I want so badly to stay but she tells me to go

[Depression = 72% of members]

Heres my situation bounced between saving and detaching boards for weeks. Year long relationship with an amazing woman that I love dearly and I know she loves me.  It has been rocky at times but we have always worked through all are issues in the past. 

Here recently we have been more broken up than together .  I betrayed her trust and now even though she loves me she can't look at me the same way and doesn't know if she ever will trust me again

[Oncebitten]

Heres my situation bounced between saving and detaching boards for weeks. Year long relationship with an amazing woman that I love dearly and I know she loves me.  It has been rocky at times but we have always worked through all are issues in the past. 

Here recently we have been more broken up than together .  I betrayed her trust and now even though she loves me she can't look at me the same way and doesn't know if she ever will trust me again

[RELATIONSHIP PROBLEM SOLVING]

RELATIONSHIP PROBLEM SOLVING This is a high level discussion board for solving ongoing, day-to-day relationship conflicts. Members are welcomed to express frustration but must seek constructive solutions to problems. This is not a place for relationship "stay" or "leave" discussions. Please read the specific guidelines for this group.

[Lilyroze]

Dear OnceBitten,

OK good glad you decided on this board. Will do the cross post and lets go from here:  Will give us more room the in DM and you will benefit from the input of some great ones on this board. Truly.

OnceBitten,

Since you wrote me am addressing here then can address all you wrote hope that is Ok. If you need more feel free to write back in the other.

You have a lot in the mix here with emotions and who is responsible for what.  So I think at the heart of it all she is insecure about your relationship when you are with her, apart from her and now.

So a good start might be the book stop walking on eggshells, and the The high conflict couple if so inclined to delve further for help, insight and even more tools to deal with the relationship. The other tools and validating are here as well. Have you read them? What do you think of them? Have you had the chance to try them before she blocked you?

Now look within first before concentrating on her and see what is fulfilling in this relationship for you? What needs work? I know you said you feel love and not lust and think she does as well, already to me.

A step further if you do have attachment issues is she comforting of that or not? Does she make you feel loved, valued and validated? Is she willing to get help as well?

Does she have any hobbies or things that give her self esteem? How about yours or your goals? Can you concentrate on them now, while blocked and become more centered, more self compassion towards your self and heal while working towards this again?

I should not be encouraging on the detached if you want to start another on a different board if you have a different goal in mind like you wrote. Then do that and we can go from there, and you will get lots of input from ones who are on your path.

Otherwise for detaching take the NC, blocked time to explore and heal  you.

  you can do this either path you chose. It is up to you.

Couple more things. She needs to be responsible now for breaking up and then getting mad at you seeing another. Unless you just parted as needing time. Even then I am sure she is broken hearted.

Where there is love, a willingness to look within, adjust and use the tools there is a way.
 How are you feeling today?

She now has you blocked so now take this time and get centered.

[Oncebitten]

Today has been ok... .

Been spending the time apart trying to get centered and fix/figure out my own problems.  Trying to do all I can to be healthy for me

[Lilyroze]

So in the other questions does she have self esteem issues? Any hobbies of her own that give her that?

So with your goals and hobbies right now, just start the healing path. When she is ready to reach out she will, but in mean time where do you see her both your needs in this? Or areas you both need to work on separate and together to build trust again?

[Oncebitten]

I dont feel that she has self esteem issues... .although that is something she has accused me of when she gets angry so projecting perhaps?

She generally comes across as very self confident,  but has always been a little insecure about our relationship.  Its long distance and that bothers her greatly.

Yes she has lots of hobbies, she loves to work out which always makes her feel good about herself.

I guess I see it that we both need to feel good about ourselves before we can fix us.  I think we had developed a level of codependency... .leaning on each other entirely.

[Oncebitten]

The main issue is how to get her past the constant reminders of the cheating ... .we have a good day or half day and then something triggers her thoughts of that and she backs away from me.

[Lucky Jim]

Hey Oncebitten, Glad to see you over on this Board, where is where I usually hang out.  Deciding or Conflicted: isn't that the place where most of us Nons are at while still in a BPD r/s?  I suspect so, because there are so many mixed signals and mixed feelings that a Non has to manage in order to stay with a pwBPD.  If you are like me, you don't want to leave, but staying is fraught with problems, so one ends up in a strange limbo that is akin to walking a tightrope.  It takes a lot of concentration and effort!

