Solicitous Questions?

[Loveofhislife]

So, after a year-long relationship where my exbfBPD spent nearly every waking moment with me:  if not at my home with my younger daughter and me; he was on the phone or texting or... .

My son contacted him (without my knowing) last Saturday when adult S told exbfBPD that he had been a jerk: that he owed me a good amount of money, and the return of my property.  My adult son was "fed up".  After 3 months, my S is tired of seeing me sad and mad and hearing me cry. :'(

CONTEXT: August 1 was the last time any of us had seen or heard from exbfBPD, as he stormed off when I reminded him that it was the first of the month (when he received a large pay check), and that he had assured me, he would deposit into my account so that I could pay some very large bills he had run up on my credit cards.

This was no surprise to him; we had been discussing it for weeks; but he acted shocked when I asked about the status of the deposit retorting, "What am I going to  live on?"  Highly compensated with a modest lifestyle and no custody of his children, I found his question to be almost incomprehensible--especially since I continued to financially support him to a large degree.

After my son ended the phone call with exbfBPD, I received a series of "solicitous" questions on text.  He seems to be acting as if storming out on the 'love of his life," the "best friend he ever had, and "the most supportive person he's ever known," is perfectly normal and that we should have moved on by now--as if the past year never happened.  It was as if he was annoyed that we are reminding him that we exist:  unthinkable for my three adult children (and me).

He abandoned me (and by default US), as exbfBPD had insisted on being an integral part of my family: birthdays, holidays, graduations EVERY WAKING MOMENT.

I guess my question is, did he really think that his disappearance would just end the relationship? Erase the past year? Erase his debts?  He moved; (with a lot of my property in his apartment); didn't let us know; and now he is asking these questions:

-Once again... why am I still the topic of conversation?-

--Why would you keep discussing our business with your kids?... .I can                  only assume you've only told them your side of the story.

--I just told my kids we're not together... that's all they need to know; I don't feel good...

--they have their own life... unless you've been continuing to trash my name

[FoolishMan]

So, after a year-long relationship where my exbfBPD spent nearly every waking moment with me:  if not at my home with my younger daughter and me; he was on the phone or texting or... .

My son contacted him (without my knowing) last Saturday when adult S told exbfBPD that he had been a jerk: that he owed me a good amount of money, and the return of my property.  My adult son was "fed up".  After 3 months, my S is tired of seeing me sad and mad and hearing me cry. :'(

CONTEXT: August 1 was the last time any of us had seen or heard from exbfBPD, as he stormed off when I reminded him that it was the first of the month (when he received a large pay check), and that he had assured me, he would deposit into my account so that I could pay some very large bills he had run up on my credit cards.

This was no surprise to him; we had been discussing it for weeks; but he acted shocked when I asked about the status of the deposit retorting, "What am I going to  live on?"  Highly compensated with a modest lifestyle and no custody of his children, I found his question to be almost incomprehensible--especially since I continued to financially support him to a large degree.

After my son ended the phone call with exbfBPD, I received a series of "solicitous" questions on text.  He seems to be acting as if storming out on the 'love of his life," the "best friend he ever had, and "the most supportive person he's ever known," is perfectly normal and that we should have moved on by now--as if the past year never happened.  It was as if he was annoyed that we are reminding him that we exist:  unthinkable for my three adult children (and me).

He abandoned me (and by default US), as exbfBPD had insisted on being an integral part of my family: birthdays, holidays, graduations EVERY WAKING MOMENT.

I guess my question is, did he really think that his disappearance would just end the relationship? Erase the past year? Erase his debts?  He moved; (with a lot of my property in his apartment); didn't let us know; and now he is asking these questions:

-Once again... why am I still the topic of conversation?-

--Why would you keep discussing our business with your kids?... .I can                  only assume you've only told them your side of the story.

--I just told my kids we're not together... that's all they need to know; I don't feel good...

--they have their own life... unless you've been continuing to trash my name

Isn't it time you did the right thing by yourself and your family? He owes you money and you have said you have a legal process going... .can't you just deal with him through that? If not he's going to manipulate you (you know, with strange questions etc). You have to realise the only reason he is contacting you like this is because the game is up.

Do you want him back?

[Loveofhislife]

Foolish--I know you're right, and no--I don't want him back. It is just so weird to have had him ask over and over (I'm paraphrasing)--aren't you over this already? There's another good thread on this board about never getting closure--maybe that's what has me ruminating again. He's in a lot of trouble, and while he's blaming me (on the one hand), he's acting like, (again paraphrasing) what's the big deal? The coming weeks won't be easy, and yes there are significant legal processes and collections processes under way. I guess you're right: pure manipulation.

