Breaking the addiction

[Depression = 72% of members]

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I am so sorry to hear that you are having to recover from this after fighting a substance addiction.  I have often wondered what was worse.  And now you have told me... .wow that's a little trouble some... .not sure I posess the strength to get past this.

[Oncebitten]

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I am so sorry to hear that you are having to recover from this after fighting a substance addiction.  I have often wondered what was worse.  And now you have told me... .wow that's a little trouble some... .not sure I posess the strength to get past this.

[RELATIONSHIP PROBLEM SOLVING]

RELATIONSHIP PROBLEM SOLVING This is a high level discussion board for solving ongoing, day-to-day relationship conflicts. Members are welcomed to express frustration but must seek constructive solutions to problems. This is not a place for relationship "stay" or "leave" discussions. Please read the specific guidelines for this group.

[patientandclear]

Great explanation from Troisette.

OnceBitten, the course of recovery that Troisette describes is not available if you continue to dip your toes back in the water and try. You say here that she's "really gone" now, but that has never proven to be the case before, has it? Several people here have observed, with pwBPD who come back, that the only person who can or will end this is you.

I started a trauma recovery therapy while I was still in close touch with my ex wBPD. (Incidentally it was that course of therapy that led to me changing how I show up in the relationship quite significantly. I no longer just accept whatever he says the terms are. That ultimately led to the end of our relationship; though not without some protracted death throes.)

Anyway, when I first started that therapy approach, I found I still felt terrible.  I was still in constant contact with my person wBPD. A friend said "I don't know that you can recover from trauma while you are still being traumatized." That proved true. I have made big strides only when I've been in a protracted break (meaning 10-15 months at a time) from this dynamic. The fact that I then feel strong enough or whatever to try again means that I keep not quite making it out of the woods; he says things to match my new position and, so far, I have always wanted to check out whether things have changed. (So far, not.)

But the point is: at some point you have to decide if you want to live in this state of mind indefinitely, because continued engagement without something changing really ensures you will keep feeling like this.

My ex and yours and others discussed here have systems running that methodically make us feel like crap. We can either try to change our reactions so we no longer feel like crap (not healthy if what is going on is abusive), or accept that we are going to feel terrible, or establish real boundaries and stop engaging on the old terms that are so comfortable to the pwBPD.

With some BPD behaviors, it may be possible to just stop caring about the behavior, and not do great violence to yourself or your values. That's not true of my r/ship: the behavior is inherently humiliating and diminishing. Can you isolate your ex's core pattern and decide if it is inherently diminishing?

If it is not something you can learn to live with without harming yourself, you can accept you are going to be continuously injured, or you can draw some lines that may result in it being The End--and let go of the outcome. I had to tell my ex I wouldn't see him on anything other than a casual level (which is of little interest to either of us)--unless something had changed with his basic approach (akin to pipedreamer's requirement that her partner stop drinking). He's been honest enough to tell me each time he comes back that it hasn't changed and he doesn't think it will. So ... .I need to stop.

I say all this because it seems to me you periodically post on Detaching saying it is over because SHE is done. But then it turns out she is not done, it's nice for a while, then you are right back here. The question is-- are YOU done, done with the way this has been going.

[lovenature]

Anyway, when I first started that therapy approach, I found I still felt terrible.  I was still in constant contact with my person wBPD. A friend said "I don't know that you can recover from trauma while you are still being traumatized." That proved true. I have made big strides only when I've been in a protracted break (meaning 10-15 months at a time) from this dynamic. The fact that I then feel strong enough or whatever to try again means that I keep not quite making it out of the woods; he says things to match my new position and, so far, I have always wanted to check out whether things have changed. (So far, not.)

patientandclear has given great advice here based on her experience; if you don't remain NC long enough, you will never get out of the FOG and see clearly enough to make a proper decision regarding your relationship.
I found that even if I had very little contact with my ex. ("encounters" that were worse than recycles), I would feel awful right away afterwards, and it became harder to maintain NC and recover each time we saw one another.

[Oncebitten]

my problem is letting go of the dream... .that dream of a future with her.  I guess I need to let go of that so I can fully detach and heal.

[Duped 1]

It's been 2 mos NC and she has a new guy immediately but it's still so weird not hearing from her. She used to text constantly and she loved to beat me down and remind me of everything I'd ever done wrong in the relationship. It's strange not being insulted on a regular basis

[Oncebitten]

duped

I know how you feel... .you become conditioned to think that any kind of attention is good attention.  I am in the same place... .even her raging at me is better than being without her.

