overnights

[Before you can make things better, you have to stop making them worse...]

here are the facts from my poorly wrote up court order,

phase 1- march 1st 2014, Monday and Wednesday 3pm to 5pm, every Saturday and sunday 2pm to 6pm

phase 2- june 1st 2014, Monday and Wednesday 3pm to 5pm , every other weekend Saturday at 2pm to 6pm on sunday.

phase 3- January 1st 2015 every Wednesday 3pm to 5pm, every other weekend Friday at 6pm to sunday at 6pm.

ok so heres my problem, my ex is against overnights and is trying to stop them at all costs. I showed up last Saturday ( the 31st of may) I asked my ex for breastmilk and she said why, I said this weekend starts the overnights ,she said no its still may they don't start until june 1st ,I said that's 1 day away. I ended up not fighting with her over it and took my daughter for the 4hrs on Saturday and sunday for 4hrs. because I didn't get a overnight this weekend I was expecting to get this upcoming weekend then every other weekend would start. well my ex sent me a email trying to talk me out of overnights and to inform me that if I showed up this weekend to get my daughter my ex would file a harassment charge because this is her weekend and my weekend wouldn't be until fathers day weekend.

basicly what she is saying is that since I got my daughter this last weekend ( the 31st for 4 hrs and the 1st for 4hrs ) this upcoming weekend would be her weekend. my ex lawyer that wrote this plan up really screwed me, it should say may 31st the overnights start not the 1st. or it should say that they start the first weekend in june.

the judge set this up to get my daughter accustomed to my house and that's why it was every weekend then it was supposed to go right in to overnights. my ex is doing this to prolong moving to overnights,  I told my ex that I would show up this Saturday to get my daughter for the overnight and if she denies me I will file contempt of court on Monday.

I called my new lawyer and told him what was going on and he said I should do as I planned and show up for visitation and document it and if she refuses visitation to file with him on Monday.

also in the court order it says I get my daughter on fathers day at 9am to 6pm, I missed a day of visitation on mothers day so this was a chance to get that missed day back

I know this is very confusing but I would like to hear thoughts and opinions on this

[Eco]

here are the facts from my poorly wrote up court order,

phase 1- march 1st 2014, Monday and Wednesday 3pm to 5pm, every Saturday and sunday 2pm to 6pm

phase 2- june 1st 2014, Monday and Wednesday 3pm to 5pm , every other weekend Saturday at 2pm to 6pm on sunday.

phase 3- January 1st 2015 every Wednesday 3pm to 5pm, every other weekend Friday at 6pm to sunday at 6pm.

ok so heres my problem, my ex is against overnights and is trying to stop them at all costs. I showed up last Saturday ( the 31st of may) I asked my ex for breastmilk and she said why, I said this weekend starts the overnights ,she said no its still may they don't start until june 1st ,I said that's 1 day away. I ended up not fighting with her over it and took my daughter for the 4hrs on Saturday and sunday for 4hrs. because I didn't get a overnight this weekend I was expecting to get this upcoming weekend then every other weekend would start. well my ex sent me a email trying to talk me out of overnights and to inform me that if I showed up this weekend to get my daughter my ex would file a harassment charge because this is her weekend and my weekend wouldn't be until fathers day weekend.

basicly what she is saying is that since I got my daughter this last weekend ( the 31st for 4 hrs and the 1st for 4hrs ) this upcoming weekend would be her weekend. my ex lawyer that wrote this plan up really screwed me, it should say may 31st the overnights start not the 1st. or it should say that they start the first weekend in june.

the judge set this up to get my daughter accustomed to my house and that's why it was every weekend then it was supposed to go right in to overnights. my ex is doing this to prolong moving to overnights,  I told my ex that I would show up this Saturday to get my daughter for the overnight and if she denies me I will file contempt of court on Monday.

I called my new lawyer and told him what was going on and he said I should do as I planned and show up for visitation and document it and if she refuses visitation to file with him on Monday.

also in the court order it says I get my daughter on fathers day at 9am to 6pm, I missed a day of visitation on mothers day so this was a chance to get that missed day back

I know this is very confusing but I would like to hear thoughts and opinions on this

[whirlpoollife]

My opinion is she is going to use the breast feeding as a way to not give you overnights. And when it turns into a court order the breast feeding will stop. ( I'm for breast feeding but after a year , MHO it's not necessary)

It is good you are going in with some type of plan. But don't be nice about it. If you want to see your daughter more then go extreme with the time you want with her.  So ex will then have to compromise to which would hopefully be  the schedule you want in the first place. My  Npd/BPD h did that with my first L and he got what he wanted. 

