How do you cope when they're very depressed?

[Grey Kitty]

Apparently, animals notice emotional maturity... .and prefer people who have more of it. 

[RELATIONSHIP PROBLEM SOLVING]

RELATIONSHIP PROBLEM SOLVING This is a high level discussion board for solving ongoing, day-to-day relationship conflicts. Members are welcomed to express frustration but must seek constructive solutions to problems. This is not a place for relationship "stay" or "leave" discussions. Please read the specific guidelines for this group.

[Cat Familiar]

My husband is always questioning if the cats still love him.  And he can feel rejected by a cat if the cat doesn't pay enough attention to him!

And he wonders if the horse I bought for him still remembers him. If he would just spend some time with him, Blue might be a bit more demonstrative. Horses have great memories and he knows when he's being ignored. Of course I don't say that.

[ColdEthyl]

My husband is always questioning if the cats still love him.  And he can feel rejected by a cat if the cat doesn't pay enough attention to him!

And he wonders if the horse I bought for him still remembers him. If he would just spend some time with him, Blue might be a bit more demonstrative. Horses have great memories and he knows when he's being ignored. Of course I don't say that.

Again CF... .the similarities are astonishing. Mine is always saying the dog respects him as Alpha but he loves me more. He also says if the dog was female... .it would totally be his. PS... .my D14's dog is female... .and she likes me better as well

[Cat Familiar]

My husband is always wondering if people like him too. Yet, he is the first to reject someone for not meeting his stringent criteria. (How I ever passed the test, I don't know.  )

We had dinner last week with an old friend of his and his young girlfriend. The guy is kind of skeezy, but he's intelligent and is interesting--oddly enough he's a psychologist and he will say the most inappropriate things in public. (We're in a Thai restaurant, he dates a young Singaporean woman and he turns to my husband and me and says, "All these Asians look alike." I just roll my eyes.

So, after this dinner, without any further issues, my husband proclaims to me that this is the last time we'll ever see this guy. He's always like that and my husband has been long distance friends with him ever since he was in law school. When the weather warms up, they certainly will be dropping by to use our swimming pool. So whatever, I think and let that proclamation slide without responding.

And on Saturday, he's going to take out a former colleague, who is now dating a former county supervisor that my husband had also worked with. He tried to get out of seeing them, then caved and now he's telling me that is the last time he wants to see her. She was his best friend for several years when he worked at a job he despised. But now they have nothing in common. (Kinda sets off my radar--he really liked her when she was single, but now he has nothing in common with her. They were such good buddies at work that some of their colleagues thought they were dating. He says his relationship was one of a mentor and now she has advanced in her career and they don't talk much. At the time, I wondered if anything was going on, due to my history with my first husband running around with women behind my back and in plain sight and since I wasn't jealous--I didn't even see it.)  I don't think that was the case, but who knows?

[Cat Familiar]

Last night as I was preparing to go to bed, my husband told me that his feelings were hurt the last time we slept in the same bed because his favorite cat slept on my side!  

I wanted to laugh, but I didn't.

[ColdEthyl]

Last night as I was preparing to go to bed, my husband told me that his feelings were hurt the last time we slept in the same bed because his favorite cat slept on my side!  

I wanted to laugh, but I didn't.

Good girl for you to be able to stop from laughing! I have a really hard time sometimes!

About your husband's co-worker... .it's hard to say. Was his behavior towards you at all different during that time? With the way they are able to cut people off... .who knows!

We went to visit my husband's son and family this weekend, and while the guys were gone I talked more to his wife, and we were comparing notes about how they re-write history during an argument and the rages. She started talking about how he will go on and on about something and get mad at her for 'not listening'  and tell her he's going to go on longer now because she cut him off.

We were laughing so hard because even the language they use is similar. Anyways later on they came back... .we were talking for a bit. She said something... .he cut her off and started talking... .forgot what he was saying. She said "So anyways... ." and kept going with what she was talking about before.

He then said if she would have let him finish he would have remembered what it was. We kind of just looked at each other and tried not to laugh.

[Cat Familiar]

Last night as I was preparing to go to bed, my husband told me that his feelings were hurt the last time we slept in the same bed because his favorite cat slept on my side!  

I wanted to laugh, but I didn't.

Good girl for you to be able to stop from laughing! I have a really hard time sometimes!

About your husband's co-worker... .it's hard to say. Was his behavior towards you at all different during that time? With the way they are able to cut people off... .who knows!

