Questions about therapists for we 'Nons'...

[How to communicate after a contentious divorce...]

Hi all, I initially thought about putting this on the "Taking Personal Inventory" board but would like to hear experiences with any of you who started therapy after their r/s with their pwBPD ended.

Off the top, my two primary goals entering therapy (and that I expressed in consultations) were:

1.  To discuss my depression, explore and reevaluate stalled goals in my life and generally an emerging pattern in the last few years of taking on and burying trauma -- personal, family & career related -- issues of codependency and generally becoming 'stuck' in many aspects of my recent life.

2.   Related to #1, to discuss the postmortem of my BPD r/s and to determine why entering and participating in the creation of that bond was so powerful.  Through my own introspection, reading, journaling and this outstanding support community, I've picked up a tremendous amount of knowledge about the who's, what the hell's and whosamawhatsits of how I entered into a relationship that my rational mind knew was doomed, why I held on for 14 months and why the fantasy bond was so powerful.  It's been enlightening and fascinating on many levels, even more fascinating if it hadn't been me whose psyche was starting to resemble a twice fried mocha frappuccino.

My fourth session was this week.  The first three sessions were spent going over much of the detail of the BPD r/s and some personal background about myself.   I'm doing a timeline for her, we've just began to talk about FOO and next week she wants to do some light therapy (heliotherapy).  She is an LCSW with a degree from a prominent university in and her training is in psychodynamics.  :)uring the consultation I requested a familiarity with BPD as fundamental.

My concerns:

1. I'm doing all the damn talking!  On her end it seems a lot of head-nodding with some pop psychology summations thrown during the last 2 minutes as I struggle to figure what I've paid for for those 48.675 minutes (yes it takes about 1.325 minutes to get from the lobby to her office.  Can I prorate this?)

2. Being in an r/s with a pwBPD involves a very specific but common set of experiences for the non.  When I describe these experiences -- trauma bonding, mirroring, splitting, triangulation, FOG, etc. -- she seems to be reacting like she's the student and I'm the one giving the class!  At 90 ducats an hour, this doesn't feel good. :'( (Those tears are for the Benjamin's tumbling out of my pocket and into hers as she seems to be using me as a one man, fully paid extension course.)

3.  Before my 2nd session, I sent her a half page e-mail describing the overall experience and effects of being in a BPD r/s in layman's terms and she never read it.  Again, at 90 bucks an hour this doesn't instill confidence on my part.

4. I'm pro-active with my recovery and am starting to feel like I'm learning more on my own.  See #3.

So my questions for all of you are:

1. I don't want to make a rash decision but I want to be comfortable with my choice.  How many sessions did it take for any of you to feel like it was a good fit for your recovery?

2.  As a 'non', how important was it for you to see a T who specialized or at least had hands-on experience with treating BPD?  And was level of education -- masters versus doctorate -- a consideration?

3.  How proactive was your T with tools such as book recommendations, using different modalities, take-home exercises, etc?  As an example, my uBPD ex's T (who practiced art therapy and who my ex initially went to for her kids) had the ex painting masks, taking home printed exercises for emotional regulation and other things.   So far the only thing I've received from my T is my signed disclosure.  (Note to mods:  we need a 'spittin' bullets' emoticon).

Thanks to everyone and thank God for the NBA playoffs this weekend otherwise I could easily go nuts.  

[Sunny Side]

Hi all, I initially thought about putting this on the "Taking Personal Inventory" board but would like to hear experiences with any of you who started therapy after their r/s with their pwBPD ended.

Off the top, my two primary goals entering therapy (and that I expressed in consultations) were:

1.  To discuss my depression, explore and reevaluate stalled goals in my life and generally an emerging pattern in the last few years of taking on and burying trauma -- personal, family & career related -- issues of codependency and generally becoming 'stuck' in many aspects of my recent life.

