A true transanctional relationship

[Split black]

First... .thank god I sold my biz and home and buildings and Im moving thousands of miles south to the sunshine and new opportunities... .  with the added benefit of distancing myself from a relationship recycling pattern that is destroying me.

As an older guy falling for very pretty younger borderline disordered girl... .I was doomed from the start. I really didnt feel much in the beginning.  But... .as we know they can do, she had other ideas, and that part of me that loved the way she idealized and seduced was just too intoxicating. Narcissistic on my part... .no doubt.

All the lying, cheating, devaluing, manipulating, blackmailing, just wasn't enough to make me quit if she reached out and needed something... .which led to sex, which led to more sex and of course the ultimate sneaking lying and cheating. Over and over and over

She would tell me... .all you want me for is sex. Your not a friend... .oh, please can I have 500 hundred for rent, please can I have some new shoes,... .look... .mine are terrible... .please please give me give me give... .  oh... .all you want is sex. Just let it happen. Then when I would walk she would come back and sex bomb me just enough and then withdraw. ( With a parade of exes in tow)

Im leaving in 9 days... .I did mention it. She doesn't care... .then she said she had a relative in the city Im moving to in the south. She said, dont get your hopes up.  Yeah well... .I can not wait to get away from this persons ability to reach out to me.

Everything became an impersonal objectified transaction. Didn't matter how many times I tried to explain that making love to someone was a way to express your feelings for them. Doesn't matter that I truly do care for her and worry shes not going to make it... .she wont, she is an avid substance addict.  Nope. Shes not hearing any of that... .made it easy for her to hate me when she had no more use for me. No way to win this one... .yes, there were many fun times, just enough to keep the hook in deep. Of course the next day would bring relentless drama of some sort. As if the day before never happened.

Im exhausted.

[myself]

We kept them hooked, too. Or tried to.

We liked that they were latching onto us.

That we had somewhere to latch onto.

[Split black]

We kept them hooked, too. Or tried to.

We liked that they were latching onto us.

That we had somewhere to latch onto.

Yeah... .I guess... .totally not worth the stress in the long run. 8 days and Im on the road. Until them I feel like Im looking over my shoulder every minute.

And you cant keep them hooked IMHO. They have too many other backups. When they finish with you... .your banished until someone else pisses them off... .and they tip toe back with open legs.

[fromheeltoheal]

Hey Split-

Something that took me a while to accept, I didn't even connect with it at first, and when I did it was profound, and is now comforting: my ex was incapable of true emotional connection.  It's not that she didn't want to, it wasn't something about me, she was literally incapable, a byproduct of not developing beyond her traumatic upbringing.  And of course, when I was taking her devaluation at face value, believing it, along with the way I'm wired to begin with, I concluded it was me, something I was doing wrong; shtty place to be.  Very profound to learn and accept that she is incapable of human adult bonding, and sad too, but very relieving for me, it reframed the entire experience; the closer I tried to get, the more she'd push me away, the more she'd go on attack, she just wasn't having any of it, she didn't understand it and it scared her, and it also scared her that there was something there that she was aware of and couldn't do, it scared her that she might get more confirmation something was just not right with her.  Bummer.  She could have had all of me, if she could only give me all of her... .

[Split black]

Hey Split-

Something that took me a while to accept, I didn't even connect with it at first, and when I did it was profound, and is now comforting: my ex was incapable of true emotional connection.  It's not that she didn't want to, it wasn't something about me, she was literally incapable, a byproduct of not developing beyond her traumatic upbringing.  And of course, when I was taking her devaluation at face value, believing it, along with the way I'm wired to begin with, I concluded it was me, something I was doing wrong; shtty place to be.  Very profound to learn and accept that she is incapable of human adult bonding, and sad too, but very relieving for me, it reframed the entire experience; the closer I tried to get, the more she'd push me away, the more she'd go on attack, she just wasn't having any of it, she didn't understand it and it scared her, and it also scared her that there was something there that she was aware of and couldn't do, it scared her that she might get more confirmation something was just not right with her.  Bummer.  She could have had all of me, if she could only give me all of her... .

