The others in your life who take advantage

[Trog]

Since understanding my codependency thanks to my exBPDw (though I won't be thanking her anytime soon!) I am understanding lots more behaviour I tolerate or allow in my life from other people that really take this p8ss. There's currently a friend in my house overstaying their welcome, eating my food, paying no rent and taking up the entire front room, she came seeking 'a job' and yet didn't attend one interview in 2 months time and this morning instructed me to go and get croissants for her and has spent the day sick on the couch.

I'm a little furious, but the good news is that I am kicking her out and she goes on Friday. I'm annoyed with myself as I knew she was a taker, there was never any question or doubt on that as she always paid less than her way when we went out anywhere before the spell on my front couch, but for whatever reason I believed she would actively seek a job, I since found out she didn't even send an email to get one, she's just happy sat there bumming off me.

I keep drawing these losers into my life, and it can't be by accident, is it a case of the self esteem of the codependent that they feel powerful helping someone? Or we can't say no. What is it in someone else that happily takes all this from another person? I would never dream of imposing myself like that!

The same is true of other very close people in my life who will happily sit there and order the prime rib if I am paying, I don't want to have to never eat with people because they are all on the take. It makes me feel lonely and loved only for the free things I can bring to people's lives. Why do people feel so entitled around me? The common factor is me, it makes me feel like sh8t!

Does this happen to others? I'm sure this is the route cause also of my downfall of terrible boundaries and suffering a BPD relationship.

[Pingo]

I've been asking myself this a lot too Trog.  I allowed my uBPDexh to sponge off my good nature and generosity to the point that I got into a lot of debt trying to take care of him and waiting for him to get back to work.  This went on for years!  Ironically he finally got a job 3 weeks before I ended our marriage.  But it was always take take take.  Now he has been replaced by my adult daughter sponging off me.  She has been back living with me for 6 mths (came right after my marriage ended) and she doesn't work and doesn't look for work and won't lift a finger to help out, clean, cook or anything.  She sleeps all day and goes out and socialises all night.  Must be nice!  I gave her an ultimatum.  Get a job and help with rent or clean 8 hrs a week to work off her rent.  She chose to do neither and is shocked that I want her to find her own place!  She gave me nothing for Christmas, not even a hand made card after I spent hundreds on her and her younger brother, making the turkey, doing all the little things to make a special Christmas for them.  She only takes takes takes.  Seems familiar.

Outside of these two I actually have very generous friends who would never think to 'take' from me without giving back.  So for me, I think it is some weird sense of obligation I have towards my exh and daughter, that somehow I need to look after them and allow them to keep stringing me along.  For whatever reason the two of them both pushed my boundaries and I let them.  I've been trying to understand this and working with my T to get to the bottom of it.

[Trog]

I've been asking myself this a lot too Trog.  I allowed my uBPDexh to sponge off my good nature and generosity to the point that I got into a lot of debt trying to take care of him and waiting for him to get back to work.  This went on for years!  Ironically he finally got a job 3 weeks before I ended our marriage.  But it was always take take take.  Now he has been replaced by my adult daughter sponging off me.  She has been back living with me for 6 mths (came right after my marriage ended) and she doesn't work and doesn't look for work and won't lift a finger to help out, clean, cook or anything.  She sleeps all day and goes out and socialises all night.  Must be nice!  I gave her an ultimatum.  Get a job and help with rent or clean 8 hrs a week to work off her rent.  She chose to do neither and is shocked that I want her to find her own place!  She gave me nothing for Christmas, not even a hand made card after I spent hundreds on her and her younger brother, making the turkey, doing all the little things to make a special Christmas for them.  She only takes takes takes.  Seems familiar.

Outside of these two I actually have very generous friends who would never think to 'take' from me without giving back.  So for me, I think it is some weird sense of obligation I have towards my exh and daughter, that somehow I need to look after them and allow them to keep stringing me along.  For whatever reason the two of them both pushed my boundaries and I let them.  I've been trying to understand this and working with my T to get to the bottom of it.