We went to visit my husband's son and family this weekend, and while the guys were gone I talked more to his wife, and we were comparing notes about how they re-write history during an argument and the rages. She started talking about how he will go on and on about something and get mad at her for 'not listening'  and tell her he's going to go on longer now because she cut him off.

We were laughing so hard because even the language they use is similar. Anyways later on they came back... .we were talking for a bit. She said something... .he cut her off and started talking... .forgot what he was saying. She said "So anyways... ." and kept going with what she was talking about before.

He then said if she would have let him finish he would have remembered what it was. We kind of just looked at each other and tried not to laugh.

He used to talk a lot about his co-worker and I started wondering.    However, we both previously had relationships where we were betrayed by our spouses and I really doubt that he would do that. I think it just was casual flirting. But you never know. Since I wasn't previously a jealous person (that was before my first husband the sex addict), I really never imagined that a spouse would cheat--how naive.  

But I do think my current husband has gotten a lot of self-worth from women flirting with him. It's funny how he's left behind the metrosexual lawyer in the expensive suit look and has grown his hair long and looks like he should be at Burning Man now.

And I think he was a bit disturbed seeing his co-worker with her boyfriend, who, by the way was a fascinating guy. I could have talked all night with him. Actually, I think we dominated the conversation at dinner. His co-worker had put on some weight and she looked way more casual--actually kind of sloppy--but they were headed to a concert after dinner. Previously she was always impeccably groomed and looked like she should be on the cover of a magazine for women executives. She just wasn't as gorgeous as she used to be, but time changes everyone. She did look happy.

And it's so funny about the self-importance of pwBPD--how they hate being interrupted, though they're so willing to interrupt others!

[ColdEthyl]

Last night as I was preparing to go to bed, my husband told me that his feelings were hurt the last time we slept in the same bed because his favorite cat slept on my side!  

I wanted to laugh, but I didn't.

Good girl for you to be able to stop from laughing! I have a really hard time sometimes!

About your husband's co-worker... .it's hard to say. Was his behavior towards you at all different during that time? With the way they are able to cut people off... .who knows!

We went to visit my husband's son and family this weekend, and while the guys were gone I talked more to his wife, and we were comparing notes about how they re-write history during an argument and the rages. She started talking about how he will go on and on about something and get mad at her for 'not listening'  and tell her he's going to go on longer now because she cut him off.

We were laughing so hard because even the language they use is similar. Anyways later on they came back... .we were talking for a bit. She said something... .he cut her off and started talking... .forgot what he was saying. She said "So anyways... ." and kept going with what she was talking about before.

He then said if she would have let him finish he would have remembered what it was. We kind of just looked at each other and tried not to laugh.

He used to talk a lot about his co-worker and I started wondering.    However, we both previously had relationships where we were betrayed by our spouses and I really doubt that he would do that. I think it just was casual flirting. But you never know. Since I wasn't previously a jealous person (that was before my first husband the sex addict), I really never imagined that a spouse would cheat--how naive.  

But I do think my current husband has gotten a lot of self-worth from women flirting with him. It's funny how he's left behind the metrosexual lawyer in the expensive suit look and has grown his hair long and looks like he should be at Burning Man now.

And I think he was a bit disturbed seeing his co-worker with her boyfriend, who, by the way was a fascinating guy. I could have talked all night with him. Actually, I think we dominated the conversation at dinner. His co-worker had put on some weight and she looked way more casual--actually kind of sloppy--but they were headed to a concert after dinner. Previously she was always impeccably groomed and looked like she should be on the cover of a magazine for women executives. She just wasn't as gorgeous as she used to be, but time changes everyone. She did look happy.

And it's so funny about the self-importance of pwBPD--how they hate being interrupted, though they're so willing to interrupt others!

Yeah they do get inflated with flirts/attention it's possible that's all it was. My husband was also cheated on, so I know part of his paranoia is from that. He talks about it when he apologizes for assuming something.

My husband also get a lot of attention from females. He's a good looking guy, and they are magnetic with their personalities. I think if he was ever going to cheat, his behavior would tell on him. I would most likely be painted super black, and he would invent things to get mad at me so he could run off. That's just a theory, though.

[Grey Kitty]

He used to talk a lot about his co-worker and I started wondering.    However, we both previously had relationships where we were betrayed by our spouses and I really doubt that he would do that. I think it just was casual flirting. But you never know. Since I wasn't previously a jealous person (that was before my first husband the sex addict), I really never imagined that a spouse would cheat--how naive.  