LuckyJim

[Oncebitten]

LJ

Yeah I suppose you are right... .I do love her more than anything and I can cope with a lot of the aspects of the disease.  Just trying to get a handle on this current problem so that we can move forward with the relationship.

[Lilyroze]

  OB,

OK, if no other problems like that then, and love is there. You are golden. Here is why love is the key and answer to everything in the Universe. Repeat that with me love is the key. You are loving and wise so you know the difference between lust and love. Some don't as sad as it is.

So you have love, had a foundation right? Don't tear it down or let her. So she loves you but was hurt, and jealous. We can both understand that right? You as her lover and friend. I as a woman. My heart is in there for her, but am on both your side. So... .the work begins.

You nor her can make the other person the focus, but does need addressed. Martial and counselors including Mayo clinic yes Mayo... . loves love. Says it must be addressed, not ignored, honored for the hurt, but there is a key.

The golden key is to not let it become the focus. I can tell you a secret as a woman, why some want to talk on it longer then men. They want it truly addressed. So address it. Only give a limit to each other of 15 -20 minutes a day to address it then put it aside. They say do that for months. ugh who wants that, not me, for sure.  If a secure true loving woman she might only need a day or two to understand, get it out and you two go back to a stronger relationship. If she needs longer not bad, but well remember love is the key.

Once your partner finds out that you’ve been involved with someone else (or once you admit it), it might seem like the easiest thing to do is run. But relationship experts say leaving a damaged partnership can sometimes be a cop out — a way to avoid taking responsibility or recognizing your own faults. Instead, assume that staying together is equally possible, if you’re willing to put in the hard work required. In fact, sex and relationship researcher Dr. Mark, "If a couple can get through an infidelity and restore the trust in the relationship ... .they can come out the other side a stronger couple."

It might seem simple, but if you don’t come to terms with the fact that you messed up, and therefore messed up the relationship, the healing process won’t go anywhere. Instead, whenever you're apologizing for something hurtful, recognize that you made a mistake that caused your partner pain. You my friend were the true honorable man and admitted as you didn't quite realize you were still in a relationship in her mind, and both your hearts. Even if seems bad think on that, you both still loved. What does that mean? Well love is the key. Lust won't last, fake won't last, love will though if honored, and respected and the right one. Only you will know if the right one, and worth working for.

 Truly recommitting to your relationship means ceasing all interaction with the person you cheated on your partner with. Still, you need to be able to promise your partner that the affair is over for good and that you’re totally committed to moving forward in the current relationship. Which you are.

Trust isn't just essential to relationships; it's necessary for a happy, meaningful life. The most important predictor of rebuilding trust after an affair, other than love, is how happy and meaningful can you make the relationship.

Work on you, heal, and reach out when she is ready and ask if she wants to work on a committed relationship? If the answer is yes, then do it with the tools.

[Lilyroze]

Also of note she was concerned you can't be alone. So wanted to say in women talk she is essentially saying am I the one? Or just someone? Well, you already answered that to me, she is the ONE.

So don't feel bad or let her hurt label you, that is not what she really means or is intending in her heart. Can you be alone? Maybe is hard, maybe you are healing something in life or from FOO or working on you. But yes you can because as you heal you will give yourself compassion, love, respect. Set some goals, work on your core values, set sometime to read up on the tools and goals for your relationship ( it will work out you must have faith and believe) but all aside if it doesn't the tools will help you understand you and her and life better.  SO worth it, yes?

So do that find some joy in the day today, put your foot forward for starting some goals tomorrow. Remember though there is only NOW. So live in the now, how can you make all this better for you both.

Hopefully she is working on herself, healing and can bring something better to the table as well. Connect soon, don't waste away the future worrying about yesterday. It is gone, live for now. Make it work.

At the same time remember you can't carry it all, or be responsible for it all, she must try as well.

[Lilyroze]

Sorry these are in bits but having a slight issue with computer and in a fog right now as you know. ( not FOG but well mind fog hehe).