I too have some good friends who always go 50/50 and I love spending time with them. It's so awkward being friends with spongers and I have resolved to myself to not have people like this in my life anymore. It hurts the soul. I simply can not imagine how bad I would feel to be such a burden on someone else and to be so thankless too. I am probably too extreme in the other direction (being strong, not being a burden, too generous) and need to strike a vulnerability balance but also, with past history, need to be careful where that comes out. I can never imagine taking advantage or thinking it's ok for me not to work and others will feed me. I suppose as a child I was that way but as soon as I was out to work I was proud to provide help for my parents. I dunno, sometimes I feel very alone in this world my morality seems not en vogue

[Pingo]

I cannot imagine either Trog, taking advantage of others.  I think what you said about being that way as a child but then you grew up and took care of yourself and helped your parents, maybe some people never grow up in that capacity.  I think this is what was going on with both my ex and my daughter.  A sense of entitlement, like they were young children and forgot to pass through that growing up stage where they were the drivers of their own lives and accountable for their decisions.   It's easy to take it personal, like we weren't worth being treated better than that but whenever I ask myself 'why am I not worth more than to be just used and abused' my answer always comes back to the fact that I allow it.  When I stop allowing it and believe I am worth more, I'll be treated as such and invite people into my life who believe I'm worth it.

[Trog]

I cannot imagine either Trog, taking advantage of others.  I think what you said about being that way as a child but then you grew up and took care of yourself and helped your parents, maybe some people never grow up in that capacity.  I think this is what was going on with both my ex and my daughter.  A sense of entitlement, like they were young children and forgot to pass through that growing up stage where they were the drivers of their own lives and accountable for their decisions.   It's easy to take it personal, like we weren't worth being treated better than that but whenever I ask myself 'why am I not worth more than to be just used and abused' my answer always comes back to the fact that I allow it.  When I stop allowing it and believe I am worth more, I'll be treated as such and invite people into my life who believe I'm worth it.

I'm pretty sure you are right. It's simply a question of are we prepared to take it, or not, I think I've been caught up in some psycho analysing if these deadbeats, maybe I feel superior to them in someway so I let them take advantage and then take the high road. I knew my friend was this way but I did hope to be proved wrong. I think most people just don't take those kind of emotional risks or they have the confidence to lay out the boundaries early on. It's the same with my wife, I knew she had issues but I hoped she would treat me better, but I knew better and went against my better judgement. I do this far too often, with directions. For example, I KNoW we are going the wrong way but another's insistence means I will begrudgingly go miles out of the way, irritated at the time lost just because I can't assert myself and let the idiots go the wrong way while I'm at hope with my feet up having a cup of tea.

But these people are attracted to me for sure, I'm putting this energy out there, like I said, I have friends where things are even and my opinions respected and then I have these morons! And I let them do it. That ends now.

[Pingo]

But these people are attracted to me for sure, I'm putting this energy out there, like I said, I have friends where things are even and my opinions respected and then I have these morons! And I let them do it. That ends now.

I just had this thought which applies to me too:  The friends you have where things are even are that way bc their values are about fairness and respect.  The ones that take advantage are those who don't have those same values.  I think with my daughter, my exh and some others from my past, I thought they would have the same values as me and expected them to act accordingly but they simply do not have those same values.  Instead of accepting this as the truth, I try to change them, hoping they'll develop some moral obligation to treat me fairly.  That's the codependence part I suppose. 

[seenoevil]

This happens to me all the time.  I always assumed everyone had the best intentions, but I am working on changing this.  I hate people taking advantage of me.   

I have been with my wife for 14 years and she has never paid one bill in our house.  She does not even pay her own parking tickets which she receives often, not her student loans, not for food.  She has worked very little and whatever she earns, she spends on herself.  If I complain, I'm a cheap guy.

