served, now what...

[cbz1198]

its been a few years by now that we were married, pretty much got pregnant right away, and the year was just hell, the emotional abuse, the control that she had over me, how i stand, how i talk, how i walk, what o ear, how i drive, when i go etc... .
she wouldn't agree for help, but then finally after baby is born, she does come for marriage therapy, which after a few months just turned to personal therapy (she wouldn't go herself, only with me... .) lead to a psychiatrist giving her depression meds, which were taken for 3 days, after month of not visiting anyone back to the psychiatrist for a "possible BPD" and sent her to DPT, didnt go consecutively, and nowhere near the amount she was prescribed to go, kept on asking me for another kid, saying she cant work on herself before being pregnant again, i wouldn't give in to having another kid in this state of the marriage... ., it led to numerous physical abuse, abandonment of the kid, me not being able to work,  bc had to run home every day from  a scare of something else... .the last few months i have been emotionally dis-attaching myself from her, so she went even crazier, keot on asking for divorce, then not then yes... eventually i said, lets divorce, she agreed to meet me with lawyers the next day, however that evening i come home and its all back to normal, meanwhile i had filed, and decided to serve her with a summons and complaint, her parents suddenly kicked in and hired one of the top lawyers in town, and responded that it was all my fault and i caused her to act and become as crazy as she became ("she was locked in a cage" they said, what do you expect of her... ) they (her parents, lawyer and herself, want me to commit to starting therapy from new, get re-evaluated and restart it all (im already over 20k in debt from the first round of therapy for her and myself, i have been going every week... .
we live in this tiny apt, and since the serving shes been acting fairly normal saying how she does not want to get divorced, she wants to stay married, im stuck sleeping in the same apt as her, due to the kid and lawyer advice, and now im having trouble giving my lawyer clear game plan routes, im confused, in doubt but know that its the right decision... .  being with her under one roof doesnt make things better and keeps the doubting rolling ... .

[Sluggo]

cbz1198,

I am not sure what the right answer is, but you did come to the right place.  Reading other stories and sharing your story is a great first step. 

Sorry you are going through this. 

[ForeverDad]

kept on asking me for another kid, saying she cant work on herself before being pregnant again, i wouldn't give in to having another kid in this state of the marriage... .

You were so smart not to get her pregnant again.  If that had happened she probably would have held that as Leverage over you too.  Don't ever feel bad about having held to that boundary.  In my case, we purposely had a child, even seeking help of a reproductive specialist.  What I didn't realize was that instead of her seeing a bright spot arriving in our lives, she projected fears of her childhood into it.  I learned the hard way, having a child does not fix the problems in the marriage, it only make them more complicated, especially to unwind.

they (her parents, lawyer and herself, want me to commit to starting therapy from new, get re-evaluated and restart it all (im already over 20k in debt from the first round of therapy for her and myself, i have been going every week... .
we live in this tiny apt, and since the serving shes been acting fairly normal saying how she does not want to get divorced, she wants to stay married, im stuck sleeping in the same apt as her, due to the kid and lawyer advice, and now I'm having trouble giving my lawyer clear game plan routes ... .

While it is good that you've stuck with your counseling, be careful of being trapped into a defensive posture where they can claim, "He needs therapy, his spouse is just fine and doesn't need to do it."  Whenever there is an opportunity make sure any solutions aren't husband-blaming.  If you are to get assessed, evaluated, a psych eval or custody eval, then make sure any such order applies to BOTH of you, not just you.

And if you have to share results or other information, don't present your information first, odds are she won't cough up her info.  You can be fair and equitable, you can't expect her to reciprocate.  Rather, let your lawyer say, "We have the requested info, when can we exchange the papers?  We will hold the results until we can have a mutual exchange."

[cbz1198]

Thank you so much for all your help advise and support!

A bit of a update, things have not changed, still living with her, she thinks life is amazing, -!; it's all great.
Her aunt (who has been trying to help out before I served) is missing her nose in asking me to give it a 3 month trial period, honestly, we all know that this isn't going anywhere, but I decided to give her that chance, however in the meantime she quit therapy and isn't going to anything now, I told my lawyer that there is nothing to talk about before she goes back to therapy... .
She's busy making me dinner and buying me laptops for the holidays, I don't feel like accepting it, (I told her I'm thinking about it) like I've read it all and went though thwpary but still don't get how she can think after me serving her that life can just continue normally.
I'm being nice and respectful, obviously not allowing any type of intimate relatiship, I cut touch and affection, Bc DONT need her thinking marriage is so flowery... plus honestly after the things she's done to me, it's hard to look at her the way I did when we first married... .

