The breakup conversation (transcribed)

[poedameron]

I had one of our fights toward the end of my relationship with my exBPDgf  (about a month ago) transcribed hoping it might show some of the techniques used by the BPD and how it is impossible to get anywhere... .maybe it will help someone.

I should point out that this took place the morning after the day being discussed, where she complained in the morning of stomach pains and some pink urine.  I had a meeting to sign an agreement to buy a house we picked out together that day, and was spending the rest of the day with my son.  I offered to stay and cancel those and try to get someone to watch my son... .I offered to hold her and stay with her and she told me it was fine and that she would see me that night... .

I had to watch my son even though it was not my day because my brother and his wife had just had a stillborn and our schedules were all messed up from that... .and you'll see in the fight she doesn't even care about those circumstances at all.

I came home to our apartment that night after watching my son and she was not there.  She would not answer my calls or texts so I called repeatedly til she did as I knew she wasn't feeling well.  She answered and screamed at me and told me she had a miscarriage, etc.  She came home the next morning and this is when the fight began.

She also told me she was on birth control and was either lying about that or the miscarriage... .6 month earlier she told me she was pregnant from a time she was also supposedly on birth control, and she told me she had a miscarriage and blamed me for not being there, despite the fact that she lived 2000 miles away at the time.  I ended up finding out that she had an abortion, not a miscarriage from a mutual friend that lives out there.

She has also lied to other people including me that she had surgery on her ovaries and she probably can't have children... .none of which is true.

The fight ends with her breaking up with me, but that didn't last more than a couple hours as usual.  

NOTE: I modified the swearing as it's not allowed here... .she was also yelling pretty much the entire time.

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ExBPDgf:   Do you mean after you called me 35 times? You mean after you started giving a crap after your ex-wife was done with Taylor Swift?

Non:   It had nothing to do with my ex-wife.

ExBPDgf:   Shut up. It has to do with your priorities. It has to do with the fact that I was going through that, and you were f-ing gone again. You don't give 2 craps about me. You were too busy worried about f-ing going to Dave & Buster's with your son.

Non:   Are you leaving again?

ExBPDgf:   Yeah, I am because you won't leave. I just took more Dilaudid and now I have to go f-ing drive more.

Non:   You're leaving again. Why are you doing this to yourself?

ExBPDgf:   Look at what you're doing to me. Leave me alone.

Non:   I'll go out in the other room if it's that bad. Now you can stay here if you don't want me to [crosstalk 00:00:44].

ExBPDgf:   Are you seriously recording this?

Non:   Yeah. Come on, Dog. Come on, Dog. I hope you feel better.

ExBPDgf:   You're lying.

Non:   No, I do.

ExBPDgf:   You're lying.

Non:   ExBPDgf, if you calm down, you'd realize that all I wanted to do ... .

ExBPDgf:   Was know where I was. You didn't give 2 craps about how I was feeling.

Non:   Yes, I did.

ExBPDgf:   That's not true. That's not true at all.

Non:   How do you know that? You're making assumptions.

ExBPDgf:   You were too busy at Dave & Buster's while I was going through that by myself.

Non:   By yourself? You were at the movies.

ExBPDgf:   Thank you.

Non:   You were at the movies and getting tacos with your friends.

ExBPDgf:   There are people that want to make sure I eat and that I have water and that I'm doing okay emotionally because I just lost your baby. Make sure to record that.

Non:   Let's go to the movies.

ExBPDgf:   What? What, now that you don't have anything better to do? You want to go to the movies?

Non:   No. I said [inaudible 00:01:36].

ExBPDgf:   Now that your family has nothing better to do, you can finally make some time for me? Thank you. Skip.

Non:   Skip what?

ExBPDgf:   Skip movies with you.

Non:   You're not going to go to the movies with me any more?

ExBPDgf:   You called me at 1:15 and yelled at me and accused me.

Non:   You yelled at me.

ExBPDgf:   You know what, fine, Non. I slept with someone. I went out, and I danced the night away, and I slept with someone.

Non:   I didn't say you did.

ExBPDgf:   Yes, you did. You said, "You're hiding stuff from me. You're lying to me." That's what you said.

Non:   You didn't tell me where you were going.

ExBPDgf:   You didn't tell me where you were going.

Non:   Yes, I did. I sure did.

ExBPDgf:   You mean after? Sure. Then I told you after so what's the big deal? You mean, after you called me 35 times? You mean after you asked me if it was yours?

Non:   Are you done?

ExBPDgf:   No, I'm not.  Leave me alone. Go. Stop pretending like you give 2 craps because honestly, if you did, I would not be this upset right now.

Non:   That's not true.

ExBPDgf:   You would be looking out for me, but you don't.

Non:   I try.

ExBPDgf:   How?

Non:   By calling you and texting you.

ExBPDgf:   You mean at 1:15 in the morning?

Non:   ExBPDgf, you sent me a text with a bunch of exclamation points that you're going to the movies. Is that somebody who's in rough shape? What are you doing?

ExBPDgf:   I'm not going to sit there and make you feel bad because you're not going to. You're not going to feel bad. You're not going to want to be with me because you would be with me.

Non:   Then don't worry about making me feel bad.

ExBPDgf:   I know. You made a choice.

Non:   Yes, I made a choice to commit to something I had already committed to with my son.

ExBPDgf:   You made a choice to not be there for me.

Non:   The choice was to be with my son, which I had already committed to.

