Please help with question BPD

[Depression = 72% of members]

I maybe not be asking in the right place. Many may not want to touch the subject but I hope some will.

My ex, I can clearly see is not doing well at all. We're on very LC. It doesn't break my heart to see her that way anymore. What i mean is, i want to help but no longer feeling sorry for her. I don't think she'll appreciate that from me (me feeling sorry for her).

 Curious to know if there's a possibility to getting her to where she can appear normal again? Or is that who she truly is and only a brand new attachment can get her there?
Has anyone ever been able to or allowed to? Am I setting myself up for another fall?

Idk why I want to help. I believe she knows how left field she is right now.  I'm not thinking of it for my benefit or any reason I can understand at the present time.

Is it possible or no?

[FallBack!Monster]

I maybe not be asking in the right place. Many may not want to touch the subject but I hope some will.

My ex, I can clearly see is not doing well at all. We're on very LC. It doesn't break my heart to see her that way anymore. What i mean is, i want to help but no longer feeling sorry for her. I don't think she'll appreciate that from me (me feeling sorry for her).

 Curious to know if there's a possibility to getting her to where she can appear normal again? Or is that who she truly is and only a brand new attachment can get her there?
Has anyone ever been able to or allowed to? Am I setting myself up for another fall?

Idk why I want to help. I believe she knows how left field she is right now.  I'm not thinking of it for my benefit or any reason I can understand at the present time.

Is it possible or no?

[fromheeltoheal]

Curious to know if there's a possibility to getting her to where she can appear normal again?  Or is that who she truly is and only a brand new attachment can get her there?
Has anyone ever been able to or allowed to?

It depends on what you mean by "normal", for all of us, plus appearing normal and being normal, however we define it, are two different things yes?  Borderline personality disorder is not curable, since it formed in the first few years of life and got hardwired into the personality, although borderlines can learn techniques and tools to lessen the impact of the strong emotions they feel and temper the resulting behaviors.

Am I setting myself up for another fall?

Idk why I want to help. I believe she knows how left field she is right now.  I'm not thinking of it for my benefit or any reason I can understand at the present time.

It depends on what the goal is.  It can be very fruitful to find out why you want to help, the real reason, that can help us gain new insights into our motivations, one of the benefits of the relationship.  :)o you know what your real goal is?

[FallBack!Monster]

Do you know what your real goal is?
I was once able to "assist" her in not making her feel like she's ONLY a disordered. Maybe i can help her out of the darkness she appears to be in right now. Maybe knowing that I'm not sitting here focused on judging her or trying to harm her... .Maybe? idk. Does that make any sense? or is that something that only I brand new attachment might provide?

I honestly don't know. I know BPD is incurable. In no way shape or form do I think I can cure anything.  I'm no Dr. The only explanation i can provide at this time is this is someone my family and I spent time with. If I can do something, why not? Should I focus on the stigma and be pessimistic instead? Please someone be kind enough to answer my original questions.
the very few times we've ran into each other, she seems confused, on the defensive, as if she expects me to judge her.  
Her conversation says she's trying to remember something or figure something out; in imbo. So I talk about anything that comes to mind. No it's not to feed my ego, in case there are any negative minds here. I can't say, really. Let's call it concerned about someone that I use to know. How is that?

[fromheeltoheal]

A selfless desire to help is noble, and it's clear you care about her.  If there is another reason in there it may become clear with time.

A challenge can be that someone who was in a relationship with a borderline is probably the least likely to be able to help, since the disorder is triggered by intimacy.  The good news is borderlines are survivors, they have to be to live with a disorder that is a living hell, and you're right, a new attachment will allow her to feel whole and complete, the goal of attaching, and that will feel good for a while, and the relationship will likely go through the same phases as past ones, leaving her in the same place all over again.

But if you are detached enough to be able to interrelate with her without getting triggered or off balance yourself, then there's no risk, and maybe you can help in some way.  It goes back to what is the goal and how will you know you've achieved it?

[FallBack!Monster]

A selfless desire to help is noble, and it's clear you care about her.  If there is another reason in there it may become clear with time.

A challenge can be that someone who was in a relationship with a borderline is probably the least likely to be able to help, since the disorder is triggered by intimacy.  The good news is borderlines are survivors, they have to be to live with a disorder that is a living hell, and you're right, a new attachment will allow her to feel whole and complete, the goal of attaching, and that will feel good for a while, and the relationship will likely go through the same phases as past ones, leaving her in the same place all over again.

But if you are detached enough to be able to interrelate with her without getting triggered or off balance yourself, then there's no risk, and maybe you can help in some way.  It goes back to what is the goal and how will you know you've achieved it?

