D16 is pregnant

[SeaSprite]

Yes Healingspirit, I had found a really good group skills class for her, and she got mad, said she didn't need a "program". Stopped taking her meds without telling me. His influence I believe. She says she's fine, even though she acknowledges she has issues with anxiety and depression (we've never talked about BPD in front of her, but her counselor was using dbt with her)

It does look like she tries harder to hold it together so that she doesn't get sent back to therapy, I just hate that she's decided therapy is bad. She used to say she got a lot out of it.

It did make me happy that she was sounding assertive enough to be mistaken for her mom. Even with the text shorthand that I don't ever use. 

I think we have the same daughter. Well, except for the pregnancy. I'm still half in denial sometimes. 

Our objective is to better understand the struggles our child faces and to learn the skills to improve our relationship and provide a supportive environment and also improve on our own emotional responses, attitudes and effectiveness as a family leaders

[MammaMia]

SeaWalker

I beg to differ... .this is not YOUR problem, it is HIS.  HE is responsible for dd's pregnancy.

Someone needs to confront him and let him know that if dd elects to keep the baby, he will be paying her medical bills and child support.  When possible, get a paternity test and be sure his name is on the birth certificate.  Once you can prove he is the father, you can prosecute.

If dd gives the child up or has an abortion, you may wish to consult an attorney about options.

If the bf refuses to help or walks away, being in the military will actually help you locate him.  If he does this, get a restraining order and prosecute for the other charges.

When you play with fire, you are going to get burned.  It is time for the bf to accept his share of the responsibility.  He is a grown man.

[.cup.car]

He replied that he couldn't believe how controlling I was, that no one in his family would put up with that, that his aunt thought I was bipolar for how I was acting. And so on. He's kind of nuts.

I don't wanna defend the guy, but my ex was your daughter's age when she fed me numerous fictional stories about her mom & dad that painted them out to be monsters. I had no choice but to go along with it; I didn't want to risk questioning her and leaving her family to deal with the inevitable outburst and self-harm afterwards.

It's entirely possible that on top of the challenges you're already facing, she's feeding him a totally different version of events that are taking place in your home - again a result of her disorder. Don't take it personally.

[Elbry]

Double check the guidelines on the age of consent is 16 thing.  I live in Maine, and the age of consent is 16 here, except if the age difference is greater than 5 years.  I had a pregnant 16 yr old as well, but the father of the baby escaped prosecution because he was only 21 and just fell in that 5 year range. 

So sorry to hear you are going through this.

[MammaMia]

www.aspe.hhs.gov/hsp/08/sr/statelaws/summary.shtml#Sexual


Elbry, you are correct.  Above is the link to current prosecuting guidelines as they relate to the age of the father by states.

I also wonder if BPD will contribute to SeaWalker's dd being considered "vulnerable" by law,

even if she meets the age requirement for sexual consent.

[HealingSpirit]

I think we have the same daughter. Well, except for the pregnancy. I'm still half in denial sometimes. 

  Mine has PCOS, which may make it harder for her to conceive someday. Even so, we will not let her go to the Midwest to see her BF unless she has Norplant.  She has an appt for that tomorrow. Yay. I don't want her following your DD's path. Yikes! I'm sure I'd be in denial too. The truth of such a life-changing event can only be processed in small segments. 

cup.car, MammaMia & Elbry,

You are presenting great information.  With everything there is to consider about this issue, it's making my head spin.  And it's not even my DD!  But it easily COULD be any of our DD's.

[.cup.car]

I live in Maine, and the age of consent is 16 here, except if the age difference is greater than 5 years. 

Same thing up here in Canuckistan.

The photos are illegal - not saying I didn't do that myself at that age (let's be real, all teens have smartphones and it happens), but the fact that he's 29 and his background is shady could sway things in your favor.

