Vengeance is natural, helps with recovery? Thoughts on this:

[feelbetterdoit]

Its been a long time since it ended and I still have brain fog and damage related to what she did to me. I've taken huge steps forward but I guess there are two unresolved areas I think need resolving- 1) I need to rebuild up my damaged ego by proving further to myself I deserved love, and somehow I feel like I need to sleep with more people to show myself I'm back on track in the normal dating game. Don't know why this matters but my mind directs me this way... .After 2.5 years after we broke up I think it will finally settle my low feelings once and for all.

2) I want to knock her ego to show her it was not ok to hold me in place and kick me while I was too weak to fight back. She refused me closure and held on to very important personal possession of mine that I needed back for a whole year, making me wait on her terms for its return while I suffered and struggled and was unable to move on. She slept with more people to shove in my face how she was moving on and I was stuck, she built herself up while I was trapped in mental distress. My feelings for revenge are wholly natural and no one deserves it more than her.

My plan: I want to access her Facebook account, her portal for narcissism and advertising of how far she got to enjoy her life while I was made to suffer, and I want to delete every single photo, every 'like', every post, that she has. I want to show her what it feels like to realise everything you thought real can be taken away just like that. And taking away her sole source of ego and false narcissistic platform of memories would be the perfect way to trigger her so called 'abandonment issues'. Take away all the ___ she built up at other people's expense.

How would people feel about this form of revenge, are there legal repercussions and do people think it's a good idea?

Don't worry about me: I'm getting better, ___ it's been 2 years and I now mostly feel silly I used to accept what she did to me and perpetual brain fog. I'm getting on with the first part but the second could use a boost. It's not actually harmful is it? Just hacking... .

[Daniell85]

Consider. Your damaged self esteem.

This won't help build you up.

And hacking other people's social accounts... not legal. The repercussion from that is probably a slap on the wrist. Same time, if you are considering what is best for you?

Will tell you some stories.

I am not proud of this. My exbf has run me through a lot of wringers. Cheating, someone else pregnant, stealing from me, blaming me, silent treatments, blocking me all over. The whole time running smear campaigns and projecting all of the "blame" onto me.

Because I got upset. So I come here to this site, spend enough time on various boards that I "get" BPD.

All I basically have heard from my ex is that "you're an awesome woman, but you lose control."

He thinks, with time, I can overcome that.    I think not being in contact with him, with time I can overcome that. ( see what I did there?)

That brings me to the "lose control" aspect. That is what you are doing. You are losing control. Feeding into the chaos, and darkness of what your ex has done.

You won't resolve not feeling lovable by taking revenge. Or even trying to find justice. With BPD, as frustrating as it is, it's a waste of time because they will flip it all around and use it to show everyone "see what did I tell you about feelbetter? He's crazy."

BPD/NPD are experts at manipulating public eye.

I don't know what to do with that burning sense of injustice you sound like you are feeling. I feel it, too. I lashed out in pain and anger, too. Every single times I have ( no matter how normal I was to do it) I feel I gave away my dignity and self respect. There has not been one single time I walked away instead of telling my exbf off that I have ever regretted.

Maybe you have enough regrets already?

What do are your thoughts?

[C.Stein]

Perhaps you should be trying understand why after 2 years you are having these highly self-destructive feelings of revenge?   The better course of action IMO is to find a way to let go of the anger and move forward with your life in a positive and healthy fashion.  I fail to see what good lowering yourself to her level will do for you. 

[confusedandangry]

I completely understand what you mean by revenge.  I feel my exBPD left me with low self esteem, self loathing and castrated  (and I'm female).  I have thought many of ways to plot revenge on how to make her suffer and see how it is to be in pain.  I want her to feel something, BUT... .everything I have been reading on here, it won't make it happen and it will not make me regain my self worth.  She has been gone for over a week, in a new relationship and has blocked me from every aspect of her life.  I am angry, confused and still there is a part of me that knows revenge will not make any of that go away.  My family and friends keep saying good riddance, but my heart doesn't accept that. 

