How many months into the relationship did devalue/instability begin?

[Before you can make things better, you have to stop making them worse...]

I had a rs with a NPD and a BPD (both male, I'm female).

With both of them i noticed the honeymoon ended around the 4/5 month mark. Thats when they started to show their true colors and idolization ended and thing became rocky.

Both of them have had relationships in the past, they usually broke up after 6/7 months.

Also, after 4 months approx, they started to hunt again secretly. You just felt a shift in energy within the rs.

Would love to hear if anybody had the same 4/5 month mark experience.

[2014]

I had a rs with a NPD and a BPD (both male, I'm female).

With both of them i noticed the honeymoon ended around the 4/5 month mark. Thats when they started to show their true colors and idolization ended and thing became rocky.

Both of them have had relationships in the past, they usually broke up after 6/7 months.

Also, after 4 months approx, they started to hunt again secretly. You just felt a shift in energy within the rs.

Would love to hear if anybody had the same 4/5 month mark experience.

[drummerboy]

Yep, things started going south exactly 4 months after we started. We were done by 5 months.

I had a rs with a NPD and a BPD (both male, I'm female).

With both of them i noticed the honeymoon ended around the 4/5 month mark. Thats when they started to show their true colors and idolization ended and thing became rocky.

Both of them have had relationships in the past, they usually broke up after 6/7 months.

Also, after 4 months approx, they started to hunt again secretly. You just felt a shift in energy within the rs.

Would love to hear if anybody had the same 4/5 month mark experience.

[Infern0]

Yeah 4 to 5 months things got bad

[Blimblam]

Yup about 5 months.

[2014]

They broke up with me with 5 months as well.

I also noticed that around the 4 month mark they started to push my boundaries. Before that they were very careful.

I made it known to them (in a kind loving way of course) that i was sticking with my boundaries and thats when they just dumped me.

No talking things over, no compromising, not trying to find a solution, just discard.

Both of them had a new rs within days with back up girls.

I even told one: I am not an IPhone you can just replace instantly.

[lm911]

The idealisation phrase was about 4-5 months. Then the she began to sabotage and we broke after another 6 months, in which I was trying stop her weird behaviour. Immediately after we broke the devaluation began.

[elessar]

4 months first relationship, 6 months second relationship (same person) and many years of recycling... .none of which lasted over 3 months.

Are we starting to see a pattern here? 4-7 months?

[2014]

Are we starting to see a pattern here? 4-7 months?

Bingo! I've been wondering the exact same thing. There seems to be a pattern and i wonder why/what happens around that time in their mind... ? Hmmm.

[elessar]

First time in 2006 she gave her brother access to her email, who saw our emails, and her mother told her to break it off with me.

Second time in 2011, her sister-in-law saw her email account (still not sure how), saw our photos, and her brother told her father.

The similarity of the two things freaks me out. But before that second incident, she had officially broken up because of religious reasons.

I think we can deduce what is going on. They mirror us and idealize us. My ex did that. She loved and liked and had interests in whatever I did. Within a few months she started saying she doesn't like any of these things, and is liking them for me. Whenever I asked what do you like, she never had an answer. Probably because she is hollow inside without any self. So she was the person her parents would like, then the person I would like, but in reality she doesn't know who she is. But within a few months they realize that this idealization was fake, and that's when "we have issues" comments starts coming out and soon after the devaluation.

[Loveofhislife]

2014: there is another thread on this board asking when we were split black that is similar to your question. How odd that we all seem to have an expiration date of 4-5 months: not counting any recycles. I was onto him pretty quickly as the idolization phase was clingy and creepy for me. The abandoned child phase lasted quite awhile where he clung and NEEDED me. And as long as he NEEDED me (always financially). He seemed to be able to suck up the angry child. Like you, I FELT the barometer dropping as criticism of myself, my friends, and my family ensued. But he was a love bomber and anytime he felt my rebelling against unreasonable treatment, he vehemently proclaimed his undying affection. Did you ever get silent treatment? Because that seems to be the REAL warning that you're about to get discarded. It was a long way for me to fall: from being utterly adored to utterly ignored, and I got there in less than 60 seconds when he decided to throw his new iPhone away.

