Embracing my 'brain damage' and letting go of shame (It's a good thing... right?)

[Harri]

Hi.  I keep coming back to this thread and then turning away.  It hurts and I feel raw and I have just been sitting with those feelings.  It's okay but I don't like it, not even a little bit.  Thankfully, liking the feelings is not a prerequisite for moving through.  

Eyvindr, thanks for introducing yourself!  It is nice to meet you.   You said I am dealing with this objectively and gracefully and I appreciate that, but I don't see it.  I am so angry and frustrated and hurt and I am full of resentment.  I've spent a lot of time trying to get used to walking with these feelings without letting them control me.  I've done okay with that walk though they do escape sometimes, but I want to let go of them.  I can't keep carrying them with me anymore.  

What do we know about the past?

It's over and what worked to my advantage back then is no longer necessary or useful and in fact, those things are now causing me harm.  

I keep thinking Hey! I am 49 years old and I 'should' be so much farther ahead... .and then i remember I was still living with my parents until about 2004- believe it or not, I can't remember exactly when i broke away- but when I force myself to look at it as ~11 years, it seems a bit more acceptable to me, as if I am still developing emotionally.  haha, talk about arrested development!  And when i look back at where I was, I do see that I have done a lot of work, so thanks for saying that it is obvious.  I have.  It is all too easy to get bogged down in the present and lose sight of the progress I have made.

Pessim-Optim, I don't really have the words to respond  You said:

little by little, you are getting to know better the beautiful, kind and sweet Harri that's been within you all along. The one who is resilient, strong and resourceful, but also profoundly feminine. The one who is safe now.

 that made me bawl my eyes out.  Between your words and Ziggiddy's, and really everyone who has joined me here but especially you both (Kwamina, I will get to you later on!   ), I have been through a couple boxes of tissues.  Thanks so much... .  +    I did not understand why your words elicited such a response... .it was sort of like they hurt, but I realize it is not just that they hurt but it is because a part of me desperately wants to believe those things are true and that I am good and kind and loving... and feminine.  That last one makes me pause a bit.   It does not fit at all with my bad-a*s false self.  For now I keep reminding myself it does not mean I have to wear high heels or pink flowery crap.    (yeah, I definitely need to work on my idea of what it means to be feminine!)

I am going to look for a T.  I definitely need some more guidance.  Oh yeah, I wanted to clarify too.  "Brain damage" is my term.  Ziggiddy did describe the process as re-building neural networks too... .but the brain damage part kind of amused me!  I did not grasp the difference though---> damage is generally structurally based and less likely to be fixed whereas messed up wiring seems seems more doable.  It also gives me a more positive way to frame the work I am doing.  Thank you for pointing that out.  I want to grasp the belief that 'the sky's the limit' and never let it go.  Right now, I can sort of grab it, but it is like my hands are too slippery with garbage to hold on to it for any length of time.  I will keep working on it.  

Kwamina, between you and Pessim-O I feel less intimidated when it comes to spending time with 12 year old Harri.  Your input has taken the pressure off and it made me realize there really are no words to be said, at least not right now.  She just needs a friend and protector to hang out with and remind her she is safe now.  As for being a thriver in progress, you have told me that before and I skipped right over it.  I think I was ready to hear it this time around though as I am far less resistant to the word victim in relation to my past (though i am not sure I want to actually use that word--- I still don't like it)  And yeah, I did check the Survivor's Guide to double check your assessment!  I concede... .   Thank you.

As for what you said to me about my capacity to love... .that is a guaranteed way to bring me to my knees.  I want that to be true too.  I want to be able to show that without holding back in fear, anticipating having to give payment that destroys me.  It is terrifying.  I never thought of what I write here as being a measure of the love I have inside me though.  Thank you for saying that and letting me know you see love in me.  It is more important to me than you can imagine.

Funfunctional, thank you for an alternative and more workable view of shame.  

