If we don't get closure, do they?

[Family Court Strategies: When Your Partner Has BPD OR NPD Traits.]

I never got closure from my ex and nor did I seek it from her. Total NC from the moment she had that nuclear explosion in her head and the marriage was over - faster than you can click your fingers. This forum helped me understand why it wasn't going to happen and so I quite happily found it myself.

The topic of closure has come up a number of times, and it's got me thinking... .if they don't give us closure, how do THEY get closure? If we need closure so much, don't they need it too?  Is closure important to them or is the new relationship they had lined up their distraction from facing what they did?

Any ideas / theories / experiences?

[Aussie0zborn]

I never got closure from my ex and nor did I seek it from her. Total NC from the moment she had that nuclear explosion in her head and the marriage was over - faster than you can click your fingers. This forum helped me understand why it wasn't going to happen and so I quite happily found it myself.

The topic of closure has come up a number of times, and it's got me thinking... .if they don't give us closure, how do THEY get closure? If we need closure so much, don't they need it too?  Is closure important to them or is the new relationship they had lined up their distraction from facing what they did?

Any ideas / theories / experiences?

[rotiroti]

With my ex, she was the victim. None of it was her fault so she didn't ruminate nor have any guilt. Just moved on

[UserName69]

The best thing to do is to move on and forget your exBPD. It's impossible to stay with a pwBPD. Once when we broke up I decided to move on, I went nc and within 2 weeks she wanted me back.

In six months we broke up for like 14 times. At the end I decided to move on. We've blocked each other she never wanted to talk to me when I told her that I'm going to date an another girl and that she shouldn't bother me anymore. The only reason why she became upset is the fact that I actually gave her a middle fibger instead of going on my knees for her like her exbf did (according to her).

Just move on with your life, one day you'll meet someone who's even better than your exBPD. I really can't see a reason why I should or even would talk about the rs with my exBPD. She's pretty dead for me and I would never ever go back to that evil creature. Yes I have found replacement and I'm happy with her because she did make me happy and supported me at the point where my exBPD neglected me. It made me hate her a lot, and this made everything easy.

Forget about your exBPD and move on, even if you get back to her she'll treat you even worse. I saw this 14 times.

[FannyB]

Hi Aussie

My experience was that everything was played out in her own head i.e. she was judge, jury and executioner. So when she decided she wanted out, she would come up with a scenario that would justify her exit and paint me black into the bargain. That was her 'closure'.

Now if I had ended it when all was good in her eyes, then maybe she would indeed have needed 'closure'. Is this the catalyst for stalking behaviours perhaps?

Fanny

[SummerStorm]

I really don't think they care about closure at all.  In a period of about four weeks, I went from friend to lover to friend again.  When I tried to get closure on the intimate part of our relationship, she texted back, "You want closure.  I want shower sex." 

When she cut me out of her life completely, I tried to get closure and got complete silence.  I even said, "So, after everything we've been through, this is it?"  She replied, "Yep." And just like that, it was done.   

[Chrisbazsky77]

I had been agonising for closure too especially a week ago... .I have come to see a common thread here that for exBPDs, "closure" involves blame games or dramatic exits with no explanation or reasoning-and I agree... .in my case-I asked HIM to leave(with law enforcements because it was that bad evenutually) yet closure became an obsessive nagging thought to me but remained far out of reach ( due to NC and a protection order!).

So each day I remind myself that trying to get closure from someone who is broken and has a disorder,is wasting my valuable energy, yet again.

Believe me, I know this is easier said than done-it's a tough one because we presume we could somehow tap into their "normal" inner beings and hear something out their mouths that could actually make sense for us nons to move forward... .I doubt the maturity level and sensitivity we seek in our exBPDs, actually exists for a "closure" session.

I refuse to keep on renting out a space for him in my head, heart and mind.