[TheBPDSurvivor]

Mine lasted just 4 weeks for the idealization/mirroring and the devaluation started right after her ex wished her on her birthday followed by the instability/doormat and silent treatment at random intervals for another 4 weeks. One final question like do you really love me? and BAM I'm painted pitch black!

[michel71]

My situation is different because we were long distance. She lived in the UK. I live in the US. We did the back and forth thing for over two years, got married and then still had to be apart while we were waiting on her visa. I think the idealization phase was extended because of this. I will say however that there were little nigglings of something being off. Her incredible sensitivity and hurt feelings. I would feel awful and gravel for her to forgive me for offending her (somehow); then, within a few days, it would be back to idealization.

The devaluation/instability did happen but kicked into high gear after we got married and on each of my visits to her while we were waiting for her visa.

She told me recently that she had reservations about moving on several occasions. Wasn't sure if I was "worth it" (that is how she put it) when we argued. If I am honest, I would say that I had my reservations as well. I think we both wanted to see our commitment through.

Now we are both miserable. The devaluation and instability has kicked in full force, culminating in her telling me a few weeks ago that she "loves me less". I am having a hard time getting past that one.

Good luck to you my friend!

[Pingo]

I believe the 4/5 mark in any r/s, BPD or not, changes at this time.  In a healthy r/s the passion slows down and you come out of that 'drunk' state and remember you are two separate people.  This is where true intimacy and a deeper love is possible.  And this is where you start to realise that your partner is not perfect, they are human after all... .a pwBPD is a whole other story, this is when I started to see there was a problem but it didn't really kick into high gear until about a year into it.

[Recooperating]

Here too every 4-5 months! It was a perfect cycle... .Honeymoon month, "stable" month, moody month, hell month ending with a huge fight, suicide threath etc. Then 2 weeks of being split black... .And RECYCLE... .Honeymoon month... .Etc.

(In moody month he would start to "look" for other women... .)

I saw a clear pattern and told his psychologists. Because of this clear cycle I thought he waa bipolar, but the P clearly said he was borderline.

[RisingSun]

I had my first what the heck moment around three months into the relationship. We were on vacation, had been drinking a bit, and got into our first argument.

It was about something small and insignificant. She blew up and slammed a medicine cabinet door and shattered the glass.

This was the unveiling of her disorder.

Soon after our vacation she started to devalue me. I think what triggered her "coming out" was, on our vacation we started to get closer and our intimacy increased.

So four months in, she started to she signs of NPD/BPD. That began an 11 year roller coaster ride.

Come to think of it, there was another cycle that started 4 month into our marriage. It was after the second honeymoon phase ended. That's when things got really bad.

What is it about 4 months? I did a google search and found a site where people suffering from BPD were talking about how they go through cycles. Most said they

would cycle out of their PD for three months and then would start to get triggered easily. Their trigger sensitivity would culminate and peek in around a month.

At this point, they could go into a phase lasting for an unpredictable amount of time depending on the situation.

My thoughts are, at the beginning of a relationship PD's go into reset and begin a new cycle.

[Pingo]

I had my first what the heck moment around three months into the relationship. We were on vacation, had been drinking a bit, and got into our first argument.

It was about something small and insignificant. She blew up and slammed a medicine cabinet door and shattered the glass.

This was the unveiling of her disorder.

Soon after our vacation she started to devalue me. I think what triggered her "coming out" was, on our vacation we started to get closer and our intimacy increased.

So four months in, she started to she signs of NPD/BPD. That began an 11 year roller coaster ride.

Come to think of it, there was another cycle that started 4 month into our marriage. It was after the second honeymoon phase ended. That's when things got really bad.