Yes, no doubt. Mine is quite aware that she is flawed emotionally. She also has a lot of other co-morbid qualities... .  malignant narcissism, anxiety disorder, and several addictions... .booze, pain killers, coke and weed being the less extreme.  One of her long time exes is also a AA guy and believed, i guess that a condition for her to be with him was to go and stay in meetings... .including Al-Anon... .which really isnt relevant in her case IMHO.

Now that Im somewhat detached and can look at this more objectively... .she absolutely can not sustain intimacy or an emotional relationship. She is aware of her patterns but draws the line at the long term therapy it would require to change.

She will continue to live double and triple lives because... .well... .she can. She will always have some white knight enabler to objectify and use. She just didnt know quite what to do about me... .  Im a projection target for her. I always call her on her shtt... .I dont walk on eggshells and as a result Im banished a lot... .until she needs money for whatever... .rent, drugs, etc etc. 

She always has an excuse as to why everything is all my fault... .and everyone else's.  Shes the eternal victim.

End of the week... .shes going to have to find a new sugar daddy if she has not already. It will take her about an hour. In the meantime shes trying to milk me for everything she can... .while trying withhold the one thing I care about with her anymore. 

My relationship became truly transactional... .and thats a shame because I do have love for this fractured, emotionally crippled young woman.

[BorisAcusio]

Hey Split-

Something that took me a while to accept, I didn't even connect with it at first, and when I did it was profound, and is now comforting: my ex was incapable of true emotional connection.  It's not that she didn't want to, it wasn't something about me, she was literally incapable, a byproduct of not developing beyond her traumatic upbringing.  And of course, when I was taking her devaluation at face value, believing it, along with the way I'm wired to begin with, I concluded it was me, something I was doing wrong; shtty place to be.  Very profound to learn and accept that she is incapable of human adult bonding, and sad too, but very relieving for me, it reframed the entire experience; the closer I tried to get, the more she'd push me away, the more she'd go on attack, she just wasn't having any of it, she didn't understand it and it scared her, and it also scared her that there was something there that she was aware of and couldn't do, it scared her that she might get more confirmation something was just not right with her.  Bummer.  She could have had all of me, if she could only give me all of her... .

Yes, no doubt. Mine is quite aware that she is flawed emotionally. She also has a lot of other co-morbid qualities... . malignant narcissism,

Just for the sake of the record, malignant narcissism is already a mix of several PDs, closely related to Type 1 and 2 psychopathy. As far as I know, there is no recorded comorbidity with BPD.  

[Split black]

Comorbidity of

Narcissistic Personality Disorder

With Other Axis II Disorders20


Axis II 

Disorder

   

Percentage 

of Co-Occurrence

Histrionic Personality Disorder    

53%

Borderline Personality Disorder    

47%

Paranoid Personality Disorder    

36%

Avoidant Personality Disorder    

36%

Passive-Aggressive Personality 

      Disorder    

28%

Antisocial Personality Disorder    

16%

Here is the link... .    www1.appstate.edu/~hillrw/Narcissism/comorbidity.html

Here is another link   www.samvak.tripod.com/faq82.html

She's got a lot going on inside her head... .  but Im not a PhD. in psychology... .  masters... yes. Shes undiagnosed as far as I know... .except for anxiety. She laughs about the many therapists shes been through, that her adopted parents made her go to. Her words were "they were easy to trick" Not for nothing its kind of irrelevant.