I have older kids , it was three three day weekends plus two evening visits. Plus lengthy phone calls whenever he wanted.

The evening visits were a pain because we would wait he wouldn't show then he would make up time, he would call kids before and after.

So with new L ... . I had to compromise ... . that if I didn't like the evening visits then I had to give him him three extra  nights  in exchange.  Well with extra nights for him meant he has less c/s to pay

The more overnights she has the more c/s you will pay out , maybe different in your county.

[ForeverDad]

Follow the court order.  With the ambiguity of the past weekend over - ex-lawyer didn't bother to look at a calendar? - the rest should be crystal clear.If she objects, cite the order.  Always carry it with you in case the police get involved and they ask to see it.  (Make multiple copies so one is always in the car, one always at work, one always at home, one always with you, etc.)  Realize that the police likely won't enforce the order, they'll ask her to obey it but that's likely all they will do.  In my case the police said they'd write a brief report for my documentation and told us both to fix it in court.

Be aware that if there is a confrontation or 'incident' of some sort and she makes an allegation, substantiated or not, you may get carted off to defuse the immediate incident, perhaps even arrested.  Be aware and try to avoid that.  I often had my recorder running at nearly all exchanges.  I got some choice curses, projection, blaming, twisted logic and more.  A couple even protected me.  You don't know when it might save your skin to prove you didn't do anything bad and weren't the one misbehaving, but if it happens you'll be thankful you had that 'insurance'.

I never told my ex I was recording, she suspected, sometimes she even said, go ahead.  Of course I didn't shove anything in her face, they were nearby or in my pocket, I was not trying to inflame our encounters and exchanges, I just wanted to document myself for self-protection.   (My state is a one party state so I had no legal concerns, but even if it was a two party state I would have done what I had to do to protect myself from false allegations.  As I've mentioned before here, very few have had any court consequences for recording and the worst that happened was that they were told to stop recording.  Besides, so many types of devices today record that I think they realize they can't stop it all, so generally they just limit how it can be used.)

Is there a way to have a friend nearby that can corroborate events in case you are accused, especially during encounters where the tensions are high?  For example, next Saturday is a likely time for her to flame out and either make allegations or try to frame mischief on you.  It's possible too that she will just refuse to allow the exchange.  She might even relent and do the exchange, stranger things have happened.  The point is to be prepared for anything.  The main thing is (1) don't be trapped, framed, buttons pushed or incited to misbehave and (2) don't 'agree' to let her obstruct the order.  If she obstructs, just document it and walk away and let lawyer and court deal with it Monday.

If she demands a return in a few hours, just ask for your child and then follow the ordered schedule.  Your time is your time, she can't set terms and conditions beyond what the order says.  Don't get into an argument over what it means or how it applies.  Don't even bother asking for breast milk.  If she provides it, fine, if not, that's fine too, it's her problem.

Many of my exchanges were at the local sheriff's offices.  Yes, ex tried to complain to the deputies on duty that I did this or that but the most they'd do is write up an incident report and otherwise ignore us.  I got to know many deputies by name and sight.  And they knew us.

[Waddams]

Some further suggestions on how to be proactive with this:

-One - I agree, follow the order as closely as you can.  Show up when the court order says to show up.  Period.

-Two - talk to the police in her jurisdiction ahead of time.  Show them the email where she is threatening you.  Explain what's going on and ask them for their advice, and even to accompany you to her residence for the pick up.  They might not, but ask anyway.  Tell them you don't expect them to enforce the order (they can't without a judge's order to them to act), but ask for an escort that can provide a report to document that she's withholding visitation per the order that you can later use in a contempt filing.

the police escort will also be ironclad protection against harassment charges.

-three - have your handy dandy recorder going.  if you have a smart phone - get a recording app, put it in your pocket with the mic up so it hears the sound better, or in a front shirt pocket, etc. 

-four - if possible, have a non-family 3rd party person go with you.  a friend, trusted co-worker, etc.  someone that will be willing to testify as a witness later if needed.

don't tell you child's mother anything except you intend to show up to pick up your child per the court orders.  and you intend to exercise overnight visitation per the court orders.  if she doesn't provide breast milk, you can get formula from the grocery store.

you can't make her follow the court orders.  you can document her non-compliance and take her back to court on contempt charges and ask for consequences to be levied.  so do what you can do - show up for visitation/pickup, document what happens, and go from there.