2.   Related to #1, to discuss the postmortem of my BPD r/s and to determine why entering and participating in the creation of that bond was so powerful.  Through my own introspection, reading, journaling and this outstanding support community, I've picked up a tremendous amount of knowledge about the who's, what the hell's and whosamawhatsits of how I entered into a relationship that my rational mind knew was doomed, why I held on for 14 months and why the fantasy bond was so powerful.  It's been enlightening and fascinating on many levels, even more fascinating if it hadn't been me whose psyche was starting to resemble a twice fried mocha frappuccino.

My fourth session was this week.  The first three sessions were spent going over much of the detail of the BPD r/s and some personal background about myself.   I'm doing a timeline for her, we've just began to talk about FOO and next week she wants to do some light therapy (heliotherapy).  She is an LCSW with a degree from a prominent university in and her training is in psychodynamics.  :)uring the consultation I requested a familiarity with BPD as fundamental.

My concerns:

1. I'm doing all the damn talking!  On her end it seems a lot of head-nodding with some pop psychology summations thrown during the last 2 minutes as I struggle to figure what I've paid for for those 48.675 minutes (yes it takes about 1.325 minutes to get from the lobby to her office.  Can I prorate this?)

2. Being in an r/s with a pwBPD involves a very specific but common set of experiences for the non.  When I describe these experiences -- trauma bonding, mirroring, splitting, triangulation, FOG, etc. -- she seems to be reacting like she's the student and I'm the one giving the class!  At 90 ducats an hour, this doesn't feel good. :'( (Those tears are for the Benjamin's tumbling out of my pocket and into hers as she seems to be using me as a one man, fully paid extension course.)

3.  Before my 2nd session, I sent her a half page e-mail describing the overall experience and effects of being in a BPD r/s in layman's terms and she never read it.  Again, at 90 bucks an hour this doesn't instill confidence on my part.

4. I'm pro-active with my recovery and am starting to feel like I'm learning more on my own.  See #3.

So my questions for all of you are:

1. I don't want to make a rash decision but I want to be comfortable with my choice.  How many sessions did it take for any of you to feel like it was a good fit for your recovery?

2.  As a 'non', how important was it for you to see a T who specialized or at least had hands-on experience with treating BPD?  And was level of education -- masters versus doctorate -- a consideration?

3.  How proactive was your T with tools such as book recommendations, using different modalities, take-home exercises, etc?  As an example, my uBPD ex's T (who practiced art therapy and who my ex initially went to for her kids) had the ex painting masks, taking home printed exercises for emotional regulation and other things.   So far the only thing I've received from my T is my signed disclosure.  (Note to mods:  we need a 'spittin' bullets' emoticon).

Thanks to everyone and thank God for the NBA playoffs this weekend otherwise I could easily go nuts.  

[BuildingFromScratch]

Okay. I'm not going to respond to your points specifically. But I'm going to give my two cents. First thing first... . if you feel like you're not getting help and like the counselor just doesn't care or doesn't know enough switch. I may do this soon myself, but I'm going to try a bit more with this one.

Second, you seem to be intellectualizing things a lot. I do the exact same thing myself, a ton! I can explain the human condition very well, the BPD condition very well, I've researched them both obsessively for like a year or two. And I do feel like no one understands really.

But counseling is generally about you dumping your feelings on someone, it validates them, gets them out and allows healing.  Finding the right person and the courage and patience to do this is what will help you. Psychoanalyzing isn't going to help you much.

This is just my opinion as a crazy and intelligent person. You seem intelligent too and may have similar issues. Good luck! Hope I helped.

[Skip]

Have you considered CBT?

Behavior therapy, in general, are very hands on and instructional.  It's all about making lifestyle changes to change nonconstructive thought patterns.

You do part of it in a group, which is the most structured, and part of it in one on one which is talk therapy where you the break down the struggles (understand them) and then discuss how to alter your lifestyle or thinking.

CBT is the state-of-the-art for depression treatment.