Challenging question.
I'm sure you can tell from my previous answer, I cannot answer simply bc I'm not sure what I'm trying to achieve or exactly why I would want to. I will say this. I read somewhere that humans are responsible for one another's well-being. To me it was representative of a moment of sudden insight. I don't believe it was meant only during natural disasters or terrorist attacks . 
This time around I don't intend on sacrificing myself even  for a "noble" cause. Neither do I want to cause triggers. Simply curious about an ex helping w/o expectations.
Let me say this. My ex an I had many disagreements and I was blamed for things she did. Regardless of it, I'm passed that. In fact besides the issues cause by impulsivity, we had a cute r/s. I don't foresee intimacy between us being an issue in the near future.
I thank you for taking the time. You help me to think and realize my purpose may not be possible to achieve.

[fromheeltoheal]

I read somewhere that humans are responsible for one another's well-being. To me it was representative of a moment of sudden insight. I don't believe it was meant only during natural disasters or terrorist attacks .

I agree with that, we're social animals who evolved that way, because we wouldn't have made it on our own.  And if that's the case, and you are triggering for her because of what you've been through together, your history, then the best way to ensure her well-being might be to let someone else help her, or maybe she decides to help herself, yes?

[FallBack!Monster]

I agree with that, we're social animals who evolved that way, because we wouldn't have made it on our own.  And if that's the case, and you are triggering for her because of what you've been through together, your history, then the best way to ensure her well-being might be to let someone else help her, or maybe she decides to help herself, yes?

Once again, you make complete sense. I cannot tell whether or not I'm a trigger. Maybe you can tell from my writing and that is why you're so sure. Guess I didn't see it that way bc i know for a fact she remained in contact with herchildren fathers and other r/s. Maybe that's why I didn't think of myself as a trigger. Besides she moved on and that didn't work out either.
As I said, idk why but I wanted to. Where I've come to emotionally, im surprise I still care to care. In my thoughts, the main reason why she has not apologized, one is bc she might know how I feel about apologies. I've said it too many times around her. I can live w/o it. Secondly, she's too busy trying to figure out why she keeps messing up (enogh failed r/s). 3rd, the disorder is doing what it do. I don't expect an apology and belive me, I don't need it. I think that's healthy.
All in all, I will consider what you've said.
One more thing... .Last time we spoke, she implied i was family to her. Don't know what to make of it. You probably know better. Maybe that's where the idea came from.
Danke

[fromheeltoheal]

I cannot tell whether or not I'm a trigger. Maybe you can tell from my writing and that is why you're so sure.

It's common early in detachment to want to help our exes, I almost sent my ex a very large check because she was unemployed and hurting when I left, it ties into that bond that kept us in the relationship when we knew things just weren't right, and it's a way of keeping hope alive.  You haven't been around here long and there's something we call the FOG, an acronym for fear, obligation and guilt, and it takes a while for the fog to clear once we're out.  Up to you to decide if that's true for you, although not knowing what you want or what your motivation is are symptoms.

Guess I didn't see it that way bc i know for a fact she remained in contact with herchildren fathers and other r/s. Maybe that's why I didn't think of myself as a trigger.

Borderlines hate to lose an attachment, it's interpreted as abandonment, the worst thing that could happen, the core of the disorder, so a borderline is motivated to keep the attachment in place regardless of what actually happened in the relationship.  It's up to us to decide if an ex is still a positive addition to our lives.

One more thing... .Last time we spoke, she implied i was family to her. Don't know what to make of it. You probably know better. Maybe that's where the idea came from.

Going back to attachments, we may not always get along with family members, but they're always there, there's that blood bond, so that thought is likely comforting for her.  What matters is if it's comforting for you, and why.

[FallBack!Monster]

What matters is if it's comforting for you, and why.
In a way it is, maybe.  If I think about it what other reason could there be, to be honest? The way I see it. We meet some people, some do bad things and good things. Sometimes they disappear or we lose contact, whatever but we don't care. Some I/we do care. There are people who do good things and are easily forgotten.
 I have had every opportunity to move on with my life and forget my ex ever existed but there's has to be a reason why  I have not. If she got lost and I never see her again, it wouldn't destroy my feelings. But maybe i too see her as family.

