The Hardest Thing I am Facing

[workinprogress]

At 48 now, and still in a marriage with BPDW, I find the hardest thing for me is the realization that the adults in my life, (parents/spouse), could possibly have never loved me.

I know I have given everything I could to everyone else.  Perhaps it was in the hopes of being loved?  Perhaps I gave so much because I never really knew any other way of living?

My wife and I just had our 23rd anniversary.  She didn't get me a present card or anything, again.  I got her roses.  This has worn on me over the years.  She always says that she doesn't want to spend the money.  How unimportant am I?  I made everything she wanted happen.

Yet, nothing that I have wanted in life has happened.  It almost seems like my hopes and dreams are impossible.  I do little things and take little steps, but, I find myself yearning for a bit of love and affection.  Something that just doesn't happen.

It's just hard to pick my self up and to be enthusiastic and feel good about life living this way.

[Sunfl0wer]

Hi workinprogress,

To feel as though the adults in your life, who were supposed to love you, never did, must be devastating.  I have certainly felt this about my mom, and have spent much time unhappy about the fact.  I know that much of my over care taking stems from wanting to feel valued/loved to make up for this, and generally feeling as though I need to earn love.  Which is exactly the dynamic I participated in with my ex.

Sometimes I have thought to myself that I am sure that some people have just loved me as much as they were capable of.  Sometimes this had made me feel a bit relief... .to feel at least loved to the best of their ability.  I admit, that other times it felt invalidating, as though I should be satisfied with their partial love ability. 

Sometimes, when I am down, I just see things kind of cloudier than when I'm not... .so I am aware that my perception is fluid.  Which I find helpful.

23 years is quite a bit of time.  I can understand why you would want that recognized.  I certainly would appreciate a card and a date out at the least. I was so disappointed last Mother's Day, instead of spending it with me, he spent it running around trying to get me something... .thus not being with me... .thus me looking ungrateful.  ... .and we were just 5 yrs together.

You did not post this in the staying board, but rather the personal awareness board. So I'm thinking that you are not asking for suggestions on how to problem solve getting her to recognize this day. 

What do you think you may need right now?

In the meantime: 

[workinprogress]

What do you think you may need right now?

In the meantime: 

No one has ever asked me that.  I think I need to get over all the dysfunctional people that I allowed to drain me in life and enjoy my life some.  I would love to be able to laugh again and not feel like the weight of the world is on my shoulders.

[going places]

At 48 now, and still in a marriage with BPDW,

Has she been officially diagnosed, and is under the care of a doctor or therapist?

I find the hardest thing for me is the realization that the adults in my life, (parents/spouse), could possibly have never loved me.

I know I have given everything I could to everyone else.  Perhaps it was in the hopes of being loved?  Perhaps I gave so much because I never really knew any other way of living?

Define Love the way your mind and heart, defines love.

My wife and I just had our 23rd anniversary.  She didn't get me a present card or anything, again.  I got her roses.  This has worn on me over the years.  She always says that she doesn't want to spend the money.  How unimportant am I?  I made everything she wanted happen.

Yet, nothing that I have wanted in life has happened.  It almost seems like my hopes and dreams are impossible.  I do little things and take little steps, but, I find myself yearning for a bit of love and affection.  Something that just doesn't happen.

What does love and affection look like to you?

It's just hard to pick my self up and to be enthusiastic and feel good about life living this way.

What are some steps you can take to heal YOU?

[going places]

No one has ever asked me that.  I think I need to get over all the dysfunctional people that I allowed to drain me in life and enjoy my life some.  I would love to be able to laugh again and not feel like the weight of the world is on my shoulders.

Do you have children?

[Trog]

Firstly, as crap as they may be, people only act out love as they learnt it themselves, either from other people or via you directly.

My situ is quite similar, I am always the initiater of hugs and the buyer of big presents for my family, but with older siblings I know my parents really are just acting how they learn to act, I don't get any worse or less love than them, we are not a tactile family.

As for the wife. I think that's horrible that you feel a craving for such basics that are not beig fulfilled but again, she can't do it, she doesn't have the capacity to give to you as you want so you either accept this, that she won't change or let her know and give her the chance to change or find love and affection outside the marriage. Why should you get to 48 and be feeling this way? I think many of us have poor relationship examples, we have these yearnings for love and peace that are unfulfilled but we saw this growing up. So we tolerate it. I don't think you should have to tolerate it. You are a kind human deserving of love but you/we need to do some boundary work. I don't know if your wife has the capacity but mine could take no criticism at all and bought me hurtful presents. I'd rather have had no present at all.