There are people out there are actively looking for someone like you who has weak boundaries.  Now I try to be more self aware of this and stop trusting people until they have earned some trust.  Try to look at everything from your own frame of reference.  Ask yourself if what they propose is fair or if it is of any benefit to you.  This is something that we will need to practice in order to get better.

[rollercoaster24]

God, great topic and unfortunately one I also have problems with all the time.

Since my work is at a Shopping Centre, (and I work alone as my own boss) people approach me often, for help in some way or another.

Over the years I have worked there, I have taken in numerous people that were homeless, (exBP was one) or helped heaps of different people out with seemingly urgent problems for which they couldn't (or wouldn't) seek solutions elsewhere for.

Usually it seemed like they were asking for simple help, which when you delved deeper, found out there were lots of lies, and their situations were incredibly complex, which makes it very hard to deal with.

If I can be honest about my motives for helping people, it felt good to help and do good stuff if people asked and you were able to at the time. But maybe also I felt like I was selfish if I didn't put my own life aside to assist them. So there is some blocked up conditioning in there somewhere that I need to work on, so I don't buy into people's guilt trips so often.

Currently I am reading about moving beyond Codependency and Caretaking and Rescuing, (reasons why I got with BP etc) and many other mistakes I have made in my life.

Generally though, I am the type of person who helps those who are prepared to help themselves only, and I am very clear and upfront with individuals about what I am prepared to do, and how far they can push it.

Unfortunately with some people, it doesn't matter if you state your boundaries, they will keep pushing and pushing until they trample all over you and you are used up and fed up entirely. The idea is to not let it get to that point where you become a persecutor to them for draining your resources in the first place! Easier said than done however with certain personality disorders.

Which is where I am right now, so over it, yet feeling so guilty that I am in a better position than others are and that I SHOULD be helping otherwise I am a bad, selfish person, (eeek where did that conditioning come from?) I think it was BP actually, because I wasn't this bad before, or was I?

Um, yea I was, gulp.

So again, especially over the last few days, I have a zero policy tolerance to people trying to take advantage of me.

I just gotta own my right to be angry with certain people for trying to shaft me, and not allow them to do it ever again. This will prevent me from losing my cool with them and staying angry and resentful.

If I have to avoid them, so be it. Sometimes telling people you need some time to yourself just doesn't get respected!

[going places]

Boundaries.

Yes, for me, I had no boundaries.

That's like leaving a "COME AND GET IT" Neon sign around my neck.

*I* attracted losers and users.

My desire to be 'noticed' or to be 'recognized' was pretty big for a while... .(a not so normal childhood + an abusive husband)

So I not only allowed, but I invited people to use me.

Once I started enforcing boundaries, people started dropping out of my life like flies.

No one can 'take' advantage of me.

People only take what I allow them to have... .

[Trog]

It seems this behaviour can come from many places.

Ive done a few things that indicate both behaviour patterns, i willingly dates then married an incredibly needy woman, i believed I was helping but I mus have got something from this. I needed to be needed. I didn't put her in a position of low power, her illness already did that, but I do seem to be setting myself up to be the saviour, helper and then resenting it when these people who are incapable of emotional support etc fail to do it. I can see a pattern of uneven relationships where I naturally get/have the upper hand also in my family relationships but I crave true equal companionship, I don't want to be used for need I want to be loved. Yet I set things up the other way. And end up in terrible pain.

I have believed, apart from my first girlfriend at 16-20yo, that i was either emotionally stronger or smarter than all my partners, I didn't see any of them as equals but I really tried to love them but showed that by beig a doormat and resenting every day quite quickly. It sounds a bit NPD but I think it's a face of low self esteem/codependcy

Sorry that was a ramble, im trying to work something out!

[Perfidy]

Trog, take the time out of your life to get to know your self. We go from being someone's child to being someone's boyfriend or someone's girlfriend and even someone's parent. We skip the part about being our own. We miss out on finding out who we are. At some point during our lives we could benefit from focusing entirely on our self. I did the care taking bit myself. My care taking was a direct result of having six children. It was my identity. I was dad. I was comfortable with my role as dad. Perfect for a dependent person.