ExBPDgf:   Did you not already tell me that if something were to happen to me medically, you would be there? No matter what?

Non:   Did you not not tell me what the hell was going on yesterday?

ExBPDgf:   You knew what was going on. God damn, just leave please. I'm going to go back to my friend’s house.

Non:   Run away again, wow. Why don't you go lay down and calm yourself down.

ExBPDgf:   Take him. Take him. Take him out of the house.

Non:   Just go lay down. I just asked what you did, and you didn't tell me, ExBPDgf. Now you're leaving again.

ExBPDgf:   Maybe I'll just go take a pill and leave. I'll take my dog too because I know he's such a hassle.

Non:   I wouldn't drive on those pills.

ExBPDgf:   Are you kidding me? Stop pretending like you give a crap, seriously.

Non:   I do.

ExBPDgf:   Leave me alone.

Non:   Stay. Come here.

ExBPDgf:   No. Leave me alone.

Non:   ExBPDgf, come on. Stop. What are you doing?

ExBPDgf:   Leave me alone. Me and my dog are leaving.

Non:   Are you serious?

ExBPDgf:   Yeah, because he's not welcome because he hurt your dog's leg.

Non:   I thought he was our dog.

ExBPDgf:   Leave me alone. No. You don't get to say stuff like that and then expect it to be okay.

All I wanted to know was where you were at.

Non:   Look at how you're behaving.

ExBPDgf:   You're lying.

Non:   Look at how you're behaving.

ExBPDgf:   Do you not realize what I went through? You don't care! Go away! Go away! Go take care of your son! Go take care of your son! That's what's important.

Non:   This is all abandonment issues. You’ve got to stop this.

ExBPDgf:   I had a miscarriage, and the person that did that f-ing left me to go hang out with his son. That's what this is. That's not okay.

Non:   It's okay what you did to me, right?

ExBPDgf:   What?

Non:   You told me to leave. I tried to do things for you that morning, and you said no.

ExBPDgf:   You were too busy worried about brushing your teeth.

Non:   You told me to go watch TV.

ExBPDgf:   That's because you were too busy getting ready.

Non:   That was before that.

ExBPDgf:   You f-ing were in the shower and taking care of yourself first. Then you're like, is there anything I can do?

Non:   Taking care of myself? you were asleep.

ExBPDgf:   I was not. I was crying. I was crying in the shower. I was crying because I'm f-ing ... .

Non:   Yesterday morning?

ExBPDgf:   Yes, I cried all morning. You just didn't notice because you were too busy brushing your teeth for your meeting and for your son and for your ex-wife, so they could go to Taylor Swift.

Non:   For my meeting for you... .for us.

ExBPDgf:   For me? If you were there for me, you would've been here with me yesterday, but you don't get that. You're like, I already had prior engagements, sorry, ExBPDgf.

Non:   Is that how I said it? How come you're so full of anger?

ExBPDgf:   Leave me alone. I just went through a miscarriage, and you weren't there again, again!

Non:   I got that house because that's the one you wanted.

ExBPDgf:   Again! Then cancel it.

Non:   I can't.

ExBPDgf:   Then cancel it.

Non:   I can't.

ExBPDgf:   Then fine, live there by yourself. Leave me alone. I don't want to be with someone who is just fine not being with me while I'm having a miscarriage.

Non:   No. My point was I want [crosstalk 00:07:13].

ExBPDgf:   I don't want to be with someone that's okay with me having a miscarriage while he's at Dave & Buster's. I'm not okay with this. I'm not okay with this.

Non:   I didn't know that that was happening. You didn’t tell me anything until today.

ExBPDgf:   Bullcrap! Bullcrap! Bullcrap!

Non:   Not Bullcrap. It's not Bullcrap.

ExBPDgf:   Bullcrap.

Non:   They're going to call the cops on you.

ExBPDgf:   Good. I hope they do.

Non:   Me too. Maybe they'll take you in, and you'll calm down.

ExBPDgf:   Leave me alone. Leave me alone. I just went through a miscarriage, and I need

support, and I need you to leave me alone. Go away. Take your dog. What if my dog hurts him again?

Non:   We can talk about the dogs another day but ... .ExBPDgf.

ExBPDgf:   Have you even looked at my dog’s ears?

Non:   Can you calm down?

ExBPDgf:   Poor your Dog. Poor your Dog. Poor your Dog.

Non:   Can you calm down?

ExBPDgf:   No. Leave me alone. I need you to leave.

Non:   You showing up and not saying a word to me and going into the shower.

ExBPDgf:   Dude, you chose to not be with me when I was having a miscarriage. That's on you.

Non:   Dude? You chose to push me away. That's on you.

ExBPDgf:   Fine. I'll take responsibility because you know what, if my partner was going through any health issue or miscarriage or anything like that, there is no f-ing way I would leave their side. No way.

Non:   You never told me anything until today!

ExBPDgf:   Fine. Sure. Cool. Thanks.

Non:   Come on, dog.

ExBPDgf:   I'll just take another pill so please leave.

Non:   What's [inaudible 00:08:52]?

ExBPDgf:   Leave me alone.

Non:   I'm not going to leave you alone. You said last night you wanted me to be there. Why are you telling me to leave you alone?

ExBPDgf:   No. You don't get to be here when it's convenient for you. That's not being a partner. This is not being a partner. You want to be here now because it's convenient for you, and your ex-wife doesn't need to go a Tay Tay concert.

Non:   This has nothing to do with my ex-wife. ExBPDgf, I bought the tickets for my daughter a year ago. I'm not going to go, so my ex went with her.