[FoolishMan]

Foolish--I know you're right, and no--I don't want him back. It is just so weird to have had him ask over and over (I'm paraphrasing)--aren't you over this already? There's another good thread on this board about never getting closure--maybe that's what has me ruminating again. He's in a lot of trouble, and while he's blaming me (on the one hand), he's acting like, (again paraphrasing) what's the big deal? The coming weeks won't be easy, and yes there are significant legal processes and collections processes under way. I guess you're right: pure manipulation.

Nothing else but manipulation. I am going through manipulation now. I don't care why or what's behind it. I'm ignoring it for my own good.

You don't have to speak with him or answer his questions. Do you owe him anything like money or possessions? If not stick to the legal process and allow him to self destruct. Of course your other option is to go down with the sinking ship? That's a choice you have though it's nothing to do with him. Think of your family if not yourself.

[Caredverymuch]

Foolish--I know you're right, and no--I don't want him back. It is just so weird to have had him ask over and over (I'm paraphrasing)--aren't you over this already? There's another good thread on this board about never getting closure--maybe that's what has me ruminating again. He's in a lot of trouble, and while he's blaming me (on the one hand), he's acting like, (again paraphrasing) what's the big deal? The coming weeks won't be easy, and yes there are significant legal processes and collections processes under way. I guess you're right: pure manipulation.

When they dump you on your head and ditch, in their mind " its over." The splitting black is indeed black and white thinking and immediately they are able to distance you through dissociative, disordered thought patterns.  Often, there is a replacement lined up. They dont tend to leave one r/s unless there is a safe place to land.  Perhaps this is a generalization, but since our ex's are BPD twins separated at birth it seems, this is my opinion on you situation.

When my ex would split me black during the r/s, if I went to him one day later asking to speak to him, he reacted to me as if I were a casual  passerby.  He would seem perplexed if I stated hurtful emotions.  Literally perplexed.  I would say I was hurting deeply and he would look at me and ask " has something happened?"  This is how real the ability was to split, dissociate, and "end" the r/s ( without ending a thing directly with me) was to his disordered mind.

I would ask for a simple explanation.  Very simply. Please tell me what is going on? Please help me understand what happened from yesterday until today?  If I had anyone else to ask, I would, but I can only ask you as this makes no sense to my heart or mind.

His reaction was again of wonderment. Of confusion.  He would say things riddled in projections but provide zero logic reason on why I would be in this place of pain. 

Literally, it was " over" to him.   

I just never got the memo.

Its a disorder.   You cant make this stuff up.  And you can never think the way they do. 

Thankfully.

They move on at the speed of light. 

Love=need.

Until they don't need you. 

Thats not my definition of love.

[Loveofhislife]

Foolish and CVM--thank you for your reminders and responses. Truly, the mind can know something, but it takes awhile for the heart to catch up  Saturday night caught me completely off guard when my 20 year old son jumped headlong into what Mutt called a Karpmann Triangle--there had been no voice communication with exbfBPD in the 3 months since his "rapture" He picked up the phone immediately when my son called (after midnight). He told my son he was sorry that I remained so upset months later, but that I had hurt him when I was going out with other men (like my business partner) behind his back. My son then became angry at me (his N father used the same excuse when I filed for divorce) so, no doubt--exbfBPD used an old wound against me via my son: classic splitting. My son begged me to answer exbfBPD's texts, because exbfBPD told my son I was refusing to communicate and put this behind me. He told my son I refused to move on and instead had hired an attorney as retaliation for his "breaking up with me."

I told my son I would text with exbfBPD briefly, and, as Foolish pointed out, it was pure manipulation. My goal was to make it clear that I would discuss nothing with him, without an attorney, EXCEPT for what he had told my son about my cheating:  ALL LIES. He obviously has used these fabrications to ease his shame for abandoning me. When the truth is, it's always been about his feeling entitled to EVERYTHING of mine (and everyone else's), and when he decided not to pay me back, he disappeared. He had been obsessively accusing me of cheating throughout the r/s.  Probably projecting.

CVM is on the mark about need. He only NEEDS me now (and wanted to communicate via text) to manipulate me into "calling off the dogs" who are on his heels for financial fraud. He continued to call me a liar and a cheater who was retaliating against him; instead of any recognition for his fraudulently using my credit cards, etc.

Thanks for the support here--I just didn't know why he kept asking the same questions. Your answers make sense. The game is over when they say it's over. Or in his case, when the lawyers, creditors, and his probation officer says it's over.

It's a little funny to me that he thought I would just go away--it tells me that many others have. And not recognizing my detrimental codependent traits, my son kept telling exbfBPD on the phone, "She will not stop; she will not back down; she will hunt you down; you will NOT get away with this with her."