Lastly, in all therapy, I think it helps to set the style of what you want.  Some people just want to be heard and validated.  Others want feedback. If you want feedback, stop 3-5 times in a session and ask the T what he/she thinks about your thoughts.  Ask them questions.

3.  Before my 2nd session, I sent her a half page e-mail describing the overall experience and effects of being in a BPD r/s in layman's terms and she never read it.  Again, at 90 bucks an hour this doesn't instill confidence on my part.

Most won't.  If you really want to discuss the email, offer to pay her to read it before the session.

2. Being in an r/s with a pwBPD involves a very specific but common set of experiences for the non.  When I describe these experiences -- trauma bonding, mirroring, splitting, triangulation, FOG, etc. -- she seems to be reacting like she's the student and I'm the one giving the class!  

I'd generally suggest getting away from the jargon.   Some of us, especially early in the healing process, can misunderstand/misuse some of the terms and it is very confusing to the therapist.  For example, in terms of classic family system theory, the term triangulation in the paragraph below may be more confusing than clarifying.  "Triangulated as a surrogate son" is not a conventional use of the term - I'm not sure any therapist would lock onto this.

Also, I was close friends with my uBPDex's MIL long for several years prior to my r/s with uBPDex.  The MIL was aware that there were problems in her son's marriage and in some ways (I now realize) I allowed myself to be triangulated as a surrogate son (for MIL) and replacement husband/father (for BPD ex and kids) in her son's family.  Quite complicated but in hindsight much clearer now.  I always felt guilty not be able to reveal to her that I became engaged in a r/s with her DIL and that DIL and her son were on the road to separation.  I spoke to my T about this yesterday and I'm still deciding whether and what I want to share with MIL now about our r/s, if at all.  It feels dishonorable to me not to disclose and be accountable what my role was but I'm still processing that I think.

Develop your healing plan with the therapist - don't develop it here and take it to the therapist.  bpdfamily is an adjunct and support to therapy - not the other way around.

Lastly, a BA social worker has far less training that a PhD psychologist.  BPD is more in the "psychologist" realm.  A social worker is not likely to have experience in this area unless they worked in a specialized practice.

[1KitKat]

I wasn't split from my ex when we started therapy together, we were still together and he had asked for couples therapy as a means to repairing our relationship.  So... .   we started with a clinical psychologist (I believe he had his Master's degree).  Similar to your situation, my husband was not doing the 'work' and would not talk during any sessions; he'd simply nod his head, or if somebody put words in his mouth, he'd say 'possibly' or 'maybe' or 'hmmm... .   yes I should think about that'.  It went on until I abandoned couples therapy and found another therapist for myself.  I just was NOT feeling comfortable with the treatment we were getting from the first therapist.

My new therapist is a dream.  She is part of a group of therapists who use 'body-centered' psychology; in other words it is not just about the mind but how one's thoughts and emotions show up, or manifest, in our bodies.  She has done me a world of good; since then, my ex has abandoned the first therapist as well and now consults her.  Sometimes we go together, but not often.  She speaks her mind (it took her about thirty minutes into the first session to say to me what the first guy had taken MONTHS to say).  I appreciate feedback.

As BuildingFromScratch wrote, if your current T is not doing it for you, leave and try to find someone else.  It worked for me.  I also read everything that I can get my hands on relative to this and other psych illnesses because I too approach things from an intellectual perspective.  This has sometimes helped me, and at other times completely hamstrung me.  I guess, for me, there is such a thing as TOO much thinking and evaluating.  And I will say, my current T is reluctant to label my husband as ANYTHING... .   BPD, NPD or anything.  She knows he's ill, and she may be holding back from a diagnosis because, in a lot of cases, it just gives the pwBPD or whatever an excuse to continue with the behaviour... .   with an excuse now!  She's quite bright, and she is just brilliant for me! 

I hope this helps shed some light.

[Sunny Side]

KitKat, Skip and BFS, thanks so much for your feedback!