So yeah anyway, that's the update...
She threw at me at some point that I was abusive and controlling and therefore caused her to be the way she became, but I know I wasn't, and what I don't get even more is, if that's what's she claims, why is she "fighting" to stay with me? Why is she giving me gifts?

[ForeverDad]

Probably she's trying to win you back.  Or she may be in the upswing of a repeating love-hate cycle.  Odds are it won't last, not if she's not addressing her issues.  That usually takes help.  Help not from you, you're too emotionally close to her, it usually takes an emotionally neutral professional or someone trained in counseling.

She said she was acting poorly because she was around you?  To a certain extent, that's true.  BPD behaviors become more evident the closer the relationship.  Yes, just being close can trigger her.  That's why distance often improves the behaviors but don't fool yourself ... .if the person hasn't been permanently blacklisted due to the ended relationship, ended relationships are usually viewed as abusive since the pwBPD can't accept responsibility for causing the End.  Still, she shouldn't blame you for her poor behaviors, she ought to be responsible for her own behaviors.  While she can react to you and your actions, she shouldn't overreact.

That she stopped her therapy sessions is noteworthy and a negative.  In addition, for the relationship to succeed she would have to do more than attend, she would have to apply counsel diligently in her life,, thinking and behaviors, not for a few visits but long term, probably years.  Would she do that?  That's what it would take for the relationship to become healthy and functional — versus the current unhealthy and dysfunctional.

[cbz1198]

Thanks again!
Yes i know it wont last, and as confusing as it gets, with he buying stuff and the being nice and not being ice, i keep on getting the very clear reality checks almost every day, that no, shes got something, we can call BPD something else, but shes deff got a problem.
At some point a week or two ago, shes was crying and screaming, saying that she doesnt know why shes married to me etc,  so i asked her back, so why do you want to stay married, i served you, if im controlling and abusive then take this and leave the marriage, so shes says, "well i just dont need and want divorce in my life right now" with which i responded, is it that that you dont want divorce or is it that you want to stay married to me and you value this relationship, she tells me well its just that i dont want divorce in my life, so i understand that, bc who wants divorce, not why u married in the first place, but either way, her not being interested in the relationship, still feeling for some reason she has to stay married but doesnt want to stay married to me i think can be causing alot for this, what i understanding is, if thats it, so why doesnt she just run now, now that i called the divorce?

[oshinko maki]

i dont want divorce in my life, so i understand that, bc who wants divorce

My wife, if I understand correctly, does not want divorce either, although she loathes or hates me deeply, when she does not like me -- because she does not think she can carry out her own everyday living necessities, like household finances. I think this is a bit trivial of a reason and that she can actually do it own her own anyway, as she worked as an accountant for over ten years (during which time too I had to handle her finances). For my part, I am jealous that you started the process as I am too afraid to push for a divorce because I know/fear she will try to take everything I own, just to hurt me, not for greed. She may also try to hurt me and/or our son (who has been asking me more and more to divorce her and move away to live alone with him.) I think I will take on that fight for a divorce when I can ensure that my son gets my assets first. He is 13 now, so I many have to wait another 5 years, which is a really long time in that you age at 3 times the normal pace, at least I do, compared to someone who is not living with the mind-blowing destructiveness of a person with BPD.

[cbz1198]

Thanks for what you wrote, and totally agree with you too!

