Coping with hurtful comments

[EaglesJuju]

A couple of days ago my bf had an epic rage towards me on the phone. He said probably one of the most hurtful things imaginable. He never said anything like that this before; it was that bad.  After his lengthy diatribe, he started talking like nothing happened and how I was so amazing.  Unfortunately, I cannot forget the awful thing that he said to me. Usually, I can cope with the projection/rage, but this is an entirely different level.  How do you cope with comments that are extremely hurtful? 

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[Cat Familiar]

EJ, I'm so sorry to hear this. It sounds like an outlier event in your otherwise happy relationship.   

It's so amazing how they can completely do a 180 and act like nothing happened, yet they sure wouldn't accept us behaving that way. 

Do you want to confront him about what he said? I probably would be seething if I were in your shoes and want to bring it up.   I've been avoiding confronting my husband on little things he says and does, but sometimes I wonder if I'm building up resentment. This, however sounds like a very big thing. Do you think talking with him would be of any benefit?

[EaglesJuju]

Do you want to confront him about what he said? I probably would be seething if I were in your shoes and want to bring it up.   I've been avoiding confronting my husband on little things he says and does, but sometimes I wonder if I'm building up resentment. This, however sounds like a very big thing. Do you think talking with him would be of any benefit?

Thanks Cat.   

I want to bring it up, but I can see it triggering him.  Along with the terrible comment, he told me that he knows exactly what to say to hurt me and sometimes he does that. That leaves me somewhat conflicted on whether to say anything or not.

[formflier]

 

Couple thoughts here.

There is the issue about what... .if anything you do about the comments that were recently said.

There is an issue of what to do about future things that come up.

How do you think you would like to handle the same conversation in the future... .?

I'll do some thinking on the comments you are dealing with now... .but I think it is likely that you will need to pick a good time... .and tread carefully.  Stick to I statements... .talk about how you feel... .vice blame him.

Be ready to exit if it starts getting bad... .

Thoughts?

[Restored2]

Hi Eaglesjuju.  I feel for what you are going through.  It is not an easy position for you to be in.  Is your bf in counselling/therapy for his BPD?  If not, then this could be good reason for him to go.

[123Phoebe]

A couple of days ago my bf had an epic rage towards me on the phone. He said probably one of the most hurtful things imaginable. He never said anything like that this before; it was that bad.  After his lengthy diatribe, he started talking like nothing happened and how I was so amazing.  Unfortunately, I cannot forget the awful thing that he said to me. Usually, I can cope with the projection/rage, but this is an entirely different level.   

That's just stinky and yuck, EaglesJuju

How do you think you would like to handle the same conversation in the future... .?

This is a really good question.  Would you handle it any differently?

How do you cope with comments that are extremely hurtful? 

I don't listen to future ones and make it known.  That that is an area we don't want to go... .

[EaglesJuju]

There is the issue about what... .if anything you do about the comments that were recently said.

There is an issue of what to do about future things that come up.

How do you think you would like to handle the same conversation in the future... .?

Be ready to exit if it starts getting bad... .

FF, I should have said something when he was raging. Usually when he is projecting, I tell him to stop projecting or lashing out at me, because that is not constructive communication. That primarily works and he apologizes and stops. One a rare occasion, if he does not stop, I tell him I will talk to him another time.  I know all his triggers, but I was really unprepared for this rage.  I just shut up and took it. My own issues ended up getting triggered and I was in a state of shock.  

Deciding whether or not to say something is reliant on a few things. Do I just let it go and chalk it up to "projection?" Do I say something because he should be held accountable?  Will saying anything make me feel better or provide a different outcome in the future?  Should bringing this up be done in front of a professional?

Since the rage, he has not mentioned the rage or any of the things he said.  He has been on his best behavior.  

[EaglesJuju]

Is your bf in counselling/therapy for his BPD?  If not, then this could be good reason for him to go.

Hi Restored2,

He is in therapy. He has been working on a lot of issues and I have been seeing progress. I do not know if this was an anomaly or what not. 

[Stalwart]

Hey Eagles:

I can so feel for the situation you're in and just how personal and hurtful some comments can be when a spouse loses control of what they're saying to a point of being hurtful. Probably most of us here have been through that same situation and probably are as full of the same pain that you feel as a result. It really is difficult to 'know' what the right thing to do is in a situation that just isn't right.

