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VIDEO: "What is parental alienation?" Parental alienation is when a parent allows a child to participate or hear them degrade the other parent. This is not uncommon in divorces and the children often adjust. In severe cases, however, it can be devastating to the child. This video provides a helpful overview.
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Author Topic: Physical appearance  (Read 950 times)
blackbirdsong
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« on: February 15, 2016, 09:51:31 AM »

It may seem shallow, but I realized that some part of reasons why I am constantly thinking about her is her physical appearance.

I already mentioned she is a celebrity in my country. She is really good looking.

So, I often bump into her picture/video/some_other_media . It makes NC rule pretty useless in this case. 

When I see her, I think to myself: "And you left her? You moron!"

But then 'other part of me' jumps in and says: ":)ude, remember that situation when... ._insert_some_classic_BPD_behavior".

And then those "two guys" start fighting :D

I know I need to work on my self-esteem more, but now I am pretty sure that I will never have a girl so good looking again... .  Being cool (click to insert in post)

And this is bothering me (narcissistic trait  Smiling (click to insert in post))

Do you experience something similar?
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cosmonaut
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« Reply #1 on: February 15, 2016, 09:56:07 AM »

One of the common problems I've noticed with us guys is that we can invest a good degree of our self-worth in how attractive our partner is.  I've been there myself.  It's not something that I've noticed to any such degree with women.  To us men, we can believe that if someone highly attractive loves us then we must be worth something.  It's not healthy thinking at all, and it's a sign we have some work to do inside.  I'm not sure if that's what is the case with you, but it's something to consider.
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blackbirdsong
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« Reply #2 on: February 15, 2016, 09:58:08 AM »

  I'm not sure if that's what is the case with you, but it's something to consider.

Yes, it is. Smiling (click to insert in post)
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Lonely_Astro
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« Reply #3 on: February 15, 2016, 10:19:56 AM »

It's two fold: ego and biological selection.  Hear me out.

On a biological level, we have selected this person because they tell our deeper genetic self that they would be a good mate to propagate the species.  If you see a girl that "does it for you", on a biological level, there's a reason you want to sleep with her.  Something inside you says they would be a good mate.  This is the biological level I'm talking about, not emotional/ego.

One the ego level, we have all been so bombarded with what 'beauty' is by our cultures that if we are with "a 10" physically, we feel on top of the world.  We look at it like we have this idealization that we have "one upped" our fellow man by having this attractive female.  It makes others envious and we enjoy that.  Even more so when it appears this attractive female is in love with us, of all people.  That may sound N from us, but that has been my experience as to the why.  We are competitive by nature.  We want to be the king of the mound (no pun intended, btw) and we judge our success of that on our various conquest... .whatever they may be.  I say this because I have felt this way, others have too that I've talked to about it.  The fact is, we all have N traits, but that doesnt make us disordered.  I know that my success isn't measured in the way I've described, but I also know I am competitive and want to succeed in whatever I set out to do.

J, was by far, the most attractive (physically) woman I have ever been with.  I can't debate this if I wanted to, it's simple fact.  But, the other side of that coin is that she was the ugliest I've ever been with emotionally speaking.  Don't get me wrong, I understand that she was doing the best she could, but there were plenty of times she hurt me knowingly.  I don't doubt she 'loves' me, but it's in a totally screwed up kind of way.

It was her looks that attracted me first (biological) and then when she appeared to be super nice, interesting, and a great girl that made her even more attractive (ego/emotional) to me.  The thing was, she only appeared to be those things.  She wasn't/isnt nice, interesting, or a great girl really.  She attracted me like a predator would their prey.  I get that this wasn't intentional on her part, but in a way it is in the present day.  She knows she's "messed up" (her words), how much a mess she is... .and she simply says "oh well" about it.  That's criminal.  I'm not saying all BPDs don't have a right to love or be loved, but when you're intentionally hurting people and you say "oh well", that's just wrong on so many levels.  Not all BPDs are bad people, but J is a bad person, just like there are bad 'nons' out there too.

But, letting go of the physical attributes of your ex is tough.  I know, I still struggle with it.  Not solely for the physical aspects but because of emotion tied to the physical.  Here was this great girl who said she loved me and wanted to be with me.  And she had 'the looks' to go along with that.  I was on top of the world.  To bad it wasn't meant to last, no matter how good I was to her or tried to show her that I did, in fact, love her.  She's with someone new and that's a point of contention for me right now... .it's really hit my ego.  My ego wants them to fail.  Right or wrong, that's what I want right now.  In a few months, it won't matter, but I'm not there just yet.

Sorry for the ramble guys.  Todays a hard day for me.

Anyway,
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steelwork
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« Reply #4 on: February 15, 2016, 10:29:33 AM »

Some things about D that I guess make him generically attractive (like his muscular physique or his careful grooming) were actually kind of turn-offs to me. In the beginning I though, Huh, there's a guy most chicks would find attractive. But once he started love-bombing me, he became much more attractive. By the end I was caught up in the anxiety that I'd never be with a guy that hot again. It's kind of settled back to where it was: he's not my type physically. I really still miss his spirit and intellect and humor and vulnerability and all that stuff, though. And the sex. Hah.
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Lifewriter16
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« Reply #5 on: February 15, 2016, 10:44:45 AM »

Not intending to by judgemental at all, but when I read this type of post or the posts where men are banging on about how great the sex was and how no one else will ever compare, I despair of ever finding a decent bloke... .