ExBPDgf:   Again, more important than me having a miscarriage.

Non:   No. It's not. Did I know that when I bought those tickets? Did I know that my son would not be watched when I bought those tickets?  

ExBPDgf:   You were with your parents. Come on.

Non:   Did I know that you would get pregnant again and have another miscarriage on the day of the concert, even though you didn’t tell me you were having one? Did I know that? No.

ExBPDgf:   That doesn't change priorities. I should've been a priority period, but I wasn't.

Non:   I don't know how miscarriages happen. I don't know how long they take.

ExBPDgf:   Fine. Trust me, I get it. I get it. I get it.

Non:   You didn't tell me. You weren't talking to me, ExBPDgf. You were just saying, go, go watch TV.

ExBPDgf:   Yeah, because you were too busy worried about your teeth and everything else while I'm in here cringing in pain.

Non:   After you said that.

ExBPDgf:   Bullcrap.

Non:   I held you, and I sat next to you on the toilet. You were like, "Go away. You don't have to stand here."

ExBPDgf:   Yeah, because you were leaving. You were going to f-ing go. Your ex-wife has things she has to do. You know what, Tay, Tay wins again.

Non:   What are you talking about?

ExBPDgf:   Your family wins again. You know what, you don't get to be here for me today.

Non:   I don’t understand what you're saying.

ExBPDgf:   You just don't care.

Non:   No. I do.

ExBPDgf:   This doesn't affect you.

Non:   Yes, I care. That's why I called you so many times last night.

ExBPDgf:   You mean after you were done with your family. You mean when you got time.

Non:   I texted you.

ExBPDgf:   When you got time, that's when you started calling.

Non:   You disappeared.

ExBPDgf:   For 2 hours while I was in a movie.

Non:   After that as well.

ExBPDgf:   At 11:30 when I was asleep because I just had a f-ing miscarriage?

Non:   Was it before or after tacos?

ExBPDgf:   Some people wanted to make sure I was going to eat. Some people wanted to make sure that I wasn't alone.

Non:   I don't make sure you want to eat? I only pay for an apartment for you, I buy all of our meals. I don't make sure you want to have a roof ...

ExBPDgf:   This is why I'm leaving.

Non:   Wait.

ExBPDgf:   This is why I'm leaving.

Non:   You can't say some people make sure you want to eat and give them credit for giving you tacos.

ExBPDgf:   You give me an apartment, but you won't be here for me when I have a miscarriage. Lucky me, because your ex-wife and your daughter need to go see Taylor Swift.

Non:   That's why I wasn't here because they need to see Taylor Swift? Okay, ExBPDgf. You're leaving me, again.

ExBPDgf:   You know what? Honestly?

Non:   You are leaving again.

ExBPDgf:   I will pay you back for the apartment.

Non:   You keep running away, ExBPDgf.

ExBPDgf:   I'm not going to keep using your money for you to throw it in my face.

Non:   Keep running away.

ExBPDgf:   This is your excuse for caring about me that you buy me an apartment, but you won't

here for me when I have a miscarriage.

Non:   I’m buying us a house, ExBPDgf, one that we picked out together.

ExBPDgf:   You didn't buy me a house. You bought you a house.

Non:   For us.

ExBPDgf:   Bullcrap.

Non:   I told you I wouldn't be here if it wasn't for you. I [inaudible 00:11:47].

ExBPDgf:   Then you better go try and f-ing change that.

Non:   I can't.

ExBPDgf:   I'm sorry. You and your kids will love that house.

Non:   You're not going to live in it.?

ExBPDgf:   No. I'm not. I'm not. I'm not going to live in an apartment that you buy me because

you think it's okay not to be with me when I'm having a miscarriage.

Non:   I don't think it's okay.

ExBPDgf:   Because you buy me an apartment.

Non:   ExBPDgf, I don't think it's okay.

ExBPDgf:   This is not okay.

Non:   I know it's not.

ExBPDgf:   You just don't give a ___ because your ex-wifey and your daughter had to go see

Taylor Swift.

Non:   [inaudible 00:12:12] abandonment issues.

ExBPDgf:   That is not abandonment issues. That's not being there for your partner. Do you think anybody when I told them that the reason you couldn't be with me was because you had to watch your son so your ex-wife could go to a Taylor Swift concert. Do you think any of them said, you have abandonment issues.

Non:   No, because they don't know you.

ExBPDgf:   It's because I was having a miscarriage, and you didn't give 2 craps. He’s not going to be there for you when you're having a miscarriage? Are you sure this is something you want to do?

Non:   This is what this is. This is 5 girls ganging up on a guy.

ExBPDgf:   It's just you being an a-hole.

Non:   Do they know our story?

ExBPDgf:   It's you being an a-hole.

Non:   Do they know our background and what I've done for you and us to get to [crosstalk 00:12:56]?

ExBPDgf:   The apartment that you throw in my face constantly that everything that you've ever bought me you've thrown it in my face, the TVs.

Non:   You just threw tacos in my face. Some people want to make sure I'm fed. You threw that in my face.

ExBPDgf:   That's because they were emotionally there for me.

Non:   I can't mention the apartment, right? I was emotionally [crosstalk 00:13:13].

ExBPDgf:   That's not being there for somebody.

Non:   I was there for you in the morning, and you pushed it away.

ExBPDgf:   Why do you think, because you were too busy showering while I'm in here cringing in pain. You were too busy fixing your hair and brushing your teeth.