In the meantime on my side the way thing progressed, is that like mentioned she hired this (well not realy she, her parents who all of a sudden are helping and being there for her... .) hired this top 10 attorney in the city, (im assuming its maybe to intimidate me, or for their self reassurance... .) either way, their wanted to take it to war, but then a outsider, (her aunt) suggested to go for this 3 month trial period to "try making this marriage work". all of them obviously no knowing the actual problem, and believing her in the fact that she is saying its a simple communication issue. They wanted me to go to Marriage Therapy with her. I agreed to all of this, but under one condition we both stay in personal therapy and she signs a post nuptial agreement to a 50/50 custody (and debt)... .She agreed verbally and went ahead and cancelled her therapists (tells the world her therapist cancelled her... .) she said she will look into further therapy (this is over a month ago... .) in btwn, life was just the regular, (well yeah regular as its described in the "walking on eggshells"... .) anyway her parents decide to call mine and say, listen up, your son never kept to his side of the deal, hes not reciprocating... (in this time she was making dinners, laundry, bought me a expensive laptop etc, came with me international for a siblings wedding... ., she wanted to go to her parents, so i said only with written letter that she would be coming back ... .she didnt want to, also she started again askign for babies, waking up at 4 am crying her head off till 6am about that... .not that there was anything intimate going anyway within the last few months... .) so back to her parents, they told mine, its not nice, that i cant trust her, and wont let her come to them for the holidays etc... .so they want to know if im out or in, bc if im out, they wanna tell their lawyer to start fighting (let me not forget they used the past month to gather or at least to try gather info on me that im controlling and abusive, they found some kid that i taught 4 years ago, who fyi was a mad trouble maker, that says i would always get him in trouble, and using that to say u see hes controlling... .EITHER way... .) My father replied, well she kinda stooped going to therapy and is still asking for babies is that normal?... .they agreed to get her into therapy, but ignored the baby issue... .
In the meantime, i didnt waste time, and my lawyer and myself sat and wrote up the 60 page divorce agreement and waiting to see how this plays out, if they dont take this srsly it will have to go down this way... .

Here are my feelings, why and i still having 2nd thought, like i know what this person did to me, and i know what shes capable of. so why is there still some type of "spark" in me that doesn't wanna let go... .I get its the whole unknown buz, and the divorce, not being with my child 100% of the time, (how a normal life and marriage and parenting should work) but its more then that... .

Im reading the book "splitting" very helpful, however, still so hard... and SO CONFUSED some times... .

[ForeverDad]

Here are my feelings, why am i still having 2nd thoughts, like i know what this person did to me, and i know what shes capable of. so why is there still some type of "spark" in me that doesn't wanna let go... .

Your heart hasn't caught up with your head yet.  Give recovery time, you're not really 'out' of the relationship yet.  For her, recovery from BPD perceptions and behaviors, if it ever happened, would take time.  For you, recovery from exposure to the chaotic life with a BPD spouse also will take time - and distance.  Recovery may move faster for you once you have that time and distance.

[takingandsending]

It took me 2.5 years from intuitively knowing that my marriage was not going to continue to being able to act on ending it. In that 2.5 years, I have been allowing grief to arise and accepting that a part of me still doesn't want to let go. But I'd like to share something that has helped me and echoes ForeverDad's sentiment on distance. When my wife went on a two 1+ weeklong trips to Hawaii for workshops/classes, and it was just me and my S5 and S11 at the house, the amount of ease, peace and happiness that I felt confirmed that I only had one possible choice in my relationship.

What is hard to let go, what causes the grief, is the thoughts of what it was supposed to be, not what it is. Most people would not stick around for what it really is. Work on your self esteem and boundaries with T. Look at how and why you got to where you are. Heal yourself. Just from your descriptions of your experience with your wife, ask yourself, would someone who loves themselves stay? Oddly enough, my STBxw suggested asking the question "What would someone who loves themselves do?" for every life situation/every decision, every day for a year. (She obviously has not had to work for a living.) The first time I asked myself that question, I heard "They would leave." That was 2.5 years ago. My answer is still the same. It just took me that long to trust myself.

[cbz1198]