[woofhound]

Clever got me this far

Then tricky got me in

Eye on what i'm after

I don't need another friend

Smile and drop the cliche

'Till you think I'm listening

I take just what I came for

Then I'm out the door again

Peripheral on the package

Don't care to settle in

Time to feed the monster

I don't need another friend

Comfort is a mystery

Crawling out of my own skin

Just give me what I came for, then I'm out the door again

Lie to get what I came for

Lie to get just what I need

Lie to get what I crave

Lie and smile to get what's mine

Eye on what i'm after

I don't need another friend

Nod and watch your lips move

If you need me to pretend

Because clever got me this far

Then tricky got me in

I'll take just what I came for

Then I'm out the door again

Lie to get what I came for

Lie to get what I need now

Lie to get what I'm craving

Lie and smile to get what's mine

Give this to me

Mine, mine, mine

Take what's mine

Mine, mine, mine

Take what's mine

Mine, mine, mine

Lie to get what I came for

Lie to get what I need now

Lie to get what I'm craving

Lie to smile and get what's mine

Give this to me

Take what's mine

Mine, mine, mine

Take what's mine

Give this to me

Take what's mine, take what's mine, mine... .

Take what's mine, take what's mine, take what's mine,

This is mine, mine, mine [whispered]

"The Package" by A Perfect Circle

I had to post these lyrics. The song was written about people just like the one you're talking about. My ex also had these behaviors. You're not alone, man. This is a world wide phenomenon.

[BorisAcusio]

Comorbidity of

Narcissistic Personality Disorder

With Other Axis II Disorders20


Axis II  

Disorder

   

Percentage  

of Co-Occurrence

Histrionic Personality Disorder    

53%

Borderline Personality Disorder    

47%

Paranoid Personality Disorder    

36%

Avoidant Personality Disorder    

36%

Passive-Aggressive Personality  

     :)isorder    

28%

Antisocial Personality Disorder    

16%

Here is the link... .   www1.appstate.edu/~hillrw/Narcissism/comorbidity.html

Here is another link   www.samvak.tripod.com/faq82.html

She's got a lot going on inside her head... . but Im not a PhD. in psychology... . masters... yes. Shes undiagnosed as far as I know... .except for anxiety. She laughs about the many therapists shes been through, that her adopted parents made her go to. Her words were "they were easy to trick" Not for nothing its kind of irrelevant.

There are two dinstinct diagnostical dimensions within narcisissim. The vunerable one bears so much resemblance to BPD that it is argued whether it should be considered a separate condition or a subtype of Borderline Personality Disorder.

The malignant/grandiose type which you referred to and DSM criteria put much emphasis on is extremely rare, closely related to antisocial disorder. The whole NPD story was derived from the early limited clinical experience of the pioneers of the field. The empirical studies of the last 15 years made the whole structure crumble to a point where it was recently slated for deletion from the new version of DSM along with histrionics PD, which also score high on the co-morbidity scale.  

Back to your story. Narcissism is an integral part of BPD so I'm sure that your expereince is valid. Especially after following your ordeal for a while. A nutjob from the lower end of the spectrum.

These disorders or personality styles—Factor 1 and Factor 2 psychopathy, grandiose and vulnerable narcissism, BPD, and Machiavellianism—share a tendency toward self-centered, dishonest, and callous attitudes toward others, which often result in behaviors that fall on the externalizing continuum (e.g., Krueger, Markon, Patrick, Benning, & Kramer, 2007).

[fromheeltoheal]

I posted on another thread that my ex used to say "I can get anything I want with a blow job", and she honestly believed it.  It was actually good of her to put the terms of her attempted transaction out there, for us suitors to accept, until we didn't.  That was the narcissism speaking though; she honestly thought she was the most amazing woman in the universe and someone would be stupid to not accept that deal.  And then the other side eventually showed up, the one where she'd get balled up in a fetal position and wallow in shame.  I'm no shrink and I've only started using the labels since I got here, but way before I knew there was a term for it, the two sides were obvious since they couldn't have been more opposite each other.  I kept telling her reality is somewhere in the middle, and she should stay there and not flop back and forth.  Guess how that went... .

[Split black]

@Woolfound... .awesome... .on point.