Non:   You were cringing in pain when I woke up?

ExBPDgf:   Bullcrap.

Non:   You were asleep. I drove you around last night [crosstalk 00:13:30].

ExBPDgf:   This is 5 women ganging up on a dude. No. This is a dude not being there for his girlfriend. That's what it is, but you don't get that.

Non:   I do get that, and I'm sorry.

ExBPDgf:   You don't care because your ex-wifey and your daughter had to go see Tay Tay.

Non:   Yes, I care.

ExBPDgf:   It is what it is. Sorry, ExBPDgf, but I buy you an apartment and a house.

Non:   I can't take that back. I can't fix that.

ExBPDgf:   I know, so you'll do some really ___ty ___ and be like, I can't take it back. What do

you want me to do? It'll happen again.

Non:   ExBPDgf, honestly, I did not know that you were going through the miscarriage then. You've had a lot of days where you've had abdominal cramping and pain. You don't tell me what's going on.

ExBPDgf:   You knew.

Non:   No, I didn't.

ExBPDgf:   Play stupid. It's cool. I know that's your defense. Please just go.

Non:   I didn't know.

ExBPDgf:   You know what Non, I saw what I needed to see last night. Honestly, you let me go through that alone.

Non:   Did I? You didn't tell me what was going on.

ExBPDgf:   You knew.

Non:   No, I did not know.

ExBPDgf:   Yes, you did. I even told you. I even told you I was bleeding. I told you. I told you.

Non:   No, you didn't.

ExBPDgf:   Yes, I did, and you knew.

Non:   If you were pregnant, you hid the pregnancy. How are you going to hide this? You don't tell me, and I do care, and that's not true.

ExBPDgf:   Five women beating up on a man. Really? No. It's just some fricking guy not caring about his girlfriend more than his daughter's concert.

Non:   I tried supporting the fact that you were with your friends.

ExBPDgf:   You couldn't be there, and I hope you in the back of your head ... .

Non:   I didn't know you were having a miscarriage.

ExBPDgf:   Bullcrap!

Non:   I didn't know.

ExBPDgf:   You knew last night when you called me 35 times because you finally got time to call me.

Non:   I called you back when you called me and talked to you. ExBPDgf, you were fine until I called you that many times.

ExBPDgf:   I was not fine. I was in tears all f-ing ... .I was not fine.

Non:   At the movies you were in tears?

ExBPDgf:   I was in tears all f-ing night. They kept piecing me together because I just had a miscarriage, and my boyfriend would rather watch his son than be with me.

Non:   That's not true.

ExBPDgf:   Bullcrap! Bullcrap!

Non:   What do you want to do? You're not accepting my apology.

ExBPDgf:   You don't mean it. You had things you had to do, and that's more important. That was more important.

Non:   I asked to take you to the doctor 3 times, and you said, "No."

ExBPDgf:   There's nothing they could've done.

Non:   I would've done that, ExBPDgf.

ExBPDgf:   There was nothing they could've done.

Non:   You're saying I don't care. Why would I say that?

ExBPDgf:   You offered to take me to the doctor's before you left me, that's you caring?

Non:   If I took you to the doctor's, I would not have left. I'm not going to leave you at some

hospital alone.

ExBPDgf:   That's the indicator. If I'm in the hospital, you'll make time for me.

Non:   You are notoriously quiet about your health problems, notoriously. In fact, you make them up sometimes.

ExBPDgf:   Leave.

Non:   You do.

ExBPDgf:   Leave!

Non:   You make up stomach cancer.

ExBPDgf:   Leave me alone! Just leave!

Non:   This is the bed you laid.

ExBPDgf:   Leave me alone!

Non:   ExBPDgf, you know that you're quiet about that stuff.

ExBPDgf:   Leave me alone.

Non:   No. Who are you texting? 

ExBPDgf:   I'm texting her to come pick me up.

Non:   You  need to be saved again, right? Fine. I'll leave if that's what you want. You don't want support any more. You want to hide your ... .

ExBPDgf:   You mean what I wanted yesterday while you were too busy because your ex-wife needed to go to a concert.

Non:   Hide your medical problems like always.

ExBPDgf:   Maybe I made this one up too.

Non:   You might have. I don't know. [inaudible 00:17:30].

ExBPDgf:   You're just the one that left your girlfriend when she was having a miscarriage.

Non:   [inaudible 00:17:39] and making up, I [inaudible 00:17:44] 50% [inaudible 00:17:45] and

then crying about it. Really? [inaudible 00:17:50]. I mean, good Lord, ExBPDgf. I forgave you for all that lying when you moved here.

ExBPDgf:   Obviously not.

Non:   No, I did.

ExBPDgf:   Obviously you don't even know the truth. I made it up, fine. I also slept with someone last night so please leave me alone.

Non:   I thought you couldn't have sex for [inaudible 00:18:07].

ExBPDgf:   I lied about that. I'm just a liar.

Non:   I know that, but I thought when we came here you agreed to stop doing that.

ExBPDgf:   I'm a liar, so leave. I'm a liar that needs her Dilaudid. I'm a liar that can't be grieving, so leave. Leave. I'm just a liar.

Non:   You're good with these [inaudible 00:18:24]. Are you going to call her again?

ExBPDgf:   Leave.

Non:   Thanks for being so open.

ExBPDgf:   Thanks for calling me 35 times [inaudible 00:18:38] care when you had time. [inaudible 00:18:40] more important things to do. I'm a liar, go. You deserve better.