[feelbetterdoit]

Hi, thanks for your responses so far. This is long, but I tried to make it somewhat exciting to read... .Please do----

Well, in response and to clarify some things,

I do agree with the idea that the real solution to my negative reactions is to change and adopt positive thought patterns and habits until the day they are truly internalised and I think no more of what happened. I get this, and have been making progress with this. In fact, as soon as the breakup happened all time ago I immediately started travelling to prevent myself dwelling.

However, in short, as expected, back then I got no closure after 2 years of abuse, she just vanished, and said she was suicidal, then left me to handle that while she vanished off the planet never to give meanything to suggest she was still alive. For a full year. Even if I had wanted to let go I was tortured by what the abuse had done already and anunshakeable gut wrenching guilt, as if I was the bad one. So I didn't move on, or get with anyone for a full year. Couldn't.

When she did finally show up again, reactivating her facebook (she lives in another continent so I had no idea) I waited 6 months to contact her. By this point I was markedly f'ed up and contacting her filed me with habitual fear.

She lied about waiting for me, and blah blah. Truth was of course that she had wasted zero time moving on, sleeping around (2000 tinder matches), going to events, from the word go. In short, while I spent a year almost mourning her in regret and damage, she went about recovering at my expense. I tried too. And did ok, travelling and changing my path in life but clearly damage done at just 19 was hard to fix and loss of a 'loved one' hard to deal with.

When she wanted to get back together, some instinctual fear pushed me away, as well as deeply ingrained pain. At first she claimed to be with no one the whole time and loved me so much, but after rejecting her soon enough she revealed the numbers. This hurt a lot. And she had something of mine that I needed back personally. It was a childhood gift from a parent who had had a heart attack, and I could not accept I had given it to her when perhaps my memory of that parent was in an evil person's possession. i jsut wanted it mailed back so I could let it all go and focus on getting on with my life.

She didn't mail it back. It's all I wanted, and I refused to let it go- it was extremely personal and important to me, and she knew of my dying parent. Yet refused to send it. In fact, what she did was sleep around and post on facebook the nights out with this guy. Seemingly my dying parent made her horny.

She didn't return it until a whole 9 months later, after I had been through emotional hell, and degraded myself to almost begging for her to return something before my dad died. (He didn't but it was a very close thing, and how did she know if he did or not? Is the point. She didn't care. It seemed as if it turned her on.)

She only returned it after I lied that he had died. Only returned it after I took back all the 'nasty things' I said to her- calling her immoral and evil and cruel and a slut and all this terrible stuff. Because of course I was the evil one calling her such 'lies'. I regretted almost using the dying parent as a weapon for her guilt. But you know what? He really could have ___ing died. He nearly ___ing did and it scared me to death. And she grew from it. She got me, begging for mercy almost, begging her to let me free.

What that did to me was immensely damaging. I hope people can see that.

Fast forward-- I did well at university year. I got exchange year to her city. I had insecurity issues, i had developed self consciousness, awful awful negative habits for my self esteem which actually I had none of when we first broke up. I left her. I found her disgusting. I pitied her. I hated her. I was ok. I left her, and I went to Europe and found happiness at last. But that was before, and then of course I made the mistake of contacting her, but it was becasue I wanted my thing back.

She won. She lowered me and built up her ego. She made me cry and fall. She made me beg. Then when i mentioned the death she ___ed off and said I need mental help. Acted like the sane one only trying to get me 'proper support' for my loss. I watched 'Gone Girl' and it scared the hell out of me, seeing what she was. She was worse.

Anyway, I got exchange. Felt good, felt justice, but not enough. Still felt weak, damaged, wanted validation and support. Tried to meet her (really I just wanted sex with her because I was too ___ed up to try with other girls. I felt like letting her use me sexually for a power trip would at least give me the experience with a girl to eventually ditch her and get with someone else. I was successful with this actually. What she did to me honestly damaged me sexaully, I couldn't get hard, I couldn't enjoy sex. I had serious anxiety about whether I could even have sex anymore.

