Defining the roots and predicting the consequences

[sempervivum]

I wrote before that my uBPDh expresses himself mostly through dissatisfaction about food. In our 25 yrs of marriage he said so many false, illogical and controversial things about food. I will name just some:

- he severely objects to a meal that I made, but he praises and worships the same meal made by him

- he objects to the choice of shops where something is bought

- he objects to the time of day when something is served and so on... .

Some mean things that really hurt me:

- he does not "say I am a bad cook", but we will eat something when it is tasty (what can I read between the lines?)

- he objects to my "having not enough time to cook", translation: meal is bad because I did it in (what?) 10 minutes

- he never praised anything but himself and his achievements

Coming of his dysregulation can be sensed like gathering of clouds on the sky. For too many years I reacted in a wrong manner, like many other uneducated non-BPD. Luckily, I don´t do it any more, I don´t try to please him. It was and it is a long journey.

It became clear to me that he was taught that way: that food is the weapon for satisfaction. That is why his mother used to ask me for a long time did I made a good meal for him.

The stage I´m in now is dangerous, I might become really indifferent and disrespectful and that is exactly the thing he is afraid of most. Two days ago he started objecting again and I simply left the room. He finished the meal (I didn´t bother to check how much did he eat) and I sat back at the table. He started to nag again and left the dining room and ate standing over the counter in our kitchen.

What do some of you think: can a BPDp get a message from such a reaction?

When I was younger I naively believed that conversation can solve anything, but now I really don´t want to converse any more. So, I enclosed non-JADE-ing as mine!

[RELATIONSHIP PROBLEM SOLVING]

RELATIONSHIP PROBLEM SOLVING This is a high level discussion board for solving ongoing, day-to-day relationship conflicts. Members are welcomed to express frustration but must seek constructive solutions to problems. This is not a place for relationship "stay" or "leave" discussions. Please read the specific guidelines for this group.

[waverider]

It is an obvious trigger point, much the same as being stuck in a car, so they lean on it as it feels empowering to them. It is also a way to convert inner issues onto some external physical representation

Using a boundary and removing yourself from it is probably the right thing. If you need to state why do it once. Not going into JADE or being dragged into a conflict which could go anywhere is essential.

[sempervivum]

It is an obvious trigger point, much the same as being stuck in a car, so they lean on it as it feels empowering to them. It is also a way to convert inner issues onto some external physical representation

Using a boundary and removing yourself from it is probably the right thing. If you need to state why do it once. Not going into JADE or being dragged into a conflict which could go anywhere is essential.

Thank you waverider, you confirmed my thoughts. In fact, once I have tasted my detachment and non-JADEing I am more than sure I can´t go back into the old pattern.

On the other hand, one of my predictions might come true. Namely, my BPD is a tough case, he reacts badly to  resistance. I know that great deal of this is my contribution, because I nurtured his behavior and I indulged him.That gave him the impression he is entitled to be treated like this until the end of the world. I understand that, but I can´t follow him this road.

He feels he is losing me and he increased his controlling pressure. To move away from the food issue: In reality it looks like this: he objects to seeing me holding my mobile phone or me sitting at the computer. After my job and my chores I like to relax and surf a little bit and play some 20 minutes of a benign game (marble popper and the similar, this is the best I can in the gaming area). If and when he sees me doing that then he accuses me of being the biggest addict in the world. Nothing I might say can change the severity of his accusations, not even the ready meal or the clean house.

So, I am dealing with a BPD who is losing his throne and bites around like wounded beast.

[waverider]

So, I am dealing with a BPD who is losing his throne and bites around like wounded beast.

Shift a little, consolidate for a while, then shift a little more and so on.

Demonstrate to him the sky is not falling in, and his world is not coming to an end and he will get used to it if you are consistent. Push too fast and he will never cope.

[Notwendy]

When I was younger I naively believed that conversation can solve anything, but now I really don´t want to converse any more. So, I enclosed non-JADE-ing as mine!

