BPD The Chameleon

[How to communicate after a contentious divorce...]

I think that is the scariest part. How you are with someone you think you know, but you really don't at all.

It's devastating and terrifying. The is a quote in a Taylor Swift song called " Red " that line when she says " Forgetting them is like forgetting someone you never met but loving them was Red "

That is exactly!


Does anyone really know why it's this way? I believe there are true parts to them but with all the emotions it like makes for an unstable core.


Thoughts?

[Kelli Cornett]

I think that is the scariest part. How you are with someone you think you know, but you really don't at all.

It's devastating and terrifying. The is a quote in a Taylor Swift song called " Red " that line when she says " Forgetting them is like forgetting someone you never met but loving them was Red "

That is exactly!


Does anyone really know why it's this way? I believe there are true parts to them but with all the emotions it like makes for an unstable core.


Thoughts?

[Darsha500]

I remember my ex lied to me upon our first meeting about graduating from college at the same time as me from the same school, a lie which she later confessed to.

I also recall getting the feeling that she was trying extra hard to sound and appear intellectual to me. I found it flattering, but also a little unauthentic. As time went on, though, it no longer seemed like an act.

It really is interesting. My ex at one point also told me that if she had ended up with a friend of mine, her plan was to salsa dance for him. For another, she planned to let him tie her up. At the time I sort of shrugged these confessions off. Now I realize they were really signs of something being not quite right.

She even told me she was a chameleon. But she also told me that she felt like she could be herself with me, unlike other men she dated. Which makes sense, because thats something I value - authenticity. 

I think about the qualities that she mirrored in me, and wonder, how could she 'fake' all those qualities. How can one fake being witty? how can one fake being intellectual? I think that what i saw was an expression of her self, in allot of ways.

Heres an idea though. It has been said that those with BPD do not possess a self. As a self, this is very hard to wrap my head around. But I can imagine it being this lack of an identity, a sort of emptiness. No core. Sounds so awful.

My ex once told me she didn't know who she was deep down. She didn't feel like she knew her true self. And i think this is the thing. One of the symptoms of neurosis is an alienation from the true self. It happens as the result of forsaking one's own deepest needs and wishes in order to obtain a feeling of safety. To do so though, one adopts behaviors that enables one to adapt to the circumstances. These behaviors constitute a false self. The true self of the person with BPD is buried deep deep deep down. But upon it lie encrusted defense mechanisms. The true self is despised, the object of unbearable shame. The true self, after all, was not acceptable. It was not allowed to emerge or grow in the environment in which it was raised. It must therefore be bad.

The chameleon like behaviors are thus an adaptation. A means of coping with life.

This is one theory on the matter.

[SummerStorm]

I think that is the scariest part. How you are with someone you think you know, but you really don't at all.

I basically said this same thing to my former friend's ex-boyfriend today.  I was like, "I was best friends with someone I didn't even really know."  I knew everything she was doing when she was with me or when she was at work, but I didn't know anything about her life when I wasn't around.  She rarely talked about her family or her now ex-boyfriend, other than to complain about them.  She didn't talk about other friends, other than to criticize them.  At the same time she was telling me that her boyfriend was awful and that she wanted to be with me, she was showing her boobs to a bunch of guys at a party.  She was going home and smoking pot all the time.  I knew she was smoking it again, but I had no idea how often.  

It's kind of terrifying to think that I trusted so completely someone who can be incredibly violent.  I never witnessed it, only her raging in texts, but her ex-boyfriend said it was unlike anything he'd ever seen.

The chameleon traits come from lack of a true self and a need to form attachments.  Essentially, pwBPD have to be open to becoming friends with/dating anyone.  Honestly, it's kind of an admirable trait.  My former friend judges individuals, but she doesn't judge groups of people.  She has no racial prejudices, is bisexual, and doesn't care about level of education.  Of course, it can also be a bad thing, since she tends to forget that there are genuinely bad people out there.  

Every single day, I worry that she will get mixed up with a group of people who are just bad or a guy who will seriously hurt her.  My state has a HUGE heroin problem, and it would kill me if she started doing that.  She did cocaine a few years ago, but since then, it's only been pot.  She can be physically abusive, but she's also only about 5'4" and maybe 130 pounds.  

The group of friends she has now is completely different from everyone else she's been friends with.  Before, she was at least friends with people who were in college and had ambition or people who already had a stable career.  Her current job is basically the same one she had when she was in college and getting into all sorts of trouble.

[SGraham]

When the author of this thread used the word chameleon it made me think of how pwBPD alter themselves to appear like your perfect partner. 

[balletomane]

Interesting thread. I don't think mirroring/being a chameleon was a particularly strong trait for my ex: he could easily express vocal disagreement and get belligerent when someone didn't agree with him. He had strong opinions and tastes. However, I noticed that he very often dated people who fell way outside his tastes and far from what he valued - I got the feeling that he would date just about anyone if they showed any interest in him at all. So paradoxically, even though he could be very rigid and inflexible in his thinking, he was prepared to compromise on things that mattered to him for the sake of a scrap of affection.

