push/pull is making me dizzy

[Jessica84]

Bizarre text exchange the other day... .I still can't decipher it.

Totally out of the blue, I get hit with... .

Him: Do you want me to stop calling you?

Me: Why?

Him: Because we aren't going out anymore and you want me to die.

Me: What? I don't want you to die!  (News to me since we never had a conversation about breaking up)

He changes the subject and starts talking about his health, work, and other random topics. Then invites me over - I tell him I thought we weren't going out anymore?

His response: "I am mentally ill. I cannot be held to my words". 

I go over there and everything's fine. Next day he's distant. Day after he's fine again. Today, he calls me to tell me he doesn't want to talk to anyone. What? Then why did he call? Every day he's different. Even his voice is different.

How did I let a mentally ill person take control of our r/s? That is so upside down it makes me dizzy! Now I'm sitting here not knowing where we stand. Are we together? Are we friends? Are we nothing? Is this a head game? If so, he wins. I don't know the rules or how to play this one. I get the push/pull thing, but this is getting ridiculous... .

[RELATIONSHIP PROBLEM SOLVING]

RELATIONSHIP PROBLEM SOLVING This is a high level discussion board for solving ongoing, day-to-day relationship conflicts. Members are welcomed to express frustration but must seek constructive solutions to problems. This is not a place for relationship "stay" or "leave" discussions. Please read the specific guidelines for this group.

[formflier]

 

Do you want to take back control of your r/s? 

What kind of reaction do you think he is looking for in his odd texts that he sends you... .

Those are a bit different... .

[Jessica84]

I don't need control. But clearly he's out of control. He's not making any sense. This depression came on like a lightning bolt, complete with suicide ideation. He's been pushing everyone away, except for me, and now me too.

He thinks I want him to die? Maybe he wants to die, but I certainly don't want him to.

I don't know what kind of response he was looking for with that. 

I wish he would stop talking in riddles. I worry he's looking for a reason to hurt himself. If he wants to use the "nobody loves me" excuse to justify it, it's not going to work. I do love him. I'm still there for him. Wish he'd stop this madness and realize that. But I guess it's not that simple.

[Notwendy]

Is he in treatment?

What he is saying isn't making much sense is it? It is perhaps because he isn't making much sense to himself- one minute he thinks one thing, the next, something else.

You can't control his thoughts, but if you are concerned that he is at a point of being dangerous to himself or others, you can call appropriate mental health services- 911, his therapist.

You can also determine for yourself what is real to you- your feelings, your reality, regardless of what he is saying. You can be loving and supportive, but if he is depressed and having suicidal ideation, he needs professional help.

[Jessica84]

He's not in any real treatment. He looked into going into a 30-day mental health facility but then worried about his business reputation if anyone found out. Truth is his rep is already damaged by his behaviors over the last year.

His psychiatrist told him to give the anti-depressants "more time". What a crock. I've suggested going to a psychologist or specialist or some type of group therapy, but he's not interested.

He's made no suicide threats yet so calling 911 seems premature. I spoke to a counselor who said having an ambulance arrive at his home or work if he's not at such risk could be more traumatic and embarrassing to him.

I'm out of ideas at this point and at a difficult crossroads... .

1) Does continuing to be supportive as a friend hurt him or help him?

I'd like to be there for him, but I know he struggles with "grey areas" - such as an undefined r/s.

2) Would going NC so he can figure things out on his own hurt or help him?

I worry he'd feel abandoned. Then again, it might make him finally seek real professional help.

I really don't know what to do anymore. I'm not a typical "rescuer" - I usually walk away from high-maintenance or difficult people. I can usually spot them a mile away and never even get close to people like this. So this is all new territory for me.

I love this man enough to do whatever is best for him and his deteriorating mental health... .even if it means I don't get the r/s of my dreams... .or I get painted black in the process. I'll live with it.

Without a magic crystal ball, I don't know the right thing to do?

[Mr.Downtrodden]

Bizarre text exchange the other day... .I still can't decipher it.

Totally out of the blue, I get hit with... .

Him: Do you want me to stop calling you?

Me: Why?

Him: Because we aren't going out anymore and you want me to die.

Me: What? I don't want you to die!  (News to me since we never had a conversation about breaking up)

He changes the subject and starts talking about his health, work, and other random topics. Then invites me over - I tell him I thought we weren't going out anymore?

His response: "I am mentally ill. I cannot be held to my words".  

I go over there and everything's fine. Next day he's distant. Day after he's fine again. Today, he calls me to tell me he doesn't want to talk to anyone. What? Then why did he call? Every day he's different. Even his voice is different.

How did I let a mentally ill person take control of our r/s? That is so upside down it makes me dizzy! Now I'm sitting here not knowing where we stand. Are we together? Are we friends? Are we nothing? Is this a head game? If so, he wins. I don't know the rules or how to play this one. I get the push/pull thing, but this is getting ridiculous... .

It all depends on what day it is.  Not trying to be funny, that's how it is once the love-bombing honeymoon period wears off.

[formflier]

 

Jessica,

OK... .I need help understanding "not in real treatment... " and being under the care of a P.

Probably need more of the story laid out again.

What is his diagnosis?

How often does he see the P?

Just one medication?

Any idea what test the P gave him?

[formflier]

Bizarre text exchange the other day... .I still can't decipher it.

Totally out of the blue, I get hit with... .

Him: Do you want me to stop calling you?

Me: Why?

Him: Because we aren't going out anymore and you want me to die.

Me: What? I don't want you to die!  (News to me since we never had a conversation about breaking up)

Jessica,

I'm not picking at you... .but suggesting that you could have influenced this exchange to go to a much healthier place... .maybe.