What is it about 4 months? I did a google search and found a site where people suffering from BPD were talking about how they go through cycles. Most said they

would cycle out of their PD for three months and then would start to get triggered easily. Their trigger sensitivity would culminate and peek in around a month.

At this point, they could go into a phase lasting for an unpredictable amount of time depending on the situation.

My thoughts are, at the beginning of a relationship PD's go into reset and begin a new cycle.

Interesting!  We also had a honeymoon period of about 4 months where everything was amazing around our wedding until things started unravelling again. 

[Caramel]

Three weeks.

[camuse]

I had my first what the heck moment around three months into the relationship. We were on vacation, had been drinking a bit, and got into our first argument.

It was about something small and insignificant. She blew up and slammed a medicine cabinet door and shattered the glass.

This was the unveiling of her disorder.

Soon after our vacation she started to devalue me. I think what triggered her "coming out" was, on our vacation we started to get closer and our intimacy increased.

So four months in, she started to she signs of NPD/BPD. That began an 11 year roller coaster ride.

Come to think of it, there was another cycle that started 4 month into our marriage. It was after the second honeymoon phase ended. That's when things got really bad.

What is it about 4 months? I did a google search and found a site where people suffering from BPD were talking about how they go through cycles. Most said they

would cycle out of their PD for three months and then would start to get triggered easily. Their trigger sensitivity would culminate and peek in around a month.

At this point, they could go into a phase lasting for an unpredictable amount of time depending on the situation.

My thoughts are, at the beginning of a relationship PD's go into reset and begin a new cycle.

Very interesting, thanks! Although it's depressing that the replacement still has another month of amazing idealization to look forward to. Maybe he will be smart enough to bail in a month or so, when the madness begins.

[expos]

3 months in, I noticed something a little sketchy - but I brushed it off.  I noticed I was dealing with something around the one year mark.  Things absolutely imploded around the 15-18th month mark.  

[2014]

2014: there is another thread on this board asking when we were split black that is similar to your question. How odd that we all seem to have an expiration date of 4-5 months: not counting any recycles. I was onto him pretty quickly as the idolization phase was clingy and creepy for me. The abandoned child phase lasted quite awhile where he clung and NEEDED me. And as long as he NEEDED me (always financially). He seemed to be able to suck up the angry child. Like you, I FELT the barometer dropping as criticism of myself, my friends, and my family ensued. But he was a love bomber and anytime he felt my rebelling against unreasonable treatment, he vehemently proclaimed his undying affection. Did you ever get silent treatment? Because that seems to be the REAL warning that you're about to get discarded. It was a long way for me to fall: from being utterly adored to utterly ignored, and I got there in less than 60 seconds when he decided to throw his new iPhone away.

Good lord, yes! The similarities are mesmerizing (and healing at the same time), yes i did get the silent treatment and with both i just immediately sensed something was up. And with both it happened in ONE 'not so holy' minute.

And good god, how i punished myself for not being what they wanted me to be in that minute.

This was all before i started to investigate PD's. I kicked and kicked myself for that, i was destroying my self esteem, attacking my own character & integrity.  

Both of them suddenly stopped answering my texts, didn't take my calls and if i 'pressured' like 'hey, u ok? drop a line pls' i got a two word response like 'yes alive'. He wounldt even talk in full sentences to me? The last text before that was one he said he felt like we were a match made in heaven.

Oh and the reason for the sudden discard was: i couldn't go to a boat party with him because i was babysitting my sisters kid.

Yep.

[2014]

My thoughts are, at the beginning of a relationship PD's go into reset and begin a new cycle.

Yes, pressing the RESET immediately with my replacement. We had planned to take a vacation together to Spain, i had already took my days off, he had booked the house etc.

After my 60 sec discard (by text, because i didn't go to a party with him) he de-activated his fb profile and started all new & fresh with her. He just took her to Spain instead of me. That was the end. How i found out? I read it in the gossip magazines as he is a well known tv personality in my country.

