struggling with my decision to stay too long and accepting what I can't know

[raisins3142]

Hi,

I broke up with my uBPDexgf 2 months ago.  I have been limited contact.  The last 2 contacts have been mutual, short happy holidays messages around Christmas and New Years.

I have snooped her pinterest account several times.  Predictably, she is posting many memes that say things like "I'm okay with my crazy" and "I have to someone who sees all my warts and loves me anyway", etc.  Basically, she has this take it or leave it attitude it seems.  This is frustrating because I want her to understand that she behaved in a way that would be unacceptable to most people in a relationship.  Rather, she feels she just needs to find someone that can tolerate her as is, which minimizes her disorder.  I will likely never get this closure that I would like.  How could I?  It would be much too shame inducing for her to say "yeah, I was a horrible girlfriend and you were right to end things".

The other stumbling block that is keeping me thinking of the relationship is that I ignored too many red flags and stayed too long.

In the past, when my self esteem was better, I was pretty ruthless as far as walking away from relationships early on that had too many red flags.  Throw yourself at me sexually and the first date and then text 20 times the next day?  I'll be walking, thank you very much.

Because of a lack of other options and wanting this to work because she was so affectionate at first, I mentally knocked down a minefield of red flags.  But they never really went away.  They were just piled up in the back of my mind somewhere. 

So, I'm angry or perplexed with myself for wasting my time and incurring emotional baggage by making bad decisions.

Early on in the relationship, I was acting very non-judgmental which was partially the truth but also a way to get someone to tell you about their past so that you can better determine if this relation is a good idea.  During that time, she alluded to a bunch of murky things about her past.  These things basically pointed to being in tons of short relationship and her being used for sex, but she never came out and admitted to a high level of promiscuity and later on denied it at the end of the relationship.  The way she lacked intimacy during sex and the way she "went about things" and all those hints but no real details just makes me imagine the worst.  Like I would not be surprised if she had been prostituted or allowed groups of men to have their way at once, etc.  Hope that is not too graphic.  I'll never know these things for sure, but pondering what is possible just makes me feel sick, sad, and a bit retroactively angry/jealous.  I would like to know if my suspicions are correct but then again I do not want to know and not knowing is bothering me for some reason.  I suppose I just want to be "right" which dovetails in with my earlier point about wanting her to understand my side of things.

Also, as far as not knowing, there were several odd things during our relationship that I would like to know about.  They all have to do with other men.  She was very overly private about her texting and facebook.  For instance, I did not know what the screen of her cell phone looked like for the first 3 months, she kept it so private.  However, her phone would ding with various notifications at all hours of the day and night.  She would check it and never mention anything.  She thought it normal to answer a text at 3 am while next to me in bed and not think to mention what it was over.  I acted much differently.  I acted in a way that made her trust me by being transparent.  Later on she would say "Well, if you wanted to know then why didn't you ask?"  Well, that works for a single instance, but I should NOT have to explain why answering 100 texts in a day and NEVER mentioning anything about them is a bit odd.  It is like someone saying "well, if you wanted me to take off my muddy boots before walking around on your carpet, all you had to do was ask!"

So, I'll never know if she was flirting with men or having emotional affairs or setting up rendezvous.  And that bothers me.  Knowing the truth is important to me.

She had me so paranoid that many things seemed odd.  For instance, she worked nights and lived above younger college student.  He mowed their grass.  Whenever he was mentioned she would always make a point of saying "It's weird I've never met him or even know what he looks like, our schedules are just so opposite". It seemed odd that she would always make a point of saying this.  Her mom was over once talking to us both and my ex again parroted the "I've never even met him line" and her mom looked off, smirked, and rolled her eyes.  This was just one example out of many.  I naturally then thought "she knows that guy and probably hung out with/drank with/slept with him when she was lonely before she and I met or maybe even after".  But I'll never know.  And there were other odd things like me leaving her to take a call and coming back and guys were looking at her oddly like something just happened, etc.  Just horrible to ponder what type of second, hidden life she might have had.

Basically, I want to know exactly how big of a train wreck I was with.  What I do know are all deal breakers, but I don't want to have had the wool pulled over my eyes and I want her to know I know.  It would hurt if I knew some really scandalous/unhealthy stuff, but it would make it easier in a certain way because I would have the "yep, I called that one correctly at the end, no way I could EVER be with someone that was like that".

Any advice on moving past this stage or has anyone else been in a similar stage/mental place?

-R+pi

[Matt8888]

This was my ex to a T!  Wonder if it's the same woman.  No intimacy during sex.  Didn't really kiss passionately.  Cell phone going off at all hours of the day and night.  She'd respond to texts while we were supposedly a couple.  I finally had enough and told her to stop.  She defiantly said, "I'll do what I want!".

You think they would at least put their phone on silent mode to keep it secret.  Several times I got up to walk out in the middle of the night when this would happen, but she would pull me back in...   I also thought she may have dabbled in the porn, prostitution field.

I stayed way too long as well.  Saw red flags after a few days.

[raisins3142]

This was my ex to a T!  Wonder if it's the same woman.  No intimacy during sex.  :)idn't really kiss passionately.  Cell phone going off at all hours of the day and night.  She'd respond to texts while we were supposedly a couple.  I finally had enough and told her to stop.  She defiantly said, "I'll do what I want!".

You think they would at least put their phone on silent mode to keep it secret.  Several times I got up to walk out in the middle of the night when this would happen, but she would pull me back in...  I also thought she may have dabbled in the porn, prostitution field.

I stayed way too long as well.  Saw red flags after a few days.

It is possible.  Whenever I read something on here, I check the dates, etc. to see if someone is possibly writing about her!  