Did it with her, in a park, at her place. Didn't get attached, tried to match her mind games. She seemed to get attached to me, I pretended to love her while talking to other girls too. Slowly trying to use her for practise and repair of my ___ed up self esteem. Kind of worked. I felt like I did ok, though soon realised mind games with a BPD are NOT something you can win. It was masochistically fun though. But masochistic is the point here. Everytime I saw her she would talkc about sex with guys, would try to devalue me and humiliate me during sex by telling me she didn't feel like it anymore before I came, things like that. It hurt, but I tried to stay in perspective and pretend to 'love her'.

Soon enough though I hated playing a facade for her benefit. I told her how evil she was almost by accident wevery time I would let myself be devalued. I insulted her and couldn't stand her. Also for some stupid reason I fwelt GUILTY about only wanting her for practise sex. I hate my guilt complex. Seriously, why do I care about that monster?

Anyway, things got better when I cut away. I met a girl, I went to China (exchanged to Hong Kong, her city), I go to china a lot now, I did some crazy fun things I had sex with multiple girls now. I know I can stay hard now (funny maybe but really I was so scared I couldn't enjoy sex after what she did). I was LUCKY. Getting these opportunities to feel as if life paid off well for me has helped enormously. I know some of her exes were not lucky and fell a long long way, into the pit of damage I have managed to ALMOST ALMOST escape from. Nearly there.

But still: the two issues I mentioned. I still have habitual anger and damaging habits from what she did, and it annoys me that they linger. While I know I'm making her feel low by her knowing I really no longer need her for validation (I have a better girl and friends and lifestyle and memories since the nightmare), I also still feel the after effects of abuse. I still have to accept the injustice that was the abuse. I think about how I would be had I not managed to get on exchange, the pit I would still be in, and into which many more guys are sure to fall.

Isn't it MORAL that I use my luck and growing strength to knock back someone into the pit they dig? I want to. I really ___ing want to.

[Daniell85]

Ok. I think maybe you are suffering guilt and shame for having let yourself down. You have done all sorts of things that degraded you in order to get back at her already. It's not helping.

I've been there, I did a few things, too. I feel guilty. You feel guilt because you are a non BPD person. And you acted out of alignment with your character. The reason you aren't satisfied is because all of that doesn't fix the damage to your self esteem.

You won't get closure from your BPD ex.

The closure is found in looking at your own self. The kind of person you want to be. Examine what your *true* values are. You have gotten twisted up in the BPD enviroment, and boy if you don't understand, it can really pull you down some dark paths.

You aren't like her. Your peace is in your values, living your life according to those values. Creating boundaries that are in alignment with those values. Acting within those boundaries.

So what kind of values, ideally, did you have originally as an innocent person who had no idea what he was getting into when he got into the relationship with the BPD? Could you see yourself acting on your pain and anger in the way you describe before someone hurt you?

What are your values?

[GreenEyedMonster]

I think you are under the mistaken impression that you can "teach her a lesson."

This is a person with defense mechanisms that keep her from being able to take responsibility for much of anything.

Anything you do to her will simply become a reflection, in her mind, of how awful you were in the relationship, and ammo to smear you with later.  You will not "prove" anything and it will not offer you closure.  After you do something like this, she will be left feeling more justified and self-righteous about anything she did to you.

[feelbetterdoit]

What are my values? Hmm, well some have remained the same throughout: fairness, honesty, justice; some have slowly returned to how they used to be-bitterness to humour, anger and sadness to mindfulness, self destruction and punishment to healing and healthy recovery; and some have changed and adpated from whatever they were before: a new view on a rose tinted world torn apart by an evil person: from unwavering forgiveness and sacrifice to non-acceptance of bull ___e, overpowering kindness and guilt complex to self respect and unapologeticness for anything that causes a good person pain, and also a desire to make amends, to focus much more on my recovery over the feelings of someone who does not value others.

The latter is seemingly self destructive, and I realise this.

