Do you think people with BPD prefer enablers as their choice of partner?

[Curiously1]

LONG POST! sorry guys!

I'll put in bold at least for what the main points or questions are 

Quick definition of an enabler: An enabler is someone who essentially helps the person with BPD to continue their inappropriate behaviors.


I have been listening to various videos that suggests cluster B type personalities cannot tolerate healthy boundaries, healthy/functional behaviour for a long period of time and most often choose to opt out of the relationship or continue to try and sabotage those boundaries the more you establish those for yourself.

However, it's not that simple. They don't ALL leave. But tend to come and go, recycle or perhaps were always faithful. I am wondering what the effect of having boundaries have to them and if that affects how desirable you are to them as a partner of choice.

There are nons who stay in the relationship and have learnt to not enable their partner's inappropriate behaviour, and those with BPD who chose to stay even if they do not enjoy those new boundaries/rules set in place and of course, continue to test and bust those boundaries of yours if they can. Overtime, perhaps the outcomes of setting strong boundaries have made clear improvements, or they have remained unchanged and challenging individuals to be with but at least with the non feeling that they are in control of their own lives and emotions regardless of what the BPD person does.

Perhaps the pwBPD who leave most often, assuming you have set healthy boundaries are more of the Witch or Queen subtypes of BPD? The ones who are more dominant and need to feel in control and want a 'sevant' type of a partner? Or perhaps you can last with those types of BPD if you are in a strong position of power? I don't know. It is just speculation.

Has anyone who has had a more self aware BPD loved one express that they appreciated you  and respected you more for setting boundaries in your relationship? That they looked up to you as a good partner for setting them and felt safer with those boundaries in place? Or did those boundaries make them feel out of control or experience more negativity towards themselves which they cannot stand and must blame you for?

I guess the reason I thought about this question was because I wondered about my own BPDex decisions of what she valued in a partner and whether she appreciated someone who stood up for themselves whenever she had crossed boundaries (me) or a doormat kind of partner who worships the ground she walks on and just allow her to do anything freely (the replacement).

I know plenty of us have been told we were the best partners they have had and for many reasons, however I certainly believe I was the better choice at least coming from a health perspective.

I believe she had issues with control when I continued to set my boundaries.
Does boundaries also equate to boredom for pwBPD? They will get bored of you more because you have boundaries? and so another motivation to just drop you and find a new enabler?


However, reflecting back, I am also pretty confrontational in my approach and I know that easily hurts her emotionally. I acted more of the 'punitive' parent in our relationship unfortunately but I know better ways of handling someone who crosses boundaries now. In a way I realised I overrode her boundaries as well because I was quite pushy for her to become a better person and to give therapy a try. All that ever do was make her feel negative.

She went back to her friend straight after we broke up a second time... who she kept telling me she regretted leaving me for and could never love because xyz. It was a lot easier for her to function and feel like herself with her and they eventually got back together.

The friend allowed her to outright abuse her and do whatever she wanted and yet still, with all of that control she had gained, their relationship did not last either last time I checked.

I thought that my ex would have lasted for much longer with her but I was wrong. I wonder why it didn't last (this is just recent) as I believed she got everything she longed from me out of this girl.

My ego likes to assume it was because she could never get over me through that person... and that she will never get over me for as long as she hasn't found her ideal type again.

The friend seemed more like scraps to her based on how she described her appearance and personality and very low self-esteem etc. My ex, basically described in an online post basically how she felt embarrassed by being with her in public because of the apparent flaws this person has.

As I recall back my ex wished for me to be obsessed with her to feel stable and happy. I remember her telling me if only she could hypnotise me and have me crazy about her the way she was crazy about me then she wouldn't have to feel like she was not enough for me. And so that made me feel a lot of guilt that I didn't accept her completely for who she was... that I could not accept certain behaviours she had displayed and how much I seem to hurt her emotionally for mentioning that.

I completely understand now why she felt I had the power to "destroy" or "annihiliate" her altogether. I kept trying to make her face herself. And not in the best way now looking at the tools on this BPD forum.


And yet, that girl who was obsessed with everything to do with my ex was still not enough to keep her satiated.

Perhaps she stayed with me  for longer simply because she could idealise me for longer that and I was truly her type?

She hasn't contacted me since their breakup for another recycle though.
I don't believe she regrets leaving me despite not preferring the friend either? Unless she lied and loved the friend too in some way, either way, the fact that I am associated with guilt and shame makes me someone to runaway from.

My assumption is that she would prefer another enabler as a partner and similar to me, is her physical type than to go back to actual me again because of how much I make her feel bad about herself.