You haven't been around here long and there's something we call the FOG, an acronym for fear, obligation and guilt,,
Have not been around long? True but  Have been reading everything under the sun here, since i registered. Also began to read about a yr ago, several other sources.
No FOG. I don't feel any obligation to her, that I can recognize in me. I owe her nothing. I gave her!.  I no longer feel any type of fear for her. I had a fear of what has already occurred. it did and I'm still alive. Period end of that story.
To be fair, I'm going to admit that its only to a certain extent that I feel I'm aware of the terrorist in her or the terror  the disorder can create in someone's life. I feel I've gained some insight. No! I do not trust the disordered mind.  Brutal honesty.

It's up to us to decide if an ex is still a positive addition to our lives.
Positive? Not sure I would call it that. But it just doesn't bother me that much anymore. If it did it would be handled differently than I did in the past. So late I don't know what I'm saying. Hope I made some sense  but again, I'm considering your advice.

[apollotech]

A challenge can be that someone who was in a relationship with a borderline is probably the least likely to be able to help, since the disorder is triggered by intimacy.

Hi NoGd4us,

I have been following the dialogue between you and FHTH, and I have a question. I am in agreement with what FHTH has written above ^^^^. You will be up against that in any kind of relationship that you pursue with her---your triggering her.

I know that you want to help. My question is what do you think has changed with her that would allow you to help her? If she was unable to control herself during the romantic relationship, why do you now think that she would now have that control during a friendship? With BPD it is often not about what either party wants; it is usuly about what the disorder dictates.

[FallBack!Monster]

Hi NoGd4us,
I have been following the dialogue between you and FHTH, and I have a question. I am in agreement with what FHTH has written above ^^^^. You will be up against that in any kind of relationship that you pursue with her---your triggering her.
I know that you want to help. My question is what do you think has changed with her that would allow you to help her? If she was unable to control herself during the romantic relationship, why do you now think that she would now have that control during a friendship? With BPD it is often not about what either party wants; it is usuly about what the disorder dictates.
[/quote]

Dear apollotick,
Thanks for all your words.  And idk

[FallBack!Monster]

I maybe not be asking in the right place. Many may not want to touch the subject but I hope some will.

My ex, I can clearly see is not doing well at all. We're on very LC. It doesn't break my heart to see her that way anymore. What i mean is, i want to help but no longer feeling sorry for her. I don't think she'll appreciate that from me (me feeling sorry for her).

 Curious to know if there's a possibility to getting her to where she can appear normal again? Or is that who she truly is and only a brand new attachment can get her there?
Has anyone ever been able to or allowed to? Am I setting myself up for another fall?

Idk why I want to help. I believe she knows how left field she is right now.  I'm not thinking of it for my benefit or any reason I can understand at the present time.

Is it possible or no?

Good replies. Might want to consider a different board. Seem you're seeking ideas on how to accomplish reattachment and members of this here board support with detachment issues.

[FallBack!Monster]

Thank you RandB, good idea.
Would anyone know why I would be more of a trigger than another ex?  I'm not her last attempt at a  r/s.

[fromheeltoheal]

Hi NoGd-

Would anyone know why I would be more of a trigger than another ex?  I'm not her last attempt at a  r/s.

You aren't necessarily more of a trigger, although the disorder is triggered by intimacy, so the closer you get the more extreme it gets.  Borderlines contend with the opposing fears of abandonment and engulfment, with the line between them always moving, which motivates the push/pull behavior: get too close, push you away, get too far, pull you back.  Borderlines know that on some level, or at least know what it feels like, so a tack to deal with it is control the emotional distance in the relationship; one popular way is by communicating primarily by texting, which retains the attachment but regulates the distance, a smartphone being an attachment device at arm's length.

Anyway, if she stays in contact with exes but regulates how close she is to them, she gets the attachment without the trigger.  For someone to try to enter her life and help her, someone who was previously in a relationship with her, that may be too close for comfort, and off go the triggers.  In the end it boils down to your motivation and getting clear on the goal, realizing that BPD is a mental illness with somewhat predictable outcomes.

[FallBack!Monster]

Hi NoGd-

You aren't necessarily more of a trigger, although the disorder is triggered by intimacy, so the closer you get the more extreme it gets.  Borderlines contend with the opposing fears of abandonment and engulfment, with the line between them always moving, which motivates the push/pull behavior: get too close, push you away, get too far, pull you back.  Borderlines know that on some level, or at least know what it feels like, so a tack to deal with it is control the emotional distance in the relationship; one popular way is by communicating primarily by texting, which retains the attachment but regulates the distance, a smartphone being an attachment device at arm's length.

Anyway, if she stays in contact with exes but regulates how close she is to them, she gets the attachment without the trigger.  For someone to try to enter her life and help her, someone who was previously in a relationship with her, that may be too close for comfort, and off go the triggers.  In the end it boils down to your motivation and getting clear on the goal, realizing that BPD is a mental illness with somewhat predictable outcomes.