At least my son understands me 

[Caredverymuch]

Foolish and CVM--thank you for your reminders and responses. Truly, the mind can know something, but it takes awhile for the heart to catch up  Saturday night caught me completely off guard when my 20 year old son jumped headlong into what Mutt called a Karpmann Triangle--there had been no voice communication with exbfBPD in the 3 months since his "rapture" He picked up the phone immediately when my son called (after midnight). He told my son he was sorry that I remained so upset months later, but that I had hurt him when I was going out with other men (like my business partner) behind his back. My son then became angry at me (his N father used the same excuse when I filed for divorce) so, no doubt--exbfBPD used an old wound against me via my son: classic splitting. My son begged me to answer exbfBPD's texts, because exbfBPD told my son I was refusing to communicate and put this behind me. He told my son I refused to move on and instead had hired an attorney as retaliation for his "breaking up with me."

I told my son I would text with exbfBPD briefly, and, as Foolish pointed out, it was pure manipulation. My goal was to make it clear that I would discuss nothing with him, without an attorney, EXCEPT for what he had told my son about my cheating:  ALL LIES. He obviously has used these fabrications to ease his shame for abandoning me. When the truth is, it's always been about his feeling entitled to EVERYTHING of mine (and everyone else's), and when he decided not to pay me back, he disappeared. He had been obsessively accusing me of cheating throughout the r/s.  Probably projecting.

CVM is on the mark about need. He only NEEDS me now (and wanted to communicate via text) to manipulate me into "calling off the dogs" who are on his heels for financial fraud. He continued to call me a liar and a cheater who was retaliating against him; instead of any recognition for his fraudulently using my credit cards, etc.

Thanks for the support here--I just didn't know why he kept asking the same questions. Your answers make sense. The game is over when they say it's over. Or in his case, when the lawyers, creditors, and his probation officer says it's over.

It's a little funny to me that he thought I would just go away--it tells me that many others have. And not recognizing my detrimental codependent traits, my son kept telling exbfBPD on the phone, "She will not stop; she will not back down; she will hunt you down; you will NOT get away with this with her."

At least my son understands me 

Funny, my exNPD spouse did the SAME THING to me with our kids. Said the same mistruths about infidelity to my kids.  Horrific and pure NPD manipulation.  CONTROL.   Did a number in the psyche of our children and was incredibly spiteful behavior. 

Both of our expBpds did/are doing the same.

Its not classic splitting.

Its classic manipulation LOHL.

Understand the NPD will initiate a horrific distortion campaign bc they will gather a proximal army of support to bring you down. For their loss of the ability to keep you where they need you.  Controller-Controllee. They will hit you where it hurts and take as much away as they can.   

This was another codependant r/s dynamic we were in.

The NPD will not come back.  The will work a distortion campaign with venom but their ego is  more protective then the BPDS.

The BPD is manipulating through their projections.  Distortions are their projections to avoid the shame and guilt of their actions. To understand what THEY have been up to since they dumped you on our heads, listen to the projection.  This is what they've been up to.

You've been cheating= they've cheated.

You're being manipulative with your actions=they are being manipulative.

They have a fragile sense of self.  Additionally their thinking is extremely disordered and dissociative. They may use the same tactics to smear you but with different initiatives.

Both these men were/are different but very much the same.

Can you see this now?

Can you see where codependancy kept us in these unhealthy r/s?

When we know better, we do better.

I would adhere to NC w your expBPD.  You're getting back on the crazy train to nowhere good and to a no win. 

The actual win is staying away.

[Loveofhislife]

CVM: maybe, we are the twins?   Unbelievable how close our stories are. If not before, I am more convinced than ever that NC is absolutely for our own good. Apparently my voice remains a trigger for him, and he avoids it like the plague. But he picked up the phone immediately for my son. In this case, exbfBPD may be showing better judgement than I. The acceptance part is coming for me but not quickly. The lonely child has not yet accepted that it's over: forever, that he never really loved her, and that now, instead of being able to help him--that same lonely child is a trigger of all things bad for him. It's a very difficult concept to accept. Thanks for helping me along that path--I won't be getting back on that train.

[peiper]

Your definitely gaining clarity into the situation ! I've gained some and when I do its ugly when I see who she really is, or isn't . I'm so happy your moving forward 

[FoolishMan]

CVM: maybe, we are the twins?   Unbelievable how close our stories are. If not before, I am more convinced than ever that NC is absolutely for our own good. Apparently my voice remains a trigger for him, and he avoids it like the plague. But he picked up the phone immediately for my son. In this case, exbfBPD may be showing better judgement than I. The acceptance part is coming for me but not quickly. The lonely child has not yet accepted that it's over: forever, that he never really loved her, and that now, instead of being able to help him--that same lonely child is a trigger of all things bad for him. It's a very difficult concept to accept. Thanks for helping me along that path--I won't be getting back on that train.

Please don't blame yourself. If he wanted help he would get it, being such a high earner etc. he's happy lying and cheating his way into trouble with the law, a recidivist. Don't follow him down, you don't belong there, the world needs less of people like him and more of people like you.

It's going to be hard, not because he was the best or mr right but because they get under your skin deliberately by lying and mirroring so it takes a while but it can be done and you can do it, for yourself and the family that loves you.