I believed this too, until I read about JADE-ing and realized that it isn't the case for all situations. But before that, I came across a book that gave me different ideas- How to Improve Your Marriage Without Talking About It by authors Love and Stosny. This is not specific to BPD but it helped me to realize that my ideas of talking didn't seem to work.

It seemed for me as if we spoke two different languages. I could not get through to my H with any words/speaking that I knew. I think I tried for decades and it was discouraging. It seems that anything I said somehow got translated into a criticism which then went down that path of circular discussions.

I too did what you are doing. Disengage from conversations that go no where. There are two at play in this. My H could toss out a criticism, that would derail a conversation or get my attention. I would react emotionally and talk talk talk, defend defend defend. But a little bit about behavioral reinforcement made me realize that all during this time, I am emotional and 100% focused on him. This is reinforcing.

All living creatures respond to behavior reinforcements. One example is when Mom is on the phone. That seems to be the moment little kid ( who may have been playing quietly before) goes up to mom and says "mom MOM MOMMMY" at which point Mom hangs up and gets angry at child. Yet, the child gets her attention again. To me, this is what JADE does - our buttons are pushed, we pay attention. The solution, which is to not pay attention - seems cold at first, but to me it was important to change my part of this pattern.

Oh the food thing. Like many nons here, we do a lot that feels unrecognized. We have had a traditional marriage, something I wanted too, but not to the extent that it happened. I didn't mind doing most of what was traditionally woman's work, but what I didn't expect was that my H pitched a fit and refused to do it if asked. His fear was that if he did it at all, I would then "expect " it and that was not fair. I didn't expect, but for heaven's sake, if I was up all night with a kid with a belly ache, a hand with the dishes in the morning would have been appreciated.

Any arguments over this turned into him pointing out anything I didn't do. I would then retort with trying to prove and defend what I did do.

Like you did, I disengaged from the blame- JADE interactions, and yes, he noticed, but the idea of doing this was not about him, but me. I didn't want to JADE and for that reason, I worked on stopping.

One thing that has helped is the idea that just because he accuses me, doesn't mean I have to buy into it. If it isn't true, then I don't have to defend it. I have done most of the cooking, laundry, child care. If he chooses to bring up the few times I didn't cook, I can't change that.

This isn't about being cold or cruel, but I don't want to perpetuate this dysfunctional style of relating to each other.

[sempervivum]

So, I am dealing with a BPD who is losing his throne and bites around like wounded beast.

Shift a little, consolidate for a while, then shift a little more and so on.

Demonstrate to him the sky is not falling in, and his world is not coming to an end and he will get used to it if you are consistent. Push too fast and he will never cope.

Right now it seems my and his "too fast" do not equal. I´ll have to work on it.

[sempervivum]

... .

This isn't about being cold or cruel, but I don't want to perpetuate this dysfunctional style of relating to each other.

I too tried to be a better listener, so over the years I ceased talking and really listened what has been said or what can be recognized between the lines and I really understood the negativity of reinforcing him. Only, I have to admit I still feel sorry for not having a "normal" marriage, I think I´ll never get over it fully.

As for Mum on the phone scene I am living it: he really IS jealous of everyone talking to me. I don´t know was I too rough on him but the other day I told him frankly that I don´t like his controlling me and that he cannot forbid me to talk with my friends. I think I pushed too far saying I was talking to one of my six lovers and if he continues with his pressure he´ll be sorry. I repent now, but his reaction to this  was considerably mild. (?)

Household and food: I surely dont want to be unfair, my H is not a lazy man, only - when he does something it deserves a gold medal of the Universe and my doing the same thing is taken for granted - or badly criticized. So I find myself in the pattern of avoiding JADE, but somehow I don´t want to pass unnoticed and I sometimes strike back verbally. He usually says then that I always have a ready answer ( I wish it were always), in such a moment he resembles a little child whose toys were scattered. I shouldn´t feel too sorry for him, although he is on a child´s emotional level, he has at least try to grow up a little. He experiences my resistance and my boundaries too tragically.

Its a totally new role of a partner: I have to be his educator or mentor (area emotions), which was not my initial plan when we met and got married. This again brings out the question of what is considered normal and what not.