She is 32 now.  If that is a match then PM me.

I never caught her doing anything wrong on her phone because she would never check it in front of me and kept it locked.

She later claimed that it was mostly facebook and email alerts.

She would also do this weird thing where she later started using her phone near me BUT would flip through all her screens at a super accelerated rate, much faster than when she was off by herself.  So, she was trying to show me "see, I don't mind using my phone near you" but she darted around some fast and clumsily on her screens that there was no way I could see anything anyway.  The insulting thing is that she did not think I would notice this (her modeling world champion at super fast smart phone navigation, even when it makes you miss buttons).

She did not understand why often when someone would text me I would state off handedly "oh that is So and So, he wants us to stop by later if we have time" and why her total lack of reciprocal behavior was odd to me.

I think it was some combination of the following:

1. she was hiding something

2. she wanted to be private so she could hide something later if needed and it would not be a change in patterns

3. she had a weird idea about privacy/accountability in a relationship that was basically "you should trust me totally and you therefore don't need to know anything at all really about my private communications"

4. she could not imagine how others feel or put herself in the  place of others or understand social dynamics

My standard position with communication with others is the following: I don't want to look in your phone/etc BUT do NOT act like you do not want me to know anything about what is going on.

[myself]

What I do know are all deal breakers

I understand where you're coming from, having been in a similar place. I looked for answers/other facts to back things up both during and after the relationship. Yes, the things I found added to the list, and gave me further reasons to not trust or be with her, but there were already enough deal breakers for that as it were. I was really just prolonging the detachment process. Hanging on instead of letting go. Avoiding seeing the 'light', myself, that I wanted her to see. I had told her many times that her actions seriously damaged our chance of being together, hurting me and herself, etc. I'm glad that I expressed it, because speaking my truth meant a lot to me as far as my own healing goes, but beyond that it didn't really change anything (well, it got us that much closer to the final breakup... .Boundaries and honesty are like poison to a r/s with a pwBPD). She faces what she does, or not, just as I do. If those deal breakers really break the deal for you, get out and stay out. Most likely you would never get to the bottom of this anyway, not with someone who is being so secretive. Let her live her life her way, and live yours your own. Accept that moving on is better.

[Mr.Downtrodden]

We must have been involved with the same girl.

My experiences, exactly.

Answering texts, 24/7.  phone always active.

Heading off to bed, she says "ill be up in a minute... "  2 hours later, she is still downstairs, texting away.

I received two emails from two different exBFs, who were probably doing me a favor by informing me of what was going on behind my back. It was mind-numbing.  At the time i thought they were just frustrated stalkers, because my gf claimed to love only me.  Maybe she did, I don't know anymore, but that didn't mean she'd stop entertaining other guys.  She had me convinced that she just needed to wortk thru her feelings and we'd survive.  nope.  another lie.

Trust me, you do not want to find out what is going on or what went on.  It's all there, in black and white.  She's involved with one or more guys.  1000% Guaranteed. Take it to the bank.

[raisins3142]

Thanks, Song.

The frustrating thing is that she only had boundaries she'd agree to when it came to huge things that are really obvious:

1. no physical violence

2. no obvious verbal abuse

3. no physical cheating

Other than that, she thought she could do just about anything and if I took issue it was my problem.

The final straw was her going off to talk to a man that was hitting on her and her acting very flirty back for 20 minutes while I was in the room, this was after she had done similar things and I called her out.

Her reply was "you think I would cheat on you while you were in the room?  who does that?".  Which is just an obvious straw man.  I did not think she was going to sleep with him right then.  But anything not to that point I suppose is just fine and not disrespectful or tending to kill trust.

She simply wanted to have the safety of a relationship but get some of the good things from being single (romantic attention from multiple men).

I do not think she is at all aware of any of this.

[downwhim]

"The other stumbling block that is keeping me thinking of the relationship is that I ignored too many red flags and stayed too long."


All I have been doing is ruminating about this! He also was super private with his phone. All his contacts were initials and he checked his phone a lot. I could tell when we were talking he was on the computer too probably on a dating site.

No trust. I feel like an idiot staying so long and taking all his crap. 

[jjclark]

Raisins,

It's a tough one.  Whether or not she was physically cheating, not having our emotions acknowledge is really hard.  I feel for you.

I come from a similar story, mine had 2 cell phones and one was a "pay as you go".  It became clear that her part time job wasn't helping her pay tuition.  One night she put her phone down on her coffee table, she had been checking her emails on it and the list of emails was visible just long enough for me to sneak a peak before it turned off,  I chose to wait til the next day to look it up online.  Sure enough...

When I tried to explain to her what my concerns were, she told me I was being insecure and even said that I was being "annoying".  I don't know why I stayed, I think I felt really bad for her like I could do something about when really there is nothing to do.  I felt like I was a child, powerless and just docile as ___.  That is not me.

Like you, the 20 year old me would have walked like it was nothing.  

The hardest part for me has been to learn to trust myself again, and trust others as well.  And to forgive myself.  I am struggling with this, 11 months out. I could care less about her now, romantically speaking I am over it.  But I am not over letting her just walk over me like that.

Right now I see it this way... .  When I was way younger I use to love dirtbikes and I would ride them pretty fast and rather recklessly.  One day I smashed into a tree and I remember seeing the wheel spinning reallly close to my leg and although it really sucked that I no longer had a bike I think the lesson was more important than the bike.  I was lucky to have gotten out of that situation with nothing more than a sore wrist and a few bruises. 

That lady was one heck of a beast of a bike and it was good and intense while it lasted.  I was reckless though, and now I have learned my lesson and am better for it.  I try and see the good in it, I'm going to heal but that bike is total'd.

I hope you will continue posting.