I can so see how well you seem to be able to handle the daily irregularities that come as a result of loving someone with this disorder. I'm impressed with your insight and situational control. Of course, none of that makes the deep hurt of really nasty statements better or helps to be able to overcome them easily.

From my own experiences I have always found the best thing to do in really heated situations is not to through fodder into the flame and you may as well have done the right thing at that time to say nothing.

I can also see how difficult it is to hold the fact that it has happened and concern over a repeat. I've had quite a bit of experience in this and at one time I would have probably reacted the way you did, especially when it isn't face to face conversation. If it helps at all there is every chance what he said wasn't a result of anything you said or did and probably totally unrelated to you personally at all, but that doesn't actually dull the sting.

Today I would personally handle that situation differently if confronted by it and it would seem that both of us have had close conversation and communications about what's acceptable and isn't with regards to wounding with words. I would have shut down the conversation immediately while letting her know I disapproved. I would have simply and calmly stated " I know that you're upset but I never would have said anything that hurtful to you or about you, but that's just because I don't have it in me to be that hurtful" and end the conversation.

I know that automatically throws the person into a guilt spiral but I've found it is a lesson learned when you strike back with defensive reasoning and calmly state the case bluntly. For some reason it seems to actually connect. Of course that's totally situational as to why the spouse is actually emotionally distressed and the environment they're in when it happens.

I certain can't advice you because I don't really feel any of us have the full picture of each other's struggles but I do know that ":)o I say something because he should be held accountable? " once the situation is removed might not be the way I would handle it. I suppose it all depends when you reason out his reasons for his dysregulation if he actually was totally in a mind where he was accountable when little can be done later after he's removed and beyond the triggering emotional event.

I've just always found it only worth setting boundaries and expectations when they arise and need to be addressed immediately to try and avoid them in the future.

I really hope you the best in finding your way past the hurt of what he's said and a path that can lead to the same event not happening in the future.

Rick

'

[formflier]

 I just shut up and took it. My own issues ended up getting triggered and I was in a state of shock.  

What does it mean that you were unprepared for it?  What does preparation look like?

Who is responsible for you staying and taking it? 

[Restored2]

Hi EaglesJuju. It's good to know that he is in therapy and has been working through a lot of issues with making progress.  Is it possible to let his therapist know what transpired between you two for them to deal with it?  Seems to me like something should be addressed. 

[EaglesJuju]

What does it mean that you were unprepared for it?  What does preparation look like?

I am pretty adept with knowing if he is dysregulating and his triggers. There is a pattern or a build up to his rages.  This time the rage was completely out of the ordinary. Granted it is more difficult with him being so far away, to recognize certain things.

My view of preparation is to always be cognizant and have the tools to diffuse a situation. 

Who is responsible for you staying and taking it? 

I am responsible for my own behavior. 

[EaglesJuju]

Thanks Stalwart.   

If it helps at all there is every chance what he said wasn't a result of anything you said or did and probably totally unrelated to you personally at all, but that doesn't actually dull the sting.

It is hard to depersonalize hurtful things.  He has told me before that I should not take anything personal when he is lashing out at me and it is his problems.  I am pretty good about letting his projection deflect off of me, many of the times his rages are irrational and contradictory.

Similar to prior rages, the majority of his comments were illogical and contradictory.  This time, the comments were horrible, but his intent (I want to cause you pain because I am in pain) makes it worse. I am struggling most with his intent of actually hurting me on purpose.  That is very tough for me to cope with.   

I certain can't advice you because I don't really feel any of us have the full picture of each other's struggles but I do know that ":)o I say something because he should be held accountable? " once the situation is removed might not be the way I would handle it. I suppose it all depends when you reason out his reasons for his dysregulation if he actually was totally in a mind where he was accountable when little can be done later after he's removed and beyond the triggering emotional event.

The reason I think he should be held accountable is because intentionally hurting someone is unacceptable behavior. I figured out why he was behaving this way. He has been feeling as if I am going to move on. I asked him yesterday if this was the case and he said yes.  Regardless of his reasoning, I feel as if I should address this at some point.