Boris... .  She has split selves from week to week, day to day. One is a little girl that needs to be responsible ( her excuse for withholding sex and manipulating her wishes) But then in more vulnerable moments she will cry like that abandoned 3-4 year old... .tears are real... .uncontrollable, no ability to self soothe without drugs or the validity of her sexual prowess over men. She functions beautifully in the world... .and can hold down a job ( waitress, managing... .until she quits or is let go)... .  shes not stupid, actually went to college for a bit... .incredibly perceptive and intuitive. Then insanity shows up... .and her lack of object constancy, black and white thinking and recklessness compulsive behavior. If you witness her crying... .she loathes her self weakness and pushes you away so hard later you think you were hit by a tsunami.  ( Im out of here in less then a week thank god)

heal    Mine has said similar... .and she brags about never getting caught. ( She always gets caught) thats why no one can stay with her. She has an endless supply of exes and newbies. She truly is a tortured soul. I cant help her anymore.

[woofhound]

@Woolfound... .awesome... .on point.

Boris... .  She has split selves from week to week, day to day. One is a little girl that needs to be responsible ( her excuse for withholding sex and manipulating her wishes) But then in more vulnerable moments she will cry like that abandoned 3-4 year old... .tears are real... .uncontrollable, no ability to self soothe without drugs or the validity of her sexual prowess over men. She functions beautifully in the world... .and can hold down a job ( waitress, managing... .until she quits or is let go)... .  shes not stupid, actually went to college for a bit... .incredibly perceptive and intuitive. Then insanity shows up... .and her lack of object constancy, black and white thinking and recklessness compulsive behavior. If you witness her crying... .she loathes her self weakness and pushes you away so hard later you think you were hit by a tsunami.  ( Im out of here in less then a week thank god)

heal    Mine has said similar... .and she brags about never getting caught. ( She always gets caught) thats why no one can stay with her. She has an endless supply of exes and newbies. She truly is a tortured soul. I cant help her anymore.

I don't know if you are into music, but if you are and like rock, you should pull up that ablum (13th step by A Perfect Circle). Its all about addictions (drugs, behavioral, emotional) and it has helped in with coping to know here my emotions put beautifully by someone in the form of music. F'sho!

[Blimblam]

@Woolfound... .awesome... .on point.

Boris... .  She has split selves from week to week, day to day. One is a little girl that needs to be responsible ( her excuse for withholding sex and manipulating her wishes) But then in more vulnerable moments she will cry like that abandoned 3-4 year old... .tears are real... .uncontrollable, no ability to self soothe without drugs or the validity of her sexual prowess over men. She functions beautifully in the world... .and can hold down a job ( waitress, managing... .until she quits or is let go)... .  shes not stupid, actually went to college for a bit... .incredibly perceptive and intuitive. Then insanity shows up... .and her lack of object constancy, black and white thinking and recklessness compulsive behavior. If you witness her crying... .she loathes her self weakness and pushes you away so hard later you think you were hit by a tsunami.  ( Im out of here in less then a week thank god)

heal    Mine has said similar... .and she brags about never getting caught. ( She always gets caught) thats why no one can stay with her. She has an endless supply of exes and newbies. She truly is a tortured soul. I cant help her anymore.

I don't know if you are into music, but if you are and like rock, you should pull up that ablum (13th step by A Perfect Circle). Its all about addictions (drugs, behavioral, emotional) and it has helped in with coping to know here my emotions put beautifully by someone in the form of music. F'sho!

Yeah the singer Maynard James Keenan is also in another band called tool and I think most if his music is inspired by getting screwed over by a cluster b woman and healing from it. I think the music by the band. Tool is actually intended to be a therapeutic tool to heal from cluster b women and using it as a spiritual catalyst to discover the true self.

[woofhound]

@Woolfound... .awesome... .on point.