Non:   You didn't tell me what was going on.

ExBPDgf:   I'm a liar, go. You deserve better.

Non:   I do deserve better.

ExBPDgf:   You know what, I do too. We both do.

Non:   You don't. You deserve worse, honestly, the way you treat me, it's unbelievable. Unbelievable.

ExBPDgf:   Then leave if I treat you so bad. Leave, because you know what? I know that I can find a man that will be there for me while I'm going through [crosstalk 00:19:03].

Non:   You can find plenty of men, but you’ll do the same thing to them.

ExBPDgf:   Leave.

Non:   We know that. [inaudible 00:19:08].

ExBPDgf:   Leave.

Non:   I don't know how long it'll last, but [inaudible 00:19:13].

ExBPDgf:   Leave.

Non:   What's your average relationship [inaudible 00:19:17]?

ExBPDgf:   I'm 25, Non.

Non:   [inaudible 00:19:20].

ExBPDgf:   Leave. I deserve worse.

Non:   I'm trying to make it better.

ExBPDgf:   I deserve worse, so leave. I'm a liar.

Non:   We know. Have you not lied a lot in the past? But I forgave you and we made a commitment to not do that when we got here.

ExBPDgf:   Leave.

Non:   No. I'm not leaving. I'm talking to you. Can't we talk?

ExBPDgf:   No. You just told me ... .

Non:   What did I tell you?

ExBPDgf:   You deserve better than me. Go. Go.

Non:   ExBPDgf, we both deserve better, but we can get that from each other if you calm down.

ExBPDgf:   Bullcrap. I can't get that from you.

Non:   Because I have a son?

ExBPDgf:   Again, priorities.

Non:   ExBPDgf, I didn't want to make my folks watch my kid all day when they're still grieving the

loss of their dead grandchild.

ExBPDgf:   You're okay letting your girlfriend ... .

Non:   No, I'm not.

ExBPDgf:   Priorities.

Non:   Yes. Listen.

ExBPDgf:   I lost.

Non:   You didn't lose.

ExBPDgf:   Go.

Non:   You had friends for the time that I wasn't here, and you didn't tell me anything. You're very

vague about your health.

ExBPDgf:   You picked your priority. You picked your priority. I'm a liar. I'm a slut, so leave.

Non:   I didn't say that you're a slut. You said that. You don't tell me what you did last night when I asked. You would not tell me.

ExBPDgf:   Because that's all you f-ing care about. You don't give a ___ what I went through today or yesterday. You don't give a ___.

Non:   Yes. When I asked what you did, yes.

ExBPDgf:   Leave me alone.

Non:   You didn't say, I lost the baby. You didn't say any of that to me. ExBPDgf, you don't say anything.

ExBPDgf:   You were too busy brushing your teeth and watching your son ... . 

Non:   No. That's not why.

ExBPDgf:   ... .because your ex-wife and daughter have to go to a Taylor Swift concert.

Non:   When I drove you around last night, that's fine though?

ExBPDgf:   Priorities! Priorities! You'll drive me around as long as you're here, and you don't have anything better to do. That's when you'll drive me around.

Non:   I have a duty to my son, yes, and my daughter. You realize that, right, or maybe you don't.

ExBPDgf:   I am not a priority. You need to leave.

Non:   You're a priority. Why am I here?

ExBPDgf:   Watching you son last night was more important than being with me while I was having a miscarriage.

Non:   I could've stayed at [inaudible 00:21:33] last night, but I came here. Why is that?

ExBPDgf:   Non, do you not understand that watching your son is not ... .Me not being as important as watching your son while I'm having a miscarriage tells me where I stand.

Non:   I didn't know you were having a miscarriage.

ExBPDgf:   Bullcrap!

Non:   I didn't know.

ExBPDgf:   Bullcrap! Bullcrap!

Non:   I knew you weren't feeling well, I told you I would stay, but you told me to leave, and you

don't say anything. It's not true. Look at your history.

ExBPDgf:   Bullcrap!

Non:   ExBPDgf, you don't tell people stuff. I bet you told the girls a lot more than you told me.

ExBPDgf:   You don't treat somebody you love like that, you just don't, but you don't get that.

Non:   You treat somebody you love the way you treat me, right?

ExBPDgf:   I am not a priority to you, and I am accepting that now.

Non:   You're emotionally abusive to me.

ExBPDgf:   I'm emotionally abusive? You mean you calling me a liar and telling ... .Really. Fine. You

deserve better.

Non:   We can figure it out.

ExBPDgf:   No. I don't want to figure it out.

Non:   We're done.

ExBPDgf:   Yeah. I'm not a priority.

Non:   Seriously?

ExBPDgf:   Yes. We are ___ing done.  

[letmeout]

This is sad, but you can not fix crazy. It reminds me of some of the crazy that would come out of my ex's mouth, only worse. I took me too long to learn that you can not argue or reason with crazy. The only thing to do is get away from crazy for our own sanity.

[UndauntedDad]

Hey Poedameron,

I'm sorry you had to go through that.  It's sad anyone has to deal with that, and moreover, as you know, when there is history of similar encounters, it all feels worse.  I couldn't even read all of it, it was too sad and made me flashback too much.