[formflier]

 

Eagles,

One of the things I am constantly trying to figure out... .is when to stay in the trenches and work the tools... .try to understand and all of that... .and when to exit.

I'm getting the vibe that in this case... .you would have been much happier to have said... ."I will be happy to talk about this later when we can talk properly to each other... ." and ended the conversation.

Then... .he could have said all the nasty things he wants... .get all of that out of his system (think about releasing steam or pressure)... .and then get back to a better place.

You would have had no idea about all the things he would have said... .

Any thoughts on this approach? 

[EaglesJuju]

One of the things I am constantly trying to figure out... .is when to stay in the trenches and work the tools... .try to understand and all of that... .and when to exit.

I'm getting the vibe that in this case... .you would have been much happier to have said... ."I will be happy to talk about this later when we can talk properly to each other... ." and ended the conversation.

Then... .he could have said all the nasty things he wants... .get all of that out of his system (think about releasing steam or pressure)... .and then get back to a better place.

You would have had no idea about all the things he would have said... .

Any thoughts on this approach? 

FF,

I tend to stay in the trenches and use the tools when wants to open up about his feelings. He tends to internalize all his feelings by repressing and avoiding. I have been really patient and understanding when he wants to discuss his feelings. It is a huge step for him to open up and he has learned to talk about his feelings in a constructive manner. He tends to use "I feel... ." (I think he picked that up from me.   ) The conversation started out like that, but something must have triggered him and he raged at me. 

I should have said I will discuss this at another time, but my dependency issues got triggered and I reverted to one of my maladaptive coping mechanisms (appeasement and submissiveness). I have put these types of discussions on hold numerous times and returning at a later time ends up being favorable for both of us. 

[formflier]

 

Eagles,

That's what I figured... .and it is commendable for you to do this.  I do it sometimes as well.

Here is my gut reaction... .let the comments go.  You chose to stay in the trenches... .so you can deal with your emotions from that choice.

Hopefully you can pick up things from the talk that you can validate and support.

Do you think that any good can come from you trying to "correct" him on his conversation and what he said to you?  If you think there is a decent chance that you are at the point where he may apologize or it may help... .then by all means... .give it a shot. 

I'm not getting that feeling... .that you are at that point... .but I could be wrong... .

What do you think?

[Cat Familiar]

It's one thing to do the Monday morning quarterbacking and figure out how we could have responded differently, but when our partner gets triggered and triggers something within ourselves, it's damned hard to catch it in the moment and change our response. When this happens to me, I think, how can I strengthen that part of me that is vulnerable, or how can I enclose it within a protective fortress, because I know this type of attack will likely occur again sometime and I want to be prepared for it. (Not a pleasant thought, but certainly a very real possibility.)

So EJ, how can you protect that vulnerable part of you that feels dependent? What strategies can you put in place so that part can feel safe and secure? What have you done in other circumstances to honor the positive parts of dependency, such as trust, surrender, acceptance, yet arm yourself against the possibility of being abused or taken for granted?

 

[EaglesJuju]

Here is my gut reaction... .let the comments go.  You chose to stay in the trenches... .so you can deal with your emotions from that choice.

Hopefully you can pick up things from the talk that you can validate and support.

Do you think that any good can come from you trying to "correct" him on his conversation and what he said to you?  If you think there is a decent chance that you are at the point where he may apologize or it may help... .then by all means... .give it a shot. 

Most likely there will not be a positive outcome of bringing up what he said. He did apologize somewhat after his diatribe.

[EaglesJuju]

So EJ, how can you protect that vulnerable part of you that feels dependent? What strategies can you put in place so that part can feel safe and secure? What have you done in other circumstances to honor the positive parts of dependency, such as trust, surrender, acceptance, yet arm yourself against the possibility of being abused or taken for granted?

 

These are really great questions, unfortunately I wish I had an answer to them.

I am still learning to protect myself from vulnerability. It has always been very hard for me to not be vulnerable.

The only thing I have worked on, with regard to my dependency and relationship, are boundaries.  Before I set boundaries, it was pretty much "anything goes." 

If anyone has any suggestions, I would truly appreciate it.   