[Trog]

Thank you Per, that is absolutely true for my life, I have gone from him to relarionship to relationship, I did spend a year alone once but was 24 so wasn't in a stage of life to analyse and also hadn't been really hurt that badly so was not suffering.

I believe my work is codependency work. 

[going places]

I was dad. I was comfortable with my role as dad. Perfect for a dependent person.

Good Morning!

Can you explain to me what you mean by "perfect for a dependent person"?

Thanks so much!

[Perfidy]

Going places, someone needy was a perfect fit in my choice of partners. Didn't turn out so well.

[jhkbuzz]

The thing that confuses me the most with my exBPDgf is that I was definitely codependent... .but I've never been in another relationship like it - either friendship or romantic.  I am independent and assertive... .I admire that quality in others... .and I feel pretty strongly that adults should take care of their own ___. I've never 'rescued' anyone before (and quite honestly, when I see people in that life stance I don't really have a lot of respect for them).  I didn't have to rescue any of the adults in my life when I was a child... .the adults in my life were fully ADULT.

So... .what gives?  How the HELL did I get sucked into this relationship?

[Trog]

The thing that confuses me the most with my exBPDgf is that I was definitely codependent... .but I've never been in another relationship like it - either friendship or romantic.  I am independent and assertive... .I admire that quality in others... .and I feel pretty strongly that adults should take care of their own ___. I've never 'rescued' anyone before (and quite honestly, when I see people in that life stance I don't really have a lot of respect for them).  I didn't have to rescue any of the adults in my life when I was a child... .the adults in my life were fully ADULT.

So... .what gives?  How the HELL did I get sucked into this relationship?

Are you totally sure you don't reacue? That could be many things? Pre-empting how you think a person will react so modifying your behaviour. Being overly cautious of others hurt feelings? Doing things you don't want to do to please people?

Could be you didn't act like that before but usually there is some helper/saver/rescuer traits

[Trog]

Today I got my apartment back from my friend. For sure i put myself in this situation, I suspected she would take advantage and not get a job and just eat all my food, drink all my wine and live on the couch. It's amazing a middle aged woman would want that life even though I gave her the opportunity to put herself together, get a job, find herself, she did nothing but watch TV. What a waste! I really don't 'get' these people, but I believe now I finally 'see' these people. It was another classic codependence of mine, trying to rescue, getting annoyed when they don't appreciate what ive offers or do t fulfill their side of the bargain (getting a job... .Even getting up!), seething about it silently with a few narky comments thrown in and then feelings like a victim.

Last time. And a far less painful lesson than the BPDex

[jhkbuzz]

The thing that confuses me the most with my exBPDgf is that I was definitely codependent... .but I've never been in another relationship like it - either friendship or romantic.  I am independent and assertive... .I admire that quality in others... .and I feel pretty strongly that adults should take care of their own ___. I've never 'rescued' anyone before (and quite honestly, when I see people in that life stance I don't really have a lot of respect for them).  I didn't have to rescue any of the adults in my life when I was a child... .the adults in my life were fully ADULT.

So... .what gives?  How the HELL did I get sucked into this relationship?

Are you totally sure you don't rescue? That could be many things? Pre-empting how you think a person will react so modifying your behaviour. Being overly cautious of others hurt feelings? Doing things you don't want to do to please people?

Could be you didn't act like that before but usually there is some helper/saver/rescuer traits

I'm from NYC - I don't care how anyone else reacts!   I'm not people pleaser either... .hmmm... .

I am pretty good at navigating the pragmatics of life - I'm good at figuring out how to get things done, because I'm organized and I have a lot of perseverance.  I sometimes find myself in conversations that I'm giving people advice - helping them figure stuff out or make plans.  But I've never crossed the line into doing for for people - until I met my exgf.  Then I definitely crossed the line into rescuing/helping - but she encouraged it as well. We were building a life together so it felt like some of what I was doing was for our future - helping her repair her credit, helping her with her career. It's confusing.