I have even attempted to construct some kind of justice/revenge/deterrant/karma that doesn't go too far... .That doesn't upset her too much. I still have the guilt complex, but I also feel a level of responsibility. She often told me I'm a good person, that she knows I would never hurt someone, and I was so fond of her. Even after all she did I tried and still accidentally see the things I admired about her. I still care. But I need to put things in perspective.

Typing back only a small fraction of the way she abused me shocks me even. That I would still be dumb enough (or human enough) to feel a shred of guilt for doing whatever it takes for me to feel justice has been done. And even if I let it go, which I agree must be done, SHE and I both know that I used to talk about how much I beleive in justice, helping people that are suffering. She was my girlfriend when I helped my mum through a messy divorce, when I helped a brother with depression, defended even her when I felt like she was being rejected by family. My family and her always knew I was proud to be someone that would defend what I felt was right. But when I was an unwilling victim for my own abuse, who was there for my defense? Not her, and my inner strength blew away in the wind. I was left all alone and I never, never imagined I would have reached the point after such damage that I could read this board and offer support to someone else. I am so proud of myself for finally escaping.

But it took 2 years... And the relationship that abused me was the same length. So that's 4 years of damage. That's so sad. All the nice people I may have met from age 18 had I not met her. Maybe I would even still be as loving and kind-- and ultimately, naive.

I learnt a lot from her. I want to help people. If I could go back in time I would have been the strong not 'love is blind and stupid' person that would have seen me suffering and saved that naive young guy from someone who did not deserve his unwavering love. Honestly, I did used to feel that way.

I've forgotten how that feels, to love like that. It's sad. But maybe I can use what I learned to help people. And one of the ways I think I should is by damaging the potential for someone like her to 'get away with it'. One of her exes committed suicide. Another has vanished completely into the pit, it's awful. She dated a guy just 19 (she now at 22) who came to her city. He changed his facebook to a picture of them two together, its almost beautiful, if not hauntingly disgusting as a precursor of his happiness to be sucked away. He changed his home city to Hong Kong. He was younger me, and as a law student, he even helped her with legal advice to scare me off when I emailed for my stuff back.

But almot 2 years later he still has the same facebook profile. He is still 'living in Hong Kong' despite his excahnge year ending last May. He still has a smiling profile of him and her together. He has frozen still. He ___ed up his exchange. She ___ed him up.

My values... .They've adapted. I can't let her do this to more people. Besides, it's fun to realise some people are truly evil, makes life feel like some things are worth fighting. I can move on, but what about that guy. What about the next. And the next, and the next. I want to use the 4 year lessons I learnt to help prevent others from dealing with that ___. Feels bad to face but someone has to make the tough decisions to semi-sink to her level to prevent years of pain for some other poor person... .

I know I can't succeed in teaching her a lesson, and I feel like a ___ to sink to her level, but there's sensitive me, and Donald Trump me, that is reserved for people like her and says "I. don't. care."---- I'm not like that but part of me feels like I need to be realistic and cold because I learnt the lesson the hard way, not wanting to let others learn it when I should use my knowledge... .

All I really feel like doing is deleting her facebook stuff. All her friends, and memories, to disappear. That actually feels like a terrible thing to do to someone, but that's the guilt complex and apologise to the abuser kicking in again... .Why not? And as for whatever she uses to justify her feelings about me, I would actually try my best to make sure she never foudn out it was me that did it... .Want her to view it as an act of karma, detached from anyone. Maybe facebook just losing her stuff.

[JaneStorm]

I can't tell if I have vengeful motives or not:

I have sexual photos of my BPDEX with a very young family member (his ex wife's half sister). He watched her grow up, she is deaf, and he bagged her at 19 yrs. old... .that I know of. No remorse. She came to him after a broken engagement for whatever young girls seek from 52 yr old family members when they are hurt. He slept with her, got nude pics from her, and Skype while... .you know.

My point is, the ex wife has a daughter from the relationship after him and their kids. The girl of the ex wife is clearly a spaz at age 13 and acts and has the body of a 17 yr old.