[Cat Familiar]

I think vulnerability is a wonderful quality--I would never want to do away with that. It took years of enduring an abusive marriage for me to become acquainted with my inner dragon--the part of me that is fiercely protective. It was always there of course, just slumbering and waiting for me to call upon it, which I never did until the going got really tough.

Since I'm very fond of using my internal dialog to discuss matters with myself (it sounds weird writing that), I explain my boundaries, priorities and needs in a way that is like a committee meeting with the various parts of myself: the vulnerable part, the efficient part, the dragon, etc. And the most appropriate part conducts business that needs to be taken care of.

For example, the vulnerable part soothes a friend's broken heart. I wouldn't send the efficiency expert to do that. The dragon lady deals with a contractor who isn't keeping his word. (She can be equal parts charming and persuasive.)

If you turn it into a game with yourself, it can be a lot of fun.

[Enoch]

I am sorry you went thru that. But, even though we don't know each other and I've not read your posts before, my greater concern is for your emotional and mental health. I wonder why you stayed on the phone. My experience (35 years married to the same DBPDW) has evidenced that staying on the phone during a rage never helps the situation. She only gets more angry and I get more desperate and defensive.

Staying mindful and maintaining my boundaries is the only thing that helps me. (I'm not really all that interested in helping her. It's her choice to get help and I cannot fix her) I stay calm and slowly remind her that I will not stay on the phone when she is ranting. I remind her calmly and if she continues, I deliberately say, "I am hanging up now"... .I do not wait and I do not give a second chance. NO more logic or explanation, I just hang up and then turn off my phone. Boundaries are for protection not punishment. After about 20 or so times of consistently applying this boundary, she knows it's going to happen. It hasn't stopped her from dysregulating, but it has stopped me from getting involved in the chaos. I haven't stuck around long enough to hear a hurtful comment in a long time.

I urge you to try it consistently... .for your own health.

I walk away from these rants when in her presence. I keep keys and my phone with me. I have a safety plan and don't hesitate to use it. The rants and dysregulations are still there... .but much less frequent only because I refuse to stick around long enough for the escalation to suck me in. I am not indifferent to her mental condition. I just cannot help her.

You do not have to stay and listen to that stuff. You are worth more than that. And you won't likely get any satisfaction from your BPDso.


I realize there are about 25 "I" statements here. Probably comes across like a lecture. Sorry for that. We just don't have time to learn these lessons slowly... .too much damage done to our mental health.

[EaglesJuju]

I think vulnerability is a wonderful quality--I would never want to do away with that. It took years of enduring an abusive marriage for me to become acquainted with my inner dragon--the part of me that is fiercely protective. It was always there of course, just slumbering and waiting for me to call upon it, which I never did until the going got really tough.

Since I'm very fond of using my internal dialog to discuss matters with myself (it sounds weird writing that), I explain my boundaries, priorities and needs in a way that is like a committee meeting with the various parts of myself: the vulnerable part, the efficient part, the dragon, etc. And the most appropriate part conducts business that needs to be taken care of.

For example, the vulnerable part soothes a friend's broken heart. I wouldn't send the efficiency expert to do that. The dragon lady deals with a contractor who isn't keeping his word. (She can be equal parts charming and persuasive.)

If you turn it into a game with yourself, it can be a lot of fun.

Thanks for this Cat.    I am going to try it.  I can be very passive and submissive. Although I do have a part of me that is similar to your dragon.  That part of me is what I think of as an oak tree. I am going to think of that when I get triggered.

[EaglesJuju]

I am sorry you went thru that. But, even though we don't know each other and I've not read your posts before, my greater concern is for your emotional and mental health. I wonder why you stayed on the phone. My experience (35 years married to the same DBPDW) has evidenced that staying on the phone during a rage never helps the situation. She only gets more angry and I get more desperate and defensive.

Thank you for the reply Enoch.  I have been practicing mindfulness for a little while, but I still need a little more practice.

I usually do not stay on the phone or deal with my bf when he is raging.  This time I stayed on the phone because the rage triggered me. I suffer from dependent personality disorder and occasionally I will get triggered.  Although I have recovered from a majority of my maladaptive traits, there still are a few that I am still working on. 

[formflier]

 

Eagles,

Can you explain mindfulness to everyone... .and how it has been affecting you and your r/s?