He asks a direct question... .and gets a question in return... .instead of an answer.  (full disclosure... .this is "an issue" for me in my r/s)... .   It can be bothersome and/or triggering to me... .and it could be to him as well.

What would have happened if you had cleared said... .

"Please continue to call... .I enjoy our conversations.  Can I call you in 5 minutes and we can catch up on things?"

If he makes ridiculous claims about you wanting him to die... .

Either ignore it... because your response most likely invalidated him... .maybe.  Or mention that this is a subject to talk properly about in person.

Also note... .for my r/s... .getting away from text has been a wonderful thing.  Zero r/s issues are discussed via text... .and about the same for email.

[Jessica84]

Thanks FF, fair enough about my responses! He kind of blindsides me at times. 

Officially, he's diagnosed with OCD, anxiety and now depression. He has all 9 BPD traits but remains undiagnosed with any PD. Basically he tells his symptoms and a drug gets prescribed. Then another drug to offset the side effects of the first, and so on... .modern medicine at its finest. Quick sessions, no lengthy discussions. To me, that's not "real therapy".

He's been to several psychiatrists, but not on a regular basis - only when he needs a prescription refilled. He asked the current psychiatrist if he was bipolar and was told he wasn't. I asked about testing - whether he took any kind of personality tests - he said no. I don't get how they can diagnose anything without testing? Brain scan? Blood work? Anything?

Last summer he went off ALL his meds at once without consulting a doctor (Lexapro, Klonopin, Wellbutrin, Adderol). He went thru withdrawals for about a month, then seemed better... .for awhile. He got back on Wellbutrin in December because of the suicide ideation. Then back on the Klonopin in January. I'm sure he'll be on all of them again, eventually.

Now he tells me he's been "experimenting" by not taking his blood pressure pill one day, then taking it the next but not the Wellbutrin. He's also been taking them at different times of the day to see if that "helps his mood swings" and his energy level. Oh Lord... .no wonder he's acting so erratic.

He also explained this is why he can't be in a r/s right now. He's been suffering fatigue, depression, extremely moody and more unpredictable - and doesn't want to hurt me while he's trying to figure his health out. He wants desperately to feel "normal". I told him I'm here for him if he needs me. He seemed grateful for that.

I wish I could help but I can't. All I can do is support him and hope he finds his way out of this hell. And protect myself in the meantime. It would help for me to remember what he's going thru when he says crazy things! There are times I simply forget, especially when he's having a "good" day.

[formflier]

 

The stuff he is doing... .experimenting... .is dangerous.

It's not your fault... .

But... .somehow... .I would think you want to tell him you won't discuss the dangerous behavior with him... .and drop it.

He may be wanting you to plead with him to get back on meds... .who knows.

Basically... .IMO... you don't want to in anyway enable it.

[sweetheart]

Hello jessica84,

What you describe for an apt with a P is fairly typical in my experience. For diagnosing any type of mental illness, testing is not necessary. Diagnosis are made on presenting symptoms and history. The P will use a diagnostic manual that is used here in the UK and will prescribe medication on a symptom led basis. There is a lot of trial and error, there is also a reluctance here in the UK to mention BPD even in my h's case and he is diagnosed with it. It is also made more difficult when each time it is a different P, unfortunately so much diagnosis in my opinion is open to interpretation and how the person presents on any given day. That's why a regular P is really important.

What your bf is doing with his medication is similar to what my h does from time to time as he hates feeling. 'defective.' My h has reduced himself on and off his meds without P supervision many times over the years. I see a mix of denial of his condition and self-destructive behaviour patterns in this. FF is right of course it is dangerous. I am in a position where I inform his mental health team and they now address it immediately.

It must be difficult for you to see this happening but there really is v little you can do apart from offer him support. I think it might also be possible using SET to let him know that you have concerns about this behaviour.

S-I can see your trying to do things differently at the moment.

E-I care so much about how all this is effecting you, you are really important to me.

T-Remember though this is what can happen when you stop your medication regularly or without support from a P. Can we do anything together to try and sort this out?

( or something like this )

It's worth saying which I'm sure you know he sounds very dysregulated and it is hard to watch someone you love unravelling.

[Jessica84]

Thank you. You're both right - very dangerous what he's doing. I can't believe he is risking his health... .so he can improve his health? I had no idea he was doing this to himself until today. Thank you sweetheart for explaining WHY he's doing it. He has mentioned before feeling defective and out of sorts - blaming the drugs for making him that way. Your SET model is very useful - I thought I did this, but now I see where I left out the S, bumbled my way thru the E, and went straight to T - reminding him he needed to take his meds as prescribed!

He's mentioned several times he doesn't want any more "labels". So I wonder if he's not holding back on revealing certain issues or symptoms so he doesn't get stuck with one. At the same time, he wants to feel better. He was relieved not to have to wear a "bipolar label". I don't know how he would react to a BPD label. My guess is probably not very well... .so I guess I shouldn't get too hung up on a diagnosis. I keep thinking with a good diagnosis he'd have better treatment options, but maybe not.

Thanks for the insights and support   Very helpful

[formflier]

 

SET

Many times... .when my SO is worked up... .I will try something that looks like SE SE SET... .or maybe leave the T off until later.

[Jessica84]

FF- Can you give me an example of how you've used SE SE SET? I'd like to see what that looks like.

Thank you so much!

[Notwendy]

If he has been altering his own medications, then it is possible that he needs to get medical attention to get his thinking and emotions regulated better.

This isn't an uncommon situation as far as I know. People don't like to think they need the medication. Also, when they take it and it works, and they feel better, they may think " I don't need this" instead of "this is working".