But you are here, and we are here, and we are whole.  Writing things down can be therapeutic; for me, writing exact quotes of certain arguments I had helped me to understand what was going on, years later. I go back and read those things we both said, when I have doubts. Sure, few people are rational when angry, and arguments make people angry. Also, most people are not proud of how they behaved during a fight.  But when I re-read the past encounters, it convinces me that I'm not dealing with a regular both-mad-fight between people who are trying to love each other.  There's something worse, something harder to deal with, and for us, it was BPD.

I think the most important thing is to first, take care of yourself.  Put on your own oxygen mask first.  Not everyone has the capacity or resources to live close to a pwBPD, and in any case, we can't fix them, nor is it our job.  Just try to get by, and take care of yourself.  Once you are OK, see what you can do to help others, including your pwBPD.  But remember, you can't cahnge other people, you can only change yourself.  The flip side of that is that I found, changing myself was not only more effective, but more more rewarding than changing others!

Good luck.

[blissful_camper]

It's really sad. Wow. I'm so sorry you experienced that type of exchange.

Sometimes I wonder if the "picking fights" is more of a strategy to hide something. (Feelings, wants, needs, actions, undesirable behavior outside the r/s.)

The reason I mention this is because I saw a pattern where my ex "picked fights" to conceal undesirable behavior occurring outside the r/s, or if he was feeling impulsive and wished to engage in inappropriate activities. (Conceal past behavior / Justify future behavior)

[enlighten me]

It reminded me so much of my exgf and some arguments we had.

The jealousy of my sons, the being berated for not knowing things that she hadn't told me about, the expecting me to somehow know how she is feeling and make it better, the whole abandonment thing because I was doing things that had been planned or just in another room getting dressed.

[poedameron]

This was just one of many fights that went like this, by the way... .circular arguments, being blamed for a variety of things while she never took responsibility.

[gameover]

Whew! Just reading that was exhausting.  I can definitely relate to some of the speech patterns and circular arguments.  Thank you for sharing--I'm sure that it was pretty triggering to type that up.

But one thing that sticks out to me is that you spent way too much time trying to convince someone of something--which in itself is a sort of codependent endeavor.  It's hard when you care about the other person, but at some point you have to hit them with a "Look, I do care about you.  I'm sorry you feel this way.  I'll be in the other room when you calm down."  Maybe put your hand on her shoulder (if she seems receptive) and LEAVE THE ROOM. 

[Gonzalo]

I didn't read the whole thing either, but it just seems so familiar even if the details are different. I remember similar arguments and all of the attempts to make sense of it. You're supposed to read her mind and know that there's a problem, but never offer help if she doesn't need it, and you're supposed to do exactly what she tells you to do unless you're supposed to do the opposite of what she said. If you don't ever get this all exactly right, then you clearly don't care about her - and if you do get it all right, you're being too controlling and manipulative so you're wrong anyway.

[Mr Hollande]

Thanks for sharing this Poedameron. Didn't read all the way through either but it's very familiar to all of us here. It's wretched.

[Mutt]

"Look, I do care about you.  I'm sorry you feel this way.  I'll be in the other room when you calm down."  Maybe put your hand on her shoulder (if she seems receptive) and LEAVE THE ROOM.

It takes two to tango.

[poedameron]

Yes I was definitely co-dependant on her and our relationship... .absolutely... .otherwise I would have recognized this BS and gotten out much earlier... .I did try pulling away from that for a few weeks at her request, and I did walk away from a few arguments, but it wouldn't solve anything... .so there was no fixing things, as we all know and I eventually learned.  She also told me when I would walk away and ignore these things that I was too distant and that there's a balance and it was only black or white with me, which would lead to more arguments... .projecting BPD on me much?

[poedameron]

I didn't read the whole thing either, but it just seems so familiar even if the details are different. I remember similar arguments and all of the attempts to make sense of it. You're supposed to read her mind and know that there's a problem, but never offer help if she doesn't need it, and you're supposed to do exactly what she tells you to do unless you're supposed to do the opposite of what she said. If you don't ever get this all exactly right, then you clearly don't care about her - and if you do get it all right, you're being too controlling and manipulative so you're wrong anyway.

WOW yes, a perfect description.  Impossible to function in that disfunctional environment.  I'd say I spent 80% of my daily energy on managing this with her... .ugh.

[AwakenedOne]

Poedameron, thanks for sharing. Sorry you have gone through all of that.

"I'll be in the other room when you calm down."

If I had said that to my ex wife she would of physically / verbally attacked me instantly. Maybe I had a more raging out of control BPD ex than most of those here but that one line would have surely set her off.

"I'll be in the other room when you calm down." = He is implying I am a crazy person.

[HappyNihilist]

"I'll be in the other room when you calm down."

If I had said that to my ex wife she would of physically / verbally attacked me instantly. Maybe I had a more raging out of control BPD ex than most of those here but that one line would have surely set her off.

I can't speak for your ex wife at all. But my personal experience was different. I had a raging BPDbf, and the times that he did calm down and didn't try to engage me during a rage (after an initial attempt) were the times that I did stand my ground and made sure he knew that I was going to leave until he calmed down. Usually just saying it and meaning it was enough - sometimes I did leave the room, and he never followed me.

These were in the earlier months of the relationship, of course, when I still had boundaries that I would enforce. He found my weakness eventually, and all my boundaries vanished instantly. But my point is that consistent boundaries do help defuse emotionally charged situations and discourage abusive behaviors.

[ogopogodude]

Poedameron, ... .respectively, ... don't waste your time. All of us have heard the exact same non-sense circular arguments that a BPD afflicted person inflicts upon us.  But if it makes you feel better, ... go for it. But transcribing them is a pointless, and fruitless endeavour.