Cat, let me pass some advice along to you about this. I'm not normally a jealous person either. I've been somewhat jealous of guys in my wife's life before... .and looking back at it, there always was a good reason for me to be jealous. My jealousy may have missed some things, but every time it was triggered, it was 100% correct.

And let me be clear. That doesn't mean that my wife was cheating with the guy who evoked those feelings in me. However, she was at least doing more than just flirting for fun (which she does do). There was something else going on, or she was thinking about something else. Sometimes it was an emotional affair kind of thing.

Don't assume that he is cheating just because you are jealous--that is reading more into your jealousy than really is there. But do pay attention.

My takeaway is that if I am jealous of a specific person in my wife's life, then there *IS* something going on there, and my intuition is telling me that I need to pay attention and examine the situation more closely. You would do well to do the same.

[Cat Familiar]

He used to talk a lot about his co-worker and I started wondering.    However, we both previously had relationships where we were betrayed by our spouses and I really doubt that he would do that. I think it just was casual flirting. But you never know. Since I wasn't previously a jealous person (that was before my first husband the sex addict), I really never imagined that a spouse would cheat--how naive.  

Cat, let me pass some advice along to you about this. I'm not normally a jealous person either. I've been somewhat jealous of guys in my wife's life before... .and looking back at it, there always was a good reason for me to be jealous. My jealousy may have missed some things, but every time it was triggered, it was 100% correct.

And let me be clear. That doesn't mean that my wife was cheating with the guy who evoked those feelings in me. However, she was at least doing more than just flirting for fun (which she does do). There was something else going on, or she was thinking about something else. Sometimes it was an emotional affair kind of thing.

Don't assume that he is cheating just because you are jealous--that is reading more into your jealousy than really is there. But do pay attention.

My takeaway is that if I am jealous of a specific person in my wife's life, then there *IS* something going on there, and my intuition is telling me that I need to pay attention and examine the situation more closely. You would do well to do the same.

Grey Kitty, that's really good advice, thank you. While I don't think he'd cheat, it certainly made me question what was going on with their relationship several years ago when he first started working at that new job. He had come from a very metropolitan area to be with me and then found himself working as an attorney in a good ole boy backwoods government office and this woman was the only person he could relate to. I met some of his other co-workers and I really understood what he was talking about. He was definitely not exaggerating.

She helped him buy presents for me; she ordered the cake for our wedding; we had dinner with her and her on-again off-again boyfriend on a couple of occasions. Once when she visited us, she said that she had wanted to find someone "just like" my husband. That really set off my radar.  

His work involved advising her (she was a department head) and now she has advanced in her career amongst the yahoos, and the county government is evolving in a more twenty-first century direction. He's retired now and she's more confident, so she no longer relies upon his advice--so he has lost his usefulness. And the fact is that her attractiveness (and availability as she's in a serious relationship now) has diminished.

What was surprising was that my husband was actually dreading seeing her and her boyfriend for dinner. (He had also previously worked with her boyfriend, a former elected official who is a genuinely nice guy.) My husband was thinking he would cut ties with her (and this is the same guy who complains about not having any friends) and I said, "But she was your best friend." And he replied, "In that context."

So, it really made me wonder why he was so willing to let go of that relationship.   

[Grey Kitty]

The jealousy/intuition tells you that something that matters to you/your marriage is happening.

Like I said... .it doesn't tell you the result.

Your H has BPD. He's not good with close relationships... .that's why you are posting here ! So his blowing up a r/s shouldn't be a huge surprise. Getting a whiff of abandonment from her, and deciding to cut her off completely fits the BPD playbook pretty well too.

Whatever risk there was seems to have spent itself without becoming a real problem.

[Cat Familiar]

The jealousy/intuition tells you that something that matters to you/your marriage is happening.

Like I said... .it doesn't tell you the result.

Your H has BPD. He's not good with close relationships... .that's why you are posting here ! So his blowing up a r/s shouldn't be a huge surprise. Getting a whiff of abandonment from her, and deciding to cut her off completely fits the BPD playbook pretty well too.

Whatever risk there was seems to have spent itself without becoming a real problem.

The BPD playbook indeed! I keep thinking that his behavior should make sense (although I know it doesn't). Does it ever get less confusing to be in a relationship with a pwBPD?     Thanks for the reminder.

