Standing Firm in Her Storm 2...

[Depression = 72% of members]

Personally, I would not be celebrating an anniversary while divorce is on the table.  My approach would be to tell her that you are not planning on celebrating it due to the divorce and the fact that she took a base ball bat to your car.

I am leaning to this side of the fence with you Fian... .

[MaroonLiquid]

Personally, I would not be celebrating an anniversary while divorce is on the table.  My approach would be to tell her that you are not planning on celebrating it due to the divorce and the fact that she took a base ball bat to your car.

I am leaning to this side of the fence with you Fian... .

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PLEASE - NO RUN MESSAGES This is a high level discussion board for solving ongoing, day-to-day relationship conflicts. Members may appear frustrated but they are here for constructive solutions to problems. This is not a place for relationship "stay" or "leave" discussions. Please read the specific guidelines for this group.

[formflier]

 

Language matters... .I would not mention celebrate.

Unless you are going to take action on baseball bat issue... .I would never mention it again.

In other  words... .enforce something... .or hush.  If you try to take middle ground... .or middle of the road... .what happens? 

Squish... .

Better question:  How do you acknowledge an anniversary to someone that you have a "troubled" r/s with... .and is triggered (sometimes) by affection and romantic overtures... .

I don't have the answer... .but I think that question is better... .

Anyone else make the question even better? 

FF

[MaroonLiquid]

Language matters... .I would not mention celebrate.

Then what do you call it?  Isn/t that what it is regardless?

Unless you are going to take action on baseball bat issue... .I would never mention it again. 

In other  words... .enforce something... .or hush.  If you try to take middle ground... .or middle of the road... .what happens? 

Squish... .

I guess looking at the dent on my hood is punishment enough for her? 

Better question:  How do you acknowledge an anniversary to someone that you have a "troubled" r/s with... .and is triggered (sometimes) by affection and romantic overtures... .

I don't have the answer... .but I think that question is better... .

Anyone else make the question even better? 

FF

This is an issue for me.  How can you recognize an anniversary and not be considered a celebration.  Right now, I don't make any real attempt to reach out emotionally.  I'm at the point where I'm not sure I can because I always seem to get burned.  I'm still pretty upset with her regarding my car.  I'm upset that she can't even apologize for it.  Does she even realize that it actually happened?  I "radically accept" that she can't apologize, but that doesn't mean I have to be okay with it.  Yesterday, I called her (it was about softball) and she acted like she was busy so I just said what I had to say about it and then said, "It sounds like you are busy so I will talk to you later." and we said bye and hung up.  I haven't told her I love her in almost two weeks.  I think she gets that there is some distance there because I don't really call her or text her much anymore... .She usually texts me these days if I go a whole day without speaking to her. 

[MaroonLiquid]

Earlier in the week, my wife mentioned our kids choir concerts (they were last night).  I asked my wife to send me the details about our kids choir concerts last night and she said she would, and she didn't.  I almost knew she wouldn't.  I didn't text her, I didn't call her, I didn't remind her and I didn't chase her for that information.  I won't.  I went to my son's baseball game, had a ball and didn't feel bad.  I could have gone to their events after his game, but she chose not to send me the information and punish them.  It's sad.  I'm not even upset by it anymore.  I'm upset for them.  I see now how she uses the control of their extra-curriculars to keep me at bay, then she can continue to play the victim card.  Funny thing is, she begged for their biological father to come to their stuff and never did, but now, when she has someone who wants to be a father to them, she makes sure he doesn't come.  The more and more I see this stuff, I realize how it's not about them, but about her. 

[Fian]

Of course, she will probably rewrite history in her head that she did tell you, and you chose not to come.

[formflier]

[

Then what do you call it?  Isn/t that what it is regardless?

Acknowledge... .or something along those lines.

Here is the thing... .it very well may turn out better to say nothing... .that just seems... .really weird.

Almost like it's worth having her grump a bit... .or dysreg... .but she knows you "remembered"... .rather than you do nothing... .and she feels abandoned.

Who knows... .

So... .what do you "want" to do... .very different than what do you "think" you should do?

FF

[MaroonLiquid]

Of course, she will probably rewrite history in her head that she did tell you, and you chose not to come.

In her case, she is more likely to not say anything because she knows in the past it hurt me because I want to be a part of their life.  It gives her the control.  I am taking that away from her more and more.  I won't beg or chase for that information nor will I ask how they went or why she didn't send me the information. 

Acknowledge... .or something along those lines.

Here is the thing... .it very well may turn out better to say nothing... .that just seems... .really weird.

I totally agree that it seems really weird to not acknowledge it... .

Almost like it's worth having her grump a bit... .or dysreg... .but she knows you "remembered"... .rather than you do nothing... .and she feels abandoned.

Who knows... .

So... .what do you "want" to do... .very different than what do you "think" you should do?

FF

I would like to acknowledge it, but saying "Happy Anniversary!" seems a bit contrite and is a complete oxymoron right now.     Will have to continue to brainstorm. 