I'm beginning to agree with all of you above, it's just so messed up, again like I have written in the past, there is something pulling and urging me to stay with her, and I know it's not just the baby, it's obviously a big part of it, but it's her too... .
But the ppl around me keep telling me, that I can't do this to my mind to sit in the fire zone and make decisions,  they say u (I) deserve a vacation from this, a time off from her where you can think alike a human being, not like a Soldier in the battle field... .and I'm starting to agree with that, i know divorce may just and is the answer but at the same time I think we or at least I need to get out a bit, create a custody plan and have a splitting / separation agreement. Would love to hear your thoughts about it... .
I spoke to my lawyer about this and the only things she's afraid about is the fact of being back stabbed during this time, giving them time to come up with bogus stories and crap on me that hardly ever happened. But besides for that she doesn't seem to have anything wrong with this... .
My Wife, also has been pushing that we never went for real marriage therapy, (btw we DID, for 6 full months till the therapist said that we not moving like this, he wanted us to work on our personal life first) either wAy, so during this separation agreement we / I may agree to do that Again and go to a top marriage counselor in the city with her and let that therapists evaluate the situation... .
I don't know if that the right thing, would love to hear your opinions in the matters too. But it boils down to my wife claiming that she has no BP (and as she also proofs to me that her new [current] therapist [that her parents found her] thinks the same... .the truth is she was never really diagnosed with BPD but she was deff sent to a DBT and was told there is a possible BPD, so yeah, also she has any of the symptoms it's discussed anywhere and walking on eggshells was and is pretty much MY LIFE. But then again, she blames (together with her new therapists and lawyer) that her actions were just reactions to our marriage... .
anyway, I'm at a point where I served her, and even sent her the settlement proposal, but she's still trying in every way to stay with me... .I'm still living in the same small apt with her due to what my lawyer recommended I do. So therefore I think it just gets really hard thinking normally and ehen it comes to pulling the trigger there is still some emotional connection there so... .therefore I think a separation period would be best, if not for her just for mine to gather my thoughts and think normally... .as for how maybe nesting or getting another apt... .idk...

[ForeverDad]

Three years nearly and you're at the brink of divorce.  Seriously, has she made any real progress?  I don't see any.  So what give you basis to believe another try would be different?

Another try, on the other hand, would delay progress on unwinding your lives.  The additional time would give her more opportunity to mess with your life, dig herself in even deeper so trying to exit a few years from now would be even more complicated and overwhelming.  And... .what if she uses that added time to get pregnant again?  Wouldn't make you even more conflicted whether to leave?

Let me first say that I am a huge marriage advocate.  But the marriages as described here were not the creator's intention.  Neither spouse should be used or abused by the other spouse.  Perhaps try this logic?  "I know you want to try again but it's been years and it's still not working.  Another try could just resume the existing problems.  I need to divorce to [example, get clarity in my life].  We can do our counseling separately as single persons.  Then in a few years we can determine what substantive progress has been made and assess whether remarriage could succeed."  The point here is that it addresses your Nice Guy inclinations yet (1) moves forward with proven fixes and (2) in time you could determine whether she would attend counseling long term and actually apply it thoroughly in her life.

I think others have said it's better to rip off the band-aid now than put it off for later and risk the wound festering more.  She wants delay but as much as she complains, she would rather have the conflict continue than end it.

[takingandsending]

cbz1198,

I feel for you. I am at the precipice of separating households with my STBuBPDxw, and after 6 months of complaining and badgering to get me to leave the house, she is now wanting me to stay/delay. My old habituated response was that I doubted whether this is the right time to leave, that maybe she's right - finances are not good, upheaval, upcoming travel, weather has been challenging, you name it. My experience is that whenever I have a chink in my armor, a moment of uncertainty or doubt or even joy or enthusiasm, my wife seizes on my own weakness, my own lack of experience of knowing what is right for me, and uses that to try to cover her own insecurities. There is almost always some kernel of truth in what she says, but it is refracted in a way that is not true. In a healthy relationship, your partner would encourage you, help you ask questions, support you in finding the answers that you need. In these unhealthy relationships, our partners are terrified of their own feelings and will stop at nothing to keep from confronting them, even if it means attacking, hurting or manipulating those that love them. If your wife were getting treatment, and if she were showing signs of improvement, by all means, I encourage you to stay. But if she is not doing any of these things, you have to develop the boundaries to take care of yourself to prevent from being sabotaged by her fear of confronting her own feelings.

[insideout77]

cbz1198,

I'm also wondering what the point of your lawyer saying she may have come up with better stories about you was all about. The only thing that can do was scare you to stay. Yes the longer you stay the more tangled you become and if you have a kid already why you would you want your kid to grow up in the chaos. Get out and get her to safety. Don't be scared of the big pompous lawyers on the opposite side. you have shown that you have tried and you need to get out to safety as soon as you can