Even if she preferred me (whether she lied about that or not), this is why I don't think I am the right person for her to want to help herself with. [/b] And yet the friend who was more enabling did not have her stick around for any longer or have her fall in love harder, I dont know. Maybe one day she will want to get better for herself or want to do it for her partner as well and those who surround her.  I wished I could have supported her better. I approached it the wrong way but all you can really do is learn and do better in future relationships.

[Turkish]

You kept trying to make her face herself.  Yet a core feeling of a pwBPD is shame. 

I did the same at the end,  helpfully,  I thought,  only to get it thrown back in my face. Truthfully,  is there a nice way to say to someone  (in effect,  how they'll take it), "you're crazy.'

[patientandclear]

They may not like it, find it easy to tolerate, or want to stay with you if you are shining an honest light on their choices. That doesn't mean they may not ultimately appreciate what you said and agree with you. Turkish's ex is a good example, several years down the road. My ex is processing probing questions and thoughtful critical comments girlfriends said to him up to 18 years back which he recalls verbatim.

The enabling may "work" better for the time being but query whether it is ultimately a stance of love and respect toward either person.

[Curiously1]

You kept trying to make her face herself.  Yet a core feeling of a pwBPD is shame. 

I did the same at the end,  helpfully,  I thought,  only to get it thrown back in my face. Truthfully,  is there a nice way to say to someone  (in effect,  how they'll take it), "you're crazy.'

Yeah because mentioning therapy itself implies something is wrong with her. no matter what I do I'll make her feel ___ and the i love yous and always be there don't cut it. she just focuses on the negative

[Curiously1]

They may not like it, find it easy to tolerate, or want to stay with you if you are shining an honest light on their choices. That doesn't mean they may not ultimately appreciate what you said and agree with you. Turkish's ex is a good example, several years down the road. My ex is processing probing questions and thoughtful critical comments girlfriends said to him up to 18 years back which he recalls verbatim.

The enabling may "work" better for the time being but query whether it is ultimately a stance of love and respect toward either person.

Perhaps what helps them question themselves is because they know theyre never happy. They know deep down something isnt right but its either they choose to deny it for the rest of their lives or really try something different like therapy to hopefully improve how they feel... .  I suppose my ex.isnt ready to face herself. Doesnt mean she wont in future but for now nothing i say takes much effect in a positive way



Turkish what made your ex change?

[Rayban]

I believe that over time they become self aware, and know that they're behavior is the cause for the  trail of failed relationship.  I believe for my ex she chooses to find ways to deny the truth rather then to get the help needed to improve her life. She knows that therapy would involve look deep into the distruction she has caused in other people's lives. She chooses to continue her lifestyle and push the envelope. I noticed she  developed narcissistic traits and was proud when she was able to pull the wool over somebody else's eyes. She's made it her lifestyle.  In essence she values her ability to charm, seduce,  and get what she wants from people.

Do BPD's choose enablers as partners? I believe they do. I believe they test and will continue to test how far somone is willing to accept their behaviors.  As you mention the end results are varied. Some nons stay and try to improve the relationship. Some have enough and dump the BPD and never go back, while others will be recycled only to have that thrown back in their faces. Bpd' s need more then one source of validation.  My ex met tons of people, and she was continuously talking about how enchanted she was about meeting a new person. Being impulse she would jump ship and pursue something more with this new person without an after thought about what boundries this person will enforce compared to their current partner. They just know that they will be able to.

In my case, I broke up with her many times after she broke boundries I wasn't willing to accept.  I became a challenge. I accepted back in where she would continue her behaviour and worse find another boundry to bust and the cycle would repeat.  That's on me, not her. I realize now that I was indeed an enabler.  I allowed her to continue  her behaviour and as long as there are people willing to enable her to various degrees,  she sees no reason to change.

[FallBack!Monster]

Realistical and interesting points on this thread. I think all people prefer enablers.
Mom says no more cake tonight. Later, mom can I have more cake please? Mom says no then feels different and says, okay just a small portion.
Wife says, I'm tired of you going out every weekend with your friends and leaving me with the kids. I'll like to do the same but we got responsibilities. H says, I understand and I'm sorry. Next weekend the guys invite him out. He says let me ask my wife. Wife rathers him home for company but doesn't want to appear mean. Convincing herself is nothing wrong with H hanging with the boys, says fine! I don't care. Enjoy, have fun, be careful, love you, come back safe, blah blah blah.
When child goes behind moms back and takes the cake only bc mom caved, then it becomes negative, or negatively enabling
When H takes advantage of wife's good nature, cheats, drinks rent money, lies about going to work to do other stuff. All of a sudden things get out of control. So much that the so called enabler hands are tied. Let's say, in too deep. Future actions can interfere with normal lifestyle. One can become an enabler w/o knowing or wanting it. Kind of like, damn!  its gotten out of control. What do I do now?  Time to brainstorm, etc. Sometimes, big decisions cannot be made in such short time. Then you're labeled an enabler. Hope you get  the idea.

