untreadedDBPDgf has become more physically abusive, is this common?

[WhatJustHappened]

I've done some 'research' aka googling  and saw that it IS common for those with BPD to be physically violent.

I really just want to know if there is anyone else here who is going through the same thing.  I 've been cut off from all of my friends, i'm not allowed on facebook, she swipes my cell phone to spy and see who i've talked to or emailed. etc. I have no one to confide in other than this message board( because she doesn't know about it and I only access it at work).

Thanks in advance!

[PLEASE - NO RUN MESSAGES]

PLEASE - NO RUN MESSAGES This is a high level discussion board for solving ongoing, day-to-day relationship conflicts. Members may appear frustrated but they are here for constructive solutions to problems. This is not a place for relationship "stay" or "leave" discussions. Please read the specific guidelines for this group.

[zeromoogle]

I'm ashamed to say that not only have I dealt with physical violence, but have taken part in it.  I'm bigger than him, too, so I feel really bad about it.  I can control myself, now, even when he has shoved me, but he won't hesitate to throw it in my face when he finds that nothing else is triggering a negative reaction.  It has reduced me to tears a number of times.

[tired-of-it-all]

Don't tolerate anyone's physical abuse.  Don't.  This will escalate.  You will find yourself either in the hospital or in jail.  This is no way to live.  Also, don't tolerate the invasion of privacy.  Stop it now.  Your phone is none of her business.

A partner that will beat you will lie about you.  They will lie to the police and you will go to jail for something you didn't do.  Either that or you will go to jail for something that you did that you didn't mean to do.  Domestic violence laws are not to be trifled with. 

This is an easy boundary to set.  Make a report to the police now.  If it happens again, call 911. 

I have traveled these roads.  It will only get worse.

[WhatJustHappened]

Thanks all, this morning she told me, 'if you keep acting like i'm going to hit you then one day i'll probably snap and know the f*** out of you!' so it would be 'my fault' if she hit me. I know it's b.s.

Also, I reminded her about the bruises on my arm (she grabbed me when she was drunk) and she didn't remember it. that THAT isn't abuse because she didn't slap or hit me. 

I wish I could record all of her threats  I tried adding a recording app on my phone but you can't really hit the button when you need to.

I tried to talk to her about her BPD last night, she told me 'You're not allowed to look up ANY MORE BPD info'

She screamed at me and told me that the the 'LAST TIME, I'M NOT TAKING PROZAC!' the other 2 meds she said she took made her sick and she can't work if she's throwing up from meds'  there is ALWAYS an excuse.  She also won't talk to a therapist about it.

So is it possible to be in a relationship with a BPD person who refuses treatment and blames all problems on you, and actually be happy or 'healthy'?

[Kwamina]

Hi again WhatJustHappened,

I’m sorry that you’re still dealing with threats of physical violence. Have you had time to check out the information on here about domestic violence?

So is it possible to be in a relationship with a BPD person who refuses treatment and blames all problems on you, and actually be happy or 'healthy'?

Being happy and healthy in relationship with a BPD person who behaves like this is very difficult. I believe the senior members on this message board can attest to that. The problem is that you can’t change someone with BPD if they don’t want to. What you can do is work on yourself and try to change your own behavior and in doing so also change the dynamics of the whole relationship with your partner. The information to the right of this message board about what it takes to be in a relationship with a borderline can be helpful. But when you don’t feel safe it’s nearly impossible to really feel happy or healthy and the (threats) of physical violence you’re confronted with really worry me. She’s been violent to you before so unfortunately you already know that it ain’t just words with her. I know you love her, you’ve said so in your earlier posts. Do you feel like she loves you too and/or that she’s really capable of loving someone else?

[WhatJustHappened]

What you can do is work on yourself and try to change your own behavior and in doing so also change the dynamics of the whole relationship with your partner. Do you feel like she loves you too and/or that she’s really capable of loving someone else?

THAT IS EXACTLY what i'm trying to do. to change how I behave so that I won't 'set her off' or contribute to the madness.

I do think she loves me, she just can't get out of her head long enough to show it.  She's completely immersed in the BPD and the ME ME ME. Why can't you just love me? DRAMATICS. 

Thanks for the info! I'll definitely look up what I can do to calm this monster down. monster=BPD not her.

