Looks Like Divorce, Part II Interesting Turn of Events

[Verbena]

Emotionally... .do you think you will be ok in the house (home) after he is gone.  I'm assuming this is where you raised kids.

I think I would be.  We have basically lived here "alone" together for  many years.  Yes, our son was two and daughter was seven when we moved here in 1992. 

The seller's market here is hot right now.  Five doors down from me a house just sold in four days.  The house across the street sold in a week.  My house is SUPER close to a busy road, though.  The noise is insane.  That may be a factor. 

My realtor friend told me that she currently has four clients who have sold and have nowhere to go.  She also told me that no seller in this area is willing to accept offers unless you already have a contract on the house you're selling and it's past the option period.  Translation:  I would more than likely have to move twice. 

The good news  is that my son-in-law's parents have a totally self-contained guest quarters out in the country where they live.  It has furniture, dishes, linens, a washer and dryer, a big bedroom and bathroom, living, nice kitchen, and porch.  They even put in all new flooring recently and re-painted it.  There's a big dog run too.  I have three dogs.   

I've been told by his parents that I could stay there if I need to.  They are wonderful people and raised a wonderful son.  I'm very blessed there. 

[Grey Kitty]

Grey Kitty, I agree that sharing some of my ideas as I move forward are not his business now.  I have said nothing to him about buying out his half of the house or anything about his 401K, etc.

A lawyer can tell me what I need to ask for, what is fair, etc. 

A lawyer will tell you what is legal; what the law says. It may or may not be "fair"

I would suggest that the idea that you are "asking" your husband for things is pretty much over at least as long as you are on this path.

There are things you will tell him.

And there will probably be things you will negotiate with him, in whatever form that takes, which *hopefully* will be between the two of you mostly, not with lawyers racking up billable hours.

Whether either of you ends up in possession of the house after a split would be one of those negotiated things--I'm pretty sure that the law isn't going to give a clear answer, although if you get into a bad enough pissing match over it, a judge could end up deciding that. (You don't sound willing to go down that path for it though.)

In addition, there *is* at least some room for either of you to choose to give up more to the other than you are legally required to. Chances are if the two of you agree to something like this, the courts won't overrule it.

You can ask for something like this, perhaps something that would make it easier for you to keep the house. You can choose whether to tell him how much it is in your favor or not when you make a proposal. (I'd suggest not--he can do his own legal research.)

On a personal note, I'm dividing up assets with my wife right now, and we've agreed to split things 50/50, so it should be easy. What is sticky for us is that we do not (yet) agree on the value of things, or even whether they should all be included or not. Value of the boat I ended up with and tools/belongings aboard it... .and my wife thinks that some of her retirement assets should be excluded from the division. (Pretty sure the law doesn't agree with her. Currently waiting to hear from her on the latest round.)

So figuring out how much it is in your favor may be rather up in the air anyways, depending on the value of the house.

... .and if you end up agreeing to sell the house, the two of you divide the actual proceeds; no need to guess on the value of it.

[formflier]

 

I've been told by his parents that I could stay there if I need to.  They are wonderful people and raised a wonderful son.  I'm very blessed there. 

Have you worked out the particulars of this, ?  Or is this a general idea.

If you can trust them that they can be quiet, I would approach them again about particulars.

In other words, you need to know that this is really an option in your back pocket.  Ask them if there are any time frame issues here.

Moving twice sucks, but rushing and making a bad decisions is even worse. 

Selling house, putting money in bank or safe investments and getting "breathing room" is likely something that would benefit you.

Have you considering what possessions you want to keep and what you can sell?  Will you need to store anything if you go to guest house?

FF

[Verbena]

Grey Kitty, you make some good points.  I'm sorry you are in the middle of a divorce, too.  It stinks.  

FF, I would have to store all my stuff somewhere.  There are storage units on every corner.  I hate the thought of paying for one, but I'll have to.  My daughter's mother-in-law has said that I absolutely can live in their guest quarters if I need to.  I told her that we could come up with an amount I'd pay them to rent it.  Other family members have stayed there for short periods of time and paid no rent, but I would feel better paying them something.  

