What do you say when BPD partner asks you what you think of them?

[Depression = 72% of members]

Disclosure: Although I post on the Staying board, I readily admit to a lot of indecision about staying in my rs. I am trying, for the time being, and the tools I am learning here are helping improve communications with my uBPDw.

That said, a friend of my wife has an uBPDh (at least he displays many traits). He recently left his spouse and D4 for the second time this month, taking her car, refusing to pay his portion of the rent, and to my eyes, appeared to have been planning it for some time. He has been telling all of his wife's friends that she has a mental illness. It's unfortunately very familiar to the many stories on this site. Hearing what is going on triggers the heck out of me.

Which leads me to my question. My wife was saying that he is running away because of his issues in feeling safety in relationships, and that no intimacy can be built because there's no foundation of safety to build upon. I said he is running away because he is emotionally unstable, fears abandonment, and is accusing his wife of the very things that he is doing - being unsafe, painting her black, abandoning, and otherwise dysregulating. My wife has previously identified similarities between her and her friend's husband and asked me point blank if I think she is unstable.

What would you say or have you said to the pwBPD when asked that? I felt very uncomfortable. I hate this feeling of sitting in judgment. This is not what I wanted in my life. I suppose I brought it on by judging the friend's husband, but I am in a bit of FOG here.

Any thoughts? 

[takingandsending]

Disclosure: Although I post on the Staying board, I readily admit to a lot of indecision about staying in my rs. I am trying, for the time being, and the tools I am learning here are helping improve communications with my uBPDw.

That said, a friend of my wife has an uBPDh (at least he displays many traits). He recently left his spouse and D4 for the second time this month, taking her car, refusing to pay his portion of the rent, and to my eyes, appeared to have been planning it for some time. He has been telling all of his wife's friends that she has a mental illness. It's unfortunately very familiar to the many stories on this site. Hearing what is going on triggers the heck out of me.

Which leads me to my question. My wife was saying that he is running away because of his issues in feeling safety in relationships, and that no intimacy can be built because there's no foundation of safety to build upon. I said he is running away because he is emotionally unstable, fears abandonment, and is accusing his wife of the very things that he is doing - being unsafe, painting her black, abandoning, and otherwise dysregulating. My wife has previously identified similarities between her and her friend's husband and asked me point blank if I think she is unstable.

What would you say or have you said to the pwBPD when asked that? I felt very uncomfortable. I hate this feeling of sitting in judgment. This is not what I wanted in my life. I suppose I brought it on by judging the friend's husband, but I am in a bit of FOG here.

Any thoughts? 

[RELATIONSHIP PROBLEM SOLVING]

RELATIONSHIP PROBLEM SOLVING This is a high level discussion board for solving ongoing, day-to-day relationship conflicts. Members are welcomed to express frustration but must seek constructive solutions to problems. This is not a place for relationship "stay" or "leave" discussions. Please read the specific guidelines for this group.

[Hutsepotmetworst]

UxBPDgf : ":)o you think I'm a difficult person to live with ?"

Me : "Well, in all honesty, I do think so, yes."

UxBPDgf : "WHAT ? Nobody told me that before ! It's you that is nearly impossible to live with ! Don't you know what you do to me ?"

... .

RAGE RAGE RAGE... .

She just couldn't handle the truth.

[Theo41]

I find it very hard to be completely open and honest on this subject with my u BPD w when things are going well. It would upset the apple cart causing her to disregulate. So I do it during the bad times: when she has acted out and I feel tat I can't take it anymore. I also set boundries during these situations. Example: "I have decided I don't want to travel with you any more . Don't schedule any more trips. " This has been most effective in making her change her behavior for the better. THEO

[Robins0n]

Sometimes, I trigger my wife's feelings of abandonment/rejection by complimenting her  I'm not surprised that your wife took you judging her friend's husband personally. In addition, your delivery might've been affected by your own grief a bit. Don't think you're alone with this - I've been in this situation several times myself.

I'd put myself in her shoes and try to understand her comment. She probably believes that you're indirectly judging HER; and that's what I'd apologize for.