What is beautiful is that shame means you have this clear awareness now that what happened to you is wrong.  But shame is the response (short term).    Once you see into the cause of the shame (higher awareness) you have learned and grown and overcome a disfunctional situation

Wow.  This makes so much sense and makes it so much easier to embrace the shame.  My instinct is still to cringe away, but thanks to the new perspective, I can do this.  I can also see myself putting the shame and responsibility on my parents rather than me.  I have so much hope for my future!

And this from Eyvindr

and guilt, in a well-regulated mind, as an alert that our own behavior choices may be misguided or thoughtless.

is definitely going to be incorporated into my understanding of guilt/shame/blame.

thanks everyone!

[Kwamina]

I am so angry and frustrated and hurt and I am full of resentment.  I've spent a lot of time trying to get used to walking with these feelings without letting them control me.  I've done okay with that walk though they do escape sometimes, but I want to let go of them.  I can't keep carrying them with me anymore.

What do you think is preventing you from letting go of these feelings?

As for being a thriver in progress, you have told me that before and I skipped right over it.  I think I was ready to hear it this time around though as I am far less resistant to the word victim in relation to my past (though i am not sure I want to actually use that word--- I still don't like it)

So you skipped right over it? Good thing I'm a parrot, we just keep repeating the same words over and over again until we get through to you

As for what you said to me about my capacity to love... .that is a guaranteed way to bring me to my knees.  I want that to be true too.  I want to be able to show that without holding back in fear, anticipating having to give payment that destroys me.  It is terrifying.

I understand your fear Harri. Could it perhaps be that this fear is what's keeping you from letting go of all the anger, frustration and resentment?

When you've lived a certain way for very long it can indeed be very scary to explore new territories. The grey meadows or the light? There's a huge difference between them but also one similarity: your love still shines through. You were able to light up the grey meadows for many other members here And to me that indeed is a glorious and undeniable sign of the love and compassion you have inside of you Harri

[pessim-optimist]

I am so angry and frustrated and hurt and I am full of resentment.  I've spent a lot of time trying to get used to walking with these feelings without letting them control me.  I've done okay with that walk though they do escape sometimes, but I want to let go of them. I can't keep carrying them with me anymore.

I think Kwamina asks a good question (what stands in your way)?

Our feelings are there for a reason - once we realize we are having a feeling, it informs us about our life, and together with our thinking mind it allows us to make good informed decisions.

The problem with feelings from the past is that they inform us about unresolved problems. Sometimes it is a matter realizing something and grieving a loss. Sometimes it is an indicator of a past problem that is a source of a present problem. Once we make the connection, accept the reality and make a path toward a solution, the emotion is not necessary any more and it slowly goes away.

I used to be "stuck" in feelings of anger and resentment towards my parents because my past experiences with them created losses and missed opportunities in my adult life, and misshaped my personality in ways that were not helpful. I was angry for a good reason. But as long as I kept looking towards the past, the anger did not change and neither did I.

It was much later that I discovered what you already know as well: that we can change, and that we can heal and that yes, out past may have robbed us in many ways, but that life can get better and that freedom is within our reach.

As I traveled on my journey toward healing (changing my dysfunctional patterns of behavior), with all of the changes and little victories, I slowly started leaving the angry feelings behind. They were no longer necessary - my past wasn't causing me harm in the present any more.

Does that make sense?

Sometimes it's a simple matter of insight and grieving over a loss:

In reading the "Rachel - Get Me Out Of Here" book I realized that I too had similar recurrent dreams of being lost in unsafe buildings, with staircases leading nowhere or elevators that were teetering and threatening to fall... .

It led me to the profound realization that as a child, I felt lost, alone and unsafe and that my life then was going nowhere. And that the recurrent dreams were an expression of that. 

With surprise I told my husband about that discovery, and broke down in uncontrollable sobs. I cried and grieved my childhood loneliness and fear right then. For some reason, that was it for me. With that realization/insight those dreams went away, and while I understand that my childhood was that way, somehow, having realized and grieved over that and that I am safe now has allowed me to leave those feelings behind.

I am not a trained therapist, so I do not have an answer for you, but it seems to me that the question is: what do you need to work through your feelings? Insights about the past or how it has influenced you in the present (your coping skills that helped in childhood but no longer helpful), solutions or how-tos? Anything else?