I'd say meet an officer after-hours (you can call and arrange an appointment with a night-shift officer at the station) and present everything like this:

>My daughter is 16 and involved with a 29 year old man with a military background (give his exact info)

>He does not have a job, lives in his mom's basement, and has a child with another woman (give info)

>He has possession of nude photos of my daughter, I am unsure when they were taken

>My daughter was diagnosed with BPD, a serious mental illness that greatly affects her decision making

>I'm afraid he's going to spread the photos of my daughter to damage her reputation

>I'm afraid he's used my daughter's mental illness to manipulate her for his own personal pleasure

>I'm unsure how to protect my daughter from this man, as her disorder causes her to swap between wanting to see him, and wanting to get away from him

Print out everything incriminating from Facebook/Skype (this won't be easy if you're not comfortable with computers). The more you have, the quicker the police will do something.

[SeaSprite]

In my state, the age of consent is 16, age difference does not matter.

I've told them both they don't want to see each other because they don't want him to go to jail (photos and alcohol plus whatever the military does.)  I am not going to pursue charges unless he tries coming around again, or she tries to see him.

If he's worried about the police, he'll delete his photos and stay away. If he comes around, then I will get the law enforcement involved.

I don't care about proving paternity as long as she isn't trying to keep the baby. That's a bridge we can cross later, if needed but I'm still hoping not. She seems pretty attached to the idea of adoption.

Saving the most recent Skype convo is a good idea, it shows his intent. If she hasn't deleted it I can grab some screen shots or something. I also have photos of them with the alcohol. The explicit photos are trickier, since they are just her, I deleted them off her phone etc. I didn't want them getting out anywhere.  It will depend what the phone records and/or his phone or computer show. If he has deleted them, and computer forensics can't find them, at least she is protected from anyone else seeing them.

[SeaSprite]

Oh no oh no oh no... .

She's flipped, everything seemed fine, I left the house with family, she was here with a girlfriend, I came home, and now she's now "keeping the baby" and "has to get out of here".

She's going to go raise the baby with the guy.

I'm going to the police station with all my info in the morning to see what they can do about the guy.

My daughter "will never forgive me" she says.

First she said she was talking to him today on a texting app, then she wasn't, she was talking to his cousin, who was trying to find him (drama drama drama). The cousin is married to her "man" who she met when they were 15 and 27... .and she and her mother are still not speaking according to her. So the family is... .like that.

My daughter is moving out in the morning, no plan, she doesn't know where, but she can't live in this toxic environment.

I ask her what's in the best interest of the child, and she can't get past "I want the baby".

[lever.]

Oh no, Seawalker.

This is the catch 22-if you try to tell her what to do she will blame you for ever for the consequences of the decision whatever it is-yet she is irrational and just reacts on her emotions rather than thinks things through.

I agree-go to the police and see what they can do-you need outside authorities involved.

The law seems more flexible in the US.

Here in the UK it is just a straight 16 is the age of consent and there is no "age difference" component. Also I don't think the other things are an offence here unless its definitely without consent.

I am so sorry about your situation, I really am. I hope the police or child protection can help you.

[HealingSpirit]

Oh Noo!

I understand your panic! AHHHH!

I feel the same way every time my DD announces she is moving in with her BF in the Midwest.  They just broke up last Friday, and on Monday, they were "back together" as if nothing happened.  I agree, go to the police to see what your options are.

But, I also recommend BREATHE!  And try to stay calm... .she may change her mind again.  My DD does not like to listen to logic from me, but I have been successful once in a while from simply showing her how much things cost.  Maybe you could try a similar tactic.  Appeal to her adult logic.  Take her "window shopping" for baby products, furniture, and accessories.  Do you think if she sees how much 1 package of diapers costs, and that she will be supporting this baby on her own, would it get through to her?

WOW!  I'm so sorry you are dealing with this!

HS 

Our objective is to better understand the struggles our child faces and to learn the skills to improve our relationship and provide a supportive environment and also improve on our own emotional responses, attitudes and effectiveness as a family leaders

[tristesse]

Oh Seawalker,

I'm so sorry that the tides have changed and things have gone downhill.

I am hoping that your trip the police station helped at least a little.

Hang in there and know that I am thinking of you still.

[pessim-optimist]

What a stressful night... .

How are things going today, SeaWalker? Were the police helpful?

I'd try to keep it as two separate issues:

1. DD's decision about the baby is one thing - that can wait (even though - things being what they are, some input from the authorities would be nice - knowing your own options and rights etc.)