My opinion, is to make use of your time wisely.  You are important. Your BPD loved one has already wasted enough of your valuable time.

Here's a thought: if it is only a audio recording, and you want to show the world (of the nonsense argument) then post it on Youtube as long as you edit it beforehand to eliminate any chance of the yeller/screamer/rager (or anybody for that matter) being identified.

I had thoughts of posting on Youtube my many, many audios & even videos, but I refrained. I am glad that I did.  The only thing it really would have accomplished was/is to educate others as to what a rage/temper/illogical-reasoning behaviour of a BPD person is all about.

Someday, BPD will be a household term and people will know what exactly it is all about. Five years ago, I had no idea what it was nor that this condition even existed.

I still have reminders of the BPD rages around my house.  For example, ... .my (ex)wife was a major door-slammer, and I have little (almost-invisible) clear rubber bumpers --that I purchased at the dollar store-- that I put on all door jambs to muffle the sound of slamming doors.

As I walk past these door jambs, I now laugh internally and say to myself (as if I am having a conversation with my BPD-afflcited (ex)spouse:

"well,you ain't slamming doors anymore now are you?  You are powerless now, and it is I, me, that is the powerful as I have my life back again"

[gameover]

Yeah, I think that those types of boundaries have to be established early in the relationship and and reinforced consistently--once behavior has escalated to a certain point (based on what's been tolerated in the past) it's almost impossible. 

Obviously some pwBPD will push boundaries harder than others.  But in my experience the boundaries I fought for hard and early were the ones that stuck.  But there were other places where I was lax and those places were eventually compromised beyond repair.

[unicorn2014]

Yeah, I think that those types of boundaries have to be established early in the relationship and and reinforced consistently--once behavior has escalated to a certain point (based on what's been tolerated in the past) it's almost impossible. 

Obviously some pwBPD will push boundaries harder than others.  But in my experience the boundaries I fought for hard and early were the ones that stuck.  But there were other places where I was lax and those places were eventually compromised beyond repair.

How early in the relationship? I mean sometimes it takes a few years to realize there's a serious problem, right?

[unicorn2014]

Poedameron, thanks for sharing. Sorry you have gone through all of that.

"I'll be in the other room when you calm down."

If I had said that to my ex wife she would of physically / verbally attacked me instantly. Maybe I had a more raging out of control BPD ex than most of those here but that one line would have surely set her off.

"I'll be in the other room when you calm down." = He is implying I am a crazy person.

I agree with this one. I think if I said this to my pwBPD when he was raging at me it would set him off as well. That's when you just leave.

[gameover]

Yeah, I think that those types of boundaries have to be established early in the relationship and and reinforced consistently--once behavior has escalated to a certain point (based on what's been tolerated in the past) it's almost impossible. 

Obviously some pwBPD will push boundaries harder than others.  But in my experience the boundaries I fought for hard and early were the ones that stuck.  But there were other places where I was lax and those places were eventually compromised beyond repair.

How early in the relationship? I mean sometimes it takes a few years to realize there's a serious problem, right?

Like the first time it happens and every time after that.  Any sign of disrespect--a lot of little boundaries get tested and crossed before it even gets to rage. 

[Mr Hollande]

I've still not read the transcripts in their entirety but I've given them some more thought. Does anyone else have an image of an angry child who is randomly lashing out over something lost or impossible to find while not even knowing what it is? I sense an unhappy and frustrated person who feels very, very lost.

[unicorn2014]

Yeah, I think that those types of boundaries have to be established early in the relationship and and reinforced consistently--once behavior has escalated to a certain point (based on what's been tolerated in the past) it's almost impossible. 

Obviously some pwBPD will push boundaries harder than others.  But in my experience the boundaries I fought for hard and early were the ones that stuck.  But there were other places where I was lax and those places were eventually compromised beyond repair.

How early in the relationship? I mean sometimes it takes a few years to realize there's a serious problem, right?

Like the first time it happens and every time after that.  Any sign of disrespect--a lot of little boundaries get tested and crossed before it even gets to rage. 

Unfortunately the first time it happened I wasn't healthy myself and unfortunately I haven't got that healthy until very recently so it is no wonder things are so difficult now. For me its been 3 years.

[Gonzalo]

Like the first time it happens and every time after that.  Any sign of disrespect--a lot of little boundaries get tested and crossed before it even gets to rage. 

One major problem that I had was that I'd think of the little boundaries as not being important enough to fight over, which helps set up for more and more boundary pushing. Eventually it got to the point where she felt like she got to make medical decisions for me! It's really different dealing with the people around me now, if I say that I do not want them to do X, then they treat it seriously.

[AwakenedOne]

"I'll be in the other room when you calm down."

If I had said that to my ex wife she would of physically / verbally attacked me instantly. Maybe I had a more raging out of control BPD ex than most of those here but that one line would have surely set her off.

I can't speak for your ex wife at all. But my personal experience was different. I had a raging BPDbf, and the times that he did calm down and didn't try to engage me during a rage (after an initial attempt) were the times that I did stand my ground and made sure he knew that I was going to leave until he calmed down. Usually just saying it and meaning it was enough - sometimes I did leave the room, and he never followed me.

These were in the earlier months of the relationship, of course, when I still had boundaries that I would enforce. He found my weakness eventually, and all my boundaries vanished instantly. But my point is that consistent boundaries do help defuse emotionally charged situations and discourage abusive behaviors.