[pessim-optimist]

As for what you said to me about my capacity to love... .

... .I want that to be true too.  I want to be able to show that without holding back in fear, anticipating having to give payment that destroys me.  It is terrifying.

This capacity to love (another great reminder of the Rachel book and her therapist btw) it IS true, Harri. 

When we have grown up with and been dependent on and loved people who were not safe, it makes sense that we connect love with pain and are weary of showing love. Only healing, new behaviors and very good boundaries can protect us from making ourselves vulnerable to unsafe people over and over again. Perhaps that fear serves as a safety buffer for now?

It can also be the fear of new/unknown as Kwamina mentioned - that part of fear is not healthy as it keeps us from growing.

How can you nurture yourself to grow in showing love in safe situations that will make little Harri feel good, confident and protected?

[Harri]

Hi Kwamina and Pessim-O I have been coming back to respond, writing and then deleting.  I kept writing a whole bunch of reasons that justify the the anger, resentment and frustration I feel.   Heh, so I am justified dammit!  The good news is I think the fact that I can see and express reasons for those feelings means I really have fully accepted that I *was* a victim    The bad news is that I found a small part of me that wants to wallow in it all.    

I do think there are a couple of other things going on as well.  One is that I think there is more to be uncovered and processed, at least in terms of my father.  The haze and confusion regarding him is lifting.  I keep seeing his mouth coming at me and feeling his cold wet lips on me.  I am working on not shutting down and slamming the door on the feelings and the images.  There has to be something there but I know pushing too hard to remember or make a connection is not going to help. 

You are definitely on to something regarding my fear as a reason to hold onto the feelings.  Fear about explaining my past to people.  How do I explain that?   Sometimes I think the fear is because I do not trust myself enough, but I know I can handle whatever happens.  I am just scared about what happens to me between the beginning and end of any friendship.  The last two (my ex and now-ex-friend) really has me questioning just how much I have learned in terms of interpersonal stuff.  So my feelings keep me feeling unworthy and not fit for human consumption and my fear keeps me in my comfort zone.  I am not sure how to work through that especially because I am so isolated right now.

As I traveled on my journey toward healing (changing my dysfunctional patterns of behavior), with all of the changes and little victories, I slowly started leaving the angry feelings behind. They were no longer necessary - my past wasn't causing me harm in the present any more.

Does that make sense?

Yes, it makes sense Pessim-O.  Thank you for sharing part of your story with me.  I am saddened to know you have experienced similar things but I am happy to hear you have been able to let go of those feelings.  I keep saying that I don't think a place of no anger or pain is possible for me.  Not that I think it will always be present, but that the feelings will still arise from time to time.  Am i limiting myself and basically ensuring that the anger, resentment and all that will never go away for me?  Right now, I will settle for getting to a place where I do not hate myself for what happened. 

what do you need to work through your feelings? Insights about the past or how it has influenced you in the present (your coping skills that helped in childhood but no longer helpful), solutions or how-tos? Anything else?

All of the above?  I did buy the book "get me out of here" and I have found it hugely helpful, so thank you for mentioning it.  I learned a lot by reading it (still have two chapters to go though) and I now understand more about the therapeutic process especially about inner child work and how listening to Little Harri is important but so is *parenting* her.  There were so many examples of what unconditional parental love looks and sounds like!  I also spent a lot of time crying my way through it. 

When we have grown up with and been dependent on and loved people who were not safe, it makes sense that we connect love with pain and are weary of showing love. Only healing, new behaviors and very good boundaries can protect us from making ourselves vulnerable to unsafe people over and over again. Perhaps that fear serves as a safety buffer for now?

It can also be the fear of new/unknown as Kwamina mentioned - that part of fear is not healthy as it keeps us from growing.

Yes, some of my fear does serve as a buffer.  I like that word.  It is a far more accurate and less harsh way to look at it.  Thank you.  And yes, Kwamina is right too.  Fear keeps me from growing and taking risks.  so there are several reasons i am holding on to the fear.  I can work on all of them though.  Thank you both for your help with this.