[Duped 1]

That is so true Once Bitten. Sad but true. The new guy is in for a real treat once the idolization phase ends.

[Oncebitten]

indeed... .its a hard landing when you get pushed from the pedestal

[Oncebitten]

what the heck... .I do something that I need to do to detach... .after she had told me she was done.  Fine you are done then I am done... and then I get a text from her... .some bs about what I did... .if you are done why do you keep reaching out?

[lovenature]

I guess I need to let go of that so I can fully detach and heal.

ABSOLUTELY  

[Oncebitten]

its so damn hard when they keep re-engaging you

[myself]

You could not read the messages, or block her number. Change your pattern.

[patientandclear]

OnceBitten--highly recommend that you stop expecting her to do anything other than this current pattern.  (Note that a ways up the thread you wrote, as if you believed it, "she is really gone this time."  It was completely predictable that she would be gone for a nano-second only.)

She gets something out of this current dynamic -- where she continuously pushes you away and you keep trying to get re-admitted.

She is in control and it feels good.  She is not lightly going to give it up as it is gratifying.

If you want this to change, you will need to change what YOU do.

[Oncebitten]

PNC

I know, I did something, she did what she always does and I reacted.  Doesn't matter if my reaction is neg or pos.  She got me to react which is exactly what she wants. I have no idea what she gets out of my reaction but she does indeed enjoy it. 

If you are done with someone, and they do something that doesn't really affect you but you notice... .do you need to message them?

[heartandwhole]

If you are done with someone, and they do something that doesn't really affect you but you notice... .do you need to message them?

No. You don't have to do anything that doesn't feel right for you. And you don't have to justify, explain, or defend your decision.

If you are truly done, then your behavior will be different now than when you were in the relationship.

heartandwhole

[Oncebitten]

heart

no I was asking about her.  Why would she message me if she is really done? 

[heartandwhole]

heart

no I was asking about her.  Why would she message me if she is really done?  

Because she is not done in the sense that she will completely let you go. Because:

• Her feelings change in a heartbeat, and feelings=facts
• She might need you now or in the future
• Reaching out soothes her uncomfortable feelings

I'm sure you can think of more.  If she can have you around without having to invest herself to the point that she will dysregulate, then it doesn't surprise me that she would try to hold on to you somehow, especially after having been in a close relationship with you.

[Oncebitten]

Heart

close doesn't begin to describe our relationship.  Incredibly close for both of us

[Lucky Jim]

no I was asking about her.  Why would she message me if she is really done

Hello again, OB, It's not about her, my friend; rather, in my view it's about whether you are ready to get off the roller coaster.  Well, are you?  If not, that's OK.  LJ

[Lil Rocky]

It is exactly an addiction.  I am currently 8 months sober from 25 years opiate use and I will tell you... .THIS feels worse.   Although drugs/alcohol are highly addictive and causes dependency, it is nothing like the emotional addiction experience that I'm currently going through.  It is so overwhelming sometimes that I'm not sure how to proceed besides day by day.  I've never experienced dreams about someone and wake up and feel heart broken all over again.  She was my best friend (was platonic only) and now she's mist.   I'm trying to detach because she will not offer closure... .just my own loud unanswered questions.  Comparing a drug addiction to her... .all I can say is at least the drugs didn't give me the silent treatment.  At least it was black and white.  I often question if I am irreparably damaged emotionally because of her and she could care less.  It sucks man.  I get it.

It does feel like an addiction. I'm sorry you went thru that. After my ex female friend ended out friendship 4 months ago (we were more than friends but not as a couple) I felt utterly hopeless. When talking to her. She made me feel like a million bucks.

I relapsed a couple of times & contacted her, back last Aug and again last week. Its difficult to let go of someone you shared your most inner thoughts and personal information with and now they act like you don't exist. Even after reading a book about BPD it still boggles my mind how things between her and I went downhill. I'm still healing and resumed NC. I'm hoping to keep it that way. I'm sorry you went thru that, empty reflection.

[apollotech]

its so damn hard when they keep re-engaging you

OB,

It's not re-engagement unless YOU participate. This is not about her getting control of herself and moving on---it's about you getting control of yourself and moving on, if that is what you want. She may never truly move on, but you can.

[fromheeltoheal]

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