[maxen]

hi WhatJustHappened.  i'm really sorry to read about your situation. far be it from me to judge the quality of others' relationships  - any fool could have told me that mine was a dead letter, but i stayed in it - but to be frank, you're being abused in every way. she's been physically violent, verbally violent, and has explicit rejected the concept of personal responsibility. i'll go farther and say that it isn't possible for a person with untreated BPD to love on any mature definition of that word. my wife treated my like an emotional punching bag, lied to me, blamed me for her own decisions, and put me in physical and fiscal danger, while declaring sometimes through tears how much she loved me. it didn't compute. she needed me, but that's not love.

as Kwamina said, do read the material there on the right hand side, but go in with your eyes open. what happiness are you getting out of the relationship?

[tired-of-it-all]

You can't change your behavior so that you don't "set her off".  You can only change your behavior so that you don't get sucked into her game and manipulated by her.  If you let her bad behavior dictate what you do, she will constantly change the game on you.  Once you think you know the ground rules, she will snatch the rug from under you feet.  You have to change the way you think.  You have to detach from her manipulation.  With someone who abuses you on this level, I don't hold out a lot of hope for the situation.

It is worth considering that she may in fact not love you.  She may only love what you can do for her.  Or she may just hate not having you which is nothing like real love.

[Love Is Not Enough]

So is it possible to be in a relationship with a BPD person who refuses treatment and blames all problems on you, and actually be happy or 'healthy'?

It is extremely difficult. Especially when you add in drug and alcohol problems. You must protect yourself. Set a firm boundary and leave when attacked. Only return if she agrees to treatment. This is what I did after my gf attacked me and she has been improving with DBT. She was also ready for it and WANTED to get better. She also did not want to lose me, so I guess that was part of her motivation. You are in a bad spot right now and you should think about a therapeutic separation so you can have some space to be able to think straight. There is a lot of abuse going on right now in your rs and the FOG is thick.

[Kwamina]

Hi WhatJustHappened

What you can do is work on yourself and try to change your own behavior and in doing so also change the dynamics of the whole relationship with your partner. Do you feel like she loves you too and/or that she’s really capable of loving someone else?

THAT IS EXACTLY what i'm trying to do. to change how I behave so that I won't 'set her off' or contribute to the madness.

Very good that you're trying to work on yourself! I see from all your posts too that you are doing your best to find a solution for this difficult situation you're in. I totally get that you are trying to find ways not to set her off so everything can be drama free. However, I would suggest you put the focus a bit more on protecting your own well-being instead of not setting her off because I don't believe that you are the problem here. By working on yourself I'm also thinking about setting and enforcing boundaries with your partner to protect yourself from any further emotional and physical harm. Boundaries aren't primarily aimed at not setting the other off but are aimed at how to protect yourself from others, when they misbehave. When you look at boundaries like this they can empower you because no matter how the other person behaves your boundaries are clear. Otherwise all your efforts are indirectly still completely focused on your partner and her emotional needs and not on yours. What do you think of this suggestion?

[Grey Kitty]

THAT IS EXACTLY what i'm trying to do. to change how I behave so that I won't 'set her off' or contribute to the madness.

I gotta say... . it is impossible for you to change whether you "set her off" or not. The only one who can control that is her.

If you walk on eggshells trying to "not set her off" nothing good will come of it... . believe me, we've all tried!

All you can do is choose to step out when she is dysregulated. Definitely leave (at least temporarily) if she becomes physically abusive. This will protect you from both abuse and false accusations of abuse.

It is better to enforce a boundary of leaving when she first becomes abusive, even if it is only verbally abusive. That way you get out before it escalates to physical abuse.

Read this for your own safety... . and the safety first link too:

TOOLS: Domestic Violence Against Women

You *might* also benefit from scanning this too. Many of the legal and cultural assumptions about abuse are that men beat women, and this is clearly not your situation. I doubt you are as vulnerable to false accusations of DV as a man would be from a woman... . you still might learn something helpful to you here.

TOOLS: Domestic Violence Against Men

[thebadseed]

I am being physically abused regularly. Emotionally and psychologically everyday with temper tantrums and threats. I've been cut off from friends, accused of everything one can think of, projected onto, gaslighted.  Trying not to set them off, sets them off. And whatever else happens, don't worry, its always my fault. I have had my religion thrown at me, my ancestry, my sexuality and any tiny little thing that she can remember to cause any pain at all, she'll do it. Right now, her things is that I no longer get any holidays celebrated, becasue I dont deserve them, because of the way I treat her.