What I was attempting to say in my previous post was that if we don't choose our words wisely the situation can get worse. If it is perceived that you are implying a pwBPD is crazy or stupid things can go horribly wrong.

For example : Somehow I called her crazy once in her mind. I only said something though like "You are getting worked up about this issue, please relax". I spoke in a low and caring voice. Apparently that remark meant to her that I said that she is a nutcase. She exploded. What happened is a long story. But to fast forward it... .five people or even more could of easily died due to the chaotic hell of her rage if I hadn't of in a complex way diffused the situation or God did.

[HappyNihilist]

AwakenedOne, I agree completely - we should always be careful of our word choices during emotionally charged situations, especially with someone who probably isn't capable of thinking rationally at the moment. 

Like the first time it happens and every time after that.  Any sign of disrespect--a lot of little boundaries get tested and crossed before it even gets to rage.  

Unfortunately the first time it happened I wasn't healthy myself and unfortunately I haven't got that healthy until very recently so it is no wonder things are so difficult now. For me its been 3 years.

unicorn, I feel you.  

The important thing is that now you are healthier now. It doesn't matter how long it takes to get there - it takes time to heal our deepest wounds. You're there now, and moving on even further, and that's what matters.

Disrespect doesn't necessarily mean a boundary has been tested, and vice versa. Boundaries are tested and broken in many ways, from overt to subtle. Sometimes we don't even realize our boundaries were violated until much later, looking back on the situation. Sometimes, looking back, we realize that some things we thought were our boundaries really weren't realistic or authentic.

If you would have asked me about myself before this relationship, I would have said I had strong boundaries. I would have been gravely mistaken, but I would have said it anyway.

It's ok to not be healthy. It's also ok not to really understand the concept of boundaries, or to not feel strong enough to enforce them yet. We're all learning.

I personally found this article and workshop very enlightening when I was trying to figure out what boundaries truly were, and how they can help defuse conflict situations - BOUNDARIES - Living our values

[LostGhost]

This gave me flashbacks to my very recent breakup.  The dialogue between my ex and I wasn't nearly as long and I didn't speak back to her as much. I tried using validation and SET but I received nothing but push push push for my efforts. What the other poster said I think it's 100% accurate. They project onto you because of current unacceptable behaviour or very near future behaviour that they can then justify since you're such a terrible, horrible abandoner. So ridiculous.

Awful. I'm sorry you went through this. I think I'll have PTSD for a while. Those kind of arguments are insanity inducing. If I ever get back together with her, next time this happens I'll likely do something outrageous like bear hug her and lick her face excitedly while singing Winnie the Pooh, then ask her "Are you mad?" before tying a blanket around her like a superhero cape and then saying, "Now you're super-mad!" just to see what happens.

[enlighten me]

Lostghost

If you do that then please send me the link. I cant imagine what my exgf would have done.

[Gonzalo]

I tried using validation and SET but I received nothing but push push push for my efforts... .Those kind of arguments are insanity inducing.

"OK, what I'm hearing is that you feel X" "Oh my god no that's not it and I can't believe you would think I would think something like that you clearly don't even like me" "OK, so I wasn't hearing you correctly, what would be a better summary of what you feel?" "Just shut up, if you cared about me you'd understand what I said."

"It disturbs me when you do specific thing X in response to Y, I don't think it's a fair or reasonable response to Y and would like for you to avoid that in the future." "Oh, so you're saying I'm a crazy cxxx?" "No, I'm saying there is a specific thing that bothers me and... ." "Yeah, you're just telling me I'm a crazy cxxx, you never fxxxing take responsibility for anything."

If I ever get back together with her, next time this happens I'll likely do something outrageous like bear hug her and lick her face excitedly while singing Winnie the Pooh, then ask her "Are you mad?" before tying a blanket around her like a superhero cape and then saying, "Now you're super-mad!" just to see what happens.

If I wasn't so worn down and exhausted at the end, something like that would have hilarious. It's not like it could have made her any angrier, she was already dialed up to 11.

[LonelyChild]

First off, this is EXACTLY (word for word, certain sentences) how conversations went down with my uBPDxgf.

She often said "you made a choice" "you need to reconsider your priorities" and the "again and again and again" stuff. Scary!

Secondly, this woman is obviously crazy. The most honest thing she said during the convo is probably sleeping with someone else.

Third, you need to get out of this for good.

[unicorn2014]

I personally found this article and workshop very enlightening when I was trying to figure out what boundaries truly were, and how they can help defuse conflict situations - BOUNDARIES - Living our values

Thank you, I've read that before but I will make sure to reread it again very carefully. I have identified some core values conflicts with my partner which I believe has created a lot of conflict. I have to take full responsibility for not living in line with my own values and I believe that will solve the problem. My partner doesn't like it because he says I'm changing everything and that is unfortunate but I do have to take care of myself and if he truly loves me, he'll come along for the ride. This isn't going to be easy.

[emergent]

You're supposed to read her mind and know that there's a problem, but never offer help if she doesn't need it, and you're supposed to do exactly what she tells you to do unless you're supposed to do the opposite of what she said. If you don't ever get this all exactly right, then you clearly don't care about her - and if you do get it all right, you're being too controlling and manipulative so you're wrong anyway.

I love this. It's a perfect summary. I'd just add that if you get it all right, you're damned for being so "saintly" or trying to look good next to the pwBPD.

It is exhausting being with someone who acts like this and who has all of these needs.