I do have a friend who was such an incredible chameleon that for a long time I never knew who she was at all. It took me a while to work out that she was just copying me and my interests; at first I just thought we were very similar people. I remember saying to her once, "This is weird, it's like we share the same brain." She was always frightened of saying what she really thought to people in case they didn't like her any more. She pretended to dislike the same foods as I do because she was frightened I would terminate the friendship if she ate things I didn't enjoy. She doesn't have BPD though. She has been receiving treatment for severe anxiety and OCD and all the professionals in her care think this is the issue, not a personality disorder. I can see that - she isn't manipulative and she doesn't have other maladaptive behaviours, just the chameleon thing. It can still be pretty difficult to deal with though.

[Kelli Cornett]

I remember my ex lied to me upon our first meeting about graduating from college at the same time as me from the same school, a lie which she later confessed to.

I also recall getting the feeling that she was trying extra hard to sound and appear intellectual to me. I found it flattering, but also a little unauthentic. As time went on, though, it no longer seemed like an act.

It really is interesting. My ex at one point also told me that if she had ended up with a friend of mine, her plan was to salsa dance for him. For another, she planned to let him tie her up. At the time I sort of shrugged these confessions off. Now I realize they were really signs of something being not quite right.

She even told me she was a chameleon. But she also told me that she felt like she could be herself with me, unlike other men she dated. Which makes sense, because thats something I value - authenticity. 

I think about the qualities that she mirrored in me, and wonder, how could she 'fake' all those qualities. How can one fake being witty? how can one fake being intellectual? I think that what i saw was an expression of her self, in allot of ways.

Heres an idea though. It has been said that those with BPD do not possess a self. As a self, this is very hard to wrap my head around. But I can imagine it being this lack of an identity, a sort of emptiness. No core. Sounds so awful.

My ex once told me she didn't know who she was deep down. She didn't feel like she knew her true self. And i think this is the thing. One of the symptoms of neurosis is an alienation from the true self. It happens as the result of forsaking one's own deepest needs and wishes in order to obtain a feeling of safety. To do so though, one adopts behaviors that enables one to adapt to the circumstances. These behaviors constitute a false self. The true self of the person with BPD is buried deep deep deep down. But upon it lie encrusted defense mechanisms. The true self is despised, the object of unbearable shame. The true self, after all, was not acceptable. It was not allowed to emerge or grow in the environment in which it was raised. It must therefore be bad.

The chameleon like behaviors are thus an adaptation. A means of coping with life.

This is one theory on the matter.

Wow powerful stuff. Deep.

[hurting300]

I have no idea who my ex is. Everything she told me she did or did not like or do was a lie... she would have different personalities for different people. It's like she is a ghost or something. It's so confusing.

[SGraham]

I have no idea who my ex is. Everything she told me she did or did not like or do was a lie... she would have different personalities for different people. It's like she is a ghost or something. It's so confusing.

Yeah i get that too. I used to think my ex and i were so perfect because we liked so many of the same bands, hobbies, had similar political and religious views or whatever issue was, now i look back and have to think: there is a good to fair chances that all that was bullsht. 

[hurting300]

I have no idea who my ex is. Everything she told me she did or did not like or do was a lie... she would have different personalities for different people. It's like she is a ghost or something. It's so confusing.

Yeah i get that too. I used to think my ex and i were so perfect because we liked so many of the same bands, hobbies, had similar political and religious views or whatever issue was, now i look back and have to think: there is a good to fair chances that all that was bullsht. 

when she was in college she was a (know it all) but was also failing bad. But that didn't stop her from correcting me! She also told me she wasn't a drinker. Well... .

[imstronghere2]

I was with m ex-wife for 22.5 years, 19.5 of them married.  Right before she moved out we were talking on our back patio and I said to her:

"I don't know who you are.  Has this person been there all along?"

And she replied:

"Yes, just repressed"

So even after living with one of them for that long, you still won't know who they really are because THEY don't know.   They have no core self.

[balletomane]

I was with m ex-wife for 22.5 years, 19.5 of them married.  Right before she moved out we were talking on our back patio and I said to her:

"I don't know who you are.  Has this person been there all along?"

And she replied:

"Yes, just repressed"

So even after living with one of them for that long, you still won't know who they really are because THEY don't know.   They have no core self.

This triggered a really strong flashback for me. During the month preceding the breakup, my ex was distraught, spiteful, and furious all at once. He said to me, "Is this the real you? This had better not be the real you. Have you been pretending all along?" I was also distraught and this seemed to me like such a bizarre thing to say, but I reassured him that the real me liked him and cared about him. I didn't even know what he meant. He seemed to have constructed this whole sinister personality for me and was paranoid that his previous image of me was false (which, knowing BPD idealisation, it will have been). On another occasion I said he reminded me of Dr Jekyll and Mr Hyde. He got outraged and said, "No, you're the one who is Jekyll and Hyde," and told me I wouldn't manipulate him that easily.

Ow. Whenever I think I'm getting better memories like that come and stab me.

[Dutched]

I think we all knew deep down who the ex was….

Even see it as their ‘personal branding’ is turned 180…again.

We all know who in fact kept the r/s going and who in fact put that much effort in it… working hard to fulfil (emotional)needs and support (more than one can imagine), care, love, etc. for the sake of us, the ex and because of the family/kids! of to stabilize.

Now… we fully realize it.

PwBPD are like chameleons because of their half core.

When the audience is gone, the mask tumbles down and they are empty.

We were the audience…. but were kicked out as we didn’t applaud enough…