I got a mobile phone cover for xmas that clearly cost about 5£ and it was for the wrong phone. They are showing you is what value we have. Another Valentine's Day she bought me a book called 'know who is manipulating you', so romantic, I could have hit her in the face with it. It's actually disrespectful IMO and deliberate. It's an eff you. So in the end i said eff you to my wife and kicked her out. Best move i ever made.

You should NOT be searching for scraps of love! The trick to this really is a cliche! You really do have love yourself first. If you don't you tolerate shiv from people who hurt you and loving yourself means having real boundaries and not accepting less, taking care of your body, mind, filling yourself with experiences and to hell with the BPD wife and her approval! Someone who loves u wants you fit, healthy and happy. It is not normal to be looking for scraps of affection. You know it. We normalise so much in these relationships and accept such poor behaviour.

If you want to stay with the wife, tell her to her face, not good enough and go ahead an give yourself that love.

[vortex of confusion]

At 48 now, and still in a marriage with BPDW, I find the hardest thing for me is the realization that the adults in my life, (parents/spouse), could possibly have never loved me.

I don't think you are along in this line of thinking. I have had that same thought at different times. It seemed like my parents loved me as long as I did what I was supposed to do. Just the other day, my mom asked me to look up something for her. I did it and called her with the results. She thanked me and jokingly said, "I knew I could count on you. You always do what you are told." Ugh, here I am at the age of almost 40 and my mother is still reinforcing this notion that she loves me because I do what I am told.

I know I have given everything I could to everyone else.  Perhaps it was in the hopes of being loved?  Perhaps I gave so much because I never really knew any other way of living?

Were you ever given another option? I know that I have felt like I had to give everything to everyone else. For the longest time, I didn't even question it. It is what I was supposed to do. It wasn't because of love. It was because that is how other people defined me. Other people defined me as the person that gives. Other people defined me as the person that takes care of everyone else. Those aren't necessarily bad things but it sure does stink when I don't feel like being giving. It sure does stink when I want somebody to take care of me for a change. I don't get taken care of because everybody seems to perceive me as somebody that doesn't need any care or consideration. I am the rock that gives. Any deviation from that is not acceptable.

My wife and I just had our 23rd anniversary.  She didn't get me a present card or anything, again.  I got her roses.  This has worn on me over the years.  She always says that she doesn't want to spend the money.  How unimportant am I?  I made everything she wanted happen.

   We are getting ready to celebrate our 17th anniversary in a week or two. I am dreading it because I am the one that usually does stuff for my husband while he does little or nothing. Even when we haven't had the money, I have cooked him dinner or given him special favors. One year, I posted a song and a story for every year that we had been married. I thought it was sweet and so did a lot of our friends. He did nothing other than say/post Happy Anniversary. I know that "How unimportant am I" feeling. I don't know how to combat it to be honest. I try to focus on being important to ME. That is easier said than done though.

Yet, nothing that I have wanted in life has happened.  It almost seems like my hopes and dreams are impossible.  I do little things and take little steps, but, I find myself yearning for a bit of love and affection.  Something that just doesn't happen.

What kind of love and affection are you wanting? Is it the kind that you can get from a friend or relative or is it the kind of love and affection that can only be given to you by your spouse? My kids are very loving but what I have found is that I want the kind of love and affection that can only be given to me by my spouse.

[Sunfl0wer]

Hi workinprogress,

I can certainly relate to no one asking how I am, and what I need.  This just happened yesterday, that I was caught off guard by someone asking about me, and it surprised me!

Finding a way to not be burdened or drained by others sounds like a great goal!  Finding joy for yourself also sounds excellent!

Can you come up with some steps to take... .what actions will help you achieve these?

~SF

[boatman]

Hi workinprogress-

I understand what you are feeling. About five years ago, I had a therapist say to me, "It seems like your parents aren't attached to you". In the moment I felt irate about her comment, but over time I have realized that it was a life changing moment for me because she is right. My work since then; through continued therapy, meditation and awareness practice, is a process of letting go of the hope that my parents (my family for that matter) will change, that they will love me. Currently, it involves no contact with my family but that may change as time goes on. Who knows?

It seems like you might be in the same boat. I know how painful it is so I'm sorry.

[workinprogress]

Thanks for all of your responses, sorry that I am slow to reply.

Firstly, my idea of love is sharing one's life, hopes and dreams with another person, and working towards helping one another realize those.  It is about communication, kindness, and affection.

As for the kids, they are all nearly adults, and they are doing well.  My wife was a "supermom."  So, the kids lacked for nothing.  I also devoted a great deal of time to them and really love them.  Although there were times that I really felt left out for some reason.