Kwamina wrote: 

The grey meadows or the light?

I choose the light.   

Kwamina said:  There's a huge difference between them but also one similarity: your love still shines through. You were able to light up the grey meadows for many other members here.  And to me that indeed is a glorious and undeniable sign of the love and compassion you have inside of you Harri... .Pessim-O said:  This capacity to love (another great reminder of the Rachel book and her therapist btw) it IS true, Harri.

Thank you both for that.     :'(

How can you nurture yourself to grow in showing love in safe situations that will make little Harri feel good, confident and protected?

I am not sure.  I am thinking about doing some volunteer work when I get better (health wise).  I love working with kids and the elderly so maybe I can do something for them.  Any other ideas?

PS  I had a really hard time responding here.  I think I got triggered and while I dislike even saying that phrase as it seems like an excuse and pity seeking, I mention it simply so I do not forget.  This haziness, confusion and exhaustion is all to familiar and the fact that it has happened over several days as I tried to reply tells me I am definitely hitting on some deeply rooted stuff here.  Thanks so much for helping me. 

[eyvindr]

I think those are great ideas, Harri. You have a lot of compassion, and when you feel ready tom, I think you have a lot to offer other people.

PS  I had a really hard time responding here.  I think I got triggered and while I dislike even saying that phrase as it seems like an excuse and pity seeking, I mention it simply so I do not forget.  This haziness, confusion and exhaustion is all to familiar and the fact that it has happened over several days as I tried to reply tells me I am definitely hitting on some deeply rooted stuff here.  Thanks so much for helping me. 

I know how you feel, Harri -- but hearing you say this is really an inspiration to me. Your honesty and willingness to be open serves as an example.

I'm almost 6 mos out, NC the whole time, and there are days when I think I'm over this and ready to move on -- but then I'll read some posts and get triggered -- particularly the posts on the "Staying" boards... .I can see all of the pain in the posts there, and I remember being there myself -- makes sense, I think? Anyway, when I get triggered, it's a good reminder to myself to slow down, give myself more time, I'm still hurt -- even though I was the one to decide to end the r-ship. It's like I'm hurt because I feel like I was forced to make a decision that I didn't want to make, in a way I didn't want to make it, but one that had to be made -- and one that my ex would not make, at least not rationally.

Thank you for helping me.

[pessim-optimist]

Thank you for sharing part of your story with me.  I am saddened to know you have experienced similar things but I am happy to hear you have been able to let go of those feelings.  I keep saying that I don't think a place of no anger or pain is possible for me.  Not that I think it will always be present, but that the feelings will still arise from time to time.  Am i limiting myself and basically ensuring that the anger, resentment and all that will never go away for me?  Right now, I will settle for getting to a place where I do not hate myself for what happened.

 

Thank you Harri. I do not want to take undue credit, though - my level of my trauma was incomparably smaller and also in different areas and so the recovery was/is much easier. I tend to be slow and cautious when it comes to changes that require courage (heck, when it comes to approaching life in general   ). But I think that sharing the "how" toward healing helps because I believe that the process is the same or very similar.

I don't think you are limiting yourself if you now feel in your gut that your anger or pain may never completely go away. That's being honest. But it might be worth it to be open to the possibility. And I think you would be limiting yourself if you gave up trying or hoping. "A journey of a thousand miles begins with a single step" we can't always tell what awaits beyond the horizon.

This is a long process. Taking it one step at a time and enjoying and celebrating every little victory is a very wise approach, Harri. Not hating oneself - i.e. having a road open toward loving, nurturing and even liking oneself is huge.

[Ziggiddy]

harri i wanted to quote so much from your last comment but I am short for time (thunderclouds rolling in and I want to get as much done on the PC as I can before the lightning strikes and I suddenly come to life (It's a-LIVE! it's a-LIVE!)

I think fear has been your constant companion and behind him is disgust. Holding hands with him are self contempt and shame.

As far as justifying your feelings or excusing them I TOTALLY get this. I do it all the time. ALL the time.