[EaglesJuju]

Can you explain mindfulness to everyone... .and how it has been affecting you and your r/s?

Mindfulness is honing our minds on the present without judgment or attachment.  When we are mindful we are aware and alert in the present.  On the other hand, when we are not mindful there is a tendency to block, suppress, reject, or avoid the present moment.  

There are different states of the mind: "reasonable mind," "emotion mind," and "wise mind."  When we are using our "reasonable mind," we tend to focus on facts and logical and rational reasons. Thinking with "reasonable mind" is devoid of emotions.  When we are using our "emotional mind," we tend to focus completely on our emotion states.  "Wise mind" is the balance and synthesis of both "emotional mind" and "reasonable mind."  It goes beyond  "emotional mind" and "reasonable mind" and adds intuitive knowing.  

There are various exercises one can do to practice mindfulness, such as breathing and meditative exercises.  

I have a lot of problems with my "emotion mind" eclipsing my "reasonable mind." As a result of my dependent personality disorder, my feelings/emotions of fear and anxiety can be very overwhelming at times.  This incident with my bf triggered my "emotion mind" and I was not able to think with my "reasonable mind" or balance both into "wise mind." Mindfulness does take practice, but when I am able to do it, I can react more calmly to many of his behaviors.  For example, my bf's favorite maladaptive coping mechanism is avoidance.  His avoidance behaviors used to trigger me badly.  After I started practicing mindfulness, I stopped having fear and anxiety when he would engage in those behaviors. I felt upset because he was avoiding me, but I logically knew why he was doing it. Both my logic and emotions balanced each other and I ended up feeling not really affected.  

I see what you did there FF.       

Here is some more information on wise mind.  

TOOLS: Triggering, Mindfulness, and the Wise Mind

[Ophelia71]

EaglesJuju,

You have really touched home when you mentioned to your bf to stop lashing out on you. I have told my husband to stop yelling or taking things out on me. Lately, I have been telling him that I cannot have this conversation with him while he is angry or upset. I go to my bedroom to avoid him. It makes him so mad. Like right now he is sleeping on the couch giving me the "silent treatment". Like you I am dealing with my own emotions such as not being able to work, possibly looking at having surgery on my back, and then to keep dealing with my husband emotional outburst which created my anxiety issues which in turn now I have adjustment issues meaning I am having a hard time coping with stressor or traumatic events in my life. I feel for you when it comes to coping with hurtful comments. I can forgive my husband for that, but the stress is just not good for my health or blood pressure. I have been trying to live with tomorrow is a brand new day and hopefully a better day. I never know what kind of day I will have with my husband. I do know the mode he is in now, he will be like this for at least two days before he comes out of his bad mood. Thinking of you... .

[formflier]

 

Ophelia71,

It sounds like you are doing the right thing... .are you trying to enforce a boundary? 

If you could give us some more details on how the interaction goes we he starts to yell... .we can probably help you get a better result... .or feel more confident in how you approach it.

I'm glad you have found us and are posting here about your experiences... .I think we can help you... .and your openness will help others

[Restored2]

Is your bf in counselling/therapy for his BPD?  If not, then this could be good reason for him to go.

Hi Restored2,

He is in therapy. He has been working on a lot of issues and I have been seeing progress. I do not know if this was an anomaly or what not. 

Hi EaglesJuju.  Glad to hear that he is in therapy and working on a lot of issues with progress being seen.  Hopefully everything stabilizes with him staying on the right track.  You need a break from the stress of the drama.

[EaglesJuju]

Glad to hear that he is in therapy and working on a lot of issues with progress being seen.  Hopefully everything stabilizes with him staying on the right track.  You need a break from the stress of the drama.

Thank you Restored2.    He has been on the right track for awhile, and has been figuring out why he tends to self-sabotage and is trying to curb his impulsive behaviors. Unfortunately, lately he has been really depressed.  I think the rage was a culmination of his abandonment fears, depression, and self-loathing. Regardless, I do need a break from the drama. 

[Restored2]

You're welcome, EaglesJuju.  It sounds like he is really trying, despite the recent rage.  I have been taking a natural supplement for my depression called 5-HTP (5-Hydroxytryptophan).  Basically, it is tryptophan to increase serotonin levels.  It has been very helpful in my battle.