Lifewriter
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steelwork
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« Reply #6 on: February 15, 2016, 10:51:45 AM »

Not intending to by judgemental at all, but when I read this type of post or the posts where men are banging on about how great the sex was and how no one else will ever compare, I despair of ever finding a decent bloke... .

Lifewriter

I know what you mean, LW! On the other hand, these ladies make us non-crazy women look pretty good in other ways. I've been the beneficiary a few times.
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steelwork
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« Reply #7 on: February 15, 2016, 10:57:22 AM »

That sounded bad. What I mean is that some of my old boyfriends had horror stories about the gorgeous but unhinged women they'd been with. I think it made them appreciate me more. I'm attractive enough--don't get me wrong--but I don't put my looks out there as bait.
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steelwork
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« Reply #8 on: February 15, 2016, 11:26:14 AM »

Sorry for the ramble guys.  Todays a hard day for me.

I didn't think it was a ramble. Thanks for your honesty. I'm sorry you're having a hard day. Want to talk about it?
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thisworld
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« Reply #9 on: February 15, 2016, 11:56:34 AM »

Blackbirdsong,

Thank you for writing about this openly and honestly. I think this is more common in relationships than we usually think but not everyone talks about it openly. Kudos.

I think when someone has something out of the ordinary to offer to us (be it beauty or a specific talent) and if that thing has some significance for us all well (something we appreciate or think adds to our self-worth), it becomes harder than usual to let go. I think this is a normal phase in detachment and you already seem to have the two sides of the issue fighting in you, which is good. Hopefully, in time, the emotionally healthier and beneficial side will win and integrate the other.

I think it's important to see it from the perspective of what we, as responsible and loving partners, can offer to someone as well. Otherwise, it would be unfair to them, wouldn't it?

My personal experience with men who perceive my whole body only from the outside (that is through its outer features) has been that I have been kind of scared of them, or disappointed. Whenever I receive repetitive compliments about a feature of mine but there isn't much emotional trust between us, I start thinking what would happen to us if I lost one of my "beautiful" organs - traffic accidents, cancers, these are realities of life and they are hitting females from pretty early ages onward really. If these men are "tolerating" me because they think my beauty is an "asset", would they resent me if I, for some reason, lost a part of this "asset"? So, as a responsible and loving partner, would you be able to love your BPD partner even if she lost her beauty perhaps sooner than you ever imagined? If not, I'd really think again. I think Nons should be as emotionally responsible as they expect from pwBPD or perhaps more. So, my question, would you be able to love this woman full-heartedly and with radical acceptance if she lost what you like, or would your resentment build up? I think, this axis, rather than whether to leave or not may give hints about what you really want.   

Secondly, I have come across men who were attracted to me saying I was beautiful but felt kind of glad when I became less beautiful due to severe stress- my BPD/NPD ex, who is a rather handsome person actually, tried to bring me down a lot and seemed happier as I became exhausted - except when I had to function as a "prize". (I think NPD does this.) I think enjoying a person's demise like this is not healthy. Would you be able to encourage her beauty even if you thought this could be at your expense?

Thirdly, if you think your ex-girlfriend is more beautiful than women you usually date and you relate it with your own self-esteem, what would happen to you if you lost something more or less attractive about yourself? Would you be able to feel comfortable around her or would you feel insecure and contribute to the relationship negatively? 

Without emotional safety for both partners (not only us but also our partners), one's perceived superiority in something may cause unhappiness in a relationship. Does your partner give you that safety? Can you give her that for the right reasons even when she isn't that beautiful? 

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cosmonaut
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« Reply #10 on: February 15, 2016, 12:01:24 PM »

On a biological level, we have selected this person because they tell our deeper genetic self that they would be a good mate to propagate the species.  If you see a girl that "does it for you", on a biological level, there's a reason you want to sleep with her.  Something inside you says they would be a good mate.  This is the biological level I'm talking about, not emotional/ego.

Is being a slave to our biology being a man?  I would suggest it is the absolute antithesis of manhood.  Is it not the willful denial of our most animal instincts that is the hallmark of a man?
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Frank88
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« Reply #11 on: February 15, 2016, 12:15:47 PM »

Astro. You're spot on about the biological piece. I've always been a believer in that. One more thing for us to consider the next time it happens. Perfect looks could be hiding a lot.
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apollotech
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« Reply #12 on: February 15, 2016, 12:52:56 PM »

When I see her, I think to myself: "And you left her? You moron!"

But then 'other part of me' jumps in and says: ":)ude, remember that situation when... ._insert_some_classic_BPD_behavior".

And then those "two guys" start fighting :D


I don't know BBS, I personally don't see your fighting with yourself as such a bad thing. I think this is actually an indication that you've matured; in contrast, at one time, her looks would have trumped your thinking, now that's no longer the case. Now you're seeing her as a whole person.
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