the 2 hours one way and back again to get him from school every other Friday. Then we met his dad halfway on Sunday at 1 as that is his extra day every week. He has not been allowed to see him as he made a huge parenting mistake while drunk. Our D was to make the drive this time because she screwed up the plans.  The ex in laws never come to get him when it was their S days.  Turns out our D now has let her ex have him but didn't tell us. Our GS told us. The communication between all of them is horrible. Our daughter is disorganized beyond reason (our poor grandson in more ways than one) the ex never communicates with his parents. We aren't allowed their number although we had it for years and got rid of it on our own. I'm sure they have ours. So this is not about time with GS. It is about our D honoring her promise to us which was we could keep him all weekend. She asked her ex (even though he wasn't seeing our GS at the time) and he didn't care. It was Friday night late when ex in laws demanded him at their house. That's what got me. They demanded it. The divorce decree is between the couple, not the grandparents. So here's the rest of the story. On Tuesday (remember we're never to see our grandson again at this point) we get a text from D that ex in laws wrote our D saying they were no longer going to take GS on their sons weekend. (Needed in 3 days) we have told her that we would never take him for them or our ex SIL. I texted back that I didn't see why we needed that info as we have no idea why she didn't come to get our GS or even knew she wasn't coming. Said must be a problem on that end. My H then texted with her dome. I stayed out of it. Somewhere along the line the ex in laws changed their mind and agreed to again. Will probably never know what happened. What a complicated mess pwBPD make of their lives. It just never has to be this way. Soo long of a story. So sorry. Thanks for listening.

[qcarolr]

What a complicated mess pwBPD make of their lives. It just never has to be this way.

Yes it is complicated beyond reason. Hmmm. My BPDDD does not always have very good access to her reasoning mind.

Yes it does not have to be this way. It just is. So often.

I have been practicing letting go of my should', ought's, if only's --- so hard to do. When I can then my internal life is more peaceful, even with the chaos that surrounds DD so much of the time continues.

qcr

[Stella1425]

Along these same lines I'd like to ask anyone how they would handle this. It seems a small thing compared to some of the horrors you all are going through, but it is constantly a problem for us. I am reading the book setting boundaries with your adult child. We try to set boundaries and it almost always  makes her do the opposite. So here is our current recurring situation. We are to be met half way at 1:00 on a Sunday when we  have our GS on my D weekend for her. She knows that. Her ex is not allowed to see his S right now but that is not out problem. She refuses to get someone (his parents) or her or a friend to get him. What would you do. Keep him and make her come all the way?  How do you give consequences gor behavior when they manipulate so badly?

QCR. Thanks for reply. It come in as I was typing this. I know I must learn to let go of should and oughts. I've learned some things that make me more peaceful internally such as texting not calling. It's the situations where we must rely on others to keep her world working that exhausts us. She doesn't keep us filled in. Luckily she is higher functioning BPD and able to raise her son, but she needs so much help from us and others. I know the "laundry list" of problems are the same for many of us. I just can't seem to get a handle on the logistics of dealing with BPD. I think I could let if all go if not for my GS.

[pessim-optimist]

Hm... . I am really sorry that the communication between you and at least the ex's parents isn't possible. It would make the situation easier to manage... .

Trying to figure out some boundaries and consequences when it also involves your grandson is much harder than when it only involves you and the pwBPD, because if there are negative reactions, it will affect everyone in the mix. So, that is something to consider as well.

The basics remain the same though:

First, you need to really figure out what you are willing to do and what you are not willing to do in this situation. Then you can devise a strategy as to how to achieve that. Are you ok with driving all the way? If you absolutely do not want to do that, you can enforce boundaries.

Are you afraid that she will not let your grandson stay again if you don't give in to her? If so, she probably knows that and is using it to blackmail you. Is that something you feel strong enough about to call her bluff? What if she isn't bluffing - is it likely you will lose contact with your grandson? If so, is it worth it?

In the example that you give:

What is happening? You know she has nobody to drive him, so you drive him all the way? Or you come to the half-way point and then find out it's up to you to drive him all the way?

If it's the first scenario, and she called to tell me that she doesn't have anyone to drive him, I'd say: "Ok, honey. Let me know when you can pick him up, and we'll drive him to the half-way point." If she pressed me to drive him all the way, I'd say: "I can drive him to the half-way point. That was the original agreement. I am sorry, I will not be able to drive him all the way."

If it's the second scenario, I would come, call her and leave a message or text: "Hi honey, we are here at the half-way point, we are ready to drop off your son. Let us know what's happening." I would wait 15 min, half an hour at the most, doing something fun with the gs, and if she did not contact me, I'd go back home and let her pick him up at my place.

She would most likely be very upset - especially if her son would miss school the next day. If she knew this was non-negotiable, she would get the picture after a few mishaps.

In the meantime, you would need to:

1. Be willing to not see your grandson, if it's an issue that is important enough to you.

2. Stay strong and not give in (if you gave in, you would be giving her what's called "intermittent reinforcement"  and would be worse off then before)

3. Validate her feelings about her difficulties, stay calm and positive, yet firm about your boundary.

Depending on your age, health, time-constraints: do you think this would be something worthwhile in your situation?

[peaceplease]

Stella,

I am sorry that it is all so complicated.  It certainly is not fair to you.  Is it too late to get on decent terms with his parents?

My dd just threatened today that once she is on her feet and no longer NEEDS me, I will no longer see my gs. She loves to use him to threaten me! (However, she dropped him off here after she picked him up from school. She does not have any food and wanted us to feed him)   One thing that is a consolation to me is that I believe that my gs dad would allow me to have him during his week.  I am on decent terms with him. 

I am just saying that it would be helpful to be on civil terms, if possible.  If it is not possible, then I am sorry.

peaceplease

[Stella1425]

Thanks for the advice. I neglected to say it was more about not getting someone to watch him the rest of the day along with the driving. But in the long run I am not willing to lose him and yes I'm sure she knows that. The next weekend we are going to get him from school and go camping in their area so it won't be an issue. One visit at a time I guess. Maybe we'll do it that way all summer. We'd pay for camping almost with what we'd save in gas!  Thanks again for trying to help.