[Notwendy]

Cat and GK- I recall a coworker like that. I wrote on a previous post that my H admitted she tried to seduce him. I was always suspicious of that r/s. At the time, my H was painting me black. It all fit together. They were close for about 10 years. Eventually she left town. He has always denied it was more. But I agree with GK- I am not usually jealous. I did protect myself and go to my own gyno for a check up for any sexually transmitted diseases. I knew she had been with others. My H would be horrified if he knew I did that. Although I had no proof he was doing anything, I was never sure enough.

On the other hand, if he met up with her, or someone for lunch, and told me about it, I would let it go, because, being upset wouldn't have made a difference. I was upset about the one I mentioned, but if he was going to do anything, that would not have changed it.

The other reason is that it makes me crazy to be subjected to his jealousy over the few times I have had the chance to meet old friends who are not romantic in any sense. I don't socialize with men in general, there isn't much desire to as well as the fact that as a mom, I am usually with other moms and kids. However, there are a couple of men who don't live near me who I grew up with, and they are happily married with wonderful wives. The few times I have had the chance to see them, my H has had awful- miserable- rages over when we were in private and he was with me the whole visit ( and their wives) With one, he was so angry driving in the car, it was terrifying. His argument is that I wouldn't like it if he saw a female friend like that.  

Actually, even if I didn't like it, I don't believe that being married means you give up your friends, albeit your relationship must consider spouses. So, if I want the freedom to see old friends, he has to have it too. So I'd let it go. If he's going to cheat, he'd do it anyway, and I believe that if someone cheats, it's more about them than the partner.

[Cat Familiar]

Thanks, Notwendy. When my intuition tells me that something is possibly going on, I'm not going to ignore it. I really think that my husband is trustworthy, but he loves to get emotional support (or admiration) from women. Actually, I'm not really sure what he gets, but I think whatever it is feeds his ego. He knows I see too deeply into him and that I know his weaknesses, so getting props from women who don't know about his mental illness and substance abuse probably makes him feel "normal."

There is a woman he's known for decades. She was friends with his ex-wife and is very beautiful. My ex-husband had a major crush on her. My current husband wanted to date her after his previous marriage fell apart, but she only was interested in being his friend. However, she is a tremendous flirt and apparently is now an alcoholic. Fortunately she lives hundreds of miles away, but she did visit our area once. I was certain that she was attempting to seduce him, so I made sure that she had no opportunities to do that. I told my husband my concerns, and he brushed them off, but then later, he admitted that I may have been correct in my assumption and that she was "crazy" and in a desperate economic situation.

They did keep in contact occasionally and my husband learned that this woman seduced the husband of her best friend and was reduced to sneaking out the dog door when her friend returned home unexpectedly.

Since then, we've gotten occasional drunk dialing calls from her at midnight. I told my husband in no uncertain terms that this is completely inappropriate and he let her know that her behavior was unacceptable and extremely rude and disrespectful to me.

I think this woman has used her sexuality for years and whenever she has contacted my husband, she has run out of other options for the moment. Fortunately I think he has realized that my assessment of her is most likely correct.

[Notwendy]

I understand this. My H has a wonderful persona with people he is not intimate with. He saves the rages for me. I would not have been as upset with this other woman if he had not painted me black at the time and was treating me poorly. She idolized him, and at least was a source of ego gratification. Meanwhile, I'm home alone with the kids and my self esteem dropped.

This woman also was very flirty and seductive and not just with my H. I actually began to suspect she might have BPD by her idealization and dramatic behavior.  I've wondered if my H's decision to try to improve the marriage was as much a part of her drama as  my being depressed at the time.

I do not doubt he liked the attention, but I think he prefers the caretaker type.

At any rate, she left town, and I haven't been concerned since. In the meantime, some of my friends' marriages broke up over cheating, and I read about it out of curiosity. It's usually the fault of both people in a way, and more about the cheater than the one cheated on. I know some serial cheaters, and they seem to only want the initial thrill of the relationship, not the long term part, some are narcisistic.

In the end, I can only decide for myself what I can do. If he's gonna cheat, he will. I can't really have restrictions on who he sees as he will then turn around on me and say how much I upset him by wanting to see my childhood friends.

[Cat Familiar]

My first husband was a serial cheater, but I did not know about that until I was well into the relationship.

He moved into my life when I was at a really low and weak point and he was very attentive and caring. I really wasn't that into him, but he was persistent and I just went along with what I thought was "meant to be." It wasn't long before the cheating started and the lying. He was very good at weaving a narrative to distract me from what he was really doing and I naively bought into it.