Many LD relationships built on goofiness ( no disrespect or not real etc won't work) but true LOVE in a LDR can really be a blessing and test of time. You put in the work, romance and love without instant gratification. You get to know each other, value each other, have patience, true respect and value. There is no price on that, it is the equivalent of old fashioned getting to know each other not a McDonald fantasy meal life with a side of chaos, cheating and a s-- toy in the box... .hehe

So that is a plus to bring up to her when she makes contact, you were willing to wait for her, put the time until your life can begin. Not to take from mastercard but priceless. Romance and love make it work. So just thought of that point that out, if you couldn't be alone you would go local.

Awww OB look at all the pluses already out of many disasters this one truly has promise. I really don't say that to people unless mean it.


Keep us updated.

[Oncebitten]

LR

Thank you so much for the advice.  Yes we truly love one another.  And we are actually talking again.  We have really good long meaningful talks.  And then something small can derail the progress.  The current issue is that she wants so badly just to go back before it all happened.  Which we both know we cant... .she gets despaired at times because she is overwhelmed with hurt.  I have been honest with her as to what happened, and we have talked about it and I have told her that whenever she is hurt to let it out and direct it at me... .not to hold it in but bring that pain to me since I caused it.  It hasn't been easy but I feel like we are making progress.  She doesn't see it, but I can tell its easier for her to talk to me, laugh smile and see the love and feel all the good that remains.  We have a tremendous foundation, we no one another to our very cores... .because of it being long distance we are much closer than your average couple.  There is too much good in this relationship to simply walk away from it.  She has been working to move past my mistake and continues to do so.

So what can I do for her specifically ? I dont run from the tough talks, and I have cut all contact with the other woman. 

I am completely committed to her and us.

[Oncebitten]

oncd again I find myself conflicted.   Awash in a mess of mixed signals.  She continues to tell me to let her go.  But as soon I get to the point where I say goodbye I hear from her.  Sometimes sweet sometimes mean... .doesn't matter, I know that contact with me means she still cares.  And that somewhere inside of her there is still the desire to be in a relationship with me.

We talk and argue fight and cry.  And decide to give it another go.  I want to move forward with her and be with her. I love her and want to marry her but how can I help her stabilize her emotions?

The constant I love you I hate you on a daily basis is just killing me slowly.

[Oncebitten]

I want to make this work with her and any input would be greatly appreciated.

i need to know a few things to move forward with her.

1 what can I do to help build trust and move her past my cheating.  I have done the obvious, removed all contact with the other woman.  Talked with my gf about what happened, apologized sincerely.  And continued to validate her feelings when she brings them up.

2 what can I do to stabilize her emotions?  I feel like if we go back and forth every day all day long we cant move forward.

[jrharvey]

I want to make this work with her and any input would be greatly appreciated.

i need to know a few things to move forward with her.

1 what can I do to help build trust and move her past my cheating.  I have done the obvious, removed all contact with the other woman.  Talked with my gf about what happened, apologized sincerely.  And continued to validate her feelings when she brings them up.

2 what can I do to stabilize her emotions?  I feel like if we go back and forth every day all day long we cant move forward.

How long has it been since you cheated? What did you do that is considered cheating? How did she find out?

#1 Your going to have to change your mindset. There is no quick fix. It will be a LONG AND TEDIOUS process. Losing trust and getting over unfaithfulness can take years. You destroyed her trust in you. She will be hyper aware of everything you do for at least a year or even years after. She will lose control over things you cant understand. This happens with BPD or not. Just with BPD there doesn't even need to be cheating. You cheat on someone with BPD I cannot even imagine how crazy that will be. All the things your doing are the right things. Be compassionate and don't defend. She will be hurt for a long time and you just need to keep doing those things your doing for a LONG TIME! It will suck for you. Trust me. You also need to be proactive. Don't wait for her to ask you for things. You need to be OPEN AND HONEST and do whatever it takes to make her trust you without her having to ask. That will go a long way to help her heal. Ironically the only person that can heal her from the pain of cheating is YOU, the person who caused the pain.

#2 You cant. Nothing you can do will stabilize her emotions. If you think like this your going to get caught in the trap of the fixer and it will consume your life. Trust me. You cant stop her from feeling. You shouldn't stop her. The fact is you will go back and forth and you cant stop it. Accept that now before you lose your mind. You will move forward as long as you both love each other. Its just that sometimes you take one step forward and two steps back. Then two steps forward and one step back. You will move forward but it will be hard to see.