[SummerStorm]

I had been agonising for closure too especially a week ago... .I have come to see a common thread here that for exBPDs, "closure" involves blame games or dramatic exits with no explanation or reasoning

Yes, my ex-friend BPD's dramatic exit really was something else.  I sent her a frustrated text in the morning that she had to have read because she responded later to the text I sent before that one.  For weeks, she had been avoiding me and any talk of me hanging out with her.  This was after she had tried to commit suicide and after I had visited her in the behavioral care unit.  I never mentioned any specific dates, but I did mention that I had a lot of things planned this summer, and that once I went back to work (I'm a teacher) in August, we wouldn't have many chances to see each other.  She kept telling me that I was nagging her about it and that I was "clingy."  This is the same person who used to text me as soon as I woke up in the morning and e-mail me before school assemblies and fire drills and ask if she could sit with me or join me.   I didn't text her the rest of the day and was actually in a pretty good mood.  Five hours after I sent her the frustrated text, she sent me a long stream of messages, blaming me for everything and telling me to "f*** right off" because she was done with me and my "bull****."  Oh, and she called me "poison."  I tried to reason with her, but she just told me to go away.  She told her boyfriend to stop communicating with me, but she can't even give him a reason why.   I have been nothing but kind, thankful, and polite to him, and he knows how close she and I were and that I visited her in the hospital (only four people did during the five days she was there).  If I had never asked him for his phone number and we had never communicated, I'm sure it would be easier for her to convince him that I'm some evil person.   

[Low C]

Prior to becoming involved with me, my udBPDex was involved in one 8 year relationship (knowing what I know now, if that guy dies before me I will petition to have him sainted), and then for about 4 years, a steady stream of short relationships (2-6 months).  She never liked to talk about the shorter involvements, but did talk about her long term relationship from time to time.  

In the early stages of our relationship, her talk about this LTR mostly seemed sweet and normal (later it became more bizarre, distraught and frequently contradictory).  She talked about things she learned about herself, mistakes she had made, ways she had grown as a human being.  One thing she said though, struck me as odd, even then in the early stages.

She said, "There is no such thing as closure.  You just move on with your life."

Plain and simple.  

Later I learned how much anguish, revolving attachment, sense of loss, sense of anger, etc. was attached to that statement.  

[cosmonaut]

Since pwBPD often tend to experience problems with object constancy, they can experience "out of sight, out of mind".  This is similar to infants who are believed to not understand that mother exists when mother isn't physically present.  To an infant, only what is directly present exists.  For most of us, we learn about object constancy - which is to say that people and things continue to exist when they are not immediately present.  pwBPD certainly understand mentally that objects have constancy, but emotionally they often don't.  Their emotions are able to cool surprisingly quickly when a partner is absent.  For the rest of us, we tend to remember that someone loves us when they aren't there to remind us.

I suspect that this is one of the reasons that pwBPD are able to move on very quickly.  I would not say that it is anything like the closure we seek, however.  I think that closure is something very different for them.  And just as quickly as emotions can disappear, they can also reappear.  It's entirely possible that we are once again the white knight and they will seek us out.

[Trog]

I don't think my ex liked closure. She carries a torch for all her exes and even if they left or she left them she never really moved on from any of them. All of them trouble her in some way, the ones that don't speak to her mostly. Chaos and non closure seem to be the order of the day for her.

[Agent_of_Chaos]

Since pwBPD often tend to experience problems with object constancy, they can experience "out of sight, out of mind".  This is similar to infants who are believed to not understand that mother exists when mother isn't physically present.  To an infant, only what is directly present exists.  For most of us, we learn about object constancy - which is to say that people and things continue to exist when they are not immediately present.  pwBPD certainly understand mentally that objects have constancy, but emotionally they often don't.  Their emotions are able to cool surprisingly quickly when a partner is absent.  For the rest of us, we tend to remember that someone loves us when they aren't there to remind us.