[PeppermintTea]

Could you text with something like:

"wife I was thinking of you as it is our anniversary today. I hope you have a peaceful and blessed day. ML"

No L word mentioned and no 'celebrate' mentioned. And the divorce is not mentioned.

PT

[formflier]

PT,

Nice work!  I think this could be it... .or something close.

Best wishes could be added... .or "I wish the best for you... ."... .could substitute for "I love you"

FF

[sweetheart]

Hello ML,

Could you not have gone to the kids choir recital anyway ? Was there another way you could access this information so that the kids are not impacted negatively by all the passive aggressive dynamics.

You then take the ownus away from your wife in having to provide this information which changes the overall dynamic. Win for you, win for the kids.

[GaGrl]

Could you text with something like:

"wife I was thinking of you as it is our anniversary today. I hope you have a peaceful and blessed day. ML"

No L word mentioned and no 'celebrate' mentioned. And the divorce is not mentioned.

PT

I like this.  You could buy one of the nice cards with no printed message and simply hand-write a note.  That is personal and caring without the L word or celebrate or happy being mentioned.

[MaroonLiquid]

Could you text with something like:

"wife I was thinking of you as it is our anniversary today. I hope you have a peaceful and blessed day. ML"

No L word mentioned and no 'celebrate' mentioned. And the divorce is not mentioned.

PT

I like this!  I think FF is right.  Thanks PeppermintTea!

Hello ML,

Could you not have gone to the kids choir recital anyway ? Was there another way you could access this information so that the kids are not impacted negatively by all the passive aggressive dynamics.

You then take the ownus away from your wife in having to provide this information which changes the overall dynamic. Win for you, win for the kids.

I have thought about this.  Considering they aren't mine biologically and she took me off their school paperwork as a "parent", I can't get access to that information since they are minors.  

[sweetheart]

I wondered if you might still be on the school paperwork, what a shame your not.

Just a thought.

[MaroonLiquid]

     Everyday spent with my wife is an adventure it seems... .... .The more and more I have gone through this, the more and more I see how unstable pwBPD are emotionally, and therefore their thought processes.  I'm getting much better validating what should be and ignoring the outright ridiculous because some of what they say doesn't make sense.  We had a softball tournament this weekend and Saturday got rained out about halfway through the day.  My wife and I decided to go get a bite to eat together when they called the rest of the games that day due to rain delay.  We get there and it was my wife, our oldest daughter, her best friend, and I.  I felt like the 3rd wheel at times.  They were having their own conversations (usually about boys that my daughter and her friend think are cute) that I didn't have any input on so for the most part, I stayed quiet.  She asked me if there was something wrong and I said, "Not at all.", as there wasn't.  She was probably feeling guilty for having conversation that I couldn't be involved in and was projecting.  When my wife is with them, she acts like she is their age at times.  Since I am recognizing the mirroring now, it is becoming unattractive and a turnoff. 

     Yesterday,after the tournament concluded, she said she wanted to go swimming and I invited them to my pool at my apartments.  They came over and got in the pool for a bit.  I'm also realizing when she is "splitting" or not dealing with emotion very well, she will say something "triggering".  Her and I were talking in the pool and an older man was laying out there reading a book and got up and left.  My wife said, "Please don't be that age still living here."  Honestly, I didn't know how to respond so I just changed the subject.  A few minutes later, she was showing our daughters a picture on Facebook about her co-worker and her boyfriend or fiancee (named John) taking her on a helicopter ride in the Hawaiian Islands.  My wife made the statement, "John must be "loaded".  She then said our oldest son said, "We need a John."  And they laughed.  Again, I changed the subject.  A little bit later, she said, "My landlord is upping my rent when I renew."  I validated by saying, "That sucks, because that means less money you will have for other things."  She said, "I know, but what can I do?  I told them I was a single mother with three kids and could they please reconsider?"  She then said she never heard back from them.  I validated and said, "That would be frustrating when you are trying to work out your finances."  She said, "Yes!  It is!"  Later, I wondered if she was "laying the groundwork" for maybe reconciling talk (with all those things she said) later bacuse she is realizing she can't afford things, and she isn't talking about/bringing up divorce at all (which continues to confirm she did it for control and didn't expect me to dig my heels in).  Not worried about what her motives were, but just saying I'm beginning to recognize so much more much quicker these days.  Anyway, we sat while the kids swam, talked and held hands.  She brought up out of nowhere how fun it would be to take another cruise.  I validated that and said I needed a vacation.  She asked if I wanted to come over to her place and have pizza.  I said sure.

     We got to her house and ate, talked for a while.  The kids started arguing who was going to sleep with her last night.  I find it completely ridiculous that a 17YO, 16YO and a 12YO are sleeping with their mother all the time now.  Strange.     Anyway, she said she wanted to go lay down and invited me to lay down with her until she had to pick her son up from work.  I walked in there and her youngest daughter (12YO) jumps on the bed between us.  My wife said, I didn't invite you in here, you need to go get a shower and get ready for bed.  She didn't do it but instead just layed there.  My wife said it again and again, she didn't go.  My wife dropped it and then they started talking while I was there being quiet.  My wife then layed her head on her daughter (She always layed her head on my chest when we would go to bed) and continued talking.  Again, strange.  She used to be very particular about her room and that being her "space".  A bit later, she got up to go get her son from work and I walked out with her.  i grabbed my keys and we hugged for a bit and we kissed and told each other we loved each other.  I left and went home and went to bed.