I sort of blamed myself because I was never "in love with him" although I did love him, or at least tried to. So if he were to cheat, it was because of something that I was unable or unwilling to give him, or so I thought. (I think a lot of cheaters are narcissists and are very good at manipulating their victims to believe there's some deficiency within them which justifies the cheating behavior.)

Anyway, after years of dealing with his bad behavior (he was also physically and verbally abusive), my self-esteem was in the toilet. It was a perfect set-up for him--he could get away with whatever he wanted because I was too weak and afraid to leave. But ultimately I drew a line in the sand and told myself that I was just waiting to die in this relationship and that I was out the door if violence or infidelity happened again. (This is a sign of having faith in him, despite evidence. I somehow believed his promises that he had changed and that his bad behavior was now in the past.)

So when the violence happened, I had to either choose me or waiting for a slow death in this relationship. I chose me. I left. It was really hard. But I have not had a moment of regret.

[Notwendy]

Smart woman.

I know a serial cheater as he dated a friend of mine. Although she was kicking herself for falling for him I remind her that any woman who was available to him would. The man is that good. I knew him through some volunteer work. Fortunately, he has no interest in me and knows I am on to him, so we have a superficial and congenial work relationship. It's as if he has compartmentalized his unromantic relationships and then, his victims. He's an even keel pleasant and congenial person with those he has no other interest in, but with his victims, he turns on the charm- and he's good. Its a complete act, but it's hard to tell unless you know someone he has dated. He's very romantic, declares he's in love, the women are swooning. Then, when they are settled in with him, he's abusive.

[Cat Familiar]

I count my blessings that I'm out of that first marriage and when things get challenging with my current husband, I realize I've been through so much worse. It's hard to be in a relationship with a substance abuser, but he's always been kind and supportive (in general--not those times when he has dysregulated).

My first husband assaulted his next wife, was arrested, left town before his arraignment, and currently has an active arrest warrant, so it's unlikely that I'll ever see him again, thankfully.

[Notwendy]

Yes, you are much better off. I count my blessings I didn't fall for someone like the person I know. I also don't blame the women who fall for him. It makes me cringe to think he could hurt people like that, and seem so pleasant to others.

[Cat Familiar]

Yes, you are much better off. I count my blessings I didn't fall for someone like the person I know. I also don't blame the women who fall for him. It makes me cringe to think he could hurt people like that, and seem so pleasant to others.

I wish there was a way to out guys like that so that more women are not taken in and hurt.

[Notwendy]

I do too. I think people knew, but he was able to convince women that they were the one. I think he believed it too, but was not aware of the devaluing phase- push pull thing which he must have done too. Or he was that sociopathic.

[Grey Kitty]

Yes, you are much better off. I count my blessings I didn't fall for someone like the person I know. I also don't blame the women who fall for him. It makes me cringe to think he could hurt people like that, and seem so pleasant to others.

I wish there was a way to out guys like that so that more women are not taken in and hurt.

HINT: Posting publicly on facebook to all your friends that he is that kind of guy isn't the solution you are wishing for!  I've got a woman who is a FB friend who did that recently. [I don't know the guy she 'outed']  She's a sweet person, but generates waaaaaay to much drama, so this is less of a surprise that it might be. Fortunately she's living far far away from me!

[Notwendy]

Facebook isn't a good place for drama but there is plenty of it there.

[ColdEthyl]

Facebook isn't a good place for drama but there is plenty of it there.

I'm always fascinated by the amount of people willing to air their dirty laundry to everyone from co-workers, high school friends, family, etc. Even more so, the ones willing to drag their spouse threw the mud. *shakes head*

Yeah it would be nice to 'out' these guys, but social media is a double-edged sword.

[Cat Familiar]

Our world is so different than the days when people lived in small towns and villages. Even though I'm in a fairly small rural area, there is still a lot of anonymity. But people in this area certainly can develop "reputations."

It's frustrating to see these serial predators prey upon unsuspecting victims, but I agree that social media is not the place for outing them. And have you ever tried to warn a friend about their latest unreliable love object? Certainly doesn't play well and there's no use later for the "I told you so's."

[EaglesJuju]

This thread has reached its post limit, and is now closed. This is a worthwhile topic, and you are free to start a new thread to continue the conversation. Thanks for your understanding... .