About the cycle's… do they only show in relationships? Or in other parts of life as well?

[RisingSun]

I had my first what the heck moment around three months into the relationship. We were on vacation, had been drinking a bit, and got into our first argument.

It was about something small and insignificant. She blew up and slammed a medicine cabinet door and shattered the glass.

This was the unveiling of her disorder.

Soon after our vacation she started to devalue me. I think what triggered her "coming out" was, on our vacation we started to get closer and our intimacy increased.

So four months in, she started to she signs of NPD/BPD. That began an 11 year roller coaster ride.

Come to think of it, there was another cycle that started 4 month into our marriage. It was after the second honeymoon phase ended. That's when things got really bad.

What is it about 4 months? I did a google search and found a site where people suffering from BPD were talking about how they go through cycles. Most said they

would cycle out of their PD for three months and then would start to get triggered easily. Their trigger sensitivity would culminate and peek in around a month.

At this point, they could go into a phase lasting for an unpredictable amount of time depending on the situation.

My thoughts are, at the beginning of a relationship PD's go into reset and begin a new cycle.

Very interesting, thanks! Although it's depressing that the replacement still has another month of amazing idealization to look forward to. Maybe he will be smart enough to bail in a month or so, when the madness begins.

No, I would say he's probably already gotten a few doses by now. She was idealizing him before we were separated. I actually heard her get upset with him two weeks

before our split. She was already focusing in on her target. For some reason it's a reassuring thought that he's got it coming. I'm normally not a vindictive person,

but this is a unique situation.

He wanted my wife, he's going to have her, the good, bad and the extremely ugly. 

[RisingSun]

My thoughts are, at the beginning of a relationship PD's go into reset and begin a new cycle.

Yes, pressing the RESET immediately with my replacement. We had planned to take a vacation together to Spain, i had already took my days off, he had booked the house etc.

After my 60 sec discard (by text, because i didn't go to a party with him) he de-activated his fb profile and started all new & fresh with her. He just took her to Spain instead of me. That was the end. How i found out? I read it in the gossip magazines as he is a well known tv personality in my country.

About the cycle's… do they only show in relationships? Or in other parts of life as well?

They were talking about life outside of relationships. That's why I thought it was an important clue. If it was isolated within a relationship it would explain

the honeymoon phase being over. Most relationships have a honeymoon phase lasting around three to four months, depending on how much time you spend together.

I've noticed that there are other factors which can put them in auto reset as well. Like buying a new house or going on an extended vacation. When things go exceptionally

well in life they can go into regression.

Although when my stbxw would snap out of an extended period of regression, it was like she needed to rage binge.

After she got her "fix" all would be well for a short period of time.

[Rise]

Honestly when I take a look back, the instability was always there. I was just so caught up in how she was making me feel that I ignored it, or excused it. The idealisation was so intense and all consuming I didn't want something to be wrong. So I wrote off the red flags. I accepted blame for things I shouldn't have. I made excuses for when she was irrational and unstable. It wasn't until things progressed out of the honeymoon period, and I started expecting the relationship to evolve and progress that I started to take notice of what was going on. But the truth is, our relationship was never stable.

[elessar]

Honestly when I take a look back, the instability was always there. I was just so caught up in how she was making me feel that I ignored it, or excused it. The idealisation was so intense and all consuming I didn't want something to be wrong. So I wrote off the red flags. I accepted blame for things I shouldn't have. I made excuses for when she was irrational and unstable. It wasn't until things progressed out of the honeymoon period, and I started expecting the relationship to evolve and progress that I started to take notice of what was going on. But the truth is, our relationship was never stable.

As more time is passing by and the cloud over my eyes are lifting, this is what I am realizing, and this is what is helping me in moving forward in my own life. I spent too many years of my life defending her, even her abusive behavior. I always pointed to the good parts about her. Sure, there were lots. But the instability was always there. I refused to look too because I was so caught up in the honeymoon phase.