[formflier]

 

Well done ignoring the "bait"... .

FF

[MaroonLiquid]

Well done ignoring the "bait"... .

FF

Thanks.  I am recognizing the splitting going on with my wife at the moment.  It started when she mentioned her sister was coming into town tonight when we were out by the pool Sunday.  This would make sense because, to her sister, I'm the bad guy.  I'm starting to recognize when she splits she "doesn't feel good".  Yesterday, she dropped our daughter off at practice and I went up to her car and I asked how she was doing because Sunday night after we ate pizza she said she started to feel bad.  After we hugged and kissed Sunday evening, she has been distant.  This seems to happen when she is dreading something (maybe her sister coming and asking about us).  She said she felt terrible.  I validated and told her if she needed me to give her a ride home I would.  She said if she did she would text me. 

     Does anyone else see this trend?  Is it because of depression?  It's almost like the inward pain manifests as outward sickness because they can't deal with it any other way.  She told my son on Sunday she would be at his Kindergarten graduation this morning.  I called this morning to check on her and she said "she was working" and to tell him she is proud of him.  I didn't ask if she was coming, she asked what I was doing and I told her where I was going.  I told her to have a good day and she said, "You too." 

     My thing is, don't tell my son you'll come if you won't.  She may not invite me to her kids things, but I won't do the same.  Maybe that's why she doesn't come so that she doesn't have to feel guilty.  Anyway, yesterday, I sent her a video of my son's hit at his game to cheer her up with no response and this morning I sent her the video of him "graduating" with no response.  That's fine, I won't send her another one and let her be, especially while her sister is here.  I'm actually much better dealing with her splitting and it doesn't really affect me much anymore. 

[formflier]

 

Can you give us some "word for word" of how you validated? 

FF

[MaroonLiquid]

Can you give us some "word for word" of how you validated? 

FF

When she dropped her off for practice, I asked her how she was feeling, and she said, "Not good."  I said, "I'm sorry.  That has to be tough on you considering how much work you have piled up and with your sister coming into town."  She said, "Yep".  I told her to get some rest and if she needed me to bring our daughter home to text me and let me know.  She said ok, and then left.

[MaroonLiquid]

The last few days, my wife won't return a text, but will call me if I don't text her.  For instance when she said she didn't feel good, I texted her the next morning to check on her.  No response.  I let it go and didn't text again at all the rest of the day and the next day either.  She finally called me today and talked about someone we knew and other stuff for a while.  I kept it real light.  We talked at softball tonight and after softball practice we went to go get ice cream together with the kids and everywhere we went was closed.  Finally we just agreed it wasn't going to happen and she said she would see me tomorrow and I said ok.  I texted her a bit later and said that it sucked we couldn't get any ice cream with no response.  It doesn't bother me anymore, but don't understand the avoidance.  That's the difficult part of all this.  I'm doing very well staying nonchalant and not letting the "BPD" crap bother me.  Actually, I'm finding that it's pushing me away emotionally.  Also, she doesn't have me blocked on text because she texted me when we were trying to find an ice cream place open.

[MaroonLiquid]

My wife shocked me this morning!  My son's baseball team got the number one seed in his postseason tournament that starts tomorrow night and that conflicts with a softball team party (for my team) we were having at my apartment pool.  My wife offered to come hold down the party while I go to my son's game.  Again, I was shocked that she did that.  That's the first time in a long time that she has put my needs first!  That is progress.

[an0ught]

My wife shocked me this morning!  My son's baseball team got the number one seed in his postseason tournament that starts tomorrow night and that conflicts with a softball team party (for my team) we were having at my apartment pool.  My wife offered to come hold down the party while I go to my son's game.  Again, I was shocked that she did that.  That's the first time in a long time that she has put my needs first!  That is progress.

Sounds like you can't rely on her behaving in old patterns anymore. Rationale plans based on two people pushing forward two goals independently. Where has all the enmeshed behavior gone? I feel for you having to make so big adjustments  

[MaroonLiquid]

What do you mean?

[an0ught]

Hi MaroonLiquid,

in an enmeshed state people think of the other partner as an extension of themselves. This leads to controlling behavior and automatic attribution of emotions - you do what I say and you feel what I feel. In this state people act egocentric and have a hard time seeing the needs of their partner.

The change in behavior you observed in your wife is a very positive sign. She was thinking through this situation not as one but as a team of two that act independently. It is the result of you becoming stronger and taking a stand. Boundaries are very effective in breaking the sense of being able to control the other side. Your hard work on boundaries is paying off  

[formflier]

It is the result of you becoming stronger and taking a stand.

[MaroonLiquid]

This thread continues here... .https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=278127.0

[formflier]

 



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