The downside of this arrangement is the location.  It's a full thirty minutes from their house to my daughter and son-in-law's house, and I keep my grandson daily for at least part of the day as well as take him to and from his little "school" he attends.  But it will all work out somehow.  Maybe I won't have to move twice, but the odds are against my finding something to buy at exactly the right moment.  God knows what's best for me and where I'll end up.  I am trying to keep throwing this back in His lap when I get overwhelmed.  

Yes, I have started thinking about selling a few things and throwing away a lot, too. I don't want to get too carried away, though, because I could always end up needing a piece here and there for a client's project.     

[Grey Kitty]

  Yeah, it sucks. In my case, it is easier because we have far more value in liquid assets that are easily divisible than things like houses and boats... .so our conflict is down to just a few thousands or tens of thousands of dollars that I'll have in the end to live off of... .or not. No matter how we value everything, I can still afford to buy her share of the boat out and keep it. (I'm living on it)

Having to decide who gets the house, or decide to sell it is a much harder choice.



Moving twice (assuming you don't end up keeping the house) sounds like the best move.

Buying a house while needing your current one to sell... .while needing your husband to agree and cooperate... .all on the schedule of a closing, while you are mid-way through a divorce/separation... .

I doubt you need that kind of stress.

Having the guest quarters from your daughter's inlaws is a GREAT fallback / safety option. Consider it insurance for your peace of mind.

One other option to think about would be renting someplace (closer to your grandson) for a year while you sort out the rest of your plans for life going forward.

[Cat Familiar]

Verbena, you're doing a great job of getting your ducks in a row!

You've got temporary housing lined up and an update of the real estate market in your area. I agree with FF about getting multiple evaluations of your house.

In the meantime, I think it would be good to get a storage locker and start clearing out unnecessary things from your house--all the better to show it, but it probably already looks like a showpiece. That way you could store items you might need for future clients and you start chipping away at the totality of things that you'll need to do, bit by bit.

It will send your husband a message, but I don't hear in your words that you're expecting divine intervention and a major personality change in him anyway. And no explanation is needed other than "I'm making some changes." With him being so passive, it's unlikely he will ask for more details.

You're gathering information and being strategic and looking at your situation realistically. You're doing great!    

[Verbena]

Cat, the storage locker idea is a good one.  

I can never rule out divine intervention, but I am moving forward.  I did tell my husband yesterday what I found out about two homes on our street selling so quickly--one in four days and one in a week.

He had no response at all.  I used to ask him if he heard me whenever he didn't respond, and he would usually say that he answered me and exactly what his response was.  He believes he is speaking to me when he isn't and will not be told otherwise.  

Just one more thing that I will never understand.  It's a relief that I no longer

need to try to understand his behavior.  

He did ask me yesterday why I was so concerned about getting my car out of the shop.  I told him I was going to visit my family (four hours away) and wanted to take my car instead of his truck. Maybe he knows that I am planning on selling it or maybe he doesn't.  I didn't explain myself. 

[formflier]

Verbena,

I'll try to "one up" Cat on her idea. 

Consider each piece that you take out of your home.  Spend some time with a camera or your phone camera and document each piece.  Make some notes about it.   If it is an heirloom or otherwise precious, it will be good for memories.

Otherwise you now have started a file that you can use to craigslist or ebay items.  Do some research and figure out what a price is that you would sell it for (where people would say that you were silly to NOT sell it if someone was offering) and then start listing.

This could also be a marketing tool for your design business.

One of the "distractions" that I have enjoyed in my most recent round of troubles has been listing and selling items.  It helps me get my mind off my r/s issues and has brought in a lot of $$ and helped us with needed downsizing.

Gotta tell you that dealing with that level of silence would crush me quickly.   Hang in there.

FF

[Verbena]

FF, that is yet another good idea and something to think about.  I think my daughter can help me with that.  She could sell ice to an Eskimo.

I'm used to the silence.  It's the passive-agressive mind games (telling me he is speaking to me when he is actually saying nothing) that make me crazy.  Does he REALLY believe words are coming out of his mouth?  He has told me "I don't play games!" when I've tried to discuss this issue. 

I'm a little curious about what he plans to tell our children about all this.  It was all your mom's idea?  I really tried but just couldn't make it work?  I have no idea why your mom wants a divorce? 

My guess is both my son and daughter would have to initiate any discussion, if they choose to do that, and that he will just have no response. 

He really doesn't seem to think that any of this has anything to do with him at all. It's so bizarre. 