I could talk to you for hours about this. I have been here before.

[Oncebitten]

it was a month ago and I told her about it... .although I didn't tell her immediately.  We weren't together at the time we had broken up but in her mind I still cheated.

ok so I cant stabilize her emotions I can live with that. 

she feels like I am not doing anything to help rebuild trust.  I am unsure as to what to do other than what I have been doing. I know it will take time and I am willing to do the work and put in the time.

thoughts ?

[jrharvey]

it was a month ago and I told her about it... .although I didn't tell her immediately.  We weren't together at the time we had broken up but in her mind I still cheated.

ok so I cant stabilize her emotions I can live with that.  

she feels like I am not doing anything to help rebuild trust.  I am unsure as to what to do other than what I have been doing. I know it will take time and I am willing to do the work and put in the time.

thoughts ?

Yikes. A month ago is so soon. Its still very fresh. Very unstable. It will get much worse. Sorry. Right now she is in the coping stage. Just trying to live without letting this affect her life. I bet much of her time is spent trying to push away those feelings. Expect a violent anger stage about 5-6 months out. Just a warning. Its when she will accept what has happened fully and will be angry with you and her for everything. She may also feel a deep urge to make things even and consider cheating herself. Just to make things fair. She may not go through with it but she may really want to just to make things even so she can get rid of the pain.

So you guys were not even together? What happened? Did you guys really break up or just words were said? Did you have sex with this other girl? Im skeptical now if what you did was even really cheating.

[Oncebitten]

no we weren't together we were broken up and not even speaking .  I didn't have sex but spent a couple of nights with the other, gal.  Hanging on one another at the bar.  my gf feels that if I was truly in love with her that I wouldn't have done what I did.  It just a big violation of trust with her.
She keeps bringing up that she could go sleep with her ex just to try and make me

[Oncebitten]

and honestly it has gotten better.  I just want to know what I can do to show her that I am trying.  she just keeps saying that I am not doing anything and that its all on her to forgive me

[jrharvey]

no we weren't together we were broken up and not even speaking .  I didn't have sex but spent a couple of nights with the other, gal.  Hanging on one another at the bar.  my gf feels that if I was truly in love with her that I wouldn't have done what I did.  It just a big violation of trust with her.
She keeps bringing up that she could go sleep with her ex just to try and make me

Ok. My advice... .Don't buy into it. You didn't cheat. She broke up with you but wants you hanging on to her. She is trying to control you with FOG. If you go down this path you will become a slave. You didn't cheat. She is twisting it to put fear and guilt in your heart. She will most likely become abusive over this and use your actions as a scapegoat for her own bad behavior. Just my opinion. Don't fall into this trap. Maybe she really does feel cheated but the TRUTH is you didn't cheat. Don't fall into her twisted thinking.

If you want to continue the relationship MAKE SURE you keep strong boundaries. Make sure you don't fall into the trap of being controlled.

[jrharvey]

and honestly it has gotten better.  I just want to know what I can do to show her that I am trying.  she just keeps saying that I am not doing anything and that its all on her to forgive me

There is nothing to forgive. You didn't cheat. She broke up with you and you hung out with another girl at the bar. If she is that torn up the best thing is to let her go. She didn't want you then so you had every right as a human to find someone who did want you.

If I were you I would hold your boundary and if she wants to accept you on your terms then so be it. If not feel the pain of loss and move on. If she decides she wants to continue with accepting what happens then great!

[Oncebitten]

I think the issue is that I did it so quickly, just a couple of days after we broke up.

I have wondered if I am going about this all wrong by chasing her and continuing to apologize.

what I want and what I told her the other day was to move forward, together.  that we could discuss what I did and what happened but that I wasn't going to do it every day.   that doing that wouldn't accomplish anything.

I do feel like we made some progress I finally heard her the other day and validated her feelings, and stopped being defensive about it. She has been a lot calmer since although she has been distant.

[jrharvey]

I have wondered if I am going about this all wrong by chasing her and continuing to apologize.

Yes. Absolutely. BPD or not its never good to chase after she breaks up with you. You can let her know your feelings for her and that you hope things work out and you will be there for her if she decides to make it work with you. Don't keep contacting her and trying to convince her. Give her time to want to be with you.