I suspect that this is one of the reasons that pwBPD are able to move on very quickly.  I would not say that it is anything like the closure we seek, however.  I think that closure is something very different for them.  And just as quickly as emotions can disappear, they can also reappear.  It's entirely possible that we are once again the white knight and they will seek us out.

Basically my ex to a t. She has moved after every single one of her relationships ended. She claimed she wanted to continue an LDR and even tho the writing was on the wall, I desperately believed in it. I remember asking her why she swings in and out of my life one time. She stated that as much as she misses me it's just too hard to talk to me. She surely didn't mind coming around and getting an ego boost once in awhile.

[going places]

The topic of closure has come up a number of times, and it's got me thinking... .if they don't give us closure, how do THEY get closure? If we need closure so much, don't they need it too?  Is closure important to them or is the new relationship they had lined up their distraction from facing what they did?

Any ideas / theories / experiences?

Closure

By definition, 'bringing to an end, closing'.

In his mind, he did that when he walked away.

Very cut and dried.

Having someone else before getting rid of us, shows their weakness and inability to stand on their own.

It also shows that it was not the fact they 'wanted to get away from us' as much as it was the fact, they found a new toy; and like a child in the toy store, they 'drop that old toy on the floor' and run down the aisle to get the new latest greatest toy.

My ex does not need closure, because that would imply that he has normal emotions.

There is nothing normal about that human. Nothing.

[Chrisbazsky77]

Cosmonaut... .I hear you... . 

Knowing that we are replaced, blamed and "left for dead" in every sense... .is what keeps us looking back, with questions, theories, replaying memories, asking around for answers from others on forums like this etc... .we are in fact closer to finding closure for our wounded selves... .aren't we?

[Dutched]

I never got closure from my ex and nor did I seek it from her. Total NC from the moment she had that nuclear explosion in her head and the marriage was over - faster than you can click your fingers.

Is a blink of an eye faster?       happened to me after more than 3 decades.

Let’s consider some aspects.

Known is the inevitable time line from idealisation into devaluation.

Already the first flaw pwBPD finds in you will be stored in their memory.

Not noticeable for you and even without ‘consequences’, still happy forever, so to speak.

Flaws, than cracks, ending up as devaluation. At that point pwBPD already emotional detached in a way from us. Staying for pwBPD, at that point, involves the short idealisation, holding onto what is known, kids, family, etc.

In the end many pwBPD seek their ‘freedom’ and have one lined up, so a kind of closure will be overwhelmed with joy and love of ‘the best ever happened to me’. 

For those pwBPD that didn’t have a line up, the grieving is there, however it  m u  s  t  be suppressed by all means (coping, survival mode), resulting in (as described in the ‘Facebook topics’) to show off a wonderful life.

Burying themselves into activities  ‘Just anything to stop the pain’. 

The saying is: ‘when the audience is gone, they cease to exist”.

PwBPD have a underdeveloped core, need others to become whole.

Many wondering the change of appearances, about the social background of the next one, the new norms and values, the dislikes once that are now liked, etc. Just to feel whole again, to attach as a chameleon.   

However, as I experienced with a HFBPD, pwBPD are a very long time still dissociative, special when confronted with the one dumped with that click of the fingers

[blissful_camper]

I don't think my ex liked closure. She carries a torch for all her exes and even if they left or she left them she never really moved on from any of them. All of them trouble her in some way, the ones that don't speak to her mostly. Chaos and non closure seem to be the order of the day for her.

That was my experience as well.  Events that occurred 20+ years ago continued to torment him.  He discussed those relationships frequently.  As he replayed them in his mind and verbalized his experiences there was an emotional charge as though those experiences were recent.  He hadn't processed his relationships or moved on from them.  He seemed traumatized by the loss of partners.  The past was alive in his mind.  Sometimes he attributed memories of prior relationships to our relationship.  (Dissociation?)  He seemed genuinely confused when he became aware that those memories had occurred in prior relationships.  Experiencing that was frightening to me because he was out of touch with reality in those moments.