Finally Confronted Him

[JayApril]

I felt like for my own sake that I wanted to take the advantage to point out my ex's behaviors to him. It did not go over well but, I feel proud that I stood up for my son and myself after he said I was discouraging him from being a parent. No more BullButter!

I used current examples: he replied by swaring he would never email me again, but hours later he called four times. I guess he figured I was not going to chase after him and beg him to stay. 

[Turkish]

JA,

It may be good that you spoke the truth,.and him responding is interesting. What is going on specifically?

[JayApril]

JA,

It may be good that you spoke the truth,.and him responding is interesting. What is going on specifically?

I messaged him to see if he was interested in parenting classes. He asked for pictures of our son and got up set because, I did not send him enough. I also asked him if the counselor that he claims to be seeing has given him any parenting tips. Or reading tools so that I could co parent along side with what his counselor suggests. And I asked why he didnt seem to be concerned about visitation. He completly ignored my questions and, called me eight times after I explained that I could not talk at the moment.

He then ranted at me in an email saying I was discouraging him from parenting.

So I confronted him. I had, had it. I laid out everything with examples, and he ignored it.

He wrote me claiming that I was over reacting all he wanted were pictures. Then swore he would not message me again. But like always, he realized I was not going to chase after him and freaked out. He called again five times, from a different number.

I asked why he was blowing my phone up... .and he said

that he only called twice. And tried to say that he was not perfect and, that he was going through struggles like everyone else. I told him that I was not going to argue with him, and insult his intelect it was not about pictures. And hung up and changed my number.

[enlighten me]

You need to be careful with cutting off lines of communication. This could backfire on you as he could say your alienating him.

[JayApril]

You need to be careful with cutting off lines of communication. This could backfire on you as he could say your alienating him.

He can still email me whenever, but never call.

[enlighten me]

You need to be careful with cutting off lines of communication. This could backfire on you as he could say your alienating him.

He can still email me whenever, but never call.

im not sure of the situation but if you have children then not being able to contact you in an emergency has to be taken into consideration. You dont want to find out your child is in hospital by email. If you have to then a restraining ordee only to contact you in emergencies or inform him that he's only to contact yoou in emergencies or else you will file harrasment charges against him.

[JayApril]

You need to be careful with cutting off lines of communication. This could backfire on you as he could say your alienating him.

He can still email me whenever, but never call.

im not sure of the situation but if you have children then not being able to contact you in an emergency has to be taken into consideration. You dont want to find out your child is in hospital by email. If you have to then a restraining ordee only to contact you in emergencies or inform him that he's only to contact yoou in emergencies or else you will file harrasment charges against him.

I understand thank you, but this best for now because, never visits. But, I will get a restraining order as well.

[livednlearned]

But, I will get a restraining order as well.

Hi JayApril,

What would be the basis for the RO?

[JayApril]

But, I will get a restraining order as well.

Hi JayApril,

What would be the basis for the RO?

Im a still not sure how they are obtained, but its for harrasing, and harmful threats.

[livednlearned]

Where I live, harmful threats and harassment can go stale. To get an RO here, you have to ask quickly. Also, I learned the hard way that "I'm going to destroy you" is not an actionable threat. "You make me so made I could kill you" is also not actionable. Apparently, cops like things to be more specific. 

In the US at least, the temporary hearing for the RO does not need the other person to show. It's often granted because judges don't want to be in the news for denying it, only to discover the perpetrator did something really bad. So maybe you bring something forward that is kinda stale, and it passes the first hearing.

Then there is often a second hearing. Both parties are expected to show. You present your evidence, he presents his evidence. The judge might toss out the RO at that point if it seems like you're not behaving like someone who is afraid (I saw this happen in my court). Like, asking for an RO, but then sending indignant emails to someone, which gets used as evidence against you.

If you want to learn more about how things work where you live, find out if there is a DV shelter nearby and ask to talk to an advocate. In my area, I personally found the majority of first-line intake people to be young inexperienced women. However, the DV advocates who go to the hearings are typically more experienced, usually older, and have the hang of how to do this. They are accustomed to dealing with women who step forward and don't follow through, so there is often a tone I can't quite describe... .fatigue? weariness? There is a big burn-out risk being in the DV world because it's hard to watch abuse victims return to their abuser.