2. DD "moving out" might be out of the question if you want her to stay home - she is still a minor (pregnant or not... .)

[SeaSprite]

I don't know about the police yet, I have an inquiry in by no response yet. She has bags packed and is waiting for him to pick her up, she is so sure they are going to be a family, she's been wanting to move in with him and I'm pretty sure this pregnancy was only partially an accident.

I've given up. The door is always open... .But... .

[.cup.car]

Does she have any friends that would keep her in line?

Teenage girls tend to frown upon hooking up with men twice their age who live with their mom. What do her friends think?

[js friend]

Seawalker im so sorry things have taken a turn for the worse... .

Your dd will probably change her mind many, many times during this pregnancy if she goes through with it as my dd did. it is early days and there is still room for her to change her mind again, so all is not lost but i do understand your immediate panic

I think pessim-optimist has given you very good advice to try to keep the 2 issues separate.TRY to take the emotion out of it.Is there someone you can talk to to relieve some stress... .a dh, a T, or a good friend perhaps?

From my experience If you make it all about dd's bf age, or how no good he is, she is sure to run to him.  All your dd can probably see is that you are trying to tell her what to do and to control her.b/fs  age will not change or his circumstances overnight and she knew about it when she got with him. Remind her that you want the best for her, and the baby if she decides to keep it.A softer approacher is probably what is needed right now.

Pregnancy hormones made my dds depression worse during her  pregnancies especially with her first... .so much so i was really worried about her mental health during this time.

so I think it may be better to keep communication open by keeping the focus on how realistically they will be able to raise a child... .where will they live and what will they do for money.

But even then be prepared... .even with all this information put infront she probably still wont want to see it.

[MammaMia]

SeaWalker

I am sorry to hear things have deteriorated. Of course, you are frustrated and angry.  Any parent would be.

If dd moves in with the bf (in his mother's basement), I cannot help but wonder how his family is reacting.  Do they have the financial means to support everyone?  This situation may be short-lived

when reality sets in.

Don't give up yet.

Prayers for you and yours.

[SeaSprite]

I let her go, and left her with a typed list of things to work out if she is keeping the baby, like finding an OB and so on. All the nuts and bolts I could think of. I told her she always has a roof over her head here, and that her college fund is always available to her.

I told her the doors are always open here.

She is so determined, everything I do makes it worse.

She wanted to run away with him a month or so ago... .I'm pretty sure she got pregnant at least subconsciously on purpose so that they'd get started on their life together.

My h is supportive, her father (my ex h) is frantic. Her older sister thinks she's a selfish idiot.

[SeaSprite]

I should say, my h is supportive of me, and whatever life changes this brings our family, and helping her however we can. Not that he thinks she's doing the right thing.

[HealingSpirit]

I let her go, and left her with a typed list of things to work out if she is keeping the baby, like finding an OB and so on. All the nuts and bolts I could think of. I told her she always has a roof over her head here, and that her college fund is always available to her.

I told her the doors are always open here.

She is so determined, everything I do makes it worse.

Oh SeaWalker!     

I am so sad for you!  I think as hard as it is, I would have done exactly the same thing in your shoes.  Your DD set up a no-win situation (the old double-bind), so I think the only sensible thing you could have done was to step back and let her go.  Anything you do at this point would backfire against you.

Of all the ways you could have handled this, you chose a response that preserves the open communication and support, should your DD change her mind.  I think ya' did good! But I feel the pain and disappointment you must be experiencing! 

I just hope and pray that she doesn't come begging for her college money in a month or two to help with all the expenses her BF just took on.  If it were my DD, I would tell her that money is ONLY for her college education, and it will not be given for any other purpose.

I'm glad your DH is supportive of you.  God knows, you need all the support you can get!  Maybe your DD's father will be the "bad guy" and go report the BF to the police, or maybe he will try to crack down on your DD, which will likely drive her right back to you. 

I'm so sorry you're having to deal with this! 

Hang in there and go have your favorite cocktail!

[js friend]

If it means anything SewalkerI think you did the right thing.