Roger that!
My understanding so far. I Believed I could help if we were not that intimate but that's how I see it. Not exactly how she would interpret it.
On here, im taking a chance at saying this but , POINT BLANK,  pwBPD use people who care about them and they are extremely controlling. Seeking to control every aspect of a r/s attachment. Whether it is romantic or not.  They want to be the ones to control closeness, distance, topic of conversation, how, when, if or if not. The other person trying to help is not acceptable bc then it is too much for the pwBPD, being that he or she is not the one dictating the rules. In other words. It could be viewed(to her) as controlling bc that would be her intention if she did what i wanted to do (noble act).
Therefore, my efforts can be detrimental or a strain on her freedom to manipulate at will.
FHTH,
you words are helping in a way I cannot explain. So much that I started a text, was just a friendly greeting then refrained w/o regrets.
She said I could visit whenever. I don't. I already mentioned, he also implied i was family. Since the break up, we've had talks. I said she'd eventually have to feel comfortable talking to me w/o thinking I'm judging her. In one instance, she might have asked me a Q and I hesitated with my answer, and for obvious reasons. She through the comment right back at me. Saying, oh I must feel comfortable and you're still holding back. Thought I mentioned that so you see my point for wanting to try.
I said that to her with the intentions on getting pass our past. If we're going to keep contact, we have to build on a different topic. Otherwise we'll both be stuck on what was and both be triggered on every contact.
It might be more intense of an occurrence to a pwBPD but certainly not less painful to me. Nons can also be triggered.  Now I that have gotten some rest. Its not so much to cure her of anything or help. Is more of an attempt to repair something that I haven't 100% come to terms with the realization that do to her disorder,  no matter what I try, we are unrepairable; in any way shape or form. Unless I'm voluntarily signing up to be used on her spear time.

Am I on the right track or too extra?
Should I consider that part of my life dead?

No offense but please don't say "use this time to reflect, learn from it, blah.  I know what healthy means. ( by definition just like everybody else.)  .  We are all imperfect people living in an imperfect world.
So far you haven't sounded like a cliché. I thank you for that.  I know what I gotta do for myself and believe me,  I'm on it!

once nore, Dunke

[fromheeltoheal]

Its not so much to cure her of anything or help. Is more of an attempt to repair something that I haven't 100% come to terms with the realization that do to her disorder,  no matter what I try, we are unrepairable; in any way shape or form. Unless I'm voluntarily signing up to be used on her spear time.

Am I on the right track or too extra?
Should I consider that part of my life dead?

It sounds like you're looking for closure, and good for you for digging and discovering that.  Looking for closure is pretty much universally common around here, since most times these relationships don't really end, they either just fall apart or explode, a consequence of the closer you get the more triggering it is, and you're right, everyone gets triggered, it's just more intense for borderlines.  The good news is we get to find ways to give ourselves closure, which can be more powerful.

No offense but please don't say "use this time to reflect, learn from it, blah.  I know what healthy means. ( by definition just like everybody else.)  .  We are all imperfect people living in an imperfect world.

So to give yourself closure, just use this time to reflect, learn from it.  Kidding.  It is a matter of focus though, if you focus on giving yourself closure and not relying on or trying to get anything from her, it takes her out of it entirely, not a bad thing since you consider the relationship unrepairable.

Focus-shift question that may be dangerously close to a cliche: What if everything happens for a reason and it serves us?

[woundedPhoenix]

With BPD it is often not about what either party wants; it is usuly about what the disorder dictates.

I believe this sentence kind of brings the topic down to the core.

I sometimes wish i could help my ex and support her on her way to recovery, the simple reality of it is that as a person that "came to close", i trigger her trust issues, intimacy fears and low-self esteem regardless of what i do or say.

And i know her so well that i intuitively see through all the bs, lies and denial by now. Which kind of show me what a long road ahead she has to get better, after years of therapy.

A new attachment in the long run ussually makes matters worse, as new trauma and failure is built up along the way.

[FallBack!Monster]

So to give yourself closure, just use this time to reflect, learn from it.
 
Focus-shift question that may be dangerously close to a cliche: What if everything happens for a reason and it serves us?
Honestly I don't know what that means. I know but I don't. Sounds like "what happened served me right or something. Or haha that's what I get for ignoring red flags. So I don't like those words put together. I think it means everything happens for a reason & even this experience can in someway beneficial to me in the future, blah.
Thanks a million.