Anyway, call and ask them questions about how it works in your county. And if you follow through with it, keep in mind that entering and leaving the court is often the most dangerous time. Gavin de Becker in Gift of Fear talks about how ROs do not provide safety, they are more like a strategic chess move for the legal aspect. You have to up your safety plan and make sure you're on high alert.

Also, this just came to me. In some states the RO can be applied to both of you. He could file an RO against you as well. I think that varies by state, whether he can do that or not. In which case, you have to be extra careful to not violate the RO. You can be sure a motivated BPD ex will try to get you to violate the RO.

Some states have graduated versions of ROs. So you can ask for exactly what measures -- no emails, no phone calls, no showing up on the property, or whatever it is that you're hoping to address. Obviously with kids involved you have to adjust for that (maybe exchanges at police stations, etc.)

I'm not a lawyer, so make sure you find out from someone who understands how things work where you live.

[momtara]

Congrats on taking a stand! Try to figure out what you want. For him to get counseling? Get a psych eval? Leave you alone?

Now the hard part - the legalities. In my state, it is (as L and L said) not hard to get a temporary RO (TRO) and then go to court. If you have a decent case, often both parties negotiate - you drop the effort for the final restraining order in exchange for him to agree to compromises,  like supervised visitation or moving out of the house or whatever. They may not want to take the chance of having you win the final restraining order, so they do the deal. BUT you have to really believe in what you're doing. You have to feel you or your child are in some sort of danger or hurt.

Calling and emailing you a lot could qualify as harassment in my state, but you'd generally want to have told him that the excessive communications are unwelcome. 5-6 calls and emails in a day may not cut it. But it also depends on what was said.

If you truly feel harmed or threatened or just can't get peace through asking him, certainly do what you can legally.

If you don't have a lawyer to talk to, you can post for free on avvo.com.  Try to disguise your situation a little bit. Lawyers sometimes answer the questions free. Then you can figure out what to do next. You do want to be careful - protect your child, but don't create a situation where you will look bad later.

[JayApril]

Where I live, harmful threats and harassment can go stale. To get an RO here, you have to ask quickly. Also, I learned the hard way that "I'm going to destroy you" is not an actionable threat. "You make me so made I could kill you" is also not actionable. Apparently, cops like things to be more specific. 

In the US at least, the temporary hearing for the RO does not need the other person to show. It's often granted because judges don't want to be in the news for denying it, only to discover the perpetrator did something really bad. So maybe you bring something forward that is kinda stale, and it passes the first hearing.

Then there is often a second hearing. Both parties are expected to show. You present your evidence, he presents his evidence. The judge might toss out the RO at that point if it seems like you're not behaving like someone who is afraid (I saw this happen in my court). Like, asking for an RO, but then sending indignant emails to someone, which gets used as evidence against you.

If you want to learn more about how things work where you live, find out if there is a DV shelter nearby and ask to talk to an advocate. In my area, I personally found the majority of first-line intake people to be young inexperienced women. However, the DV advocates who go to the hearings are typically more experienced, usually older, and have the hang of how to do this. They are accustomed to dealing with women who step forward and don't follow through, so there is often a tone I can't quite describe... .fatigue? weariness? There is a big burn-out risk being in the DV world because it's hard to watch abuse victims return to their abuser.

Anyway, call and ask them questions about how it works in your county. And if you follow through with it, keep in mind that entering and leaving the court is often the most dangerous time. Gavin de Becker in Gift of Fear talks about how ROs do not provide safety, they are more like a strategic chess move for the legal aspect. You have to up your safety plan and make sure you're on high alert.

Also, this just came to me. In some states the RO can be applied to both of you. He could file an RO against you as well. I think that varies by state, whether he can do that or not. In which case, you have to be extra careful to not violate the RO. You can be sure a motivated BPD ex will try to get you to violate the RO.

Some states have graduated versions of ROs. So you can ask for exactly what measures -- no emails, no phone calls, no showing up on the property, or whatever it is that you're hoping to address. Obviously with kids involved you have to adjust for that (maybe exchanges at police stations, etc.)

I'm not a lawyer, so make sure you find out from someone who understands how things work where you live.

Oh wow, thank you so much for your kindness.

[momtara]

yes, there is another term that's not as severe as a restraining order - forget what it's called - civil restraint or something? no contact order - maybe that's it. but if you are co parenting you need some contact.