Although the girl was conceived during my BPDexbf's marriage, he dotes on the girl anyway.

Should I tip off the mom? I do think he is just waiting to be 'sexy uncle' again.

I too want revenge and don't pretend otherwise but part of me feels this kid will be exploited.

[philo beto]

Feelbetterdoit,

funny i am just feeling the repercussions of this in a different way but i can tell you from what I'm feeling now its no better or worse.

I posted my experience on this board earlier.

I told her friend (i was asked to lie to her about this) and sister that we had been seeing each other for a month and that i feared for her mental health and they should look at BPD because she's out of control. This might have been vengeful but more so because, what we are doing was madness and she needs help, I Thought these 2 people would understand and help her. She kept lying to these people and got herself uber trapped. repercussions were that a ton i mean a tons of lies were undercovered that she has been telling.

In the end Her best friend was shocked and ended her relationship with my ex, felt she was manipulated and extremely hurt. She apologized to me for all of the negative things she said to/ABOUT me over the years.

her sister well. First I reached out to her because we have had talks in past about ex and mental illness so i thought she would get it. Wrong. My ex sent an email to all her family that i was crazy, we only slept together twice recently and was trying to hurt her. (ALL LIES). These lies were then uncovered oops.

I was blamed for everything. Told i should walk away not said anything. Never once did she accept the fact that my ex lied time and time again and her lies are what did this not me reaching out. Told that i hurt everyone in there family with this? If my ex was just honest this would not have happened. She did this

in end i tried to talk to the two people that would listen about very crazy behaviors. it didn't end well on both accounts.

These lies are what hurt her, her family and most of all me,  not me reaching out. Will she accept responsibility for her actions? No its obvious from  her sister its my fault for bringing attention of incredibly unhealthy actions to her.

was it worth it? No probably not. They will play victim and spin so you look like the bad person. Have more self restraint and self esteem than i showed in this moment.

[philo beto]

Jane Storm,

if you are in therapy, perhaps ask your therapist. I know it might be revenge based but that also seems predatory on his part. I don't feel right reading that, yes its consensual but... .

[steelwork]

 

All I really feel like doing is deleting her facebook stuff. All her friends, and memories, to disappear. That actually feels like a terrible thing to do to someone, but that's the guilt complex and apologise to the abuser kicking in again... .

Feeling that this revenge/sabotage is terrible is not a "guilt complex" or "apologizing to the abuser"--it's proof that you have a moral compass. I encourage you to use it!

[JaneStorm]

Jane Storm,

if you are in therapy, perhaps ask your therapist. I know it might be revenge based but that also seems predatory on his part. I don't feel right reading that, yes its consensual but... .

Thanks for the feedback.

I just ended a really good series of EMDR sessions and I shared with the T. She was shocked that I did not claim any altruism; I am under no delusion, I did want his head on a stick at that time.

She pointed out that the underlying problem I have with this one (I have many of these photographic conquests he documented along with emails while we were together, including a married woman) is that it triggers my background and I felt he should have counseled her and shown her fatherly concern and guidance.

I know she is right. This sickens me to no end. Every time I saw him with that daughter of the ex wife, my blood boiled and I felt sick. I worry about his HS senior daughter's friends too. He seeks the fissure in the psyche of women.

Anyway, my T advised me to wait until March (I shared at mid January) and if I still felt strongly I should examine it. She did not condemn me or advise me not to. I liked that.

[Daniell85]

yep. very often if you take a temporary time to step back and say I will look at this again in 2 months and see how I feel, and proceed from there... .leads to some very effective preservation of self esteem.

BPD person has bailed or otherwise gone. They are focused on themselves. They can't or won't help anyone they have let down. Focus on your self for a while. A set time limit works very well for me, so I say to myself, will give this a month, or two months. THEN decide.

feelbetter, possibly you don't feel all that guilty and damage to your own self esteem because you haven't done it yet.  You may feel a big blow to yourself if you retaliate. I guess what we may be saying here, is take a month to think about it and in the meantime, let your hurt heal a bit more, while you are thinking about things.