Ive been where you are and sometimes letting them go and allowing them to learn from consequences is the best solution in a situation like this.

It is still early days... .and  i can bet that give it time and your dd will see that not the grass is not greener over there living with b/f and his mom as she thought.

Im just wondering... .are there conditions around your dd having access to the college fund? If your dd is anything like mine she will have already have bragged about it it will become an issue as she will feel entitled to have it to spend... .

like  NOW!

Our objective is to better understand the struggles our child faces and to learn the skills to improve our relationship and provide a supportive environment and also improve on our own emotional responses, attitudes and effectiveness as a family leaders

[SeaSprite]

Fortunately the college money is in the form of prepaid tuition and her grandpa owns the account. It can only be used for direct educational expenses, per IRS rules and regs. Or her grandpa can take it back out for the cash value minus fees and tax penalties, and the money is his.

[SeaSprite]

She can't access it directly either, she has to ask me for it and I submit the reimbursement request.

[tristesse]

Big Hug to you seawalker. Im not going to say I would have done exactly the same thing because It have no idea if I would have, that is hypothetical. I will say that I am sure you made the choice that was best for you and your family, and I can do nothing but support that.

Remember that you have friends here, and to take some time just for yourself. You are important too.

[lever.]

Thinking of you Seawalker.

I don't know what else you could have done and you have left the door open for her and kept your relationship.

It will be difficult for her to turn the blame onto you.

My daughter was older when she had her first child but if it is any comfort to you she made a lot of improvement when she had the baby to focus on.

If the law there is the same as here you could not have stopped her anyway if she was determined to go.

[theplotthickens]

I have to be honest and disagree with the rest of the board on this one.  You are still her legal guardian, and you had boundaries set in place.  It will be next to impossible for you to set boundaries with her if you cave when she badgers and threatens you, or if she uses emotional manipulation.  I would hold my ground.  You are the adult, and she is 16, and vulnerable to exploitation and abuse.  It is legally irrelevant that she is pregnant. I would stand by the boundaries I have set, as we cannot live being held hostage by our BPD teen's whims.  I would not let my teen move in with a thirty year old under any circumstances: love, threats, preganancy, or the illusion that they will learn from their mistakes.  They don't learn from their mistakes at this age; they simply can't see around the corner and need guidance and limits.  Are there any other options?

[SeaSprite]

I'm open to suggestions. I cannot make her stay in my house. Every boundary I've set over the past 3 years she has snuck around. She will work for what she wants, so she'll mow the lawn to be able to go on a date. But if the activity is against the rules, she finds a way past it.

She needs internet for her online class, so I take away the phone and she installs a text app on the computer while she's doing homework.

The rules have never been unclear or arbitrary. And she still has a need to sneak and do the wrong thing.

No unsupervised time with boys? She has sex with her girlfriends. Or lies about where she is.

Use two forms of birth control if you are going to have sex? She "forgets" to take the pill and doesn't use a condom.

Don't lie or cheat? She has a threesome with a a girl and a guy who has a pregnant fiance, before she breaks up with her own boyfriend.

If you get pregnant, abortion or adoption. She's keeping the baby.

If I say it, she does the opposite. Every damn time. So far she is still, marginally, in school.

Her dad is talking to the police, we will see if there are legal consequences.

But if not, how do I keep her here? Here she has a car, a nice house, a family who isn't all that bad, two dogs. She left all that behind, I did let her take her phone for safety and her laptop for school. Other than that, a couple of suitcases. She would have left without those too though. She really doesn't care about anything but this guy, and their life together.

I can't physically restrain her.

If there are choices in not seeing, I  am all ears. Ok, eyes.

[mama72]

Oh SW, my heart just aches for you. No matter what you do, there is going to be turmoil. You may have to just step back and be a spectator, as hard as that is. I really don't know what I would do in your position.

I would have a very hard time not going after that guys who took advantage of your dd and stopping the call phone payment. If she want to live like an adult, then she will have to take the responsibility that come with that.

Prayers for you during this painful time.

[Rapt Reader]

This thread has been locked due to reaching its post limit. It is a worthwhile topic, and you are welcome to begin a new thread to continue... .Thanks for your cooperation.