Run far far away and never look back. These people are poison.

[WhatJustHappened]

THANKS ALL! sorry for the delay, i've been out of state.

her attitude was pleasant while we were away but only if other people were around, once those people left it was back to the pissy grouchy way. 

She's told me her BPD has NOTHING to do with why we have issues... (ha ha haa ahahhhaa) but yet she tells her newly found family member she has it. (after telling me she doesn't).  oh hi dr jeckle, is that mr hide behind you?

I know if I ask her about why she told the family member she'll make up a lie or just start yelling and gas lighting me, her personal favorite  modus operandi it seems. le sigh!

[AlmostBroken]

My undiagnosed  BPD fiancé also searches through my mobile devices to see who I've been contacting. She's snatched it away forcefully numerous times and she gone into violent physical rages that resulted in me being cut. I don't even remember how many shirts of mine that she's ripped off. I know exactly what you're going through. Please review my previous posts to get a glimpse of my situation. I totally feel for you. Hang in there.

[Grey Kitty]

She's told me her BPD has NOTHING to do with why we have issues... (ha ha haa ahahhhaa)

Yeah, we all know better. I think you know better too--that is you know better than to challenge her on this--If you do, it will certainly provoke bad behavior on her part... . and I can't imagine any good outcome at all.

Better to focus on her behavior, and protecting yourself from it with boundary enforcement as needed... . that and trying to validate her feelings. (which are real, no matter how bizarre the conclusions she jumps to from them are!)

[ydrys017]

The physical abuse happened once to me from my uBPDw, about 5 weeks ago, it is documented by our T's - but a police incident report is also necessary?

I was stunned when it happened, absolutely stunned... .   my instinct was to drop and take it, but my T has said so many times to 'go' that as I was going down I recalled 'go' and saw an open bathroom door and ran in, locking it behind me while she was trying to get in... .   I was a wreck, this from answering her questions with calmness, honesty, and specificity - but she heard something entirely different, and lost it.  She didn't calm down until sometime the next day, offered a 1 sentence apology and then launched into a 20 minute monologue about my faults and shortcomings.  We haven't really spoken since, not even during a couples session with a T. 

I thought I was the only one who received physical abuse on top of the verbal abuse, exhausting... .  

What to do?

[Ceruleanblue]

Yeah, my uBPDh has gotten physically aggressive a few times towards me. Once he grabbed my by my robe collar from behind and flung me across the room, and I fell. That was the first incident ever. There have been incidences since. I tell myself, that he isn't hitting me, or really hurting me, and I guess it's somewhat easier to not excuse, but make allowance because I know he has something going on that needs diagnosed and treated. If he ever steps it up, and hits me, I'm gone. I've never heard of him doing that though, and he was married for 24 years before, and trust me, I'd have heard it.

I've never researched how much physical violence is a part of BPD, but I'd always figured it was. I mean they have such a lack of boundaries and self control, and self soothing. They strike out, and feel justified.

I want to stay in my relationship, and for him to get help, just as I'm getting help for my anxiety, but I will not stay if he hurts me physically. Luckily, that has really stopped. I think walking away is one way I can lessen the chance of it happening. He tends to cool off if I just leave him alone.

[Grey Kitty]

ydrys017 & Ceruleanblue,

Physical abuse is ABSOLUTELY NOT OK. Don't make excuses for the abuser about how it could be worse. Because it probably will get worse next time if you don't draw a line. Don't make excuses or allowances.

Even physically blocking the door to keep you from leaving a verbally/emotionally abusive situation is over the line.

Please read the link here appropriate for your gender, right away.

TOOLS: Domestic Violence Against Women

TOOLS: Domestic Violence Against Men

ydrys017, I don't think you have to file a police incident report. Probably depends on circumstances. Has she (since) acknowledged that physical abuse is not acceptable, and stated that she won't do it again?

Ceruleanblue, I agree with you that leaving early is a good idea. I'd recommend you do it earlier--A conversation is fine. It can even turn into an argument. When it becomes raging at you,  yelling at you, or berating you without a raised voice... . it is time to leave the conversation. Long before it becomes physical abuse.