Boris... .  She has split selves from week to week, day to day. One is a little girl that needs to be responsible ( her excuse for withholding sex and manipulating her wishes) But then in more vulnerable moments she will cry like that abandoned 3-4 year old... .tears are real... .uncontrollable, no ability to self soothe without drugs or the validity of her sexual prowess over men. She functions beautifully in the world... .and can hold down a job ( waitress, managing... .until she quits or is let go)... .  shes not stupid, actually went to college for a bit... .incredibly perceptive and intuitive. Then insanity shows up... .and her lack of object constancy, black and white thinking and recklessness compulsive behavior. If you witness her crying... .she loathes her self weakness and pushes you away so hard later you think you were hit by a tsunami.  ( Im out of here in less then a week thank god)

heal    Mine has said similar... .and she brags about never getting caught. ( She always gets caught) thats why no one can stay with her. She has an endless supply of exes and newbies. She truly is a tortured soul. I cant help her anymore.

I don't know if you are into music, but if you are and like rock, you should pull up that ablum (13th step by A Perfect Circle). Its all about addictions (drugs, behavioral, emotional) and it has helped in with coping to know here my emotions put beautifully by someone in the form of music. F'sho!

Yeah the singer Maynard James Keenan is also in another band called tool and I think most if his music is inspired by getting screwed over by a cluster b woman and healing from it. I think the music by the band. Tool is actually intended to be a therapeutic tool to heal from cluster b women and using it as a spiritual catalyst to discover the true self.

I've thought this as well... .

Wear the grudge like a crown of negativity,

Calculate what you will or will not tolerate,

Desperate to control all and everything,

Unable to forgive, you scarlet letterman!

Ironically, tool was my exuBPD's favorite band. I think she saw in them the negative aspects of herself, and on many occasions, she literally used Tool songs to project and validate her false sense of importance as a "healer" type. A case of the blind leading the blind.

[Blimblam]

woofhound.

I will assume her favorite song was stinkfist?  Which is a song about borderline personality disorder from the perspective of a borderline.

Listen to both versions of Push it the aenema version and the saliva version.  Notice how much healing has occurred between both versions.  Push it is clearly about a relationship with a borderline.  lyrics like "rest your trigger upon my finger" and "your pushin and your shoving me back down". Songs like cold and ugly with lyrics like "underneath her skin and jewelry hidden in her words and eyes is a world of cold and ugly... .and shes scared as hell"  The song reflection is about the step we need to take in our healing to start to get out of the hell they put us in. yes listen to tool and read the lyrics this music was made to heal from this experience.  the music is about healing from trauma going inside oneself to face ones demons and reclaim the parts of oneself stuck from traumatic experinces and find the true self.

[Split black]

4 days... .shes pulling out all the stops... .spent the day with her. Got her a massage... .shes never had one. Bought her food. Then left. Came back later with a bottle of wine. She was high on weed already... .after a bit. She said I dont want to have sex with you. I just looked at her... .5 min later she said lets get it over with... .

Started heating up... .she got into it in a big way... .then she bit my lower lip so hard it started bleeding over everything... .didnt stop me... .but then I got upset. Went to the bathroom and it wouldn't 4 stop bleeding.

I was upset as hell ( mostly at myself until)... .she laughed. Then she said dont be a pussy... .then she looked at it and said oops. She got some ice. I put it on. Im basically so disgusted with myself and shes "oh well I got you". Now what are you going to say to people? "Lie your way out of this one". She did say she was sorry a few times. Yeah. sure.

She went to the bathroom and I left. She called 20 times saying we are done. Then saying you left, you had sex with me and left... .she didnt want me to stay over... .she could not have cared less.  She made that clear from the beginning... .and even though I explained I was on my way to a clinic to see if I needed stitches... .all that mattered was that I dared to leave... .not that she really did physically hurt me.

My lip looks like I got hit with a beer bottle. Was it worth it? ... .   4 more days... .shes gone silent. Let it be so. Most likely getting her back up in the wings. What wings. More like in line.