[Bak86]

Instability was always there. After 3 months we had our first fight, then after 4/5 months she broke up, instantly went back to her ex.

[RedDove]

I agree with Rise and could have written the same thing myself. I was so caught up in the glamour/idealization phase that I chose to overlook the "red flags". It was always an unstable relationship. I didnt know about the BPD until the end... .4 years later! Good grief! IF I knew then what I know now! At the time I had no idea what was going on. Just knew it wasnt normal behavior, nor a normal relationship.

Just my two cents, but, I think the cycles depend on what other drama, stress, as well as the exes available for recycle or new supply options that are in their lives.

The first initial idealization cycle lasted only 6 weeks! He got a MRSA infection post-surgery, Left me a VM that it was the "hardest" thing he's ever had to do, but we couldn't see each other for a while. I responded very angrily and was very upset. He contacted me a month later to meet for drinks. The second recycle lasted maybe 1 month. I contracted MRSA and he didn't care, no empathy (surprise, surprise, surprise) and disappeared. I do believe now that he recycled an ex based upon information I've since learned.

The third recycle was the longest and lasted 7-9 months in total. It became a Rollercoaster ride after 3 months of idealization and spending every weekend together. Rinse and repeat, the next recycles became shorter and shorter as he picked up right were we left off! So idealization was very short cause at that point he knew I was a doormat! Argh! 

I'm so glad I am off of the Rollercoaster and no longer the supporting actress in Nightmare on Elm Street Part#10! I am now 7 weeks NC with my ex BPDbf. I have not heard a peep from him. He moved onto the OW, who was in the wings 8 weeks before I finally ended it with him and I went NC. I'm sure her idealization phase with him is just about done and she's miserable and wondering what happened to Prince Charming and the fairy tale. 

[LuckyNicki]

The idealisation phrase was about 4-5 months. Then the she began to sabotage and we broke after another 6 months, in which I was trying stop her weird behaviour. Immediately after we broke the devaluation began.

This here is the most annoying thing ever and if i were to hate her for anything it would be this.

This is where they begin to covertly pick fights with you by crossing boundaries.  Then when you try to express your feelings, they begin directing the argument over to you being overly "sensitive" at them.  And then mine will proceed to say "i'm so done with this".

Thinking about this, makes me angry  

[freedom33]

A steady 3-4 month cycle for me. 1st month was great, 2nd month was kind of stable but cracks are showing, 3rd month the seismic shocks are starting to rock the house and by the end of month 4 Tsunami was unleashed. This happened predictably 4 times - as you can calculate we lasted for a bit more than a year.

Another cycle I noticed was the 3-day cycle. Has anyone noticed something similar? For example when we were spending consecutive days together e.g. during holidays or if she would stay at my place or me at hers what happended was every third day there would an argument. Something would trigger her. Which meant I never saw her more than twice a week. Sounds familiar?

[Take2]

I'm so glad I am off of the Rollercoaster and no longer the supporting actress in Nightmare on Elm Street Part#10! I am now 7 weeks NC with my ex BPDbf. I have not heard a peep from him. He moved onto the OW, who was in the wings 8 weeks before I finally ended it with him and I went NC. I'm sure her idealization phase with him is just about done and she's miserable and wondering what happened to Prince Charming and the fairy tale. 

I agree with most of what you wrote here RedDove... .there were lots of red flags but they were small at the time.  Easy to overlook.  But they started the pattern of throwing me off balance, not quite understanding what he was doing (ie, I thought we agreed we had plans that night but now he claims he never agreed to that  type stuff).

It all was laying the groundwork for what was to come... .   and agree also that the cycle definitely depends on their stress level, their life circumstances as well as who or how many other people are waiting in the wings... . 

Love your quote about no longer being a supporting  actress on Nightmare on Elm Street!  Funny !