[LifeIsBeautiful]

Hi, I put up with the violence from my uBPDw and at some point I was even telling myself it was justified.

It's simply not acceptable, and finally I told her to stop and walked out when she didn't. I felt "better" the next day because I couldn't stop her without getting physical, but I took action and helped myself. It happened a few more times till she got the message, and so far it has not happened again. Basically the message is to tell her you will not put up with being abused, just like any other person would do.

I've done some 'research' aka googling   and saw that it IS common for those with BPD to be physically violent.

I really just want to know if there is anyone else here who is going through the same thing.  I 've been cut off from all of my friends, i'm not allowed on facebook, she swipes my cell phone to spy and see who i've talked to or emailed. etc. I have no one to confide in other than this message board( because she doesn't know about it and I only access it at work).

Thanks in advance!

[WhatJustHappened]

. Basically the message is to tell her you will not put up with being abused, just like any other person would do.

[/quote]
OK, BUT she says she doesn't abuse me. refuses to believe it or admit it.  she's so controling, i have a traumatic brain injury i'm still recovering from and she tells me when i can go to bed and that sleep debt is bs and if i go to bed earlier it won't help, that i'm just being lazy.  fsm, i'm so tired... . zzzzzzzzzzz.

[Grey Kitty]

OK, BUT she says she doesn't abuse me. refuses to believe it or admit it.  she's so controling, i have a traumatic brain injury i'm still recovering from and she tells me when i can go to bed and that sleep debt is bs and if i go to bed earlier it won't help, that i'm just being lazy.  fsm, i'm so tired... . zzzzzzzzzzz.

Don't argue about whether it is abuse or not. Simply stand up and say that you won't put up with it, then do something to protect yourself.

I'm assuming you live together... . if not, things are even easier than this:

If you need sleep, tell her you are going to bed and then do so.

If she is doing things in the bedroom that keep you awake, move to someplace else in the house where she isn't, like a couch or guest bed.

If she follows you around the house, get in your car and go someplace else where you can sleep in peace. If you can, pre-arrange with a friend or family member that you may need a peaceful place to sleep on short notice. Or go to a motel. Some people have slept in their cars.

Here is the important thing: You do NOT have to convince her that she is wrong and you are right regarding sleep deficits, abuse, or whatever. That is a losing argument.

All you need to do is show her by your actions that you will protect your sleep. She will probably start by making a fuss [understatement!] about it, however if you are consistent she will figure it out, and likely stop trying eventually.

[WhatJustHappened]

yes, we live together, and no she doesn't do anything in the bedroom to keep me up she just tells me i can't go to sleep.  she's dragged me out of bed before (albeit she was drunk at the time).  i'm afraid if i leave she'll destroy the house or make my life a living hell when i come back.  she soo dramatic i know it would be an all day fight which would just further drain my energy. lose/lose 

i really think if she'd take her meds we'd be so much better off.  she got them filled. that's as far as it went.  months ago...

[Grey Kitty]

yes, we live together, and no she doesn't do anything in the bedroom to keep me up she just tells me i can't go to sleep.

Good, so if it is time for you to go to bed, you can just do it. Nothing more complicated than that.

i'm afraid if i leave she'll destroy the house or make my life a living hell when i come back.  she soo dramatic i know it would be an all day fight which would just further drain my energy

OK, I get that she might destroy the house. Your choice whether it is better to risk that or to stay for the fight and/or abuse.

However, the "all day fight" concept is straightforward to handle with boundaries:

If a discussion/disagreement/whatever turns into a fight, i.e. you are being raged at, belittled, berated, and anything you say is either ignored or turned upside down and thrown back at you... . that is time to disengage.

State clearly that you won't participate in this sort of fight. (Use whatever description of it works)

If she goes back to it, leave the room.

If you are followed, you can leave the house.

The fear of abandonment is triggering for a pwBPD. As a helpful bonus, you might say "I'll be back in (20 minutes, 2 hours, whatever you plan on))" Don't use words like "soon" or "later" because they are ambiguous. Then return on schedule. You are showing her that you will honor your word in this.

*IF* she launches right into you when you return, say that you are going to leave again. I'd recommend a longer time period this time. (You didn't say you would be back to take a ration of abuse, just that you would come back!)