I spend maybe 90% of my internal talk time defending my actions and feelings from all kinds of people in my mind. I am starting to think maybe I can't stop this. But maybe I can live with it.

I am so glad you are seeing your father's disgusting mouth coming at you - molestation can take the mildest seeming pose. The more you imagine it, the more you will contact your outrage and outrage trumps shame, believe me.

Would it be worth trying to picture your different feelings as actual forms? Maybe avatars or something? Invite them all in and sit them down at the table and listen to them all? Without interrupting or justifying?

Listen to what they all have to say?

Maybe you don't have just one little Harri, Harri. More like you maybe have 15. And they all feel something different and trying to tell you while you reason with them and explain and justify and defend. Sensing a pattern here? 


PS PessOpt?

When we have grown up with and been dependent on and loved people who were not safe, it makes sense that we connect love with pain

This should have seemed obvious to me but it wasn't. thanks for tweaking it so I can relate to it in another way. you never fail to surprise me with a new nugget! 

[Kwamina]

I don't think you are limiting yourself if you now feel in your gut that your anger or pain may never completely go away. That's being honest. But it might be worth it to be open to the possibility. And I think you would be limiting yourself if you gave up trying or hoping. "A journey of a thousand miles begins with a single step" we can't always tell what awaits beyond the horizon.

This is a long process. Taking it one step at a time and enjoying and celebrating every little victory is a very wise approach, Harri. Not hating oneself - i.e. having a road open toward loving, nurturing and even liking oneself is huge.

 I totally agree with everything pessim-optimist said here!

Thank you for helping me.

I am thinking about doing some volunteer work when I get better (health wise).  I love working with kids and the elderly so maybe I can do something for them.  Any other ideas?

Volunteer work can be great and very rewarding And you know Harri that the things you do on this site can also be considered volunteer work because you have also been helping a lot of people on here You could say that we are doing reciprocal volunteer work here

[Harri]

Hi eyvindr.  You're welcome.   I am glad my post helped you.     I see triggers as generally good things as they tell me what i still need to work on, or, like with you, to slow down.  I went back and read a few of your posts on other threads and on this one here.  I have to say that you have a wonderful way of reaching out to people and I am glad you stopped by to chat and offer a hand to me. 

Pessim-O I feel the same way when i hear other peoples stories.  Trauma is trauma though.  There is so much horror out there.  None of it really surprises me much any more, though it still hurts to see it all.  What does surprise me, time and again, is how much more caring and love there is out there.  In a way, I hope I never lose my surprise and wonder when I am fortunate enough to be on the receiving end of it.  Thank you.   I am going to try to remember not to limit my ability to shed the anger and hurt completely.  Hope is good, but it all too often it does not deliver and it hurts like hell too.  Maybe I need to make friends with it too though.   

Ziggiddy!  Thank you so much for saying you defend yourself too!  I swear I sound like a lawyer presenting a case in front of a judge sometimes!  I thought I was alone in this!  I am not at all glad to know you have this going on as well though; I am sorry for that but so thankful you shared that part of yourself! 

I think fear has been your constant companion and behind him is disgust. Holding hands with him are self contempt and shame.

Sounds like I need some better friends doesn't it?  I'm working on it, though this statement is accurate... .for now. <--- is that hope?

I am so glad you are seeing your father's disgusting mouth coming at you - molestation can take the mildest seeming pose.

Gee thanks   but I understand what you are saying and I laugh every time I read that line!  No it is not funny funny, but it is hysterical in a way. 

Molestation?  Is that what it was?  Is that what a court of law would call it?  Was it incest?    I hate that word... .so ugly and twisted.  Surely there is another word when the degree of the act was so small? 

I think sitting down with my feelings and all the Little Harri's is an excellent idea.  I learned a lot about the inner child from reading the book Pessim-O recommended (Get me out of here) that I think will help me with this.  I also have the book Toxic Parents sitting next to me and I am eager (and scared) to start reading it.  Thank you.   

Kwamina, you really are brightening my world with your blue feathers!  Thank you.  Apparently parrots are both good and persistent at getting their message across to stubborn people!   Thank you.