It was a tough weekend.  No love or affection occurred during our anniversary.  I had hoped, and I did make an attempt. 

I guess I just want a deeper love relationship in which I can actually feel comfortable conversing with my spouse.  I'd like to be able to hug her without having a debate going on in my head on whether I should do it or not. 

I have a lot of ideas and dreams that could really enhance our lives.  It's just no one else cares.  I am not waiting for someone else's approval to do things, it's just I think it would be nice to have some support in trying to achieve what I'd like to achieve.  After all, I have helped everyone else.

[Thread]

Is the present giving thing a trait? my pwBPD H always got really weird around birthdays, christmas, anniversaries especially during our first two years of our relationship... .

Is this common?

He has learned now, but its always been really uncomfortable and you can tell very difficult for him, its interesting too because his family is the same way, its just a really awkward thing.

[workinprogress]

Is the present giving thing a trait? my pwBPD H always got really weird around birthdays, christmas, anniversaries especially during our first two years of our relationship... .

Is this common?

He has learned now, but its always been really uncomfortable and you can tell very difficult for him, its interesting too because his family is the same way, its just a really awkward thing.

Interestingly enough, she has never asked me what I wanted to do or receive on birthdays or holidays.  She would get me nice gifts on my bday sometimes.  I did tell her one time that all I wanted was a nice card, she got me everything but the card.

Everything she gets me is what she wants me to have, as opposed to what I wanted.

[going places]

Thanks for all of your responses, sorry that I am slow to reply.

YOU are fine!

Firstly, my idea of love is sharing one's life, hopes and dreams with another person, and working towards helping one another realize those.  It is about communication, kindness, and affection.

Love... .pure real love is described in Scripture. Even for those who do not Believe, 99% agree this IS Love:

Love is patient, love is kind.

It does not envy, it does not boast, it is not proud.

It does not dishonor others, it is not self-seeking, it is not easily angered, it keeps no record of wrongs.

Love does not delight in evil but rejoices with the truth.

It always protects, always trusts, always hopes, always perseveres.

Love, never fails.

You mentioned affection again... .so this is something that is very important.

What does 'affection' look like? What would be your definition?

Also, has your wife been officially diagnosed?

As for the kids, they are all nearly adults, and they are doing well.  My wife was a "supermom."  So, the kids lacked for nothing.  I also devoted a great deal of time to them and really love them.  Although there were times that I really felt left out for some reason.

What made you feel left out?

Is this something that you and your wife talked about?

It was a tough weekend.  No love or affection occurred during our anniversary.  I had hoped, and I did make an attempt.

What was your attempt, and how was it met?

What were your expectations, and why do you think they were not met?  

I guess I just want a deeper love relationship in which I can actually feel comfortable conversing with my spouse.  I'd like to be able to hug her without having a debate going on in my head on whether I should do it or not.

Have you and your wife gone to counseling, marriage retreats, or anything to work out the issues?

I have a lot of ideas and dreams that could really enhance our lives.  It's just no one else cares.  I am not waiting for someone else's approval to do things, it's just I think it would be nice to have some support in trying to achieve what I'd like to achieve.  After all, I have helped everyone else.

Have you shared your life enhancing ideas with your wife? Have you explained to her your hopes and dreams for the future?

I see a lot of 'expectations' in your posting... .and if your wife has a diagnosed PD, and is seeking treatment (T or P) for her PD, then maybe her P or T could explain to you that having expectations could lead to a lot of disappointment and frustration... .

With the kids getting closer to moving out and being on their own, this is the time when couples should be giddy like school kids.

The possibilities are endless! But today I see so many marriages break apart... .seems the old 7 year itch is now a 20 year itch.

It's more than a mid-life crisis... .

This should be the time where couples are planning their golden years, their retirement plans, their 'fun plans'... .etc.

Not looking for a way out so they can start from scratch w / someone new.

If she is NOT diagnosed by a professional, and seeking treatment, then my advice would be to sit her down, tell her your hopes, dreams, plans for the future; tell her they include her, and tell her that you want to seek counseling, go on retreats, rediscover each other, rekindle this marriage, etc. Show her you are willing to do what it takes to make your marriage the exception to the norm (norm being kids grow up, couples get divorced) Show her you want to make the marriage strong (have phone numbers to marriage counselors, retreats, etc. in hand ready to call when she says 'yes, I want to do this too"!)

Write down your dreams that will enhance your lives... .show her.

If she has been diagnosed with a PD, then I would schedule an appointment w her therapist and ask him/her what are realistic expectations that you should have about your future with your wife.