This works well in several ways--YOU are upset by this sort of fight--it better to go away for a long walk or to the gym and stew on it than to listen to more of that crap. In addition, when you are worked up, you will probably try to defend yourself from wacko accusations, most likely in ways that are invalidating and wind her up more. You both have some time for the adrenalin to leave your systems. (For this reason, I wouldn't do less than ~20 minutes)

Note--this is not a refusal to talk about a serious issue that is bothering her--just a refusal to be an emotional punching bag until she runs out of steam.

I've done it. It really worked for me! (My wife hated it at the time but as she has recovered, recognizes that it really forced her to find better ways of coping with stuff. She's admitted that her first reaction when I wasn't there to throw all her negative feelings at, she was alone and started throwing them at herself... . tough for her. Eventually she thought better of that too.)

i really think if she'd take her meds we'd be so much better off.

Perhaps it would. Not sure how much BPD responds to meds. Your best bet is to let go of the things you cannot control. Whether she takes meds is her choice, not yours.

[blondie34]

From what I have experienced with my BPDgf, the physical violence will only get worse over time. It started off as a shove, to a slap to punching and the most recent incident A LOT of hitting and hands around my neck.

For my gf, she will only come down off her tip and calm down after physical marks have been left on my body and she's registers what she has just done.

She will apologize. She will justify her violence in her own mind and tell me it was my behaviour that caused her to be physical towards me while acknowledging being physical towards me is wrong and that she should not lose her control. Personally, I do think they feel remorse for their actions afterwards.

[kfifd196]

Yes, it is common and I'm going to give you a piece of advice... . Don't ignore it!

My wife went into rages, triggered by the sight of other women, whether it be Jessica Simpson on TV, The Bachelor TV Show or a friend\co-worker sending swimsuit girl pix around.  She did $1000 damage to my house in a rage, RIPPING the dishwasher out of the granite counter top, screws, wires and all, broke dishes, ripped up EVERY love note, card, etc I'd given her and threw it on the bed, wrote on sentimental objects\gifts I'd given to her, then ran back home to her parents, only to come back again days later, as if nothing happened.  I SHOULD HAVE PRESSED CHARGES, BUT I REFUSED TO BECAUSE I LOVED HER... . I didn't know about BPD then.

Since then, she's thrown hot tea on me, assaulted me with a ladle while stirring hot soup (luckily she wasn't chopping onions or it would've been a knife), threw red gatorade around the house, and more!  It culminated with a recent rage in Feb, where she BIT ME, then told her parents I restrained her!  I have countless emails from her admitting all of this and apologizing!  Her parents even told me in the past they suspected she should be on meds, but regardless, I NEVER PRESSED CHARGES... . NOW, I AM THE ONE WHO IS SUFFERING!  She filed a false restraining order against ME and devalued me to everyone she knows!  She filed for divorce and is treating me like the anti-Christ!  She is trying to destroy me and has said it!  If you had read her wedding vows 8 months before or seen how she wrote a list of 365 Reasons why she loves me, you would never believe this is the same woman!  It's like Jekyll & Hyde!

MY ADVICE... . DO NOT HESITATE TO DOCUMENT THE ABUSE WITH A POLICE REPORT!  No one wants to call on their own spouse, for fear the spouse will be furious and divorce them, but fact is they will do it anyway and you will have NO protection.  If you want to help them, the police report may be the only way to prove she's BPD or needs help.  Otherwise it's your word agains hers and they are GOOD liars!  Mine had 3 therapists and her family & friends convinced I AM THE PROBLEM, but they didn't live in our house and see the verbal & physical abuse she put me through.  I still love her and have a lot of documentation, but because of the false restraining order, I can't produce them to any one!  She actually had a clause written in there SPECIFICALLY for that, cause she doesn't want the truth known!

She also emailed my friends at times and attempted to destroy my friendships and isolate\control me.  When she bit me last time, I think she realized she'd finally gone to far and knew next time, she'd do worse or I would call the cops, but of course it's NEVER her fault, so to spin it on me, she lied to everyone and devalued me.  I am now up to my ears in legal debt, behind in bills and she continues to heave false accusations and threaten more restraining orders on me.  I DID NOTHING WRONG and 4 months since she abandoned our marriage, she STILL harbors this HATRED!  My friends and family have witnessed a lot of it and know it's her, not me... . even some of her friends have said it's her, not me... . PROTECT YOURSELF!