"I'm sorry that you got the impression that I believe YOU are unstable. I just got so upset about a parent abandoning his family that anger took over and distorted my message. I'm actually very proud that OUR family is sticking together through thick and thin. We're doing something right."

Even if you currently have your doubts about that last part, try to focus on your objective here: improving the situation at hand.

[maxsterling]

A general rule of life (not just with BPD):  If someone is asking your opinion of him/her, it means he/she already has doubts or feels that way about him/herself.

Examples:

":)o I look fat in these pants?"

She's asking because SHE thinks she looks fat in those pants.

":)o you think I am too needy?"

She's asking because SHE thinks she is too needy.

Congratulations, you have just been asked a loaded question  .  I get those at least once per day.  The problem - they want some kind of validation.  But if you say, "no, you don't look fat", you have just invalidated her natural feeling that she *does* look fat.  Boy do I ever hate being placed in this situation!  If I could make one request about my fiancé that she would stick to, it would be to never ask me questions that begin with "should I... .", "am I... ." or "do I... ."

Compounding the issue is that pwBPD don't like people to beat around the bush and instead want direct answers.  Yet, if you give a direct and honest answer here, you get guaranteed rage.  So even if she does feel she looks fat and I agree, I'm blasted for thinking she looks fat.

I'm SLOOWLY learning to validate the underlying emotion, and not what was actually said.  So, if I was you, rather than saying "yes, I think you are unstable" or lying and saying "no, you are not unstable", I would  try and get at the underlying emotion.  I think that emotion is one of feeling confused and shameful. I would explain that the situation between your wife's friends is complicated and confusing and that leads to personal reflection, and that is always difficult.  I would then try and point out a few positive things your wife is doing for herself, and encourage her to do more of that. 

With my fiancé, the situation is usually her asking me why she has such a hard time with friendships and work relationships and feeling like people hate her.  The reality?  Her neediness and negativity burns people out.  She knows this, she has been told this countless times before.  It does no good for me to say that again.  Instead I will remark how everybody has wants and needs and their own issues, and just because a friend or coworker is not available at the moment does not mean she is being rejected.

[dog_star]

I'm SLOOWLY learning to validate the underlying emotion, and not what was actually said.  So, if I was you, rather than saying "yes, I think you are unstable" or lying and saying "no, you are not unstable", I would  try and get at the underlying emotion.  I think that emotion is one of feeling confused and shameful. I would explain that the situation between your wife's friends is complicated and confusing and that leads to personal reflection, and that is always difficult.  I would then try and point out a few positive things your wife is doing for herself, and encourage her to do more of that

nicely put. I usually just lie. I am going to try your technique. I am curious what you say to the "do I look fat in theses pants" question.

[waverider]

I am curious what you say to the "do I look fat in theses pants" question.

Only when the lights are on 

[waverider]

I agree with Max they already have a view and want it validated. So rather than answer the question ask for further qualifications as to what aspects does she feel she is concerned about? after all something triggered it. ie show interest in her concerns whilst avoiding making a judgement call.

Try also shifting the definitions say from unstable to variable or unpredictable

[takingandsending]

Thanks waverider, max, Robins0n and all,

I did talk with my wife this morning. Turns our her friend's husband did plan it, has likely been having an affair and her friend has been following down the yellow brick road. Poor woman.

I expressed that I wanted her to understand that while she and her friend's husband struggle with self image, the way they ultimately decide to work with their feelings is very different. And that is true, in the spectrum of this illness. I appreciated her not running away from her problems, trying to work them out, providing care, food, transportation and many other levels of support for our sons. I believe that she felt good hearing these things.

I appreciate your support in coming out of this particular FOG. Looking forward to some clear sky and sunshine. 

[Robins0n]

I expressed that I wanted her to understand that while she and her friend's husband struggle with self image, the way they ultimately decide to work with their feelings is very different. And that is true, in the spectrum of this illness. I appreciated her not running away from her problems, trying to work them out, providing care, food, transportation and many other levels of support for our sons. I believe that she felt good hearing these things.

I appreciate your support in coming out of this particular FOG. Looking forward to some clear sky and sunshine. 

Well done.