I do feel like we made some progress I finally heard her the other day and validated her feelings, and stopped being defensive about it. She has been a lot calmer since although she has been distant.

One thing I have learned here for sure is that whether or not her feelings are crazy, right or wrong she wants to feel heard and at minimum DO NOT INVALIDATE. Its been really tough for me with my BPD GF. Its hard when she is saying something completely not accurate and telling me how that makes her feel. I have had to learn the hard way that invalidating is wrong even if she is talking completely crazy nonsense that never even happened. She wants to be heard and understood. You can do that without agreeing that she is right. I cant stress enough that you need to keep your boundaries up. She may try to use this to control every action you take especially if she has BPD.

[jrharvey]

I think the issue is that I did it so quickly, just a couple of days after we broke up.

She broke up with you. Doesn't matter if its the next day or a month later. She threw you out. Your right as a human being is to feel loved. She didn't want you. She threw you away. That's her problem.

[Oncebitten]

well thats kind of my thought but she doesn't see it that way... .how do I proceed with her ? 

[Oncebitten]

also something I have always struggled with is what to do when she pushes me away?  I recognize it now and I dont let it upset me anymore.  typically she is just cold and detached not hateful or mean.  is this a time that I should hold her close and remind her I love her or should I just give her space?   I always ask what she wants but I never get an answer she stays quite and tells me to do whatever.

[jrharvey]

well thats kind of my thought but she doesn't see it that way... .how do I proceed with her ?  

Sounds like she is on the fence. Not sure what she wants. Just let her know you love her and you want to continue with her. Let her know that you will be there for her if she is willing. Let her come to you when she is ready. If she really has BPD she may twist it all kinds of ways. She may say for you to come to her when YOU are ready which doesn't make any sense when she is the one pushing you away. Don't let this piss you off. She may take your space as abandonment even if she tells you to leave her alone. Its pretty twisted.

As far as what to do when she pushes you away? Oh man that is tough. I know its hard. Me and my GF live together so I never know what to do. Im screwed no matter what. If I ignore her she says I don't care if I try to console her she wants me to get away and its this crazy cycle. Ive had times where she was upset and wanted me to get away and was abusive so I went to hang out with a friend which she immediately freaked out and said she wanted me there for her and to come home to be with her and when I did and tried to be affectionate she acted cold and didn't want me near her and it drove me nuts. I spent a lot of time freaking out and losing control myself while she played victim.

Just my experience that usually when she says do whatever that means she wants you near her. If my GF says do whatever she usually wants me to show her love. Actually ironically they always seem to want you to show them love. Even when they are yelling at you to get the F out of their sight they seem to really hope you will be there for them. Its twisted especially with BPD involved.

[Oncebitten]

she is obviously on the fence... .but in my mind that fact that we are still talking means she isnt done with me.

i have always assumed that regardless of what she says she wants me to be close and show her love.I read a essay once by a woman with BPD and she said then they push you away is when they need you to hold them the closest.

I think that is why she has had so many failed relationships in the past... .she pushes people away and most just leave.

[jrharvey]

she is obviously on the fence... .but in my mind that fact that we are still talking means she isnt done with me.

i have always assumed that regardless of what she says she wants me to be close and show her love.I read a essay once by a woman with BPD and she said then they push you away is when they need you to hold them the closest.

I think that is why she has had so many failed relationships in the past... .she pushes people away and most just leave.

Take any advice I give you as just my opinion. I am no expert.

You are right. They definitely want you there. No doubt about that. But what is good for them isn't always what they want. Don't "clean up the mess they made".

If you continue to clean up her messes its enabling her. If you show her you want her and love her and she breaks it off with you then you are allowing her to treat you like a yo yo. She will throw you away and bring you back over and over and over again. Trust me I have been there. I went through this. It didn't stop until I set strong boundaries and when she "broke up" I just let her go. It killed me but days later she was back and saying how bad she acted and how ashamed she was.

[Oncebitten]

so I should stop chasing her.  like I said anytime I have backed away because she asked me to I always hear from her in 4 or 5 days.  sometimes good she wants me back and sometimes bad she is moving on but I always re-engage and she allows it even when she tells me its over... .I might be off but I decided a while ago that we wouldn't end until I ended it... .which has actually helped me put things in perspective and has calmed things down a lot
 I no longer panic and add to the problem