Complete understanding of everyday Loosely used words, originate from thoroughly searching definitions. To me enabling means, to make possible or easy. Spooling rotten does not seem to be the purpose. Enabling begins by someone taking advantage of a loved ones good nature.

Dictionary meanings:
1_one that enables another to achieve an end. Nothing harmful in this definition.[/b]

2_a person who encourages or enables negative or self-destructive behavior in another sure! it's somebody else's fault that you are out of order. [/B]

3_“removing the natural consequences to the addict of his or her behavior."[/b]

4_Enabling is a term with a double meaning  in psychotherapy and mental health. ... .growth in the person being enabled, and can contribute to negative symptoms in the enabler [/b] wow
5_ to make able; give power, means, competence, or ability to; authorize:
6_This document will enable him to pass through the enemy lines unmolested.

Don't know if they prefer. However more beneficial to a pwBPD to get his|her way. On the flip side. I don't suffer with BPD but would prefer another piece of cake to a firm no, every time.
Thanks for bringing to light such interesting topic.

   

[TyroneWiggums]

I think this is a fascinating question if for no other reason than this is exactly what  came up in therapy this week: my most recent, serious relationship was to a woman who has a sibling that's an addict.  Sibling steals from family. Sibling lies constantly, including lying for the sake of lying. Sibling destroys romantic partners via cheating, stealing, lying. Sibling is chronically unemployed/underemployed. Family continues to enable.

Replace "addict" with "pwBPD "and it's exactly the same story with my ex. Our relationship ended when I drew a boundary and refused to enable any more.  Of course, would have never gotten entangled had I known all these things, but that's what the mask was for.

I've read a lot about recycling and what amazes me is that my ex is now back with an old partner who she dumped in a way so brutal you'd swear I was making it up; the thing is, he took her back anyway, so she knows she is in the position to get away with murder because he'll take her back: the ultimate enabling

[once removed]

I think all people prefer enablers.

this is an excellent point that brings to mind bowens family systems theory which states we tend to choose partners of the same or similar emotional maturity. to what extent were both partners enabling the other?

[michel71]

Interesting thread. Deeply complex. I don't want anybody to enable me so I will disagree with the post that said we all want that. I have always been open to honest critique from others that I respect. I welcome growth and change for the better.
As for our relationships with our BPDs, I feel that the dynamic is more about us non's being rescuer types and/or co-dependents. It appears so by taking a general tally.
Personally I never succeeded with the tools to defuse her outbursts. I tried and kept failing miserably. It was only when I simply decided to love myself and my sanity MORE than my uBPDw that I got out of FOG. But it is hard. I still slip back once in a while.
My uBPDw is high functioning but very intense at home. Every conversation about ANYTHING is a powder keg. She is beyond a formidable opponent. I cannot out argue her (why bother but I fell into JADE most of the time). I cannot out "mean" her. She can be vile and evil. I cannot intimidate her. She is the master of manipulation and defiance.
Now that we are splitting up I am BLACKER than ever. Sometimes I can feel her hate. I am just trying to keep an even keel. And have a smile on my face. If I express any displeasure she accuses me of making this period "unbearable and worse" for her. SO I keep my mouth shut. Which is always what she wanted anyway. I do so now for my own sanity and protection.

[sweet tooth]

More than likely their parents were enablers who had weak or fluid boundaries. From what my exGF told me, her parents in particular would come down on her verbally but wound up enabling her in the end. This type of dynamic creates a paradigm that contributes to the origin of the BPD in the first place.  In my opinion, yes, they prefer enablers.

[michel71]

In my uBPDw's case, her mother was inattentive and abusive. So was her step Dad but worse. She was the victim of sexual abuse and neglect. Sad.

[FallBack!Monster]

Since when do we say "I disagree" at  bpdfamily. Never noticed that before. Many dictionary and "philosophical" definitions to Enabling. Why focus on the negative. BPD?  No mention about the positive outlook.  a pessimist is a pessimist. I made my point.  Talk about emotional immaturity. Yup! The fact that someone is making something comfortable for you is not the bad thing. It's  when things are good and you start to take advantage of it. Ultimately the other person must take key to the abuse and begin to take steps to stop it. For some, its a life altering decision so may procrastinate.
Never implied enabling was positive. Merely supporting my claim. Subsequently saying making things easy for someone does not denote weaknesses. Weaknesses in the other partner's character is what takes it in to the negative. Wearing a sign stating "I am a natural born emotional cripple so pls don't do be kind to me" would be helpful.