[Grey Kitty]

Verbena, you have a LOT going on here... .legal questions... .financial questions... .planning how to separate... .planning how to negotiate with your husband... .dealing with his silent treatment / dismissal of you... .dealing with the rest of the family... .and thinking about whether you REALLY want to end your marriage now or not.

You don't sound overwhelmed right now, but if you get that way I wouldn't be surprised! 

It is OK to wander all over the place, but let me ask you--are there specific areas you need more support from this community for? Or would some aspects better fit another topic, perhaps on the legal board? It is your topic, to support you, as you need support!

[Verbena]

A lot has happened since the last time I posted here about six weeks ago:



*Divorce has been filed.

*I have decided to buy my husband out and stay in my home.

*I have applied for a loan and am awaiting the closing--less than a month away hopefully

*I have learned more about our finances and taken steps toward handling finances on my own

There have been a LOT of twists and turns along the way and a ton of passive aggressive behavior and mind games on my husband's part. I have tried not to take the bait but have not always been successful.  I've also not held back a few times letting him know just what I think of his behavior--both now and during the last 33 years.  It is so NOT good to let things go for decades the way I have done.

I'm relieved that soon I will no longer have to deal with my husband on a daily basis, and I'm excited about my future.  Some days (lots of days actually) I want to slap him; other days I feel sorry for him. 



He finally stopped ignoring the elephant in the room and actually acknowledged to both our children that we are getting divorced. He told them both that this is all my fault, that I won't forgive and forget and that I concoct stories about him. This was to be expected, but I can't say that it didn't bother me. 


I guess I am still holding on to some crazy idea that he might actually show some accountability for the break-up of an almost 34-year marriage, but I know that is completely unrealistic and won't change anything anyway.

It's just a sad situation.  If I had known what I was up against years ago, if I had had an on-line site like this one to help me, if if if... .

I will come out of this a stronger and better person.  I absolutely know that. 

[Turkish]

Sometimes I have thoughts that if I had landed here in the beginning,  things would have been better.  However,  I've observed my ex shaming her husband,  and my 4 year old told me this morning that she called him stupid this weekend when they were at the beach. Our 6 year old confirmed it (sadly,  the kids didn't seem bothered by it).  More shaming.  Validation and boundaries might have helped when she used to do it to me,  but as much as I still have pain about being in a broken family,  I'm pretty much free to be my own person.  Kudos for taking steps to be free yourself,  too 

[formflier]

Verbena,

You have picked a path and given your husband plenty of opportunities.  I feel confident that you have done your part.

I can also sense the pride and hope that you have in taking ownership of all aspects of your life.

Hang in there!  I'm proud of you!

FF

[Lucky Jim]

He finally stopped ignoring the elephant in the room and actually acknowledged to both our children that we are getting divorced. He told them both that this is all my fault, that I won't forgive and forget and that I concoct stories about him. This was to be expected, but I can't say that it didn't bother me. 

Hey Verbena, Of course it's all your fault because a pwBPD will shift his/her part of the blame to the Non in order to avoid taking responsibility for his/her actions.  Yes, it's to be expected that you will be painted black.  Not fun, but that's the way it goes after a b/u with a pwBPD.

It's just a sad situation.  If I had known what I was up against years ago, if I had had an on-line site like this one to help me, if if if... .

I will come out of this a stronger and better person.  I absolutely know that.

It is sad when a marriage ends.  Suggest you not dwell on the "ifs" because neither you nor I can do anything about what might have happened "if."  Yes, I can confirm that you will come out stronger and better on the other side.  It leads to new growth and greater happiness which, in my view, is what it's all about.

LuckyJim

[Grey Kitty]

I guess I am still holding on to some crazy idea that he might actually show some accountability for the break-up of an almost 34-year marriage, but I know that is completely unrealistic and won't change anything anyway.

 Yeah... .but if he could have done that, he could have brought something to your marriage too. And that's why you are divorcing him.

I'm glad you are making good choices for you--keeping the house and taking a loan sounds much better for you. I'm also glad he's not stopping you from doing that.

Hang in there. You will have a life that is better for you.

[Cat Familiar]

Verbena, you gave it your best and after so many years it's good to move on. You'll be amazed at how free you will feel once you've tidied up all the loose ends. Congratulations!